Do you know what Trump was found guilty of?

[TJ8869]

Again: MAGAs, sure.

Independents: Nope.

If Trump bragging about watching teenage girls getting dressed for his beauty pageant didn’t change their minds and Trump bragging about kissing women whenever he wants to didn’t change their minds and Trump bragging about grabbing women by the pussy didn’t change their minds, then why would a one-time dalliance with a porn star change their minds?

If Trump’s long history of marriages, infidelity, divorces, and remarriages didn’t change their minds then why would they give a shit about an 11th hour claim in the National Enquirer by a porn star that Trump would have vehemently denied?

Hillary needed another 45,000 votes in Pennsylvania and another 23,000 votes in Wisconsin and another 11,000 votes in Michigan. If she doesn’t get any one of those three things then Trump still wins.

Would Stormy going public one week before the election have been enough to make the difference?

Maybe. But also maybe not.

 

[sober_teacher]

Rafael’s support of Trump in 2016 was tepid because they had just waged a bitter primary fight and he was still licking his wounds. So I’m not sure that really helps your point.

I understand that the cult has grown more intense over the past 8 years, but I still think it’s very possible Trump would still have won even if Stormy had gone public. We had already heard him brag about hanging out in the dressing room with naked teenage girls at his pageant. We had already heard the Access Hollywood soundbite where he bragged about grabbing women by the pussy. And his supporters didn’t seem to care.

It’s not like we didn’t know he was slimy. He had already been a public figure for over 25 years and we already knew he had a history of infidelity in previous marriages.

If the National Enquirer had purchased her story and ran it a week before the election, the vast majority of his voters would have either brushed it off as a money grab or actually considered it a badge of honor for Trump.

We’ll never know for certain, obviously. But I think Franken is making an assumption that might not be true.

Had it not been for the last minute Comey letter, the All Access video would have swung the election to Hillary imo.

For me the bigger issue isn't the criminal aspect, it's the fact Donald Trump banged a porn star while his newlywed wife stayed home with their newborn, Barron. Somehow, his voters (especially the Christian ones) seem to not even care about this. If Raegan had done that to Nancy or George to Laura there's no way their careers survive that.

It amazed me in 2016, and every day since, the things that Trump survived that would have ended the campaign/political careers of literally anyone else.

 

[torbee]

Would Stormy going public one week before the election have been enough to make the difference?

Maybe. But also maybe not.

It wasn't a chance the Trump campaign was willing to take, so they concocted a fake paper trail to cover up the hush money payment.

Ergo - guilty.

 

[SSG T]

Short version, he committed crimes in trying to cover up something he did that wasn't illegal but was embarrassing.

 

[TJ8869]

It wasn't a chance the Trump campaign was willing to take, so they concocted a fake paper trail to cover up the hush money payment.

Ergo - guilty.

I’m not disputing his guilt. I’m disputing Al Franken’s claim that Trump would have lost the 2016 election if he hadn’t paid Stormy to keep quiet.

 

[Hans81]

Good summary

View embedded media

Is Al Franken still in politics? I thought he did some no-no thing(s) and got booted out?

 

[EasyHawk]

It’s astounding how confused the MAGA base is. They seem to have no ability to think.

 

[Joes Place]

And here is the reason they "prosecuted" him. Joe trying in whatever manner they can.

Biden has had zero involvement on this.

Go re-read that statement as many times as you need to, until it sinks in for you.

 

[Joes Place]

Interesting that this case is the only time ever that a prosecutor has pushed a case like this.

View embedded media

Because it's the first time anyone has illegally falsified records to cover up something during an election, Cletus.

Stay on the bus, here.

 

[Joes Place]

i don't understand what point people think they're making by saying they don't understand something that can be easily found, from a variety of sources, online

It's how they "legislate", too.

 

[sultanofsuede]

I've listened to a lot of people try to explain what Trump is actually guilty of, but I get a lot of different answers. So lets find out who's right on here. Without looking it up or looking at other posts in this thread, explain what Trump was found guilty of.

Hooker, lying, Jesus. Amen.

 

[Rifler]

Was it known what “the other crime” was that they said he committed?

You would have to interview all 12 jurors to find out what each of them selected,.. agreement wasn't necessary.

 

[Joes Place]

It wasn't a campaign contribution.

It was.

An illegal one. Because campaign $$ weren't used to bury the stories.

 

[Joes Place]

Outstanding.



This case, was about how he payment was filed for tax purposes. It had nothing to do with his campaign.

The jury decided otherwise, Cletus.

Quit telling us you're not a MAGA.
You have Orange MAGA jizz all over your face.

 

[Joes Place]

LOL - the latest demonstration of your ignorance. It wasn't about taxes.

Donald Trump was found guilty of 34 felony counts of falsifying business records after prosecutors successfully convinced a jury he disguised hush money reimbursement as legal expenses. He is the first former president to be convicted of a crime.

Each count is tied to a different business record that prosecutors demonstrated Trump is responsible for changing to conceal or commit another crime.

Those records include 11 checks paid to former lawyer Michael Cohen, 11 invoices from Michael Cohen and 12 entries in Trump's ledgers.

The jury found that Trump authorized a plan to reimburse Cohen for the $130,000 hush money payment issued to Stormy Daniels and spread the payments across 12 months disguised as legal expenses.

It can actually be prosecuted now, for the tax fraud, too.

And should be.

 

[Joes Place]

It isn't illegal to pay someone hush money

Yes.
It is.

The jury just decided that one for you, MAGA-boi.

 

[Joes Place]

This article pretty much sums it up

Sounds like you've been sent down the MAGA Rabbit-hole, too.

The crimes are clearly delineated and were decided upon by the jury.

Change where you get your news from - those sites are misleading you.

Probably the same folks who feed you bullshit about Ukraine, MAGA-boi.

 

[Ferentz_Fan]

See, you are playing stupid again (I hope, for your sake.)

The crimes he was convicted of were committed to assist him in winning the 2016 presidential election. Which he did.

Assist him in winning? Lol

 

[joelbc1]

My understanding is falsification of business records which is illegal under NY state law.

Edit: I admit to reading up a bit more on the exact charges a couple days ago.

Ironically, it had nothing to do with “Biden and his weaponized DoJ”……

 

[Ferentz_Fan]

Sounds like you've been sent down the MAGA Rabbit-hole, too.

The crimes are clearly delineated and were decided upon by the jury.

Change where you get your news from - those sites are misleading you.

Probably the same folks who feed you bullshit about Ukraine, MAGA-boi.

Like this?

 

[Whiskeydeltadeltatango]

Yes.
It is.

The jury just decided that one for you, MAGA-boi.

No, it isn't, it's illegal to code repayment as a campaign expense, due to tax purposes.

 

[BelemNole]

How on brand is it that the Trump voters are too dumb to understand the charges?

 

[Whiskeydeltadeltatango]

Ironically, it had nothing to do with “Biden and his weaponized DoJ”……

No Joel, that happened Tuesday.

 

[Ferentz_Fan]

How on brand is it that the Trump voters are too dumb to understand the charges?

From what I've seen on multiple threads it's Biden supporters that don't understand yet high five and ass pat.

 

[Joes Place]

Like this?

What "crimes" are you referring to?

Removing the corrupt prosecutor was US and EU policy at the time.
Our Ukrainian ambassador even told you that.

Re-read those sentences until they sink in for you.
Take as long as you need.

 

[Joes Place]

No, it isn't, it's illegal to code repayment as a campaign expense, due to tax purposes.

WTAF is your MAGA brain babbling about now, MAGA-boi?

 

[drew_hawk]

How on brand is it that the Trump voters are too dumb to understand the charges?

Between the authentic stupidity and the willful ignorance they seem to have their bases covered.

 

[Ferentz_Fan]

What "crimes" are you referring to?

Removing the corrupt prosecutor was US and EU policy at the time.
Our Ukrainian ambassador even told you that.

Re-read those sentences until they sink in for you.
Take as long as you need.

HB was in the energy business there, no?

 

[drew_hawk]

WTAF is your MAGA brain babbling about now, MAGA-boi?

 

[Whiskeydeltadeltatango]

WTAF is your MAGA brain babbling about now, MAGA-boi?

Try reading it again bitch boy, it will come to you. Not like you know what making something cum is like.

 

[IIowaFarmBoy]

Sounds like you've been sent down the MAGA Rabbit-hole, too.

The crimes are clearly delineated and were decided upon by the jury.

Change where you get your news from - those sites are misleading you.

Probably the same folks who feed you bullshit about Ukraine, MAGA-boi.

You are such an ignorant useful by someone idiot. Anyway have a nice day.

 

[IIowaFarmBoy]

I believe our lord Jesus Christ found him guilty.

Under those terms we are all found guilty but given grace.

 

[AuroraHawk]

I've listened to a lot of people try to explain what Trump is actually guilty of, but I get a lot of different answers. So lets find out who's right on here. Without looking it up or looking at other posts in this thread, explain what Trump was found guilty of.

If you are truly curious, read the jury instructions. The instructions are public record and I'll even provide you with a link. Enjoy the reading!

DocumentCloud

www.documentcloud.org

 

[TJ8869]

What "crimes" are you referring to?

Removing the corrupt prosecutor was US and EU policy at the time.
Our Ukrainian ambassador even told you that.

Re-read those sentences until they sink in for you.
Take as long as you need.

Was it also US and EU policy to replace him with a guy who was even more corrupt and had no law degree and zero experience as a prosecutor?

 

[AuroraHawk]

Did they discuss campaign violations in the trial? Was the law discussed in what’s a violation?

Read ps. 24-55 of the Jury Instructions: https://www.documentcloud.org/docum...ons?embed=true&responsive=false&sidebar=false

 

[hexumhawk]

Biden has had zero involvement on this.

Go re-read that statement as many times as you need to, until it sinks in for you.

The funny thing is you actually believe this.

 

[CoachH]

The funny thing is you actually believe this.

The crazy thing is you don't. Crazy people believe in crazy things, evidence be damned.

 

[torbee]

I’m not disputing his guilt. I’m disputing Al Franken’s claim that Trump would have lost the 2016 election if he hadn’t paid Stormy to keep quiet.

You are correct it is impossilbe to say. But on the heels of the Access Hollywood tape, it clearly caused panic in the Trump campaign. In other words, they didn't know for sure if voters were going to be able to hold their noses and overlook his indiscretions.

 

[TJ8869]

You are correct it is impossilbe to say. But on the heels of the Access Hollywood tape, it clearly caused panic in the Trump campaign. In other words, they didn't know for sure if voters were going to be able to hold their noses and overlook his indiscretions.

That’s my point. Trump and his advisors panicked and paid her off because they were worried her story might hurt him at the polls. But with the benefit of hindsight it appears that it might not have hurt him after all. And now he’s a convicted felon because of that decision. That’s why I said it’s ironic.

 

[torbee]

That’s my point. Trump and his advisors panicked and paid her off because they were worried her story might hurt him at the polls. But with the benefit of hindsight it appears that it might not have hurt him after all. And now he’s a convicted felon because of that decision. That’s why I said it’s ironic.

Agree 100%