Biden forgetful, confused and dishonest on sanctions and deterrence.

FAUlty Gator

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On Feb. 24, the day Russia invaded Ukraine, President JOE BIDEN told reporters to give him a month to see if the sanctions would eventually stop VLADIMIR PUTIN. Well, it’s been a month, and now he’s vigorously defending the sanctions-first plan when asked about it on the one-month anniversary of the war.

“I did not say that in fact the sanctions would deter him. Sanctions never deter,” he insisted during a Thursday news conference following an extraordinary NATO summit. The point of the economic punishment threatened before the incursion, and now imposed, “is to be sure that after a month, we will sustain what we’re doing not just next month, the following month, but for the remainder of this entire year. That’s what will stop him.”

NatSec Daily’s eyebrows raised after hearing that, and they moved closer to our collective hairline after looking back at administration statements from earlier this year.

“The purpose of those sanctions is to deter Russian aggression,” Secretary of State ANTONY BLINKEN said in January, adding “if they’re triggered now, you lose the deterrent effect.”

Here’s one more for good measure, linking Biden directly to this argument: “The president believes that sanctions are intended to deter,” national security adviser JAKE SULLIVAN stated in February.

We’ve spoken to U.S. officials about this for weeks now, not just since Biden’s remarks in Brussels yesterday. The general argument we hear is one Vox’s DYLAN MATTHEWS tweeted on Feb. 24: The administration believed Putin was likely to invade even with the threat of sanctions. The hope was showing the Kremlin that the U.S. and its allies would impose penalties together might lower the chance of troops crossing into Ukraine, but not eliminate it.

Two hours later that same day, White House press secretary JEN PSAKI pushed the same line. Making up numbers to illustrate her point, she said “if there’s a 95 percent chance of Russia invading without the threat of sanctions … and a 65 percent chance that they will with them, you’re obviously going to go with the threat of sanctions because you want to reduce the threat of an invasion. So, there is a deterrent.”

But Republicans don’t see it that way. OMRI CEREN, Sen. TED CRUZ’s (R-Texas) national security adviser, has openly called out the administration for changing its tune. He wrote an extensive Twitter thread showing nine separate instances in which Biden’s team made the sanctions-as-deterrence argument. Other right-leaning officials and experts have piled on, with the Hudson Institute’s REBECCAH HEINRICHS tweeting, “Biden supporting natsec commentators repeatedly made this case and said those calling for sanctions before the invasion ‘failed to understand deterrence.’”

We went back to the White House as the sanctions deterrence debate is being relitigated once again. Per a spokesperson, “we said all along that if Putin was willing to bear the cost of crippling his economy, weakening Russia’s strategic position, and isolating himself from the world, that was a choice he could make.”

In other words, the U.S. and its allies gave Putin a choice: Don’t invade, or else. The problem, of course, is that Putin chose “or else,” leading to the devastating scenes in Ukraine and Russia’s collapsing economy.

To NatSec Daily, that sounds like an admission that the U.S.-led sanctions plan didn’t work. But the question remains: Would Russia have invaded no matter what the West did? The president and his team seem to be arguing that.
 

mnole03

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Weird. I mean…he’s doing so great with all of this.
He is handling this extremely well. That’s what drives Republicans nuts. Biden has done everything with NATO that Trumped talked about. The United States and the EU are closer than ever. Russia has been exposed. China won’t commit to them. The United States is stronger than ever.
 

FAUlty Gator

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He is handling this extremely well. That’s what drives Republicans nuts. Biden has done everything with NATO that Trumped talked about. The United States and the EU are closer than ever. Russia has been exposed. China won’t commit to them. The United States is stronger than ever.
So was he wrong then when he said the sanctions were for deterrence (that didn’t work) or was he wrong yesterday when he said he never said they were about deterrence?
 
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Torg

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So was he wrong then when he said the sanctions were for deterrence (that didn’t work) or was he wrong yesterday when he said he never said they were about deterrence?
Good grief. I suppose you would rather have Trump?

He is doing as good as anyone can.
 
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mnole03

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So was he wrong then when he said the sanctions were for deterrence (that didn’t work) or was he wrong yesterday when he said he never said they were about deterrence?
I don’t care what he said. You guys are looking so hard for fault, and we’ve handled the whole situation brilliantly. Go back to blaming him for his inflation or something that actually matters.
 

Torg

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Yeah…we should just completely stop paying attention to shit because Trump is gone now. Good idea.

Criticism is ok but it should be limited to important stuff. Can you imagine the outrage of any criticism of 'W" after 9-11? Basically, Democrats fell in line because they have a much deeper concern with the USA.

All conservatives can think about is how to destroy a Democrat so they can somehow make a bigger profit.
 
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FAUlty Gator

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Criticism is ok but it should be limited to important stuff. Can you imagine the outrage of any criticism of 'W" after 9-11? Basically, Democrats fell in line because they have a much deeper concern with the USA.

All conservatives can think about is how to destroy a Democrat so they can somehow make a bigger profit.
So, he claims sanctions are strong and going to deter Russia from invading Ukraine.

Russia invades Ukraine, despite the sanctions.

He gets asked about it.

He says, “What are you people talking about deterrence? I never said anything about deterrence.”

30 examples of him and his staff are used to show that he did say deterrence several times.

This all gets pointed out.

You guys freak out and flail around because it gets pointed out…and naturally mention Trump.

To summarize: the sanctions didn’t do what Biden hoped they would do and now he’s lying about it. And now you’re all defending him on it.
 
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Torg

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So, he claims sanctions are strong and going to deter Russia from invading Ukraine.

Russia invades Ukraine, despite the sanctions.

He gets asked about it.

He says, “What are you people talking about deterrence? I never said anything about deterrence.”

30 examples of him and his staff are used to show that he did say deterrence several times.

This all gets pointed out.

You guys freak out and flail around because it gets pointed out…and naturally mention Trump.

To summarize: the sanctions didn’t do what Biden hoped they would do and now he’s lying about it. And now you’re all defending him on it.
You have spent years defending Trump, so FU.
 
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Keehawk

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The only positive of Biden is that he is not Trump. And that is plenty for the left on this board. Biden can be the 2nd worst president of all time and they'd continue the praise and worship.
 
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BioHawk

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So was he wrong then when he said the sanctions were for deterrence (that didn’t work) or was he wrong yesterday when he said he never said they were about deterrence?
Who cares? What's the alternative? So Joe is playing politics here. BFD. It's pretty clear nobody wants to be in a direct war with Russia. That limits our options on how to handle this. Yet another article bitching about sanctions yet nothing that proposes any other possible method of handling this situation. It's easy to throw stones when you don't have to have any answers.
 
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FAUlty Gator

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Who cares? What's the alternative? So Joe is playing politics here. BFD. It's pretty clear nobody wants to be in a direct war with Russia. That limits our options on how to handle this. Yet another article bitching about sanctions yet nothing that proposes any other possible method of handling this situation. It's easy to throw stones when you don't have to have any answers.
Yeah…who cares if it’s pointed out?

So funny: You guys are all so sensitive now about presidential screw ups.

I mean, everything has been the chicken little act for the last 5 years…except for now when we are dealing with a madman and nukes and war crimes and possible WW3. Now it’s “Who gives a shit?”

I mean, cut voting back to a three week window and it’s “the end of democracy”. But losing your shit on the world stage while a maniac with nukes stares you down? “Who cares?!? It’s not Trump!”
 
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Tom Paris

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Yeah…who cares if it’s pointed out?

So funny: You guys are all so sensitive now about presidential screw ups.

I mean, everything has been the chicken little act for the last 5 years…except for now when we are dealing with a madman and nukes and war crimes and possible WW3. Now it’s “Who gives a shit?”

I mean, cut voting back to a three week window and it’s “the end of democracy”. But losing your shit on the world stage while a maniac with nukes stares you down? “Who cares?!? It’s not Trump!”
Here we go with the false equivalency bullshit again. Biden lied. It's the same as the 30,000 Trump pulled. Right? This is the same? Start with the lies about Covid... that killed tens of thousands of Americans. How about his big lie...the one that is ripping this nation apart? You goddamned idiot.
 

FAUlty Gator

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How many Americans are going to die from this? Zero...so no, not the same thing.
How many Ukranians have died? The sanctions were supposed to DETER that, remember? It’s the point of the OP, that has gone whizzing over your head. Oh wait…Biden says he never said that. So…it just not be the case. Those deaths don’t count! Biden gets a do over!
 
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Tom Paris

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How many Ukranians have died? The sanctions were supposed to DETER that, remember? It’s the point of the OP, that has gone whizzing over your head. Oh wait…Biden says he never said that. So…it just not be the case. Those deaths don’t count! Biden gets a do over!
Ohhhhhh...so you blame Biden for Putin murdering Ukrainians. You're pathetic.
 

FAUlty Gator

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Ohhhhhh...so you blame Biden for Putin murdering Ukrainians. You're pathetic.
You’re an idiot. Certified.

How about this? Did Biden and his administration say the sanctions were a deterrent? Yes or No?

Follow up: Is Biden now wrong when he says he never said it (Trick question)?

These are the issues brought up in the OP. And you and the rest have decided to discuss everything except those things. And we know why that is. It’ll be OK. Just swallow the reality and move on. That’s all there is to it.
 
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KFSuperStar

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How many Americans are going to die from this? Zero...so no, not the same thing.
Americans have died because of the Russian invasion. Americans will continue to die. Citizens of every country will die. Nothing kills like poverty. Nothing drives poverty like high food and energy costs. Fertilizer up 400%. Iowa farmer-meh. Sudan farmer won’t use fertilizer this year. Yields will suffer. The world is gonna see famine like we haven’t seen since the 1990s. Inflation is just getting started.
 
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ihhawk

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Maybe one day we will have a POTUS that is able to speak and not have the clean up crew immediately release an official White House statement. That goes for Trump and Biden.

we are fortunate that the world knows Biden has dementia and only knows what he is doing 50% of the time.
 

billanole

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Yeah…who cares if it’s pointed out?

So funny: You guys are all so sensitive now about presidential screw ups.

I mean, everything has been the chicken little act for the last 5 years…except for now when we are dealing with a madman and nukes and war crimes and possible WW3. Now it’s “Who gives a shit?”

I mean, cut voting back to a three week window and it’s “the end of democracy”. But losing your shit on the world stage while a maniac with nukes stares you down? “Who cares?!? It’s not Trump!”
Do you feel that Biden has made moves that were effective?
You continue to look for poor performance while he has helped to create/work with a very effective partnership in stoning the Russian forces.
This has heretofore kept us out of direct military conflict with Russia.
What is your point, again?
 

Funky Bunch

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So, he claims sanctions are strong and going to deter Russia from invading Ukraine.

Russia invades Ukraine, despite the sanctions.

He gets asked about it.

He says, “What are you people talking about deterrence? I never said anything about deterrence.”

30 examples of him and his staff are used to show that he did say deterrence several times.

This all gets pointed out.

You guys freak out and flail around because it gets pointed out…and naturally mention Trump.

To summarize: the sanctions didn’t do what Biden hoped they would do and now he’s lying about it. And now you’re all defending him on it.

This is just not true. From that same "let's talk in a month" PC on Feb 24:

Q Thank you, sir. Sir, sanctions clearly have not been enough to deter Vladimir Putin to this point. What is going to stop him? How and when does this end? And do you see him trying to go beyond Ukraine?

And a second question I’ll just give to you now: This statement that he gave last night will — that the We- — the threat that he gave — the West “will face consequences greater than any you have faced in history.” Is he threatening a nuclear strike?

THE PRESIDENT: I have no idea what he’s threatening. I know what he has done, number one.

And number two, no one expected the sanctions to prevent anything from happening. That has to sh- — this is going to take time. And we have to show resolve so he knows what’s coming and so the people of Russia know what he’s brought on them. That’s what this is all about.

This is going to take time. It’s not going to occur — he’s going to say, “Oh my God, these sanctions are coming. I’m going to stand down.”

He’s going to test the resolve of the West to see if we stay together. And we will. We will and it will impose significant costs on him.


Nobody reads around here once again
 
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Tom Paris

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You’re an idiot. Certified.

How about this? Did Biden and his administration say the sanctions were a deterrent? Yes or No?

Follow up: Is Biden now wrong when he says he never said it (Trick question)?

These are the issues brought up in the OP. And you and the rest have decided to discuss everything except those things. And we know why that is. It’ll be OK. Just swallow the reality and move on. That’s all there is to it.
Projection. You come up with the same nonsense week after week. I, and others, tell you what it is you're doing. Instead of having any epiphany about it, you continue on. You also NEVER admit you're wrong about anything. I'm not arguing that Biden was wrong about his deterrent comment. The fact that you have been waiting for something like this to pounce on makes you sound just like a MAGA moron, which you get closer to all the time.

YOU were the one doing your stupid false equivalency thing and now you are implying people are dying in Ukraine because of Biden. It's effing asinine. YOU shouldn't be calling anyone an idiot. Not until you gain ANY level of self awareness. Good Lord.
 
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Tom Paris

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Yeah…who cares if it’s pointed out?

So funny: You guys are all so sensitive now about presidential screw ups.

I mean, everything has been the chicken little act for the last 5 years…except for now when we are dealing with a madman and nukes and war crimes and possible WW3. Now it’s “Who gives a shit?”

I mean, cut voting back to a three week window and it’s “the end of democracy”. But losing your shit on the world stage while a maniac with nukes stares you down? “Who cares?!? It’s not Trump!”
This right here is what I am talking about...you're comparing Dem reactions with thousands of lies by Trump in his 4 years in The White House, that got AMERICANS killed, with a "lie" by Biden 14 months into his Presidency!

You REALLY can't see the difference? Are you effing serious?? Biden is NOT responsible for Putin attacking Ukraine any more than he is for gas prices.

Right here, in this very post, you did you...create a false equivalency. Get a damn clue.