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COVID-19 Immunity could be twice as high as believed

Finance85

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Oct 22, 2003
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It's a study with a small sample size, and hasn't been peer reviewed.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/around-third-those-no-coronavirus-185927281.html

Up to a third of healthy people without symptoms of coronavirus may have developed immunity to it, international research suggests.

The findings suggest that public immunity could be as much as twice that found in antibody tests, meaning infection hotspots such as London could be further along the path to herd immunity than thought, and come after a study of an Italian town that was among the first in Europe to be hit by the virus showed that 40 per cent of those infected had no symptoms.

Until now, efforts to measure levels of protection against coronavirus have focused on antibodies, which have proved an unreliable measure.

At the start of the pandemic, Government advisers suggested at least 60 per cent of the population would need to be infected in order for herd immunity to be achieved. Instead, Britain entered lockdown on the basis of projections suggesting that allowing such levels of the disease would leave the NHS overwhelmed.

But a new study, by Sweden's Karolinska Institutet, suggests immunity levels in those without symptoms may be twice as high as thought.

It comes as statistics revealed that one in seven children in Leicester have now tested positive for coronavirus, with levels tripling in the last month. On Tuesday, Matt Hancock, the Health Secretary, said an "unusually high" incidence of coronavirus in children in the city had prompted ministers to shut down its schools and order it into lockdown.

The Telegraph has established that prevalence is now at 15 per cent among under-18s in Leicester – roughly three times greater than in England overall. Mr Hancock stressed that children were highly unlikely to get ill from the virus but might transmit it.

The Karolinska Institutet research on more than 200 adults, including healthy blood donors, was carried out in Sweden – the only country in Europe to avoid a lockdown.

As well as measuring antibody levels, tests examined levels of T-cell response. T-cells are a type of white blood cell that helps the immune system fightviruses, and are increasingly thought to have a key role in battling coronavirus.

In total, 30 per cent of the healthy blood donors were found to have developed "T-cell immunity" – twice the number of cases in which antibodies were detected.
 
It's a study with a small sample size, and hasn't been peer reviewed.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/around-third-those-no-coronavirus-185927281.html

Up to a third of healthy people without symptoms of coronavirus may have developed immunity to it, international research suggests.

The findings suggest that public immunity could be as much as twice that found in antibody tests, meaning infection hotspots such as London could be further along the path to herd immunity than thought, and come after a study of an Italian town that was among the first in Europe to be hit by the virus showed that 40 per cent of those infected had no symptoms.

Until now, efforts to measure levels of protection against coronavirus have focused on antibodies, which have proved an unreliable measure.

At the start of the pandemic, Government advisers suggested at least 60 per cent of the population would need to be infected in order for herd immunity to be achieved. Instead, Britain entered lockdown on the basis of projections suggesting that allowing such levels of the disease would leave the NHS overwhelmed.

But a new study, by Sweden's Karolinska Institutet, suggests immunity levels in those without symptoms may be twice as high as thought.

It comes as statistics revealed that one in seven children in Leicester have now tested positive for coronavirus, with levels tripling in the last month. On Tuesday, Matt Hancock, the Health Secretary, said an "unusually high" incidence of coronavirus in children in the city had prompted ministers to shut down its schools and order it into lockdown.

The Telegraph has established that prevalence is now at 15 per cent among under-18s in Leicester – roughly three times greater than in England overall. Mr Hancock stressed that children were highly unlikely to get ill from the virus but might transmit it.

The Karolinska Institutet research on more than 200 adults, including healthy blood donors, was carried out in Sweden – the only country in Europe to avoid a lockdown.

As well as measuring antibody levels, tests examined levels of T-cell response. T-cells are a type of white blood cell that helps the immune system fightviruses, and are increasingly thought to have a key role in battling coronavirus.

In total, 30 per cent of the healthy blood donors were found to have developed "T-cell immunity" – twice the number of cases in which antibodies were detected.
Lots more of this, until then take this shit seriously and mask up when indoors!
 
@GOHOX69 or @JWolf74

Any medical related experts who could give an idea as to why a virus could have such a large asymptomatic population. Just seems like one of the biggest mysteries of this virus (there are many).

Is there any other virus that we know of that does this?
 
Relax. Your precious virus isn't beat yet. Kenneth Griffin or Joe's Place will be along soon to cheer you up with some bad Covid news links.

No matter how many times it is explained to you, that "antibodies" tests have been shown to be pretty inaccurate (for false positives), you guys keep flocking to any study using them and cherry picking the highest end estimates.

Meanwhile, MIS-C cases are picking up, and it's a fair bet Sweden is going to experience a fair share of them.
 
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@GOHOX69 or @JWolf74

Any medical related experts who could give an idea as to why a virus could have such a large asymptomatic population. Just seems like one of the biggest mysteries of this virus (there are many).

Is there any other virus that we know of that does this?
A few educated types think it was made in a lab. Several different things give them hints this is the case.

I find it all very interesting. Not sure we will ever be 100% in the know for sure.
 
No matter how many times it is explained to you, that "antibodies" tests have been shown to be pretty inaccurate (for false positives), you guys keep flocking to any study using them and cherry picking the highest end estimates.

Meanwhile, MIS-C cases are picking up, and it's a fair bet Sweden is going to experience a fair share of them.
Did you not read the article
 
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No matter how many times it is explained to you, that "antibodies" tests have been shown to be pretty inaccurate (for false positives), you guys keep flocking to any study using them and cherry picking the highest end estimates.

Meanwhile, MIS-C cases are picking up, and it's a fair bet Sweden is going to experience a fair share of them.

Do we have a handle on the rate of false positives?
 
No matter how many times it is explained to you, that "antibodies" tests have been shown to be pretty inaccurate (for false positives), you guys keep flocking to any study using them and cherry picking the highest end estimates.

Meanwhile, MIS-C cases are picking up, and it's a fair bet Sweden is going to experience a fair share of them.

This isn't about antibody tests.
 
On Tuesday, a German study suggested that exposure to the common cold could provide some level of immunity to coronavirus. The study, which included 185 people without Covid, found four in five had a T-cell response to Sars-Cov-2, the virus that causes Covid-19.

THIS is what false positives can look like.

A test that is literally detecting "a" coronavirus, not Covid19.
 
@GOHOX69 or @JWolf74

Any medical related experts who could give an idea as to why a virus could have such a large asymptomatic population. Just seems like one of the biggest mysteries of this virus (there are many).

Is there any other virus that we know of that does this?
Cytomegalovirus comes to mind. Do remember asymptomatic doesn't mean non-pathogenic. In other words, just because you show no symptoms doesn't mean it isn't screwing you up on the inside. Stay safe my friend.
 
@GOHOX69 or @JWolf74

Any medical related experts who could give an idea as to why a virus could have such a large asymptomatic population. Just seems like one of the biggest mysteries of this virus (there are many).

Is there any other virus that we know of that does this?

I think a big factor, besides health and age, is amount of exposure/“dosage”. So if you get it because that one time at grocery store someone’s water vapor snuck in you may not show it vs if you were at tight packed indoor nightclub, no mask and multiple peoples water vapor got into you over and over. That person may end up in ER/ hospital. One sign of evidence of this is some fairly young and health medical professionals who have died, heroes, all over the world.
 
A few educated types think it was made in a lab. Several different things give them hints this is the case.

I find it all very interesting. Not sure we will ever be 100% in the know for sure.
My uncle sells red labs and sends them all over the U.S. he sold one to a guy in NM that was a biochemist. That guy told my uncle there’s zero doubt in his mind this virus was lab designed. Ive told that to numerous people and they always come back, yeah i talked to so an so who’s a scientist they said the same exact thing. Like you said, dont think us common folk will ever 100% know
 
Meanwhile...back in the USA, 0.25% of pregnant women are dead from Covid-19 (~1 in 400, I believe the stat is 26 deaths out of 9,989).

If the ~4M births per year are a metric to go by, and we run the "herd immunity" route, that's about 10,000 pregnant women dead in the coming year. Absent new therapies or vaccines.
 
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Cytomegalovirus comes to mind. Do remember asymptomatic doesn't mean non-pathogenic. In other words, just because you show no symptoms doesn't mean it isn't screwing you up on the inside. Stay safe my friend.

Yep.

Asymptomatic is what we thought meant children were spared.
Now we know that is clearly not the case, and the numbers are still out on how bad it is.

Aortic aneurysms, coronary artery abnormalities, etc ain't fun things to think about in a 5 yr old....
 
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Cytomegalovirus comes to mind. Do remember asymptomatic doesn't mean non-pathogenic. In other words, just because you show no symptoms doesn't mean it isn't screwing you up on the inside. Stay safe my friend.
Any new developments or updates that you have heard on a potential vaccine and/or treatment?
 
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Cytomegalovirus comes to mind. Do remember asymptomatic doesn't mean non-pathogenic. In other words, just because you show no symptoms doesn't mean it isn't screwing you up on the inside. Stay safe my friend.

Hep B & C, too.

No symptoms, for years, really. Then you get liver cancer and liver failure.
 
I think a big factor, besides health and age, is amount of exposure/“dosage”. So if you get it because that one time at grocery store someone’s water vapor snuck in you may not show it vs if you were at tight packed indoor nightclub, no mask and multiple peoples water vapor got into you over and over. That person may end up in ER/ hospital. One sign of evidence of this is some fairly young and health medical professionals who have died, heroes, all over the world.
Yes, viral load is a big factor. I would agree.
 
@GOHOX69 or @JWolf74

Any medical related experts who could give an idea as to why a virus could have such a large asymptomatic population. Just seems like one of the biggest mysteries of this virus (there are many).

Is there any other virus that we know of that does this?
Many people are infected with influenza viruses each year but don't show symptoms.
 
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A few educated types think it was made in a lab. Several different things give them hints this is the case.

I find it all very interesting. Not sure we will ever be 100% in the know for sure.

Not actually accurate. There's been some speculation that the virus may have escaped a viral laboratory facility, but there's overwhelming evidence and consensus of opinion in the virology world that this virus was not created in a laboratory.
 
Not actually accurate. There's been some speculation that the virus may have escaped a viral laboratory facility, but there's overwhelming evidence and consensus of opinion in the virology world that this virus was not created in a laboratory.
I have read and heard from others that refuse to totally discount it.

doesn’t really matter at this point. It is what it is.
 
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It's a study with a small sample size, and hasn't been peer reviewed.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/around-third-those-no-coronavirus-185927281.html

Up to a third of healthy people without symptoms of coronavirus may have developed immunity to it, international research suggests.

The findings suggest that public immunity could be as much as twice that found in antibody tests, meaning infection hotspots such as London could be further along the path to herd immunity than thought, and come after a study of an Italian town that was among the first in Europe to be hit by the virus showed that 40 per cent of those infected had no symptoms.

Until now, efforts to measure levels of protection against coronavirus have focused on antibodies, which have proved an unreliable measure.

At the start of the pandemic, Government advisers suggested at least 60 per cent of the population would need to be infected in order for herd immunity to be achieved. Instead, Britain entered lockdown on the basis of projections suggesting that allowing such levels of the disease would leave the NHS overwhelmed.

But a new study, by Sweden's Karolinska Institutet, suggests immunity levels in those without symptoms may be twice as high as thought.

It comes as statistics revealed that one in seven children in Leicester have now tested positive for coronavirus, with levels tripling in the last month. On Tuesday, Matt Hancock, the Health Secretary, said an "unusually high" incidence of coronavirus in children in the city had prompted ministers to shut down its schools and order it into lockdown.

The Telegraph has established that prevalence is now at 15 per cent among under-18s in Leicester – roughly three times greater than in England overall. Mr Hancock stressed that children were highly unlikely to get ill from the virus but might transmit it.

The Karolinska Institutet research on more than 200 adults, including healthy blood donors, was carried out in Sweden – the only country in Europe to avoid a lockdown.

As well as measuring antibody levels, tests examined levels of T-cell response. T-cells are a type of white blood cell that helps the immune system fightviruses, and are increasingly thought to have a key role in battling coronavirus.

In total, 30 per cent of the healthy blood donors were found to have developed "T-cell immunity" – twice the number of cases in which antibodies were detected.

Too soon to say but it would be sure great if true. One thing not for debate is this SOB is highly contagious and easy to spread far and wide.
 
Any new developments or updates that you have heard on a potential vaccine and/or treatment?
Treatments and vaccines sadly are a work in progress. My lab is more in the diagnostics space but I think the vaccine peeps and therapy peeps are working overtime.
 
My uncle sells red labs and sends them all over the U.S. he sold one to a guy in NM that was a biochemist. That guy told my uncle there’s zero doubt in his mind this virus was lab designed. Ive told that to numerous people and they always come back, yeah i talked to so an so who’s a scientist they said the same exact thing. Like you said, dont think us common folk will ever 100% know

Pure BS and ignorance then. You and your uncle need to start hanging out with smarter folks it seems.
 
Treatments and vaccines sadly are a work in progress. My lab is more in the diagnostics space but I think the vaccine peeps and therapy peeps are working overtime.

Thankfully, there are 3 or 4 options in the mix, in various stages of Phase II/III testing.
If just half end up being safe and effective, we'll have something going by early next year. Still, that's a long time to continue social distancing, and for many elements of our local economies.
 
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I think a big factor, besides health and age, is amount of exposure/“dosage”. So if you get it because that one time at grocery store someone’s water vapor snuck in you may not show it vs if you were at tight packed indoor nightclub, no mask and multiple peoples water vapor got into you over and over. That person may end up in ER/ hospital. One sign of evidence of this is some fairly young and health medical professionals who have died, heroes, all over the world.
The more I read, the more “viral load” - that is The amount of exposure over time - seems to play a huge role in 1. Whether you get infected at all and 2. How sick you do get if you are infected.

This is why I’m ok popping into a store for 10-15 minutes and moving around but no way in hell I will sit down inside a restaurant for a meal anytime soon.
 
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Relax. Your precious virus isn't beat yet. Kenneth Griffin or Joe's Place will be along soon to cheer you up with some bad Covid news links.

Its only getting started unfortunately, we’re all in the first inning of dealing with this.
 
My uncle sells red labs and sends them all over the U.S. he sold one to a guy in NM that was a biochemist. That guy told my uncle there’s zero doubt in his mind this virus was lab designed. Ive told that to numerous people and they always come back, yeah i talked to so an so who’s a scientist they said the same exact thing. Like you said, dont think us common folk will ever 100% know
Many people are saying it.
 
The more I read, the more “viral load” that is amount of exposure over time - seems to play a huge role in 1. Whether you get infected at all and 2. How sick you do get if you are infected.

This is why I’m ok popping into a store for 10-15 minutes and moving around but no way in hell I will sit down inside a restaurant for a meal anytime soon.

Now imagine you're a physician or nurse, w/o proper PPE or being asked to continually reuse it, because dorkwads who follow networks and web accounts that spread disinformation won't wear a fricking mask or limit their social contacts.....
 
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