All charge calls should be reviewed.

[RocknRollface]

For whatever reason college referees can't help themselves from calling charges whenever an offensive and defensive player bump into eachother.

Its been a part of college basketball for so long they just can't let it go.

Watching Rutgers IU game and an IU player steps in front of a Rutgers player as both are running back after a RU rebound. The referee calls a charge.

You never see this bullshit in the nba. Its always a foul on the defense.

There needs to be an intentional focus on stopping this ridiculous charge culture in college basketball.

By forcing them to go to the monitor and rewatch it right away maybe it will help them to understand why they shouldn't be making the call in the first place.

Block should be the default, when in doubt just call a block and move on.

 

[ROCKY MOUNTAIN HAWK]

80-85% of all block-charges should be a block.

It has to be absolutely clear that it was a charge to call it that way imo.

Everything else that’s somewhat questionable should be a block.

 

[RocknRollface]

80-85% of all block-charges should be a block.

It has to be absolutely clear that it was a charge to call it that way imo.

Everything else that’s somewhat questionable should be a block.

Yes, but for whatever reason, these college reffs cannot wrap their minds around this.

They absolutely love to call charges. They can't stop.

It's why you have flopping.

Even when they are supposed to be calling technical fouls for flopping they do the opposite and still call a charge.

The rest of the basketball world has evolved past this charge call fetish but college basketball is stuck 20 years in the past.

 

[NI hawk]

80-85% of all block-charges should be a block.

It has to be absolutely clear that it was a charge to call it that way imo.

Everything else that’s somewhat questionable should be a block.

Absolutely correct. I very seldom ever call a charge. Stop calling charges everytime someone falls down and the damn flops will stop. Too many refs at every level seem to get off on the charge call.
I was watching a HS girls game tonight on you tube between two ranked teams and might have seen the worst charge call ever in the first quarter.
And I have seen some bad ones.

 

[HawkBall23]

(porting this over from the "Other games" thread)

I appreciate what you're going for here, but no way. They spend too much time reviewing things as it is. And on most of those reviews, they get it wrong - or keep it wrong - anyways.

The only way it would possibly work is if they have a dedicated 'review official' who only buzzes them from the table to let them know a call needs reversed or they really need to take a look at it to make sure the call was absolutely right.

 

[RocknRollface]

(porting this over from the "Other games" thread)

I appreciate what you're going for here, but no way. They spend too much time reviewing things as it is. And on most of those reviews, they get it wrong - or keep it wrong - anyways.

The only way it would possibly work is if they have a dedicated 'review official' who only buzzes them from the 'table' to let them know a call needs reversed or they really need to take a look at it to make sure the call was absolutely right.

Well the idea is to eventually make a charge call next to non existent.

At first it would be brutal but hopefully by being forced to rewatch all their idiotic decisions to reward flopping it will reprogram them to stop calling charges.

I was also thinking that they would eventually stop calling charges just to avoid the reviews.

But you may have a point in that guys like Larry scirato love doing reviews for the attention and don't really care about what's right.

 

[HawkBall23]

I just think that with the 'ultra physicality allowed' mindset that refs who officiate B1G games seem to think is a law governed unto itself, they wouldn't treat this the way it should be or outright abuse it.


I find myself wondering which is the most physical sport in the B1G conference; football or basketball? For instance, watching bigs back down other bigs in the paint is a lot times reminiscent of watching sumo wrestlers trading body blows to try and move their opponent outside the ring.

 

[Hawkfan5220]

I completely disagree, "block should be the default ", no....just no. Using the NBA as any comparison when talking about any subject involving defense is absurd. I see far far more calls that should be a charge and not a block than the other way around.

same goes for jump/tie balls. It's getting F'ing ridiculous that everything is automatically called jump ball if a defensive player touches the ball. Earlier this season I saw Warnock get hammered to the point blood was drawn and they called jump ball.

 

[ZumaHawk]

I understand your thought here but when the big man pounds his shoulder 3 times into the chest on purpose it is not a block. I also agree with the other poster about the game is long enough the way it is let alone reviewing more calls.

 

[TampaHawkfan]

I understand your thought here but when the big man pounds his shoulder 3 times into the chest on purpose it is not a block. I also agree with the other poster about the game is long enough the way it is let alone reviewing more calls.

Same. I personally kind of despise the whole review process. Even if I thought they got the call right more than half the time even after reviewing it, I still have no interest in watching sports if it means everyone stands around while they review every other play. Yawn.

I understand the "get it right" perspective, but all the reviews kill it for me at a certain point. Let's not add more of that.

 

[texas twister]

By video reviewing all the charge/block calls, the game can then last for 4 hours. How wonderful.

 

[hknation]

It seems that ref's try to "sell" some chgr calls by their exaggerated motions in signaling the chgr call. If it's a easy chgr call, much less theatrics.
It also seems the chgr call appears to be used as a "make-up" call for a prior recent bad call.
IMHO, there is charging happening, but the inconsistencies need to addressed. I wish I knew how.

 

[unipanther1999]

The overwhelming majority of fouls called are blocks and illegal use of hands by the defense. Most blocks are called blocks, but they're so uncontroversial as to not even register in the average fan's mind --- so they tend to think charges are called more commonly than they actually are. If you have 35 fouls called in a game, maybe 2-3 of them are charges. The rest are blocks, illegal use of hands, a push, and maybe one or two illegal screens.

Most charges are actually charges by rule. The defense doesn't have to be "set," as long as they've established legal guarding position, they have a right to be there and not be displaced by the offense. If you don't like that, I guess you should lobby to change the rule, but I don't think it would benefit the game.

 

[hawkjt]

Saw a flopping call last nite go against RU in the IU game.
Very rare call these days.
I disagreed with the call.
RU guy shot a contested three and fell down. He was leaning back and appeared to lose his balance.
It should have been no call.
So many more egregious flops on drives and in the post should be called.

 

[HawkBall23]

I understand your thought here but when the big man pounds his shoulder 3 times into the chest on purpose it is not a block. I also agree with the other poster about the game is long enough the way it is let alone reviewing more calls.

I never said it was or should be an automatic block call.

My point is watching two guys throw their bodies into each other multiple times is just not fun to watch, imo, unless you are a sumo wrestling fan. Etiher make a real move to get around the defender for a shot attempt or pass the ball out. Also a lot easier to draw a foul if make an actual move instead of just bodying up.

 

[RocknRollface]

Same. I personally kind of despise the whole review process. Even if I thought they got the call right more than half the time even after reviewing it, I still have no interest in watching sports if it means everyone stands around while they review every other play. Yawn.

I understand the "get it right" perspective, but all the reviews kill it for me at a certain point. Let's not add more of that.

I hate reviews too but I hate college basketballs charge infatuation more.

Probably 90% of charge calls are actually flops, defensive fouls or no calls.

My thought was that hopefully they would learn on the job after a few months realizing that what they think they are seeing is incorrect and just stop calling charges.

A charge call should be about as frequent as a 3 second call.

The benefit of the doubt should go to the offense not the guy that falls down.

 

[ChiPackHawk]

For whatever reason college referees can't help themselves from calling charges whenever an offensive and defensive player bump into eachother.

Its been a part of college basketball for so long they just can't let it go.

Watching Rutgers IU game and an IU player steps in front of a Rutgers player as both are running back after a RU rebound. The referee calls a charge.

You never see this bullshit in the nba. Its always a foul on the defense.

There needs to be an intentional focus on stopping this ridiculous charge culture in college basketball.

By forcing them to go to the monitor and rewatch it right away maybe it will help them to understand why they shouldn't be making the call in the first place.

Block should be the default, when in doubt just call a block and move on.

How long do you want games to go?

 

[RocknRollface]

The overwhelming majority of fouls called are blocks and illegal use of hands by the defense. Most blocks are called blocks, but they're so uncontroversial as to not even register in the average fan's mind --- so they tend to think charges are called more commonly than they actually are. If you have 35 fouls called in a game, maybe 2-3 of them are charges. The rest are blocks, illegal use of hands, a push, and maybe one or two illegal screens.

Most charges are actually charges by rule. The defense doesn't have to be "set," as long as they've established legal guarding position, they have a right to be there and not be displaced by the offense. If you don't like that, I guess you should lobby to change the rule, but I don't think it would benefit the game.

I can't possibly disagree more.

It has nothing to do with the rule and everything to do with real time interpretation.

No where did I say anything about needing to be "set".

Most charge calls are defensive fouls, flops, or should just be no calls.

Legal guarding position is completely open to interpretation when both players are moving.

Defaulting to the guy that falls down is stupid. But college players know if you fall down more than likely you get the charge.

College basketball officiating needs a mindset change.

They keep trying to change the rules to weed this crap out but the problem stems from the fact thst refferees have been conditioned for decades to reward players for falling down.

The assumption should always be a flop if someone falls down. The benefit of the doubt should always go to the offense.

Its the only way to get rid of it.

 

[RocknRollface]

How long do you want games to go?

As long as it takes to teach the referees to stop calling charges.

 

[Iafootballfan]

College basketball has to get rid of defenders stepping in front of the offense at the last minute and flopping, to me that is the biggest issue with charges. I do however believe that a post-player should not be able to just barge into the defender on the block to back them down, if the defender is in legal guarding position I would call that a charge every time.

 

[unipanther1999]

The assumption should always be a flop if someone falls down. The benefit of the doubt should always go to the offense.

Its the only way to get rid of it.

I've seen this occur many times. I'm sure when there is no foul called, and 14,999 fans in CHA are screaming for a charge, you're standing up and telling those around you that it was ackchyually not a foul.

 

[RocknRollface]

I've seen this occur many times. I'm sure when there is no foul called, and 14,999 fans in CHA are screaming for a charge, you're standing up and telling those around you that it was ackchyually not a foul.

Whether I say it or not I know the defender choose to fall down to get the call.

Im not saying every contact between defender and ballhandler is a foul, if the offensive player is initiating the contact but still under control then it shouldn't be a whistle.

 

[Kinnick 4 Prez]

No replays.
Get rid of all of them.
Replay has killed March Madness. There’s no flow to the games at the end.

NO REPLAYS IN ANY SPORT.

 

[pocha444444]

I completely disagree, "block should be the default ", no....just no. Using the NBA as any comparison when talking about any subject involving defense is absurd. I see far far more calls that should be a charge and not a block than the other way around.

same goes for jump/tie balls. It's getting F'ing ridiculous that everything is automatically called jump ball if a defensive player touches the ball. Earlier this season I saw Warnock get hammered to the point blood was drawn and they called jump ball.

Ah the old and tired "they don't play defense in the NBA" take. There's a reason Garza was player of the year in college and barely sees the floor in the NBA, and it ain't because of offense.

I do agree with your second paragraph though, college refs are way too whistle happy with the jump balls. Half the time it's just a blocked shot and should be a play on.

 

[ChiPackHawk]

Whether I say it or not I know the defender choose to fall down to get the call.

Im not saying every contact between defender and ballhandler is a foul, if the offensive player is initiating the contact but still under control then it shouldn't be a whistle.

So you're saying someone like LeBron should just have a free pass to drive to the basket? The game will become a layup contest.

 

[RocknRollface]

So you're saying someone like LeBron should just have a free pass to drive to the basket? The game will become a layup contest.

Well there's never been anyone close to him before or after and probably never will be. He actually gets fouled more than anyone without a call.

But no I'm saying falling down is not a charge in college basketball.

If the offensive player initiates contact the defensive player can hold their ground.

All contact doesn't need to be a foul on either player. The problem is falling down has been incentivized now.

I want to see the falling down charge calls gone.

But generally basketball should be geared twoards offense, not grabbing bumping, holding and flopping.

 

[NI hawk]

No replays.
Get rid of all of them.
Replay has killed March Madness. There’s no flow to the games at the end.

NO REPLAYS IN ANY SPORT.

I do hate replays.

 

[ChiPackHawk]

Well there's never been anyone close to him before or after and probably never will be. He actually gets fouled more than anyone without a call.

But no I'm saying falling down is not a charge in college basketball.

If the offensive player initiates contact the defensive player can hold their ground.

All contact doesn't need to be a foul on either player. The problem is falling down has been incentivized now.

I want to see the falling down charge calls gone.

But generally basketball should be geared twoards offense, not grabbing bumping, holding and flopping.

You know exactly what I mean about LeBron - someone who can take it to the basket and is strong enough to absorb contact. You say "hold their ground". I know you are bright enough to be aware that a moving force is going to push the stationary position backwards. What about when the offensive player drops their shoulder and creates space this way? Is that OK too? I don't care how hard they try to hold their ground. It may even knock them down. I would rather the officials work to get it right than have the game become a version of the NBA All-Star game.

LeBron also bitches about calls seemingly every time he does go to the basket. That is exactly what you would end getting in your scenario.

 

[RocknRollface]

You know exactly what I mean about LeBron - someone who can take it to the basket and is strong enough to absorb contact. You say "hold their ground". I know you are bright enough to be aware that a moving force is going to push the stationary position backwards. What about when the offensive player drops their shoulder and creates space this way? Is that OK too? I don't care how hard they try to hold their ground. It may even knock them down. I would rather the officials work to get it right than have the game become a version of the NBA All-Star game.

LeBron also bitches about calls seemingly every time he does go to the basket. That is exactly what you would end getting in your scenario.

Bitching about calls has nothing to do with anything. Most of the players already do that. Watch Rebraca for instance.

The nba officiating is vastly superior to college which results in a vastly more open and entertaining game.

 

[ChiPackHawk]

Bitching about calls has nothing to do with anything. Most of the players already do that. Watch Rebraca for instance.

The nba officiating is vastly superior to college which results in a vastly more open and entertaining game.

You're not going to discuss my comments that basic physics support? It's funny that you don't think there is flopping in the NBA. And I'm also fully aware that "bitching" has nothing to do with it. Just an observation of King James.

 

[RocknRollface]

You're not going to discuss my comments that basic physics support? It's funny that you don't think there is flopping in the NBA. And I'm also fully aware that "bitching" has nothing to do with it. Just an observation of King James.

Currently most charge calls are flops, defensive fouls or should be no calls IMO.

If an offensive player runs into a defensive player then it becomes a judgment call on the reffs.

If a player falls down 99 percent of the time they choose to do it.

Id rather err on the side of the offensive player.

The amount of times an offensive player actually puts their shoulder into a defender with enough force to knock them out of the way is very rare.

It does happen obviously, usually on the post, and then you review it and if it still looks like a charge so be it.

 

[Buffalo43]

Yes, but for whatever reason, these college reffs cannot wrap their minds around this.

They absolutely love to call charges. They can't stop.

It's why you have flopping.

Even when they are supposed to be calling technical fouls for flopping they do the opposite and still call a charge.

The rest of the basketball world has evolved past this charge call fetish but college basketball is stuck 20 years in the past.

They get bored of a clean game and need to hit their quota

 

[Buffalo43]

Flopping what's that? Lol it was big in November but lost its luster the refs get more ratings from calling the charge

 

[Obviously Oblivious]

It's the biggest officiating dilemma in CBB. IMO most should be no-calls and just play on.

 

[amahawk]

For whatever reason college referees can't help themselves from calling charges whenever an offensive and defensive player bump into eachother.

Its been a part of college basketball for so long they just can't let it go.

Watching Rutgers IU game and an IU player steps in front of a Rutgers player as both are running back after a RU rebound. The referee calls a charge.

You never see this bullshit in the nba. Its always a foul on the defense.

There needs to be an intentional focus on stopping this ridiculous charge culture in college basketball.

By forcing them to go to the monitor and rewatch it right away maybe it will help them to understand why they shouldn't be making the call in the first place.

Block should be the default, when in doubt just call a block and move on.

4 hour games