A thought related to the DL and OL rooms ... the role of drowned out voices

[ghostOfHomer777]

Last year, without question, the Hawks were oddly young/inexperienced on BOTH lines.

I was struck when I listened to some of the interviews with the assistant coaches.

With Coach Bell ... since VanValkenburg was the lone veteran last season ... his voice was also the most prominent one in the DL room.

Think about it ... you're in a room full a guys ... one guy essentially knows everything and every other guy is young and doesn't want to sound stupid. Is that really a set up for a lot of learning to happen? The way people learn is by engaging with what they want to learn ... breaking it down, communicating about it, and receiving feedback about it.

With fewer voices being heard - that could impact the rate at which some guys progress (in a negative fashion).

Now ... fast forward a year. Now the word is that a lot more guys are being vocal in the room ... and this also coincides with impressions that that the guys in the room are making great strides.

Coincident? I think not!

Similarly ... look at the dynamic in the OL room last year! Ince was probably more quiet due to personal reasons ... so Shooter and Linderbaum would likely have been the "louder voices" in the OL room. However, at the same time ... the "normal" dynamic was likely thrown a little off-kilter because everybody was getting used to having a new position coach. Thus, the OL room too may have been more quiet than it ordinarily may have otherwise been.

When the room is drowned out by fewer voices ... then that leads increasingly to a scenario where guys are reliant more upon more passive-approaches to learning. Those approaches ARE rarely if ever more effective than more active and engaged strategies.

Again, fast forward a year ... the room isn't dominated by few voices. Guys likely have gotten a lot more used to Barnett. Really does seem like a scenario where guys could be poised for some gains!

 

[The Deplorable Sleeping Dog]

Belichick calls non-athletic past teachers and professors to ascertain, among other things, how the potential draftee learns. Some are visual, some are repetitive, and others learn through hearing. I wonder if that is part of Iowa recruiting. It makes sense to me.

Maybe call the geometry teacher, cuz football is all about geometry and making quick decisions about the geometry in split seconds sometimes. Ask English teachers about reading skills. A kid picks up a book and is able to read and understand it without explanation would need less hands-on direction.

Ghost has a good point about the lines. Last season the AA is probably doing most of the talking a room that's filled with freshmen, RS and true.

 

[chuck285]

Who really gives a sh-- about comments after the games. Win and everyone is happy including this board???JMO

 

[Hawk_4shur]

You can really spin this different ways if you want. Inexperienced guys could be overwhelmed, or they could be hungry to learn. Experienced guys can lead and teach, or they could decide they know what to do and do neither. It's clearly up to the coach to engage with each player and build a constructive learning environment. I think KF is focused on building a coaching staff that can do that.

But, when you are a freshman in the OL and the guy on the other side of the line is a 6 year guy, your assignment doesn't matter a whole lot - you are likely to be dominated.

Hopefully, the Hawks will face fewer super-seniors in the lines and the young guys can get some payback.

 

[ghostOfHomer777]

Who really gives a sh-- about comments after the games. Win and everyone is happy including this board???JMO

What are you talking about? Your comment makes no connection to ANYTHING communicated about/discussed in this thread. ... or, am I missing something? Please explain!

 

[ghostOfHomer777]

You can really spin this different ways if you want. Inexperienced guys could be overwhelmed, or they could be hungry to learn. Experienced guys can lead and teach, or they could decide they know what to do and do neither. It's clearly up to the coach to engage with each player and build a constructive learning environment. I think KF is focused on building a coaching staff that can do that.

But, when you are a freshman in the OL and the guy on the other side of the line is a 6 year guy, your assignment doesn't matter a whole lot - you are likely to be dominated.

Hopefully, the Hawks will face fewer super-seniors in the lines and the young guys can get some payback.

No spin ... it's literally about how guys learn. I'm talking about what happens in the OL room.

If a guy doesn't know what is going on ... his head is going to be spinning. His play will suffer as a result.

When a guy truly understands his responsibility ... understands how to dissect his own film in order to see what he's doing wrong. Then ... when he's getting live reps in practice ... he'll be able to correct things.

I've literally seen it in my class-rooms too. When the class is more "lively" and people are communicating together more ... they learn more. More voices are contributing. I've had quieter classes with more talented individuals ... but if fewer voices dominate ... then they can underperform compared to my livelier/more engaged classes.

 

[iowaflash]

Tristan Wirfs is the best example I can think of in recent times, who after working hard both in the gym and on the field, shows how it can payoff in the NFL (coming through the Iowa program). So how much of selling point/draw has this had so far on future OL recruits? Proctor obviously would be a huge "get" if he commits - at this juncture what would you estimate percentage-wise his lean is towards the Hawks?

 

[kceasthawk]

You can really spin this different ways if you want. Inexperienced guys could be overwhelmed, or they could be hungry to learn. Experienced guys can lead and teach, or they could decide they know what to do and do neither. It's clearly up to the coach to engage with each player and build a constructive learning environment. I think KF is focused on building a coaching staff that can do that.

But, when you are a freshman in the OL and the guy on the other side of the line is a 6 year guy, your assignment doesn't matter a whole lot - you are likely to be dominated.

Hopefully, the Hawks will face fewer super-seniors in the lines and the young guys can get some payback.

I think this is a point thats been undersold from last season. In an unusual year how many 5th and 6th year seniors did our very young OL, and DL face last season? I know Michigan had several. Wouldn't be surprised to see a big jump this season on both sides of the ball....

 

[cmhawks99]

I think this is a point thats been undersold from last season. In an unusual year how many 5th and 6th year seniors did our very young OL, and DL face last season? I now Michigan had several. Wouldn't be surprised to see a big jump this season on both sides of the ball....

I swear until Homer posted it I have never ever considered it. It’s a great point and increases my excitement for next year. We played a LOT of young guys last year… and what’s interesting about that is we’re still a pretty young team now. The offensive & Defensive line has a shit ton of underclassmen still.

Our WR & Rbers should also be getting a significant jump in confidence and understanding and several of those teams, Iowa St being one. Had so many upper class men, it could’ve easily stunted their growth.

 

[The Deplorable Sleeping Dog]

I've literally seen it in my class-rooms too. When the class is more "lively" and people are communicating together more ... they learn more. More voices are contributing. I've had quieter classes with more talented individuals ... but if fewer voices dominate ... then they can underperform compared to my livelier/more engaged classes.

The OL coach talks like he subscribes to this theory. The larger the numbers productively engaged in discussing solutions/improvements substantially increases the likelihood of a better conclusion. It sounds like the room is developing.

We might have another really good center coming from defense.