No Position on the Confederate Flag?

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Some presidential candidates have said the flag should come down. Jeb and Lindsey. Mitt isn't running, but he said it early. Hillary said it 8 years ago.

Some others will presumably dodge the issue by approving Halley's decision from a safe distance. Trying to be seen as doing the right thing, while not doing anything to offend racists and delusional states' righters and such.

But some haven't done any of that. Huckabee and Santorum have both said they won't take a position. Walker said it shouldn't be discussed until the victims are buried.

There is no excuse for being silent or shucking and jiving on this issue.

 

[22*43*51]

I'm glad it's down.

But, there also has been too much emphasis on it.

 

[Huey Grey]

I agree. These people are supposed to be leaders. Racism in this country is quickly becoming an important issue. So all of these candidates should have an opinion on it. To have racism, especially racism that might be viewed as state sponsored, go unrecongized by someone pursuing the office of President is completely unacceptable.

 

[hexumhawk]

I think states should do what they want and have more control honestly. If people don't like it, move.

 

[hexumhawk]

If they want to ban a flag for "perceived" racism then maybe they should ban dems for real racism...like slavery.

 

[Huey Grey]

I think states should do what they want and have more control honestly. If people don't like it, move.

But what are the limitations on this? Should states have the right to go back to slavery? Not allow black people to vote? Not allow women the right to buy property? Where is the line?

And in this particular situation, the state does appear to be the one leading the charge on removing this flag. Certainly, it is their call on whether to keep it up or take it down, but I see no reason why the rest of the country can't weigh in with their opinion. Racism doesn't stop at the borders of South Carolina.

 

[Lone Clone]

I think they shouldn't fly it. I wonder if the uproar would be as great if they flew the Confederate flag instead of the battle flag. Probably.

But this kind of thing can be taken too far. Are we going to ban "Dukes of Hazzard" reruns the way we did episodes of "Amos 'n' Andy"?

 

[naturalmwa]

I think states should do what they want and have more control honestly. If people don't like it, move.

I think the voters should do what they want and the state government should do what the people tell them.

 

[SCHawkFan]

Despite what is being reported on national news shows, the majority of South Carolinians support moving from the statehouse grounds. Governor Haley is correct, there is no place for that flag in SC's future. There may be a opposition from a handful of state legislators, but the momentum to remove seems unstoppable.

The sad thing about the flag controversy over the years is it distracted from what was really going on in SC. Business growth, a lot of northerners moving in, elections of a female Indian-American governor and an African-American senator show the state has moved a long way from its racist past.

What happened in Charleston last week looks to be moving the state further away from the old south. Exactly opposite what the shooter expected.

 

[Huey Grey]

I think they shouldn't fly it. I wonder if the uproar would be as great if they flew the Confederate flag instead of the battle flag. Probably.

But this kind of thing can be taken too far. Are we going to ban "Dukes of Hazzard" reruns the way we did episodes of "Amos 'n' Andy"?

I think that there's a big difference between decades old TV shows celebrating symbols of racism and an entire state doing the same today.

 

[theIowaHawk]

But what are the limitations on this? Should states have the right to go back to slavery? Not allow black people to vote? Not allow women the right to buy property? Where is the line?

Those would pretty clearly violate something the President swore to uphold.

But don't let that slow down your idiotic analogies.

 

[Huey Grey]

Those would pretty clearly violate something the President swore to uphold.

But don't let that slow down your idiotic analogies.

While your brilliant personal attacks are something a 3rd grader could accomplish, it still ignores my question. Gay marriage is a civil rights issue. Yet, most conservatives think that it should remain a state's rights issue. So clearly there is dispute over what should and shouldn't be considered a state right.

 

[strummingram]

I think they shouldn't fly it. I wonder if the uproar would be as great if they flew the Confederate flag instead of the battle flag. Probably.

But this kind of thing can be taken too far. Are we going to ban "Dukes of Hazzard" reruns the way we did episodes of "Amos 'n' Andy"?

They can block it out, maybe.

 

[TennesseeWaltz1]

Some presidential candidates have said the flag should come down. Jeb and Lindsey. Mitt isn't running, but he said it early. Hillary said it 8 years ago.

Some others will presumably dodge the issue by approving Halley's decision from a safe distance. Trying to be seen as doing the right thing, while not doing anything to offend racists and delusional states' righters and such.

But some haven't done any of that. Huckabee and Santorum have both said they won't take a position. Walker said it shouldn't be discussed until the victims are buried.

There is no excuse for being silent or shucking and jiving on this issue.

I have said it probably should come down...but I can say that...I am a southerner...to be real it isn't any of your business...and I am saying that in a nice way...why should it concern you?

 

[Lone Clone]

I think that there's a big difference between decades old TV shows celebrating symbols of racism and an entire state doing the same today.

How old is "Amos 'n' Andy"?

 

[Huey Grey]

I have said it probably should come down...but I can say that...I am a southerner...to be real it isn't any of your business...and I am saying that in a nice way...why should it concern you?

Of course it's our business. Racism is everyone's business.

 

[Huey Grey]

How old is "Amos 'n' Andy"?

Dude, I'd have to google it. I admit, I've never seen that show. I did, however, watch a lot of the Duke Bros back in the day.

 

[theIowaHawk]

While your brilliant personal attacks are something a 3rd grader could accomplish, it still ignores my question. Gay marriage is a civil rights issue. Yet, most conservatives think that it should remain a state's rights issue. So clearly there is dispute over what should and shouldn't be considered a state right.

I would've hoped a third grader understood the difference between a flag in a State, hoisted under state law would be a significantly different question than allowing direct violations of the Constitution.

The remainder of your quoted post completely moves on from the subject OP I ridiculed and changes the argument from what is, and what isn't a civil rights issue.

Flying a flag isn't in violation, or even in perceived violation, of the Constitution.

They were idiotic analogies, sad that you can't see it.

Argue the issue at hand, don't try to blame worse things.

 

[HallofFame]

Just another symbol of how the white man has lost his country. We are the new Indians. We won't stand up and fight for our land while it is taken over. It's reverse Manifest Destiny. But with forced diversity being such a huge historical success and all the great models of it currently I for one welcome our new overlords.

 

[Huey Grey]

I would've hoped a third grader understood the difference between a flag in a State, hoisted under state law would be a significantly different question than allowing direct violations of the Constitution.

The remainder of your quoted post completely moves on from the subject OP I ridiculed and changes the argument from what is, and what isn't a civil rights issue.

Flying a flag isn't in violation, or even in perceived violation, of the Constitution.

They were idiotic analogies, sad that you can't see it.

Argue the issue at hand, don't try to blame worse things.

I'm guessing that your attention span is pretty short, because we just had an Supreme Court decision pretty similar to this concerning license plates. The Court ruled that Texas can reject the confederate flag on license plates based on the Free Speech clause of the 1st Amendment. Which means that the Constitution does indeed have ruling over things like confederate flags and state owned property. Which also means that you're a complete moron for thinking that this had no perceived relation to the Constitution.

But we all know what your real game is around here. You run around calling people idiots because for whatever reason you don't have enough confidence to base your posts in sound reason instead of 3rd grade insults.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/06/18/politics/confederate-flag-license-plate-scotus-supreme-court-case/

 

[Nat Algren]

This whole issue is much ado about nothing. It won't change a thing. It's the cause celebre for these grandstanding politicians. You allow yourself to be manipulated by the MSM. It's all political theater. Charleston was a tragedy for sure. But, where are these brave politicians who send millions of young boys and girls off to die in wars built on lies. Like Stalin said, "One person dead, a tragedy. A million dead is a statistic." Keep your eye on the ball. They're experts at this roving shell game.

 

[naturalmwa]

Just another symbol of how the white man has lost his country. We are the new Indians. We won't stand up and fight for our land while it is taken over. It's reverse Manifest Destiny. But with forced diversity being such a huge historical success and all the great models of it currently I for one welcome our new overlords.

Bulworth had a fun solution to this.

 

[TennesseeWaltz1]

Of course it's our business. Racism is everyone's business.

I agree...but this is more than perceived racism.

 

[Lone Clone]

Dude, I'd have to google it. I admit, I've never seen that show. I did, however, watch a lot of the Duke Bros back in the day.

The "Amos 'n' Andy" television series was in the '50s, but what I really was talking about was the radio series, which ran from the late '20s through the early '50s. Before my time. I never heard it, but have read quite a bit about it and have listened to some recorded episodes.

It was incredibly popular. At its peak in the '30s, roughly one-third of the population of the U.S. listened to it six nights a week. .

The radio series was voiced by white actors. The TV series used Black actors.

In both cases, the shows were virtually identical to any situation comedy. The TV series (which I do remember) had some stupid characters, but it also had some "normal" ones -- just like "Life of Riley" or "The Honeymooners." There was some stereotyping, but it wasn't that Blacks were stupid or crooked or anything like that. The TV series wasn't as good as the radio series, and it was more offensive. It sparked some protests; the radio series never did (except among police, after an episode in which Amos was beaten by white cops for no reason).

Don't get me wrong. The dialect is offensive and some of the characters, like Lightnin' will make you cringe. But the radio series depicted a multi-leveled culture, showing Blacks as real people, not just stereotypes.

 

[TennesseeWaltz1]

Just another symbol of how the white man has lost his country. We are the new Indians. We won't stand up and fight for our land while it is taken over. It's reverse Manifest Destiny. But with forced diversity being such a huge historical success and all the great models of it currently I for one welcome our new overlords.

No...I think it is more we have other things to do...like taking care of family and obeying the law...and we will do anything to appease and shut up a constantly bitching 3 year old child so we can get on with it.

 

[theIowaHawk]

I'm guessing that your attention span is pretty short, because we just had an Supreme Court decision pretty similar to this concerning license plates. The Court ruled that Texas can reject the confederate flag on license plates based on the Free Speech clause of the 1st Amendment. Which means that the Constitution does indeed have ruling over things like confederate flags and state owned property. Which also means that you're a complete moron for thinking that this had no perceived relation to the Constitution.

But we all know what your real game is around here. You run around calling people idiots because for whatever reason you don't have enough confidence to base your posts in sound reason instead of 3rd grade insults.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/06/18/politics/confederate-flag-license-plate-scotus-supreme-court-case/

How, seriously, how do you believe those are similar?

You have a sincerely lacking understanding of the case you cited as well as a misunderstood use of analogy.

Your claim: The SCOTUS ruled that a State is allowed to reject the confederate flag. Therefore, what? The flag flying in South Carolina does what? It isn't comparable, they are not the same.

The SCOTUS ruled that license plates are NOT personal first amendment rights, they are the State's, therefore the State can utilize viewpoint discrimination. AT BEST your idea is that the State of S.C. could choose NOT to fly the flag. Well, duh, of course, but that has nothing to do with this thread, or your pathetic comparisons.

Your analogies: "Should states have the right to go back to slavery? Not allow black people to vote? Not allow women the right to buy property? Where is the line?"

All of which would be in clear violation of the Constitution.

Seriously, if you think the case you linked is "pretty similar", I don't know what to say to you. It has one similarity, a confederate flag. There are no other similarities.

But, if you'd like to post it, I'd enjoy reading how the Confederate flag/S.C. issue is rooted in the First Amendment.

 

[lucas80]

Massive flip flopping today. Lindsey Graham has pandered to the rebel flag wavers for decades, and now he's standing with Nikki Haley in removing the flag from the grounds of the the S. Carolina capital building.

 

[naturalmwa]

Massive flip flopping today. Lindsey Graham has pandered to the rebel flag wavers for decades, and now he's standing with Nikki Haley in removing the flag from the grounds of the the S. Carolina capital building.

This is a good thing. We should celebrate that our slower brothers and sisters have finally evolved toward the light.

 

[strummingram]

Massive flip flopping today. Lindsey Graham has pandered to the rebel flag wavers for decades, and now he's standing with Nikki Haley in removing the flag from the grounds of the the S. Carolina capital building.

He's a politician. They pander.

 

[SCHawkFan]

I would call Lindsey's conversion more of an epiphany. The Charleston event woke a lot of people up in the state. People who had not attachment to the flag, but went for years without saying anything against it are speaking out. People who have supported it have changed their minds. Very few are still publicly pro flag. I am guessing support to remove it from the statehouse grounds will be 80-90% in the legislature.

 

[icu81222]

Just another symbol of how the white man has lost his country. We are the new Indians. We won't stand up and fight for our land while it is taken over. It's reverse Manifest Destiny. But with forced diversity being such a huge historical success and all the great models of it currently I for one welcome our new overlords.

WTF?

 

[Aegon_Targaryen]

This is a good thing. We should celebrate that our slower brothers and sisters have finally evolved toward the light.

Now if we can just get the black folks to evolve as well.

 

[Aegon_Targaryen]

I would've hoped a third grader understood the difference between a flag in a State, hoisted under state law would be a significantly different question than allowing direct violations of the Constitution.

The remainder of your quoted post completely moves on from the subject OP I ridiculed and changes the argument from what is, and what isn't a civil rights issue.

Flying a flag isn't in violation, or even in perceived violation, of the Constitution.

They were idiotic analogies, sad that you can't see it.

Argue the issue at hand, don't try to blame worse things.

There you go watching yourself type again.

 

[naturalmwa]

Now if we can just get the black folks to evolve as well.

Perhaps you could pass along your wisdom on this matter.

 

[Aegon_Targaryen]

Perhaps you could pass along your wisdom on this matter.

It was a joke of course, but the black communities have lots of work to do. Whitey isn't going to do it for them.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

I have said it probably should come down...but I can say that...I am a southerner...to be real it isn't any of your business...and I am saying that in a nice way...why should it concern you?

So you're saying only Southerners have a right to an opinion on this?

If you are seceding again, maybe you can say that. Are you?

 

[joelbc1]

In America, it isn't against the law to the Constitution to be stupid.
To me..and it is purely subjective, it is in bad taste to fly "the Confederate flag" for any reason...other than showing folks your you're not very polished. In "the South" it was be like flying a swastika in Skokie. It may not be against the law, but it certainly is in bad taste.
The "stars and bars" and Old Glory seem polar opposites to me. One stands for unity, liberty and freedom for all.......the other represents repression, slavery and libertarianism.
Coincidently tonight, coming home from work, I was passed by a pick-up truck with a couple of young guys road drinking, flying a US flag and the stars and bars from the bed of the truck. It spoke volumes to me. To each their own.

 

[Aegon_Targaryen]

In America, it isn't against the law to the Constitution to be stupid.
To me..and it is purely subjective, it is in bad taste to fly "the Confederate flag" for any reason...other than showing folks your you're not very polished. In "the South" it was be like flying a swastika in Skokie. It may not be against the law, but it certainly is in bad taste.
The "stars and bars" and Old Glory seem polar opposites to me. One stands for unity, liberty and freedom for all.......the other represents repression, slavery and libertarianism.
Coincidently tonight, coming home from work, I was passed by a pick-up truck with a couple of young guys road drinking, flying a US flag and the stars and bars from the bed of the truck. It spoke volumes to me. To each their own.

I kind of agree, the Confederate flag, no matter how you look at it, represents a very bad time in America. I'm not sure why it should be honored.

 

[TennesseeWaltz1]

So you're saying only Southerners have a right to an opinion on this?

If you are seceding again, maybe you can say that. Are you?

So you're saying only Southerners have a right to an opinion on this?

If you are seceding again, maybe you can say that. Are you?

I don't think that is an option...however if you are concerned about racist symbols in the South maybe you should also be concerned about racist symbols elsewhere like streets named after that violent racist Malcolm X.

 

[TennesseeWaltz1]

In America, it isn't against the law to the Constitution to be stupid.
To me..and it is purely subjective, it is in bad taste to fly "the Confederate flag" for any reason...other than showing folks your you're not very polished. In "the South" it was be like flying a swastika in Skokie. It may not be against the law, but it certainly is in bad taste.
The "stars and bars" and Old Glory seem polar opposites to me. One stands for unity, liberty and freedom for all.......the other represents repression, slavery and libertarianism.
Coincidently tonight, coming home from work, I was passed by a pick-up truck with a couple of young guys road drinking, flying a US flag and the stars and bars from the bed of the truck. It spoke volumes to me. To each their own.

I think it is in bad taste to wear Malcolm X shirts around white people...but I will be willing to excuse that stupidity as well Joel...and I am waiting for your impassioned response.