Biden Ukraine call…didn’t go well

noleclone2

HR Legend
May 4, 2015
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I've said it before and will say again, fascinating to watch the far right/MAGA lovers put forth two completely opposite poutrages on on Biden and Russia /Ukraine. One hour it's "why would we have a war with Russia" and supporting Putin (ala people like Tucker Carlson) and the next hour it is "Biden is a pussy and is going to totally let Russia have Ukraine"
 

Tom Paris

HR Legend
Gold Member
Oct 1, 2001
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Our president, the defender of the free world, told Ukraine's president to prepare for Kyiv to be sacked, and oh by the way, we're not sending any troops to help.

How is that not a big deal?
I thought you didn't want any troops there. Why are you upset by this? Oh yeah, Biden is a Democrat.
 
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Tom Paris

HR Legend
Gold Member
Oct 1, 2001
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I've said it before and will say again, fascinating to watch the far right/MAGA lovers put forth two completely opposite poutrages on on Biden and Russia /Ukraine. One hour it's "why would we have a war with Russia" and supporting Putin (ala people like Tucker Carlson) and the next hour it is "Biden is a pussy and is going to totally let Russia have Ukraine"
They, just like McConnell tells them, will be opposite of whatever Biden does. Biden could give them all of their taxes back and they'd find a way to be pissed about it.
 

seminole97

HR Legend
Jun 14, 2005
15,175
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Russia is trying to make Ukraine a "puppet" country.
So we should beat them to the punch?
Nah

None of the EU nations are trying to "force" Ukraine into being a NATO ally.
Hence Nuland saying, “**** the EU” when talking with our ambassador in Ukraine back in 2014 while going over who would be installed as leader after the coup (which came about three weeks later).

The situation is not a "both sides" thing here.
Yeah, there are at least four sides.
Russia
Ukraine
EU
US

Guess who wasn’t invited to the Normandy talks…
 

Joes Place

HR King
Aug 28, 2003
117,846
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By fomenting a coup and backing a leader who will align with us instead of the one elected by the Ukrainian people.
No, instead of the one controlled by Putin and his oligarchs.

You seem to really struggle with kleptocracies and how bad they are for democracies, everywhere.
 
Mar 11, 2020
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What a ****ing shit show.

We have been relegated to the kids table and yet will be asked to do the heavy lifting if needed. We are the useful idiot here.
 

seminole97

HR Legend
Jun 14, 2005
15,175
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We'd have to ask the Republicans the best way to attempt a coup.
GOP admin successfully managed the coup in Iran, that puppet government lasted a few decades.
Democrats got behind the coup government in South Vietnam, but I’m not sure how much U.S. fingerprints were on that coup. Probably more winking and nodding to the generals than sitting in the driver’s seat.
So far the coup in Ukraine hasn’t had great results, unless war in Europe is a feature, not a bug.
 
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Menace Sockeyes

HR Legend
Sep 2, 2010
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No but he threatened to withhold a billions dollars if they didn't fire a judge who was investigating his son..........
You do realize that's been debunked, right? So did you knowingly lie, or were you just misinformed?...

When Biden had his now-famous showdown with Ukraine President Petro Poroshenko in 2015, he was delivering a message not only from the United States, but from the International Monetary Fund and the European Union. All three entities were focused on curtailing corruption in Ukraine, and all three were deeply suspicious that Poroshenko’s prosecutor was playing a familiar game of tamping down investigations as a form of political favoritism.

By all credible accounts, the prosecutor had slow-walked the investigation of the energy company that hired Biden’s son; so, if anything, the prosecutor was doing the Bidens a favor. Getting rid of him would do the opposite.

 

noleclone2

HR Legend
May 4, 2015
12,944
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You do realize that's been debunked, right? So did you knowingly lie, or were you just misinformed?...

When Biden had his now-famous showdown with Ukraine President Petro Poroshenko in 2015, he was delivering a message not only from the United States, but from the International Monetary Fund and the European Union. All three entities were focused on curtailing corruption in Ukraine, and all three were deeply suspicious that Poroshenko’s prosecutor was playing a familiar game of tamping down investigations as a form of political favoritism.

By all credible accounts, the prosecutor had slow-walked the investigation of the energy company that hired Biden’s son; so, if anything, the prosecutor was doing the Bidens a favor. Getting rid of him would do the opposite.

It’s both.
 
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Feb 9, 2013
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You do realize that's been debunked, right? So did you knowingly lie, or were you just misinformed?...

When Biden had his now-famous showdown with Ukraine President Petro Poroshenko in 2015, he was delivering a message not only from the United States, but from the International Monetary Fund and the European Union. All three entities were focused on curtailing corruption in Ukraine, and all three were deeply suspicious that Poroshenko’s prosecutor was playing a familiar game of tamping down investigations as a form of political favoritism.

By all credible accounts, the prosecutor had slow-walked the investigation of the energy company that hired Biden’s son; so, if anything, the prosecutor was doing the Bidens a favor. Getting rid of him would do the opposite.

This shit never dies.
 

Tom Paris

HR Legend
Gold Member
Oct 1, 2001
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GOP admin successfully managed the coup in Iran, that puppet government lasted a few decades.
Democrats got behind the coup government in South Vietnam, but I’m not sure how much U.S. fingerprints were on that coup. Probably more winking and nodding to the generals than sitting in the driver’s seat.
So far the coup in Ukraine hasn’t had great results, unless war in Europe is a feature, not a bug.
Why go all the way back to Vietnam? How about the current coup that is happening within our own country?
 

seminole97

HR Legend
Jun 14, 2005
15,175
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Iran is a "success" in your mind?
Our intervention in Iran was and is a disastrous failure.

The coup the overthrow their elected government and replace it with a puppet began in the Eisenhower administration and lasted through Kennedy, LBJ, Nixon, Ford, and then Carter until he decided America shouldn’t try to support the Shah.
The coup established government lasted a quarter of a century. I’d reckon that’s pretty long in the tooth for how those things tend to go and the coup itself could only be measured a success.
Of the American people who decided to do it, how many were still alive when it collapsed?
 

Joes Place

HR King
Aug 28, 2003
117,846
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Our intervention in Iran was and is a disastrous failure.

The coup the overthrow their elected government and replace it with a puppet began in the Eisenhower administration and lasted through Kennedy, LBJ, Nixon, Ford, and then Carter until he decided America shouldn’t try to support the Shah.

So, how is letting Ukraine elect their own people "bad" then?
When Putin had put his oligarchs in charge, and we helped toss them out...
 

seminole97

HR Legend
Jun 14, 2005
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So, how is letting Ukraine elect their own people "bad" then?
I didn’t say it was.
The president overthrown in the coup was elected.

When Putin had put his oligarchs in charge, and we helped toss them out...
He was elected in 2010.

International observers and the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe have called the election transparent and honest.
 
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RileyHawk

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Aug 21, 2002
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I didn’t say it was.
The president overthrown in the coup was elected.


He was elected in 2010.

International observers and the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe have called the election transparent and honest.
You mean the guy who wanted to get closer to Russia and was ultimately removed from office? And later sentenced to 13 years for treason? LOL
 
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Joes Place

HR King
Aug 28, 2003
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You mean the guy who wanted to get closer to Russia and was ultimately removed from office? And later sentenced to 13 years for treason? LOL

He seems to want to continue to sidestep the simple fact that Putin has been trying to put oligarchs in place for the past decade(s).

And that they are mostly a state-run mafia, that the rest of Europe wants nothing to do with.
Because Western democracies are tired of ransom-ware attacks subsidized by the Russian state.
 
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83Hawk

HR Legend
Sep 17, 2002
19,987
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I wish I could find a link to the Pat Oliphant political cartoon of a very small Jimmy Carter and very large Leonid Brezhnev sitting at a table with Brezhnev yelling “You’ll whip my WHAT?” to Carter. Fits this situation perfectly. (for you children on this board, this was a poke at Carter for his comment back in the late ‘70s that he would whip Ted Kennedy’s a*s)
 

seminole97

HR Legend
Jun 14, 2005
15,175
15,341
113
I wish I could find a link to the Pat Oliphant political cartoon of a very small Jimmy Carter and very large Leonid Brezhnev sitting at a table with Brezhnev yelling “You’ll whip my WHAT?” to Carter. Fits this situation perfectly. (for you children on this board, this was a poke at Carter for his comment back in the late ‘70s that he would whip Ted Kennedy’s a*s)
M7whLSC.png
 

ihhawk

HR Legend
Gold Member
Feb 4, 2004
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Fort Lauderdale
None of them ever do.
CNN tweets out that the call didn’t go well. CNN deletes the tweet. Ukraine PM holds a press conference…which he absolutely throws barbs and shade at Biden. The White House of course won’t release the transcript of the call. Ukraine says everything is fine yet Biden approved troops to go over there.

So what the hell is going on? It absolutely appears that the USA and Ukraine doesn’t have a clear and consistent message
 

abby97

HR All-American
Sep 16, 2010
3,234
2,639
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You do realize that's been debunked, right? So did you knowingly lie, or were you just misinformed?...

When Biden had his now-famous showdown with Ukraine President Petro Poroshenko in 2015, he was delivering a message not only from the United States, but from the International Monetary Fund and the European Union. All three entities were focused on curtailing corruption in Ukraine, and all three were deeply suspicious that Poroshenko’s prosecutor was playing a familiar game of tamping down investigations as a form of political favoritism.

By all credible accounts, the prosecutor had slow-walked the investigation of the energy company that hired Biden’s son; so, if anything, the prosecutor was doing the Bidens a favor. Getting rid of him would do the opposite.

Sure. Sure.......
 

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