Are you on academic scholarship at Iowa?
Brooks to PSU
- Thread starter therasslinfan
- Start date
FLO's big board, Class of 2018:
Iowa -
#17 Cassioppi
PSU -
#4 Brooks
#8 Beard
#12 Teasdale
#13 RBY
#20 J Lee
#23 S Nevills
That's all for Iowa, you ask??? Why the lopsided difference?
See, Iowa didn't have much money after their shelling out $$$ for 2016 and 2017 expensive top tier recruits...
2016 #3 Marinelli, #21 Young
2017 #2 Lee, #7 Warner
PSU, meanwhile, saved money by going after only lower tier recruits....
2016 #1 Hall, #2 Suriano, #5 Manville
2017 #6 Berge, #9 Lee, #20 Verkleeren
What is wrong with this picture?
Iowa -
#17 Cassioppi
PSU -
#4 Brooks
#8 Beard
#12 Teasdale
#13 RBY
#20 J Lee
#23 S Nevills
That's all for Iowa, you ask??? Why the lopsided difference?
See, Iowa didn't have much money after their shelling out $$$ for 2016 and 2017 expensive top tier recruits...
2016 #3 Marinelli, #21 Young
2017 #2 Lee, #7 Warner
PSU, meanwhile, saved money by going after only lower tier recruits....
2016 #1 Hall, #2 Suriano, #5 Manville
2017 #6 Berge, #9 Lee, #20 Verkleeren
What is wrong with this picture?
Wouldn’t be surprised if Carl was recruiting over Witlake for brooks after nationals and that’s why he left for ok st
Again, this morbid stock piling of talent is not good for the sport, but Carl doesn’t care about that. He only cares about himself and winning. He’s a ruthless competitor, I’ll give him that. Ironically, I think these up and down lineups of top ten recruit teams hurt his legacy.
I wish more schools could emerge in popularity like SDSU, Rutgers, or even Wyoming. But you can’t do it without at least one Seth Gross, Nick Suriano, or Bryce Meredith
Wanna save college wrestling? Evening the recruiting playing field is a great start.
Again, this morbid stock piling of talent is not good for the sport, but Carl doesn’t care about that. He only cares about himself and winning. He’s a ruthless competitor, I’ll give him that. Ironically, I think these up and down lineups of top ten recruit teams hurt his legacy.
I wish more schools could emerge in popularity like SDSU, Rutgers, or even Wyoming. But you can’t do it without at least one Seth Gross, Nick Suriano, or Bryce Meredith
Wanna save college wrestling? Evening the recruiting playing field is a great start.
What is wrong with this picture you ask? The way you presented it.FLO's big board, Class of 2018:
Iowa -
#17 Cassioppi
PSU -
#4 Brooks
#8 Beard
#12 Teasdale
#13 RBY
#20 J Lee
#23 S Nevills
That's all for Iowa, you ask??? Why the lopsided difference?
See, Iowa didn't have much money after their shelling out $$$ for 2016 and 2017 expensive top tier recruits...
2016 #3 Marinelli, #21 Young
2017 #2 Lee, #7 Warner
PSU, meanwhile, saved money by going after only lower tier recruits....
2016 #1 Hall, #2 Suriano, #5 Manville
2017 #6 Berge, #9 Lee, #20 Verkleeren
What is wrong with this picture?
Suriano is not at PSU. Manville is on ROTC. Verkleeren is a walk-on. Lee moved to PA one year in advance to qualify for in-state (I think Iowa may have had a kid do that also, right?). Brooks and Beard are not enrolling in 2018.
Schools like SDSU, Rutgers and Wyoming would be exponentially more popular if they started putting wrestlers atop the podium regularly. Is it your suggestion that we do away with the national tournament and just handed out AAs in an even distribution?
I wonder if Spencer gets 4 NCs, Warner a couple, the Bull overtakes 165 and Cassioppi beats Gable one year, if you will still be rooting for Rutgers to emerge. Perhaps Iowa would be in a better position to get the Nick Lee's of the world to move in early to qualify for in-state tuition instead of the Eli Stickley's.
Yup, that’s exactly what I meant!!
Not
Thanks for that revelation too.
You mean to say that if programs start winning, especially at the National tourney, that they will become more popular??!
That must be the penn st secret!
Now I know how you guys do it!
Seriously tho, you can’t win the derby if you don’t have the horses.
Also, I'm pretty sure that Cael would have still taken Wittlake had he decided to come. He went to OK State and he liked it there. Maybe there was more money for him also. Maybe Iowa should have tried to get him on campus (not sure that they didn't).
I'm not sure why some of you don't get it. Cael is obviously a good recruiter, but also in his favor is that he just has to throw out the results of the last 7 years to these kids who were 9 years old the last time Iowa won a NC. It makes it a little easier, don't you think?
Ohio State also now killing it. Won a team NC, has had a bunch of NCs and has the #1 superstar of the USA wrestling world on his team. Did Tom Ryan just discover how to become a better recruiter all of the sudden?
Let’s stay on topic here.
Three years ago, do you think anyone would have watched a mid season dual meet between Wyoming and SDSU outside of those respective fan bases??
No....why? Cause niether one had a super star/face of the program.
As much as I hate Ben Asskren, I respect him for choosing his own path and not go to a power house school. He became the face of Missouri wrestling and now look at them. They’re a pereniall program. That’s good for the sport
Respectfully, YOU'RE off topic here. If Iowa was ok with being Missouri you wouldn't have this thread.
If there wasn’t an unprecedented amount of top tier world caliber recruits all going to one institution seemingly at a fraction of the money they could get anywhere else, than we wouldn’t have this thread
Yes, Suriano left PSU, but he did go there and wrestled a year, apparently not happy after that and left.
Sooo.... in other words, everyone I listed is, was or will be, in fact, headed to PSU.
You're just blowing smoke.
With all the access to the internet there has to be something that shows what PS is spending on wrestlers and their 9.9 allotment?
Dang man. Whine Fest at HR.
Apparently excuses have run full circle and new ones are temporarily obsolete. All the recruits liking Penn State is bad for wrestling. All recruits liking Iowa is good for wrestling.
Penn State's staff is great at recruiting. Apparently they are also pretty good at developing all that talent, so the talent keeps coming.
Thing is, all the whining about Penn State but Ohio State is doing a helluva job recruiting top end talent also.
The answer seems simple, recruit to the level of Penn State and Ohio State, and when you do produce champions.
Apparently excuses have run full circle and new ones are temporarily obsolete. All the recruits liking Penn State is bad for wrestling. All recruits liking Iowa is good for wrestling.
Penn State's staff is great at recruiting. Apparently they are also pretty good at developing all that talent, so the talent keeps coming.
Thing is, all the whining about Penn State but Ohio State is doing a helluva job recruiting top end talent also.
The answer seems simple, recruit to the level of Penn State and Ohio State, and when you do produce champions.
A few thoughts on the 9.9 scholarships and how some schools, ie PSU and tOSU appear to have deeper pockets and much more flexibility. Before I dive in, I just want to say I come in peace and am not trying to troll the HR board. I'm from Western PA and my son wrestled at Young Guns for about 5 years and our family has become friends with many current D1 wrestlers and their families. A handful of them now wrestle for Iowa and another handful wrestle for PSU. I remain a fan of them all.
A couple of thoughts:
- I agree with Diceman's comments. He is very connected to the PA HS wrestling community and has recently gone through the recruiting process with a close family member. His comments match my experience in talking with a number of families of D1 wrestlers. While he is a strong PSU fan, I think his comments on this board are reality based and are offered in good faith.
- Accusing another team of cheating (or any other transgression) without evidence is very seldom a "winning" strategy. It's not a good look and at best becomes a parochial rallying cry for the local fan base while at the same time influencing and shaping the Iowa wrestling brand. Is it helping or hurting the cause?
- Most everyone would agree that wrestling is a niche sport. In many ways similar to a rural small town where everyone knows everyone's business. There aren't many secrets. At least not for long.
- Each schools 9.9 scholarships are not created equal. In many ways it is not a fair playing field. While the NCAA can impose a set of rules and mandate a cap of 9.9 scholarships they have not been able to equalize the value that is associated with a full scholarship from each school. Each situation is unique and each wrestler and his family determine the value of each schools offer. Each school's scholarship has a variable economic value that may increase or decrease based on numerous contributing factors.
Tuition alone may range from $15k to $75k. What about location? Coaches? Training partners? The list goes on and on.
- Scholarships are no different than any othercommercial product. They have an economical value like farm land, cars, or currencies, etc. Does an acre of farm land bring the same market value in every location? Why does Iowa farm land bring $8,000 an acre while PA farm land sells for $5,500 an acre? Is that fair? Would you rather become a corn farmer in Grundy County, Iowa or Tioga County, PA? Why? My guess is that Iowa corn farmers yield more than 2x the bushels/Gallon of Diesel fuel than PA farmers. Are Iowa farmers cheating?
As stated earlier .....scholarships are not created equal. The NCAA does it's best to level the playing field and caps each school at 9.9. That doesn't mean that the playing field is equal for every school. It is impossible to guarantee an equal playing field for each school. It's not possible. Most things in life aren't fair either. I know it sucks....I'm a lifelong Pirates fan.
PSU and tOSU haven't separated themselves from the field by cheating or having a "slush fund". Both have some structural advantages but they are also knocking it out of the park with branding, culture and value proposition. It's really not any more complicated than that.
Just my opinion. Everyone has one.
A couple of thoughts:
- I agree with Diceman's comments. He is very connected to the PA HS wrestling community and has recently gone through the recruiting process with a close family member. His comments match my experience in talking with a number of families of D1 wrestlers. While he is a strong PSU fan, I think his comments on this board are reality based and are offered in good faith.
- Accusing another team of cheating (or any other transgression) without evidence is very seldom a "winning" strategy. It's not a good look and at best becomes a parochial rallying cry for the local fan base while at the same time influencing and shaping the Iowa wrestling brand. Is it helping or hurting the cause?
- Most everyone would agree that wrestling is a niche sport. In many ways similar to a rural small town where everyone knows everyone's business. There aren't many secrets. At least not for long.
- Each schools 9.9 scholarships are not created equal. In many ways it is not a fair playing field. While the NCAA can impose a set of rules and mandate a cap of 9.9 scholarships they have not been able to equalize the value that is associated with a full scholarship from each school. Each situation is unique and each wrestler and his family determine the value of each schools offer. Each school's scholarship has a variable economic value that may increase or decrease based on numerous contributing factors.
Tuition alone may range from $15k to $75k. What about location? Coaches? Training partners? The list goes on and on.
- Scholarships are no different than any othercommercial product. They have an economical value like farm land, cars, or currencies, etc. Does an acre of farm land bring the same market value in every location? Why does Iowa farm land bring $8,000 an acre while PA farm land sells for $5,500 an acre? Is that fair? Would you rather become a corn farmer in Grundy County, Iowa or Tioga County, PA? Why? My guess is that Iowa corn farmers yield more than 2x the bushels/Gallon of Diesel fuel than PA farmers. Are Iowa farmers cheating?
As stated earlier .....scholarships are not created equal. The NCAA does it's best to level the playing field and caps each school at 9.9. That doesn't mean that the playing field is equal for every school. It is impossible to guarantee an equal playing field for each school. It's not possible. Most things in life aren't fair either. I know it sucks....I'm a lifelong Pirates fan.
PSU and tOSU haven't separated themselves from the field by cheating or having a "slush fund". Both have some structural advantages but they are also knocking it out of the park with branding, culture and value proposition. It's really not any more complicated than that.
Just my opinion. Everyone has one.
So Iowa needs to offer more farm land but not as much farm land as Psu is offering because Iowa’s is better I think I got it...
Before you even go saying whining on HR, most of our respected posters haven’t said anything on this thread. I don’t recognize half of the posters.
As of August, 2017, farm land in Iowa per acre was $8,000 compared to $6,600 in PA.So Iowa needs to offer more farm land but not as much farm land as Psu is offering because Iowa’s is better I think I got it...
Well I cant see why any of those guys would want to go there then. They must not understand business.
Less than 9.9 next year.- then Nickal/Nolf/Nevills are gone. This is not that hard.
Why don't you wait to tell us how bad this is when we get to 23?
Having lived in PA for my first 21 years and Iowa for that last 33 years.... I'll take Iowa's black rich, flat (with few rocks) over PA's rocky, hilly and somewhat marginal soil (in the northern counties) any day... (even with that price difference). By the way..... where in Iowa can I buy that farm land for $8,000 per acre (NOT in northeast Iowa)
All looks good, except for Mark Hall since he isn't getting any money. So they really are only using less than 8.9. Even more impressive.
You have a link to the data on PSUs summer camp expenses and how much their camp counselors are paid? I wasn't aware this was public info. Would love a link.
I agree with some of the PSU sentiments concerning whining comments here.
This is no big loss to Iowa. Sure it looks bad in the overall picture. Obviously, Brands didn’t really know about him and/or has someone else targeted already. I’m not sure why people are so butt hurt by this commitment to PSU. The big picture still hasn’t changed
This is no big loss to Iowa. Sure it looks bad in the overall picture. Obviously, Brands didn’t really know about him and/or has someone else targeted already
. I’m not sure why people are so butt hurt by this commitment to PSU. The big picture still hasn’t changed
Brooks is coming in after PSU lost both Suriano and Witlake so I'm not sure why his commitment is causing such a stir. Plus he will not be on the books next year since he is going to OTC for a year. Presumably he will get $$ from when the 3 Ns, Rasheed and Cassar leave the following year, just like Beard who is also deferring enrollment.
I think some of you guys are losing sight of how big nationals was for Penn State last year. It was basically an hour long recruiting commercial on national television with the entire wrestling world watching. The 5 consecutive champs and all the interviews generated a huge amount of interest from recruits who are willing to take less to be a part of the "fun". I can't overstate this.
Cael and staff also utilize every possible way to bring as many top guys as possible . They operate with the mentality of an underfunded small school instead of a giant state school as far as maximizing scholarship dollars. Camps, sure they pay up to the most allowable, they also have guys move into the state to cut schools costs in half and they use deferment like in Brooks and Beard's case to free up money early on and then they have guys in ROTC or just walk-on that don't cost a dime. What they don't do is blatantly cheat, despite what some of you may think. It's not in Sanderson or the other coaches character and quite frankly, they don't have to.
Finally, who would of thought corn brings in more then dairy. Guessing ethanol has something to do with it.
I think some of you guys are losing sight of how big nationals was for Penn State last year. It was basically an hour long recruiting commercial on national television with the entire wrestling world watching. The 5 consecutive champs and all the interviews generated a huge amount of interest from recruits who are willing to take less to be a part of the "fun". I can't overstate this.
Cael and staff also utilize every possible way to bring as many top guys as possible . They operate with the mentality of an underfunded small school instead of a giant state school as far as maximizing scholarship dollars. Camps, sure they pay up to the most allowable, they also have guys move into the state to cut schools costs in half and they use deferment like in Brooks and Beard's case to free up money early on and then they have guys in ROTC or just walk-on that don't cost a dime. What they don't do is blatantly cheat, despite what some of you may think. It's not in Sanderson or the other coaches character and quite frankly, they don't have to.
Finally, who would of thought corn brings in more then dairy. Guessing ethanol has something to do with it.
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Probably not. He can’t even spell Jeva right.Are you on academic scholarship at Iowa?
I remember when Iowa was on top and people outside of Iowa said it was bad for wrestling. But the Hawks were filling their arena and having record crowds elsewhere. Everywhere else, the crowds were almost non existent.
Now Iowa is filling their arena and PSU is filling their arena and Rutgers has had huge crowds when they wrestle Iowa and PSU and some others. t OSU filled their arena against the Hawks. It sounds like this new power shift is generating some excitement to me.
I can't speak for what is or is not happening at tOSU or PSU, but I remember the recruits the Iowa would get for very little money. They came to be a national champion and be on a national championship team and to be the best they thought they could be. They came because they had a place to follow their dreams after college if they chose to. It now seems like PSU and tOSU are the place to do that. I would guess that is the biggest reason for the bountiful riches PSU and tOSU seem to be enjoying.
The fact that Iowa has to (supposedly) offer full rides to guys like Warner, Lee, etc just means they are not perceived as the number one location to go to school. I used to coach at a Div 1 school and I routinely lost kids to Big 10 schools when they were offering less money than I was. We did not have the program they had. I am sure Edinboro, and SDSU, and Buffalo and Clarion and many others face the same problem. Iowa is now seemingly in that boat, jus they are at the 3-6 range team wise, not the 15-30 range team wise.
Could you imaging ISU crying about how Iowa gets all the recruits and they are cheating? It would just be crying and whining.
Now Iowa is filling their arena and PSU is filling their arena and Rutgers has had huge crowds when they wrestle Iowa and PSU and some others. t OSU filled their arena against the Hawks. It sounds like this new power shift is generating some excitement to me.
I can't speak for what is or is not happening at tOSU or PSU, but I remember the recruits the Iowa would get for very little money. They came to be a national champion and be on a national championship team and to be the best they thought they could be. They came because they had a place to follow their dreams after college if they chose to. It now seems like PSU and tOSU are the place to do that. I would guess that is the biggest reason for the bountiful riches PSU and tOSU seem to be enjoying.
The fact that Iowa has to (supposedly) offer full rides to guys like Warner, Lee, etc just means they are not perceived as the number one location to go to school. I used to coach at a Div 1 school and I routinely lost kids to Big 10 schools when they were offering less money than I was. We did not have the program they had. I am sure Edinboro, and SDSU, and Buffalo and Clarion and many others face the same problem. Iowa is now seemingly in that boat, jus they are at the 3-6 range team wise, not the 15-30 range team wise.
Could you imaging ISU crying about how Iowa gets all the recruits and they are cheating? It would just be crying and whining.
The funny thing to me is how all these star wrestlers are willing to take a scholarship discount because they come from "rich" families, but pro athletes (who are in many cases worth hundreds of millions) won't take a discount to help a teams cap. I'm not saying guys aren't doing this is wrestling, I'm just questioning their judgement.
And the number of "rich" college elite wrestlers apparently does not come close to resembling the general population. Quite a statistical anomaly.
And the number of "rich" college elite wrestlers apparently does not come close to resembling the general population. Quite a statistical anomaly.
It seems like people are not grateful for what they have, but instead like to complain about what they do not have.
Iowa has a great program. Iowa has great coaches who mold young boys into fine men. Iowa has great fans who love wrestling. It would be so wonderful to live in a place around people who like wrestling and want to talk wrestling. Iowa is the bench mark of wrestling.
Iowa doesn't have the financial backing some other schools have. They are not the heavily favored team every year.
Enjoy your blessings you have or complain about what you don't have - the choice is yours.
Iowa has a great program. Iowa has great coaches who mold young boys into fine men. Iowa has great fans who love wrestling. It would be so wonderful to live in a place around people who like wrestling and want to talk wrestling. Iowa is the bench mark of wrestling.
Iowa doesn't have the financial backing some other schools have. They are not the heavily favored team every year.
Enjoy your blessings you have or complain about what you don't have - the choice is yours.
I honestly don't care that Brooks is headed to PSU ... it makes sense at this point and best of luck to him. I do care about losing Thomsen and Teske. I will care if we don't get Schriever, and other Iowa studs in the future. I know we get recruits from all over, including PA, but Iowa can't let it's legit HS studs get away.
I really don't understand why this is so hard for my fellow hawk fans to comprehend. Cael can out-recruit Morningstar. That is no knock on Morningstar, but the head guy and the face of the program needs to be the guy doing the heavy lifting in recruiting. And he needs to work the recruiting aspect relentlessly. Brooks gave his verbal before we even said hi. I think that's ridiculous.
It is not really an anomaly. Kids from rich families are far far more likely to end up at an Ivy League school just for academics. Why wouldn’t rich wrestlers also be more likely to end up at the top program?
Guys like Mark Hall and David Taylor’s parents have had nothing on their mind but their son’s wrestling since day one. That is why they’ve moved all over the country just for wrestling reasons. A college scholarship is not the end goal for people like this.
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