ADVERTISEMENT

Ferentz's good teams had SUPERIOR TALENT

Dec 31, 2014
17,389
28,862
113
FRED BARR
COLIN COLE
BRAD BANKS
BOB SANDERS
CJ JONES
MO BROWN
ANTWAN ALLEN
JOVON JOHNSON
DALLAS CLARK


Where are these kind of guys??

Why / how did we stop recruiting talented football players? anyone know why??

all we hear now is how nice our academic scholars are while losing to ISU!!!!
 
A majority of the players you named were not highly recruited, which means we had better judges of talent at the time or there was some luck involved. We still get some superior talent, (two players expected to go in the first round of the draft) but we don't get enough of it. The major problem is that we depend on walk- ons and two or three star recruits. For some reason, KF does not get the effort required to attract highly rated recruits. Teams like Minnie, Indy and NW are starting to kick our butt. I don't even have to mention the Eastern half of the conference.
 
Recruiting takes passion and energy...KF has a guaranteed contract

Go 6-6...off to a bowl...all golden
 
All good teams typically have superior talent. That's why we are better than most in the B1G, but only occasionally the cream of the crop. It's been thT way for a long, long time....at least since coach Fry arrived
 
Thanks, John Madden. Next you're going to tell me that you have to score more points than the other guy to win the game.
 
Originally posted by Phenomenally Frantastic:
FRED BARR
COLIN COLE
BRAD BANKS
BOB SANDERS
CJ JONES
MO BROWN
ANTWAN ALLEN
JOVON JOHNSON
DALLAS CLARK


Where are these kind of guys??

Why / how did we stop recruiting talented football players? anyone know why??

all we hear now is how nice our academic scholars are while losing to ISU!!!!
They started listening to recruiting services and fans and stopped trusting their own judgement. If they would have recruited these guys today, the fans would be screaming about what worthless recruiters they are, as almost all of these folks were 'under the radar' recruits. Almost all were walk-ons, JC transfers, and had no offers from P5 conferences (MAC level recruits). Beleima used to pull some kids from florida that FL, theU, and FL St. didn't want, but since he left to go to Kan.St., in 2002 we've only had like 2 FL recruits who actually stayed the duration. (Mabin may be the first to finish in 8 yrs.I think Ed Miles was the last? However long it has been, I think you get the point)
http://espn.go.com/blog/bigten/post/_/id/71858/hawkeyes-florida-retreat-a-b1g-problem
I think they need to hire a coach with FL ties (they have with TX) and start working it harder and they and the FANS need to stop worrying about ratings. They can build OL and DL's mainly from IA and IL, always have, but they need WR and LB's from places like TX and FL. Say what you want about KF, but he can judge and develop talent. Let him, and quit screaming about stars and ratings.
P.S. - This team isn't as barren as some think, but yes, there is not a lot of future draft choices on this roster either, like they normally have.
 
Originally posted by BuddyRydell:
Originally posted by Phenomenally Frantastic:
FRED BARR
COLIN COLE
BRAD BANKS
BOB SANDERS
CJ JONES
MO BROWN
ANTWAN ALLEN
JOVON JOHNSON
DALLAS CLARK


Where are these kind of guys??

Why / how did we stop recruiting talented football players? anyone know why??

all we hear now is how nice our academic scholars are while losing to ISU!!!!
They started listening to recruiting services and fans and stopped trusting their own judgement. If they would have recruited these guys today, the fans would be screaming about what worthless recruiters they are, as almost all of these folks were 'under the radar' recruits. Almost all were walk-ons, JC transfers, and had no offers from P5 conferences (MAC level recruits). Beleima used to pull some kids from florida that FL, theU, and FL St. didn't want, but since he left to go to Kan.St., in 2002 we've only had like 2 FL recruits who actually stayed the duration. (Mabin may be the first to finish in 8 yrs.I think Ed Miles was the last? However long it has been, I think you get the point)
http://espn.go.com/blog/bigten/post/_/id/71858/hawkeyes-florida-retreat-a-b1g-problem
I think they need to hire a coach with FL ties (they have with TX) and start working it harder and they and the FANS need to stop worrying about ratings. They can build OL and DL's mainly from IA and IL, always have, but they need WR and LB's from places like TX and FL. Say what you want about KF, but he can judge and develop talent. Let him, and quit screaming about stars and ratings.
P.S. - This team isn't as barren as some think, but yes, there is not a lot of future draft choices on this roster either, like they normally have.   


Yup, it's the fans fault
Posted from Rivals Mobile
 
Originally posted by Phenomenally Frantastic:
FRED BARR
COLIN COLE
BRAD BANKS
BOB SANDERS
CJ JONES
MO BROWN
ANTWAN ALLEN
JOVON JOHNSON
DALLAS CLARK


Where are these kind of guys??

Why / how did we stop recruiting talented football players? anyone know why??

all we hear now is how nice our academic scholars are while losing to ISU!!!!
+1000

Don't let the blind followers of KF detract you. So many people on this board forget that Iowa plays in the Big 10.

Iowa is lacking Big 10 quality players on the current roster. The talent level is plummeting. And this year's recruiting class is more evidence of this decline.
 
Can we at least admit that Iowa's elite players typically have not had tremendous recruiting pedigrees when they came to Iowa.

Let's take out the 2 junior college players (Brad Banks and CJ Jones), who were a 3 star and 4 star, if I recall correctly. If you look at the players on the OP's list who came to Iowa out of high school, this is what you have:

Fred Barr--2 stars
Colin Cole--2 stars
Bob Sanders--2 stars
Mo Brown--2 stars
Antwan Allen--3 stars
Jovon Johnson--2 stars
Dallas Clark--no stars (walk-on)

If you want to take the ESPN list of NFL players from Iowa in 2014, this is what you have (recruiting rankings are from memory, so I might be off on a few):

Jonathan Babineaux--2 stars
Conor Boffeli--3 stars
Bryan Bulaga--4 stars
Scott Chandler--2 stars
Adrian Clayborn--4 stars
Colin Cole--2 stars
Mike Daniels--2 stars
A.J. Edds--3 stars
James Ferentz--3 stars
C.J. Fiedorowicz--4 stars
Bradley Fletcher--2 stars
Adam Gettis--2 stars
Charles Godfrey--2 stars
Shonn Greene--3 stars
Chad Greenway--2 stars
Anthony Hitchens--2 stars
Micah Hyde--2 stars
Christian Kirksey--3 stars
Karl Klug--2 stars
Tony Moeaki--4 stars
James Morris--3 stars
Brandon Myers--2 stars
Shaun Prater--3 stars
Riley Reiff--3 stars
Allen Resner--3 stars
Ricky Stanzi--3 stars
Jeff Tarpinian--3 stars
Matt Tobin--walk on, maybe 2 stars
Julian Vander Velde--3 stars
Marshall Yanda--3 stars

That's a collective 81 stars divided by 30 guys--2.7 average stars. It's lower if you exclude the 2 stars that I gave to Tobin as a walk-on.

I understand people looking at this roster and saying that it needs more talent, but you can't make that point by looking at the OP's list and then complaining about the lack of highly-ranked recruits on this roster. None of the football blue bloods thought the OP's list were sufficiently talented to warrant a scholarship offer. Their recruiting profiles would fit in perfectly with the current roster. Nor can you make it well by looking at the recruiting rankings of Iowa's NFL players.
 
Originally posted by jdv77:


Can we at least admit that Iowa's elite players typically have not had tremendous recruiting pedigrees when they came to Iowa.

Let's take out the 2 junior college players (Brad Banks and CJ Jones), who were a 3 star and 4 star, if I recall correctly. If you look at the players on the OP's list who came to Iowa out of high school, this is what you have:

Fred Barr--2 stars
Colin Cole--2 stars
Bob Sanders--2 stars
Mo Brown--2 stars
Antwan Allen--3 stars
Jovon Johnson--2 stars
Dallas Clark--no stars (walk-on)

If you want to take the ESPN list of NFL players from Iowa in 2014, this is what you have (recruiting rankings are from memory, so I might be off on a few):

Jonathan Babineaux--2 stars
Conor Boffeli--3 stars
Bryan Bulaga--4 stars
Scott Chandler--2 stars
Adrian Clayborn--4 stars
Colin Cole--2 stars
Mike Daniels--2 stars
A.J. Edds--3 stars
James Ferentz--3 stars
C.J. Fiedorowicz--4 stars
Bradley Fletcher--2 stars
Adam Gettis--2 stars
Charles Godfrey--2 stars
Shonn Greene--3 stars
Chad Greenway--2 stars
Anthony Hitchens--2 stars
Micah Hyde--2 stars
Christian Kirksey--3 stars
Karl Klug--2 stars
Tony Moeaki--4 stars
James Morris--3 stars
Brandon Myers--2 stars
Shaun Prater--3 stars
Riley Reiff--3 stars
Allen Resner--3 stars
Ricky Stanzi--3 stars
Jeff Tarpinian--3 stars
Matt Tobin--walk on, maybe 2 stars
Julian Vander Velde--3 stars
Marshall Yanda--3 stars

That's a collective 81 stars divided by 30 guys--2.7 average stars. It's lower if you exclude the 2 stars that I gave to Tobin as a walk-on.

I understand people looking at this roster and saying that it needs more talent, but you can't make that point by looking at the OP's list and then complaining about the lack of highly-ranked recruits on this roster. None of the football blue bloods thought the OP's list were sufficiently talented to warrant a scholarship offer. Their recruiting profiles would fit in perfectly with the current roster. Nor can you make it well by looking at the recruiting rankings of Iowa's NFL players.
These fans are not interested in facts. They get in the way of their uninformed opinions. To them a bad rivals rating indicates that Iowa has no talent, then by george, they have no talent. That means everyone in that poorly rated class. Don't bother, they are brain washed by stars and ratings, and their minds are made up. It's not the fans fault, but I don't think these ratings services have been good for college sports.
P.S.- not that it matters much, but Reisner was unrated up till Iowa offered him the day before signing day and then miraculously recieved 2 stars, not 3. It's all such a joke. Every year there are probably about 50 kids (maybe 50-100) nationally that are way more advanced than the others and that's not hard for anyone to see. The next 10,000 kids, it's a total crapshoot and the facts totally support this. We need a service for that?
 
Originally posted by jdv77:


Can we at least admit that Iowa's elite players typically have not had tremendous recruiting pedigrees when they came to Iowa.

Let's take out the 2 junior college players (Brad Banks and CJ Jones), who were a 3 star and 4 star, if I recall correctly. If you look at the players on the OP's list who came to Iowa out of high school, this is what you have:

Fred Barr--2 stars
Colin Cole--2 stars
Bob Sanders--2 stars
Mo Brown--2 stars
Antwan Allen--3 stars
Jovon Johnson--2 stars
Dallas Clark--no stars (walk-on)

If you want to take the ESPN list of NFL players from Iowa in 2014, this is what you have (recruiting rankings are from memory, so I might be off on a few):

Jonathan Babineaux--2 stars
Conor Boffeli--3 stars
Bryan Bulaga--4 stars
Scott Chandler--2 stars
Adrian Clayborn--4 stars
Colin Cole--2 stars
Mike Daniels--2 stars
A.J. Edds--3 stars
James Ferentz--3 stars
C.J. Fiedorowicz--4 stars
Bradley Fletcher--2 stars
Adam Gettis--2 stars
Charles Godfrey--2 stars
Shonn Greene--3 stars
Chad Greenway--2 stars
Anthony Hitchens--2 stars
Micah Hyde--2 stars
Christian Kirksey--3 stars
Karl Klug--2 stars
Tony Moeaki--4 stars
James Morris--3 stars
Brandon Myers--2 stars
Shaun Prater--3 stars
Riley Reiff--3 stars
Allen Resner--3 stars
Ricky Stanzi--3 stars
Jeff Tarpinian--3 stars
Matt Tobin--walk on, maybe 2 stars
Julian Vander Velde--3 stars
Marshall Yanda--3 stars

That's a collective 81 stars divided by 30 guys--2.7 average stars. It's lower if you exclude the 2 stars that I gave to Tobin as a walk-on.

I understand people looking at this roster and saying that it needs more talent, but you can't make that point by looking at the OP's list and then complaining about the lack of highly-ranked recruits on this roster. None of the football blue bloods thought the OP's list were sufficiently talented to warrant a scholarship offer. Their recruiting profiles would fit in perfectly with the current roster. Nor can you make it well by looking at the recruiting rankings of Iowa's NFL players.
good analysis, only thing is there are a few missing (e.g. if we are going to count Brad Banks or Bob Sanders then....Matt Roth, etc.) we should go back to the beginning, not just current NFL rosters but guys that either had very good iowa careers and/or touched the NFL (e.g. Jewell Hampton). I think your point remains the same, though one thing that i noticed is our depth of talent seemed stronger in past, not loaded with 4 star guys but more 3 star guys that really panned out.

Matt Roth 4 Stars
Clinton Solomon 2 Stars
Drew Tate 4 Stars
Albert Young 4 Stars
Ken Iwebema 3 stars
Bryan Mattison 3 Stars
Mitch King 3 Stars
Andy Brodell 2 Stars
Shonn Greene 3 Stars
Damian Sims 2 Stars
Rafael Eubanks 4 Stars
Dace Richardson 4 Stars
Pat Angerer 3 Stars
Trey Stross 3 Stars
DJK 3 Stars
Ryan Donahue 2 Stars
Amari Spivey 2 Stars
Christian Ballard 4 Stars
Jordan Bernstine 4 Stars
Brodereck Binns 3 Stars
Marvin Mcnutt 3 Stars
Tyler Sash 3 Stars
Jewell Hampton 2 Stars

(there are probably a few more that I missed.....)
 
Originally posted by BuddyRydell:

These fans are not interested in facts. They get in the way of their uninformed opinions. To them a bad rivals rating indicates that Iowa has no talent, then by george, they have no talent.
Getting 50 pointed by an average Minnesota team and losing to a 2-10 ISU team tells me they have no talent. I don't any rivals star ratings to tell me that. Did I even once mention rivals rating in my OP? No.

This years team has no talent. We have all the bad players back off a mediocre team.

Anyone thinking this fall will be enjoyable in the Winning department is fooling themselves.

Tell me lies, tell me sweet little lies. all is good then.
 
Originally posted by swagsurfer02:
Originally posted by BuddyRydell:
Originally posted by Phenomenally Frantastic:
FRED BARR
COLIN COLE
BRAD BANKS
BOB SANDERS
CJ JONES
MO BROWN
ANTWAN ALLEN
JOVON JOHNSON
DALLAS CLARK


Where are these kind of guys??

Why / how did we stop recruiting talented football players? anyone know why??

all we hear now is how nice our academic scholars are while losing to ISU!!!!
They started listening to recruiting services and fans and stopped trusting their own judgement. If they would have recruited these guys today, the fans would be screaming about what worthless recruiters they are, as almost all of these folks were 'under the radar' recruits. Almost all were walk-ons, JC transfers, and had no offers from P5 conferences (MAC level recruits). Beleima used to pull some kids from florida that FL, theU, and FL St. didn't want, but since he left to go to Kan.St., in 2002 we've only had like 2 FL recruits who actually stayed the duration. (Mabin may be the first to finish in 8 yrs.I think Ed Miles was the last? However long it has been, I think you get the point)
https://espn.go.com/blog/bigten/post/_/id/71858/hawkeyes-florida-retreat-a-b1g-problem
I think they need to hire a coach with FL ties (they have with TX) and start working it harder and they and the FANS need to stop worrying about ratings. They can build OL and DL's mainly from IA and IL, always have, but they need WR and LB's from places like TX and FL. Say what you want about KF, but he can judge and develop talent. Let him, and quit screaming about stars and ratings.
P.S. - This team isn't as barren as some think, but yes, there is not a lot of future draft choices on this roster either, like they normally have.  Â


Yup, it's the fans fault
Posted from Rivals Mobile
Most of society's problems are........
 
Originally posted by Phenomenally Frantastic:

Originally posted by BuddyRydell:

These fans are not interested in facts. They get in the way of their uninformed opinions. To them a bad rivals rating indicates that Iowa has no talent, then by george, they have no talent.
Getting 50 pointed by an average Minnesota team and losing to a 2-10 ISU team tells me they have no talent. I don't any rivals star ratings to tell me that. Did I even once mention rivals rating in my OP? No.

This years team has no talent. We have all the bad players back off a mediocre team.

Anyone thinking this fall will be enjoyable in the Winning department is fooling themselves.

Tell me lies, tell me sweet little lies. all is good then.
Say it with me...Goosefraba, Goosefraba. My remarks weren't directed entirely at you.
Some of the talent was young and undeveloped, thus leading to inconsistancy and the coaches should, and have, taken some of the blame for the loses. To claim these young men have no talent and are all bad, is not only inaccurate, but offensive to them and their families and totally uncalled for. This is a PUBLIC forum sir, not the smoking room at the local bowling alley.
Teams with NO talent (as you say) don't win seven games, they win no games. All loses are based on talent? It never comes down to game plans, execution, turnovers, etc...
I'm not going to argue with you. You are going to believe whatever you want to believe, and if you want to be miserable and choose not believe that they will develop these young LB's and OT's, etc. (like they always have) and that these youngsters will not be markedly improved next year, so be it.
But I will ask you sir, to not bad mouth these young men in a public forum where you have no idea who may be reading your posts. I will enjoy watching these young men improve, and watching you eat crow when they develop and win!
 
Biggest reason there aren't as many "diamond in the rough" type recruits today is because recruiting is so much more advanced than the late 1990s and early 2000s. Today every decent high school football player has a video on HUDL and football coaches have hired more "film watchers" for their program that don't actually coach.

But it also takes great coaches in college football to recruit. Guys like Bret Bielema, Joe Philbin, and Ron Aiken.
 
Originally posted by HawkCharlotte:

Originally posted by Phenomenally Frantastic:
FRED BARR
COLIN COLE
BRAD BANKS
BOB SANDERS
CJ JONES
MO BROWN
ANTWAN ALLEN
JOVON JOHNSON
DALLAS CLARK


Where are these kind of guys??

Why / how did we stop recruiting talented football players? anyone know why??

all we hear now is how nice our academic scholars are while losing to ISU!!!!
+1000

Don't let the blind followers of KF detract you. So many people on this board forget that Iowa plays in the Big 10.

Iowa is lacking Big 10 quality players on the current roster. The talent level is plummeting. And this year's recruiting class is more evidence of this decline.
Could you point to one of those recruits that he listed and tell me which ones you would have been excited about the day they signed? Not now knowing how they turned out, but the day they signed. There isn't any head turners that were 5 stars in that group coming out of high school.

In that group I see a lot of fall back recruits and walk ons. Guys I am sure you were bitching about back when they signed. Some people just love to bitch.
 
Originally posted by heat_dawg:

Originally posted by HawkCharlotte:


Originally posted by Phenomenally Frantastic:
FRED BARR
COLIN COLE
BRAD BANKS
BOB SANDERS
CJ JONES
MO BROWN
ANTWAN ALLEN
JOVON JOHNSON
DALLAS CLARK


Where are these kind of guys??

Why / how did we stop recruiting talented football players? anyone know why??

all we hear now is how nice our academic scholars are while losing to ISU!!!!
+1000

Don't let the blind followers of KF detract you. So many people on this board forget that Iowa plays in the Big 10.

Iowa is lacking Big 10 quality players on the current roster. The talent level is plummeting. And this year's recruiting class is more evidence of this decline.
Could you point to one of those recruits that he listed and tell me which ones you would have been excited about the day they signed? Not now knowing how they turned out, but the day they signed. There isn't any head turners that were 5 stars in that group coming out of high school.

In that group I see a lot of fall back recruits and walk ons. Guys I am sure you were bitching about back when they signed. Some people just love to bitch.
Amen. Everyone is a hindsight hero when it helps their delusion:)
 
Originally posted by heat_dawg:
Originally posted by HawkCharlotte:

Originally posted by Phenomenally Frantastic:
FRED BARR
COLIN COLE
BRAD BANKS
BOB SANDERS
CJ JONES
MO BROWN
ANTWAN ALLEN
JOVON JOHNSON
DALLAS CLARK


Where are these kind of guys??

Why / how did we stop recruiting talented football players? anyone know why??

all we hear now is how nice our academic scholars are while losing to ISU!!!!
+1000

Don't let the blind followers of KF detract you. So many people on this board forget that Iowa plays in the Big 10.

Iowa is lacking Big 10 quality players on the current roster. The talent level is plummeting. And this year's recruiting class is more evidence of this decline.
Could you point to one of those recruits that he listed and tell me which ones you would have been excited about the day they signed? Not now knowing how they turned out, but the day they signed. There isn't any head turners that were 5 stars in that group coming out of high school.

In that group I see a lot of fall back recruits and walk ons. Guys I am sure you were bitching about back when they signed. Some people just love to bitch.
For 1, Colin Cole.. Bielema was able to get him to switch to Iowa from Va Tech.... That was back when Iowa wasn't forced to get kids to switch from Northern Iowa-Jansen,Ojemudia-Eastern Michigan, or Western Illinois-Wilson, etc... Hoping Taylor-switched from Ga Tech, turns out to be damn good.
 
Originally posted by BuddyRydell:
Originally posted by Phenomenally Frantastic:

FRED BARR

COLIN COLE

BRAD BANKS

BOB SANDERS

CJ JONES

MO BROWN

ANTWAN ALLEN

JOVON JOHNSON

DALLAS CLARK





Where are these kind of guys??



Why / how did we stop recruiting talented football players? anyone know why??



all we hear now is how nice our academic scholars are while losing to ISU!!!!
They started listening to recruiting services and fans and stopped trusting their own judgement. If they would have recruited these guys today, the fans would be screaming about what worthless recruiters they are, as almost all of these folks were 'under the radar' recruits. Almost all were walk-ons, JC transfers, and had no offers from P5 conferences (MAC level recruits). Beleima used to pull some kids from florida that FL, theU, and FL St. didn't want, but since he left to go to Kan.St., in 2002 we've only had like 2 FL recruits who actually stayed the duration. (Mabin may be the first to finish in 8 yrs.I think Ed Miles was the last? However long it has been, I think you get the point)


http://espn.go.com/blog/bigten/post/_/id/71858/hawkeyes-florida-retreat-a-b1g-problem

I think they need to hire a coach with FL ties (they have with TX) and start working it harder and they and the FANS need to stop worrying about ratings. They can build OL and DL's mainly from IA and IL, always have, but they need WR and LB's from places like TX and FL. Say what you want about KF, but he can judge and develop talent. Let him, and quit screaming about stars and ratings.

P.S. - This team isn't as barren as some think, but yes, there is not a lot of future draft choices on this roster either, like they normally have.

Haha so dumb
Posted from Rivals Mobile
 
Originally posted by FlickShagwell:

Originally posted by BuddyRydell:

Originally posted by Phenomenally Frantastic:
FRED BARR
COLIN COLE
BRAD BANKS
BOB SANDERS
CJ JONES
MO BROWN
ANTWAN ALLEN
JOVON JOHNSON
DALLAS CLARK


Where are these kind of guys??

Why / how did we stop recruiting talented football players? anyone know why??

all we hear now is how nice our academic scholars are while losing to ISU!!!!
They started listening to recruiting services and fans and stopped trusting their own judgement. If they would have recruited these guys today, the fans would be screaming about what worthless recruiters they are, as almost all of these folks were 'under the radar' recruits. Almost all were walk-ons, JC transfers, and had no offers from P5 conferences (MAC level recruits). Beleima used to pull some kids from florida that FL, theU, and FL St. didn't want, but since he left to go to Kan.St., in 2002 we've only had like 2 FL recruits who actually stayed the duration. (Mabin may be the first to finish in 8 yrs.I think Ed Miles was the last? However long it has been, I think you get the point)
https://espn.go.com/blog/bigten/post/_/id/71858/hawkeyes-florida-retreat-a-b1g-problem
I think they need to hire a coach with FL ties (they have with TX) and start working it harder and they and the FANS need to stop worrying about ratings. They can build OL and DL's mainly from IA and IL, always have, but they need WR and LB's from places like TX and FL. Say what you want about KF, but he can judge and develop talent. Let him, and quit screaming about stars and ratings.
P.S. - This team isn't as barren as some think, but yes, there is not a lot of future draft choices on this roster either, like they normally have.
What a spectacular load of horseshit. Where do I even start?
Start wherever you'd like. The first line is mainly sarcasm, but the rest is mostly indisputable because it is not based on uninformed opinion, like most, but supported by fact and history. "Past behavior is the best predictor of future behavior".
 
Originally posted by BuddyRydell:
Say what you want about KF, but he can judge and develop talent.
This statement I could not disagree more strongly with you. Perhaps he can judge OL talent and even develop that talent.

But QB? No. No No No.

Has routinely played and promoted the wrong QB. His QBs do not go to the next level and play.

Not one QB that played under Ferentz, in 15 years, has EVER played a single snap of a regular season NFL game.

Sell that hogwash somewhere else partner.
 
Originally posted by Phenomenally Frantastic:


Originally posted by BuddyRydell:
Say what you want about KF, but he can judge and develop talent.
This statement I could not disagree more strongly with you. Perhaps he can judge OL talent and even develop that talent.

But QB? No. No No No.

Has routinely played and promoted the wrong QB. His QBs do not go to the next level and play.

Not one QB that played under Ferentz, in 15 years, has EVER played a single snap of a regular season NFL game.

Sell that hogwash somewhere else partner.
Every NFL scout and coach disagrees with you. But what do they know? They should just ask you?
Name one Iowa QB that has EVER been successful in the NFL in their entire history? What does Ferentz have to do with that? It was Ferentz's fault that no QB in the Hayden Fry era ever was succesful in the NFL? Did you stomp your feet when you were typing No No No, like a 3 yr. old told to take a nap? Who are you to decide who was and wasn't the right QB?
You do understand that developing a QB to succeed in your system is entirely different. Who's the last Heisman winning QB that was successful in the NFL.. Your point is one of ignorance and emotion, not of credibility. My statement is totally accurate and supported by fact. Ask any NFL scout.
And college analysts have stated over and over that no one finds and develops 'under the radar' talent' better than KF. These aren't my opinions, these are the informed observations of experts in their field, not some call center customer service rep.emoting on a message board.
 
I'll pull this out again. It can be used to argue both sides of the talent issue though it seems to me we do not get as many players with quality offers as we used to.



2003 Two Deep Offers that I could find.





Fred Russell - signed with
Michigan out of HS.
Jonathon Babineaux - Texas also offered per
one source that is disputed.
George Lewis - Mich St., Wisconsin
and Pitt.
Derrick Robinson - Colorado, Kansas, Minnesota, Ohio St,
Tennessee.
Bennie Sapp - Michigan St. (Was kicked off team and
transferred to UNI.)
Eric Steinbach - Notre Dame, Michigan,
Georgia Tech, Boston College
Jared Clauss - ISU, Kansas St.,
Nebraska (disputed) and Oklahoma.
Erik Jensen - Northwestern,
Minnesota
David Porter - Illinois, Ohio St, K-State
Andy
Lightfoot - Michigan, Notre Dame, Texas, UCLA
Fred
Barr-Louisville, Georgia Tech, Maryland (And Broward County Defensive
Player of Year)
Mo Brown - Northwestern, Colorado St., Purdue,
Michigan St.
Antwan Allen - Vanderbilt, NC St., Tennessee, East
Carolina
Ed Hinkle - Pitt, Syracuse, Virginia, Illinois, Notre
Dame
C J Jones - K-State, Missouri, Arkansas
Fabian Dodd -
Auburn with Ohio St and Florida St having withdrawn offers due to
poor grades.
Abdul Hodge - Wisconsin, BC, Auburn, LSU.
Matt
Roth - Nebraska, Purdue, Miami, K-State, Wisconsin.
Sam Aiello -
Indiana, Illinois "with interest from most of Big 10" per
his father.
D J Johnson - ISU, Purdue and Oklahoma
Cervantes - Boise
St., Idaho and late attempt to get visit by USC.
Colin Cole - 2nd
team Broward Co. (Missing 1998 info for offers.)

Class
Rankings Per Athlon -

1998 43rd nationally and 7th in
Big 10
1999 49th nationally and 9th in Big 10
2000
Not in Top 50 and 10th in Big10
2001 31st
nationally and 5th in Big 10
 
Originally posted by Phenomenally Frantastic:
FRED BARR
COLIN COLE
BRAD BANKS
BOB SANDERS
CJ JONES
MO BROWN
ANTWAN ALLEN
JOVON JOHNSON
DALLAS CLARK


Where are these kind of guys??

Why / how did we stop recruiting talented football players? anyone know why??

all we hear now is how nice our academic scholars are while losing to ISU!!!!
His good teams had good assistant coaches that overcame his junior high coaching ability. He is in rare company for coaching ineptness over the last 40 years.
 
Originally posted by hawkeyesports92:

Originally posted by Phenomenally Frantastic:
FRED BARR
COLIN COLE
BRAD BANKS
BOB SANDERS
CJ JONES
MO BROWN
ANTWAN ALLEN
JOVON JOHNSON
DALLAS CLARK


Where are these kind of guys??

Why / how did we stop recruiting talented football players? anyone know why??

all we hear now is how nice our academic scholars are while losing to ISU!!!!
His good teams had good assistant coaches that overcame his junior high coaching ability. He is in rare company for coaching ineptness over the last 40 years.
Hit the nail on the head. Back then we had better asst. coaches like Aiken & Philbin that developed players better than we have now. But even early combine those asst coaches along with our OC and DC as much as KOK could drive hawk fans crazy tough to argue Greg Davis has been better than him and obviously Norm better than Phil Parker.
 
Originally posted by FlickShagwell:

Originally posted by BuddyRydell:

Originally posted by FlickShagwell:

Originally posted by BuddyRydell:

Originally posted by Phenomenally Frantastic:
FRED BARR
COLIN COLE
BRAD BANKS
BOB SANDERS
CJ JONES
MO BROWN
ANTWAN ALLEN
JOVON JOHNSON
DALLAS CLARK


Where are these kind of guys??

Why / how did we stop recruiting talented football players? anyone know why??

all we hear now is how nice our academic scholars are while losing to ISU!!!!




They started listening to recruiting services and fans and stopped trusting their own judgement. If they would have recruited these guys today, the fans would be screaming about what worthless recruiters they are, as almost all of these folks were 'under the radar' recruits. Almost all were walk-ons, JC transfers, and had no offers from P5 conferences (MAC level recruits).
What a spectacular load of horseshit. Where do I even start?
Start wherever you'd like. The first line is mainly sarcasm, but the rest is mostly indisputable because it is not based on uninformed opinion, like most, but supported by fact and history. "Past behavior is the best predictor of future behavior".
The staff IS recruiting this caliber of player from a stars/accolades standpoint today. Lots of 2 star guys. The difference between the guys they go after today and these guys from the late 90's is they don't seem to pan out anymore. And fans are definitely screaming about what worthless recruiters they are. Not sure where you've been. But the biggest load of crap you tried to dump on us like we wouldn't notice is "Almost all were walk-ons, JC transfers.."

You need to look up what "almost all" means. Dallas Clark was a walk-on. The rest were scholarship guys. CJ Jones and Brad Banks were JC transfers. The rest came as freshman. That's 3 of the 9 listed.
I couldn't figure out what you were talking about until I went back and read my original post and found I worded it very poorly I meant to say ' Almost all were either walk-ons, JC transfers, OR guys that didn't have offers from P5 schools (since I could only find that Barr and Cole were the only ones to recieve OFFERS, not interest, and that was mainly just ACC). Thus why I said 'almost all'. I know what it means, lol.
Since I posted that H-Hawk has posted that some of these guys (Mo and Antwan) had more offers although all I could find was that the only other offer Mo got was Colo. St. I don't know where he got the old Athlon info (I can't find it) or do I know how reliable it is. If someone can link me to this info and I'm wrong, I have no problem admitting such.
 
The 2002 was picked as a 7th place team. Not exactly getting respect for all of our so called talent at the time
Posted from Rivals Mobile
 
Iowa has pretty much counted on the potential of a recruit rather than on how he has been rated by a recruiting service. Mainly because it has always been hard for Iowa to consistently get a 4-5 star recruit. It seems the one difference is the coaching changes that have taken place the last 2-3 years. Ferentz has lost some quality coaches and I'm not sure the replacements are as good. Usually when a program has started to slide is when the good assistant coaches leave. Hayden Fry went through this, Urban Meyer when he was at Florida. I think Bob Stoops is going through this right now. Saban has also been losing some quality coaches and it maybe interesting to see how he functions in the coming yrs.
 
..easy answer..they went with the iowa recruiters....
sleepy.r191677.gif
 
Iowa isn't finding the diamonds in the rough in the amounts they used to because other teams researched how Iowa did things and emulated how they did this and are now taking them off our hands to some degree.

Flattering really...and it makes it that much harder for them currently.
 
Originally posted by jdv77:


Can we at least admit that Iowa's elite players typically have not had tremendous recruiting pedigrees when they came to Iowa.

Let's take out the 2 junior college players (Brad Banks and CJ Jones), who were a 3 star and 4 star, if I recall correctly. If you look at the players on the OP's list who came to Iowa out of high school, this is what you have:

Fred Barr--2 stars
Colin Cole--2 stars
Bob Sanders--2 stars
Mo Brown--2 stars
Antwan Allen--3 stars
Jovon Johnson--2 stars
Dallas Clark--no stars (walk-on)

If you want to take the ESPN list of NFL players from Iowa in 2014, this is what you have (recruiting rankings are from memory, so I might be off on a few):

Jonathan Babineaux--2 stars
Conor Boffeli--3 stars
Bryan Bulaga--4 stars
Scott Chandler--2 stars
Adrian Clayborn--4 stars
Colin Cole--2 stars
Mike Daniels--2 stars
A.J. Edds--3 stars
James Ferentz--3 stars
C.J. Fiedorowicz--4 stars
Bradley Fletcher--2 stars
Adam Gettis--2 stars
Charles Godfrey--2 stars
Shonn Greene--3 stars
Chad Greenway--2 stars
Anthony Hitchens--2 stars
Micah Hyde--2 stars
Christian Kirksey--3 stars
Karl Klug--2 stars
Tony Moeaki--4 stars
James Morris--3 stars
Brandon Myers--2 stars
Shaun Prater--3 stars
Riley Reiff--3 stars
Allen Resner--3 stars
Ricky Stanzi--3 stars
Jeff Tarpinian--3 stars
Matt Tobin--walk on, maybe 2 stars
Julian Vander Velde--3 stars
Marshall Yanda--3 stars

That's a collective 81 stars divided by 30 guys--2.7 average stars. It's lower if you exclude the 2 stars that I gave to Tobin as a walk-on.

I understand people looking at this roster and saying that it needs more talent, but you can't make that point by looking at the OP's list and then complaining about the lack of highly-ranked recruits on this roster. None of the football blue bloods thought the OP's list were sufficiently talented to warrant a scholarship offer. Their recruiting profiles would fit in perfectly with the current roster. Nor can you make it well by looking at the recruiting rankings of Iowa's NFL players.
Thanks for posting that. It's kind of eye-opening. You see this also when people talk about Hayden, who recruited the same kind of players at Iowa with some notable exceptions like Tavian Banks and a few others. If you went up and down the rosters back then, it was dominated by two and three stars. The greatest Iowa QB of all time (arguably) was a 2-Star from Wheaton.

I'm all about saying let's get more big-time talent, but I'm also all about finding good talent that is overlooked or raw talent that has high upside. At Iowa you have to do that regardless of what people say. Yes, I would like to see higher end skill position talent, which I think we lack, but I'm loathe to pass judgment or dismiss the recruiting in the past two years as already a failure. It's a little premature.
 
Originally posted by bagdropper:

Iowa isn't finding the diamonds in the rough in the amounts they used to because other teams researched how Iowa did things and emulated how they did this and are now taking them off our hands to some degree.

Flattering really...and it makes it that much harder for them currently.
Link?
 
Originally posted by ThatsFootball:

Originally posted by bagdropper:

Iowa isn't finding the diamonds in the rough in the amounts they used to because other teams researched how Iowa did things and emulated how they did this and are now taking them off our hands to some degree.

Flattering really...and it makes it that much harder for them currently.
Link?
So, the haters can post unsubstantiated horsehockey and not provide backup, but when others do the same, we're required links to prove out our point.

Logic tends to state that since Kirk went around this winter to other programs to see how they do things (he stated this publicly) that the opposite has also occurred in the past.

You really think an Iowa would rise up to the 2002-2004 levels wouldn't have some coach asking "hey Kirk...mind if we visit your offices sometime in February and see how you do things?" Hell, D'Antonio has admitted publicly (paraphrasing) he looked at Iowa as a model on how he should run his program.

You think he just watched TV to come to that conclusion?
 
Originally posted by bagdropper:

Originally posted by ThatsFootball:


Originally posted by bagdropper:

Iowa isn't finding the diamonds in the rough in the amounts they used to because other teams researched how Iowa did things and emulated how they did this and are now taking them off our hands to some degree.

Flattering really...and it makes it that much harder for them currently.
Link?
So, the haters can post unsubstantiated horsehockey and not provide backup, but when others do the same, we're required links to prove out our point.

Logic tends to state that since Kirk went around this winter to other programs to see how they do things (he stated this publicly) that the opposite has also occurred in the past.

You really think an Iowa would rise up to the 2002-2004 levels wouldn't have some coach asking "hey Kirk...mind if we visit your offices sometime in February and see how you do things?" Hell, D'Antonio has admitted publicly (paraphrasing) he looked at Iowa as a model on how he should run his program.

You think he just watched TV to come to that conclusion?
Thatsfootball doesn't understand abductive reasoning.
Those who can observe and have the ability to infer would come to that denouement.
 
Originally posted by bagdropper:


Originally posted by ThatsFootball:



Originally posted by bagdropper:

Iowa isn't finding the diamonds in the rough in the amounts they used to because other teams researched how Iowa did things and emulated how they did this and are now taking them off our hands to some degree.

Flattering really...and it makes it that much harder for them currently.
Link?
So, the haters can post unsubstantiated horsehockey and not provide backup, but when others do the same, we're required links to prove out our point.

Logic tends to state that since Kirk went around this winter to other programs to see how they do things (he stated this publicly) that the opposite has also occurred in the past.

You really think an Iowa would rise up to the 2002-2004 levels wouldn't have some coach asking "hey Kirk...mind if we visit your offices sometime in February and see how you do things?" Hell, D'Antonio has admitted publicly (paraphrasing) he looked at Iowa as a model on how he should run his program.

You think he just watched TV to come to that conclusion?
laugh.r191677.gif
Feel free to ask the "haters" to back up their claims next time they post something, nobody will stop you.

As far as the bolded, that is a little different than your claim of other teams copying our recruiting strategy, and you obviously know that since you didn't mention the word 'recruiting' once in this post.





This post was edited on 4/1 5:13 PM by ThatsFootball
 
There's no sense in arguing with you because your mind is already closed off. You've rubber-stamped Kirk Ferentz already. Your poster name, "That's Football" - tells us all exactly where you stand.

You cannot see past your hatred to reasonably debate any and all subjects. Only a complete fool would assume that in these visits, evaluating talent never comes up. Are you seriously that dense? That not a single solitary visiting coach never asked..."gee, Kirk. How did you find Dallas Clark? How did you find Bob Sanders? How did you project their talents they showed us all in high school into possibly being the players they wound up being for your program, and how did you develop them into that?"

Yep...nobody EVER asked those questions. "Hey Kirk, diagram the zone blocking scheme for me please." That's all he was ever asked.
 
Originally posted by revkev73:
Recruiting takes passion and energy...KF has a guaranteed contract

Go 6-6...off to a bowl...all golden
So he can't be fired? Ever?

Don't you have a guaranteed contract yourself as a reverend? It seems like you lack passion and energy and your recruiting for God's team isn't what it was.

See how easy that is? I don't know you personally nor do I have anything concrete to go on, but that's the way I feel. I just made a judgment based on knowing nothing. That constitutes a majority of your posts. Yes, you can have that opinion, most certainly, and because I do know better, I can tell you you're full of...well, no need to be harsh. But you might be the best, most energetic, and passionate person in 65 counties, but I'm just throwing the other one out there even though I don't have any idea.

I can think of a lot of KF criticisms that make sense to me, but this one -- the one you harp on in every post. Every time. Is the one that's wrong. You could have said he's stubborn, won't change it up, lousy press conference coach, snarky to the media, wants to do things his way, is too conservative et. al. but since I've talked to a lot of former players, including recent ones and some recruits, they tell a completely different story. So who should I believe?

You already know that answer.
 
ADVERTISEMENT