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Gutless NCAA committee chairman

artradley

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Apr 26, 2013
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Interviewed on FLO:

http://www.flowrestling.org/coverage/252093-2015-NCAA-D1-Championships/video/764388-NCAA-Explains-Miller-v-Realbuto-Controversy#.VQyg_dJ4rKA

He's either stupid beyond belief, or a liar. He's definitely a coward. Based on his argument, the committee can never correct a an error, in which case that specifically sends these things to the committee was written for absolutely no reason. Anybody believe that?

Gutless refs, gutless committee. I'm amazed at the number of cowards in charge.




This post was edited on 3/20 5:44 PM by artradley

This post was edited on 3/20 5:47 PM by artradley
 
Re: Gutless NCAA committee chairman speaks

There's a clear rule on how scoring can be challenged. That much is clear. What are they supposed to do make it up as they go along? Yeah several people blew it for this outcome to happen. Big time. But IMO it's mainly on the coaches for losing track of the score and not knowing the rules.
 
Re: Gutless NCAA committee chairman speaks


Originally posted by Intensity_guru:
There's a clear rule on how scoring can be challenged. That much is clear. What are they supposed to do make it up as they go along? Yeah several people blew it for this outcome to happen. Big time. But IMO it's mainly on the coaches for losing track of the score and not knowing the rules.
They are supposed to see if the officials at the mat got it wrong, and if so make any possible correction. That presumably is why the rule is there. It says if the referee does not correct the error it goes to the committee.

One presumes the rule was not written so the committee would just say "we can't do anything about it."
 
technicality and procedure should not trump common sense or the right thing.
they had a chance at integrity and choose poorly.
 
Refs screw up all the time Bottom line is, if the coach asks for an official review of the score, which he admitted he did not do, that match never goes to OT.
 
Originally posted by 255:

technicality and procedure should not trump common sense or the right thing.
they had a chance at integrity and choose poorly.

+ 1. What ever happened to doing the right thing for the athlete??
 
Originally posted by Intensity_guru:
Refs screw up all the time Bottom line is, if the coach asks for an official review of the score, which he admitted he did not do, that match never goes to OT.
So, if not this, under what circumstances would the committee correct the score? What do you believe is the purpose of the rule?




This post was edited on 3/20 6:17 PM by artradley
 
The coaches didn't ask for a review, so why should they be allowed to circumvent the rules and guilt trip the committee into changing the score. Bottom line this is on the coaches, not the committee.
 
Seems like there isn't a clear cut rule on this situation given the committee had an hour long emergency meeting on this.
 
It's also on the ref, the second ref and the scores table. Either the ref never gave him one or the score's table didn't catch it. To act like this is just on the coaches is naive. Plenty of blame to go around and the only person hurt by this is the kid from kent st.
Posted from Rivals Mobile
 
Originally posted by whejoe:
The coaches didn't ask for a review, so why should they be allowed to circumvent the rules and guilt trip the committee into changing the score. Bottom line this is on the coaches, not the committee.
The rules regarding review suggests that it is to be used for overruling a referee's judgement call -- not the score. There is nothing in the rule book that suggests a coach has to use one of his allotted challenges in order to get the correct score on the board.

What the rule book does clearly say is that if the score is incorrect, and the referee does not get it corrected before everybody has left the mat, then it is up to the committee to:

3.11.2 Error by Timekeeper and/or Scorers. If there is an error on the part of the
timekeeper and/or scorers, the error shall be corrected and the referee will
inform the wrestlers, coaches and announcer of the correction. During a dual
meet, correction shall be made by the referee before the start of a subsequent
match. An error during the last match of a dual meet must be corrected before
the referee has signed the scorebook.
For a tournament, the correction shall be made by the referee and shall take
place before the contestants leave the mat area or the bout sheet leaves the
scorer's table. Any error not resolved by the referee shall be arbitrated by the
tournament committee.


This is on the score table, the referee, and the tournament committee. Not the coach.


This post was edited on 3/20 6:28 PM by artradley
 
Originally posted by McCulloughd:
I was sitting close to the mat. Ref did "not" signal the 1 point escape. It's on the coaches.
So the ref holds no fault in all this? If the refs were doing their job we wouldn't have any controversy.
Posted from Rivals Mobile
 
Originally posted by tailgaterhawk:
Originally posted by McCulloughd:
I was sitting close to the mat. Ref did "not" signal the 1 point escape. It's on the coaches.
So the ref holds no fault in all this? If the refs were doing their job we wouldn't have any controversy.
Posted from Rivals Mobile
Yes they do. If the coaching staff at the end of the match would have asked about the scoring then the ref's would have gotten involved. When the match is over the ref's aren't going to go over to the scorers table and ask for a complete run down on the scoring. Someone at the table after the match should have questioned the ref's about the escape but not awarding the point. It's almost like the Nick Dardanes and Logan Stieber match this year.
 
I didn't see it live but watched the youtube video. Commentator made some statements that coaches were questioning things which was happening off screen. Then all of a sudden they started OT. Did anyone at the meet happen to be watching. I always thought refs were pretty good about at least talking to a coach when there was some issue if during a break in the match.
 
Originally posted by Urohawk:
I didn't see it live but watched the youtube video. Commentator made some statements that coaches were questioning things which was happening off screen. Then all of a sudden they started OT. Did anyone at the meet happen to be watching. I always thought refs were pretty good about at least talking to a coach when there was some issue if during a break in the match.
The coach said he told the refs he though the score was wrong, and they and the scorekeeper told him to relax, that the score was right. He basically admitted he was on a bigger stage than he was used to and let them convince him he was wrong, without going over the bout sheet score by score.

And to the earlier post, yes, going over the bout sheet score-by-score is EXACTLY what they do in these instances. If there's a question about the score that is the standard procedure.

And you're correct; most referees will hear a coach out and then take the time to confirm with the score table. This was a HUGE error; and then an example of arrogance that led to an even bigger error -- not confirming the score before rushing back out for OT.



Also, I'm waiting for somebody to explain to me what the rule I quoted above is intended to correct, if not this kind of case. Either the rule is written for no purpose, or the committee failed in their responsibility. The person LEAST at fault here is the Duke coach.











This post was edited on 3/21 5:59 PM by artradley
 
1) I'll go with gutless. An obvious mistake was made and at that point the committee was the only entity that could have set it right.

2) It is definitely on the coach. A big part of coaching from high school on up is to have a stat person keeping score. Mistakes happen at all levels and the coach has to be on top of things to protect their guy.

3) It is on the scorer's table. They would have to notice the change in position and the fact that a point needed to be awarded. Hundreds of times I have seen scorers ask an official for clarification to be sure the score was correct.

4) It is on the assistant official. One of their main duties is to assist the main official by watching the clock and score, plus assist with input to make calls about action not visible to the main official, and be a sounding board for those critical, close calls.

5) It is on the official. As an official myself there have been times of being so caught up in the action that points don't get clearly awarded. It is unfortunate, but we are all human and no one is immune to error.

There is plenty of blame to go around. The rule book is clear about when and how to correct errors, but when all of the possibilities to catch and correct an error fail, that is when it is the responsibility of the committee to set it right. Their failure was the greatest of all- they were aware of what was right and they compounded the mess instead of correcting it.
 
Miller got screwed at least 4 different ways from those responsible not doing their job. That said, glad he made the Podium. IMO, the Gutless head of the Tourny committee is the biggest culprit and should fall on the sword and quit in humiliation.
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This post was edited on 3/22 6:39 PM by Abro1975
 
Originally posted by artradley:


Originally posted by Urohawk:
I didn't see it live but watched the youtube video. Commentator made some statements that coaches were questioning things which was happening off screen. Then all of a sudden they started OT. Did anyone at the meet happen to be watching. I always thought refs were pretty good about at least talking to a coach when there was some issue if during a break in the match.
The coach said he told the refs he though the score was wrong, and they and the scorekeeper told him to relax, that the score was right. He basically admitted he was on a bigger stage than he was used to and let them convince him he was wrong, without going over the bout sheet score by score.

And to the earlier post, yes, going over the bout sheet score-by-score is EXACTLY what they do in these instances. If there's a question about the score that is the standard procedure.

And you're correct; most referees will hear a coach out and then take the time to confirm with the score table. This was a HUGE error; and then an example of arrogance that led to an even bigger error -- not confirming the score before rushing back out for OT.



Also, I'm waiting for somebody to explain to me what the rule I quoted above is intended to correct, if not this kind of case. Either the rule is written for no purpose, or the committee failed in their responsibility. The person LEAST at fault here is the Duke coach.












This post was edited on 3/21 5:59 PM by artradley
Yes, I told my buddy with me that I saw the coaches talking to the ref; of course I don't know what they where saying.
Some blame on coach because I would never trust a ref in this sitation.

Also, I read in another post that the ref never gave a signal for the escape so how did it get on the score sheet?

Worse blame is on the "gutless" commmittee they had a chance to do the right thing and failed.
So much was wrong this year makes a person wonder why the NCAA even has this so called committee
Must be a new committee because (forget the year) but there was a mixed up in a Minn match and a friend of mine from Minn was real late getting back to the hotel room. He told me the committee ruled and fix the wrong score and when the rest of the matches where done they made the Minn wrestler and his opponent wrestle a whole new match..So this was long after this match was over.
 
Originally posted by artradley:
Interviewed on FLO:

http://www.flowrestling.org/coverage/252093-2015-NCAA-D1-Championships/video/764388-NCAA-Explains-Miller-v-Realbuto-Controversy#.VQyg_dJ4rKA

He's either stupid beyond belief, or a liar. He's definitely a coward. Based on his argument, the committee can never correct a an error, in which case that specifically sends these things to the committee was written for absolutely no reason. Anybody believe that?

Gutless refs, gutless committee. I'm amazed at the number of cowards in charge.The coach did ask the ref about the score no way did in my opinion when the ref with out checking score table that the score was correct..





This post was edited on 3/20 5:44 PM by artradley


This post was edited on 3/20 5:47 PM by artradley
Typical way things are today..Not my fault blame it on down to lowest on the pole.
 
I really thought Realbuto should have gotten at least two points for back points at the end. But then I had him in a pool so I was bias:)
 
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