Hey all, the shite finally hit the fan.

HawkCapt1912

HR All-American
Oct 3, 2001
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Former DBQer in WDM
I am just getting started, man. The disconnect for me to date is the "higher power" or religious part of it. Maybe I am just an a-hole, but that is the only reason I have questions about the program. If my admission to addiction has not been clear to this point, then pay closer attention.
It’s not religious per se. It’s more spiritual. Your higher power however you want to define it. Whoever, whatever, or wherever you seek guidance. Try not to dwell on the minutiae.
The 4th step can get into details and seem daunting.
 
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ConvenientParking

HR Legend
Gold Member
Jun 28, 2016
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you have a lonely pathetic life if you thought to post something like this on a forum of strangers.

One day science will find that there's a gene in people like you that short circuits any potential capacity people like you might have to develop an understanding of concepts like irony or hypocrisy. Hint: When you are here posting or lurking, you should have a bit of a clue that it makes you look like a moron to call someone else a pathetic loser for being here.
 

TylerJ76

HR MVP
Jun 11, 2021
2,375
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Jason,

I got to almost 8 years of sobriety by pure willpower.
No AA meetings
Nothing.

Please don't go this route, it's incredibly difficult, and a set up for a disaster.

Find your community, even if it's just a couple sober friends, even if it's just me and some people from here.
 

Colonoscopy

HR All-American
Silver Member
Feb 20, 2022
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50

AA, from what I've read over the years, is actually the most effective course of treatment an Alcoholic might undertake. A lot of people are perturbed by its religious undertones & affiliation. While I'm sure they could be subbed out for something neutral, it must be the underlying structure of the program that makes it work. I wouldn't get hung-up on the religious language, the magic there is coming from something else.
 
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jasonrann

HR Legend
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Apr 11, 2007
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you have a lonely pathetic life if you thought to post something like this on a forum of strangers.
This isn't a forum of strangers for me. I know several outside of HROT and have been on here for years. I appreciate input and help from people that I consider friends. That said, feel free to fvck off. Don't open the thread if this is all you have.
 

ConvenientParking

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Jun 28, 2016
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AA, from what I've read over the years, is actually the most effective course of treatment an Alcoholic might undertake. A lot of people are perturbed by its religious undertones & affiliation. While I'm sure they could be subbed out for something neutral, it must be the underlying structure of the program that makes it work. I wouldn't get hung-up on the religious language, the magic there is coming from something else.

My opinion is the magic there is coming from it being the only option for decades. There were some moderately successful temperance movements before AA. It's the mutual aid. The program itself has no particularly special or new insights. It's the praxis of Catholicism (take a personal inventory of your sinning, confess, repent, be open to mercy, then pay it forward).
 

ConvenientParking

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Jun 28, 2016
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My opinion is the magic there is coming from it being the only option for decades. There were some moderately successful temperance movements before AA. It's the mutual aid. The program itself has no particularly special or new insights. It's the praxis of Catholicism (take a personal inventory of your sinning, confess, repent, be open to mercy, then pay it forward).

I should add one thing that is actually very special about AA and that is their traditions particularly when it comes to AA's insistence on remaining self-supporting and completely unaffiliated with outside organizations. That's durable and important for making sure AA will be there in the future for people who need it.
 
Mar 11, 2020
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Dear @jasonrann


I'll start out this by saying I hope you got the wake up call and this is a changing point for you.



Also, actions speak louder than words. I worked with many addicts who would do dumb shit like post on a message board about how wrong they were as a way of attoning and they were back in the bottle 5 months later. Don't be the butt**** that talks a big game, you are an addict, you need help, get it. Nobody is going to show up at your funeral and tell your wife how sorry you sounded when you posted on an anonymous message board. Time for your actions to speak.
 

jasonrann

HR Legend
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Apr 11, 2007
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Dear @jasonrann


I'll start out this by saying I hope you got the wake up call and this is a changing point for you.



Also, actions speak louder than words. I worked with many addicts who would do dumb shit like post on a message board about how wrong they were as a way of attoning and they were back in the bottle 5 months later. Don't be the butt**** that talks a big game, you are an addict, you need help, get it. Nobody is going to show up at your funeral and tell your wife how sorry you sounded when you posted on an anonymous message board. Time for your actions to speak.
I haven't been sober long, but I'm sober. I am going to daily AA meetings. While I am currently separated from my family, we still talk every day and our love is still there. I'm doing the best I can at the moment. If I sound like a butt****, then I guess it is what it is. I appreciate your perspective, sir, and thank you for sharing it.
 
Mar 11, 2020
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I haven't been sober long, but I'm sober. I am going to daily AA meetings. While I am currently separated from my family, we still talk every day and our love is still there. I'm doing the best I can at the moment. If I sound like a butt****, then I guess it is what it is. I appreciate your perspective, sir, and thank you for sharing it.
There are going to be many people who wish you well and tell you all the great things. Every now and then an addiction counselor needs to hit you with the facts. The good news for you is you still have an opportunity,what you do with that is up to you. Godspeed on your journey. 1 minute, 1 hour, 1 day, it all adds up.

Edit to add: I don't think you are a butt****. If you come back in 6 months talking about how you slipped up and went on a bender again and how you are really.sorry this time..... then I will think you are a butt****. I don't practice anymore, I don't have to be PC, this is real world I've seen success and failure talking.
 

Moral

HR Legend
Sep 29, 2017
24,856
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There are going to be many people who wish you well and tell you all the great things. Every now and then an addiction counselor needs to hit you with the facts. The good news for you is you still have an opportunity,what you do with that is up to you. Godspeed on your journey. 1 minute, 1 hour, 1 day, it all adds up.

Edit to add: I don't think you are a butt****. If you come back in 6 months talking about how you slipped up and went on a bender again and how you are really.sorry this time..... then I will think you are a butt****. I don't practice anymore, I don't have to be PC, this is real world I've seen success and failure talking.

This reminds me of those talk shows that used to bring on cops and criminals to scare teens straight.

And then one of them ended up becoming a millionaire because she got meme’d which made her start her rap and only fans career. This world I swear.
 

srams21

HR Legend
Gold Member
May 23, 2004
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Best of luck Jason. You are one of the good ones on here. Do everything you can to get sober. You have a wonderful family and it sounds like they mean the world to you. You can do this. For real, DM me if you ever need anything. No BS there.
 

fredjr82

HR Legend
Gold Member
Nov 13, 2007
23,081
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Edit to add: I don't think you are a butt****. If you come back in 6 months talking about how you slipped up and went on a bender again and how you are really.sorry this time..... then I will think you are a butt****. I don't practice anymore, I don't have to be PC, this is real world I've seen success and failure talking.

People relapse all the time and as a "addiction counselor" you should know that. You should offer the person positive reinforcement instead of calling him a butt**** if he also relapses. Alcohol would be the worst in my opinion too. Drug dealer on every corner.

I really hope you aren't dealing with addicts with your above response.
 
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Hawki97

HR Heisman
Gold Member
Dec 16, 2001
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Iowa City, IA
With my boozing. I just spent 5 days in the hospital after a big weekend run with my old college buddy. My heart went out of rhythm again and this time it was really bad. I haven't been that scared ever. I am out and sober, but wifey (no pic) is none too happy with me, justifiably so. I am staying with a good friend and going to daily meetings, but good thoughts would be appreciated. I know I am an a-hole, but I really feel like one now. I hope to be back with the family in a week or so.

God bless.

Ooof, good luck jason...sounds like a tough one. Have you been boozing on the regular or was it just the occasional bender with buddies?
 
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ConvenientParking

HR Legend
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Jun 28, 2016
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There are going to be many people who wish you well and tell you all the great things. Every now and then an addiction counselor needs to hit you with the facts. The good news for you is you still have an opportunity,what you do with that is up to you. Godspeed on your journey. 1 minute, 1 hour, 1 day, it all adds up.

Edit to add: I don't think you are a butt****. If you come back in 6 months talking about how you slipped up and went on a bender again and how you are really.sorry this time..... then I will think you are a butt****. I don't practice anymore, I don't have to be PC, this is real world I've seen success and failure talking.
You were an addiction counselor? What guidance counselor thought that would be a good path for you? That seems like a mismatch of skills. You should be like a Scout troop leader for kids who are not addicts.
 
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jasonrann

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Apr 11, 2007
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Best of luck Jason. You are one of the good ones on here. Do everything you can to get sober. You have a wonderful family and it sounds like they mean the world to you. You can do this. For real, DM me if you ever need anything. No BS there.
I appreciate you, brother. Thank you!
 
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jasonrann

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Apr 11, 2007
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People relapse all the time and as a "addiction counselor" you should know that. You should offer the person positive reinforcement instead of calling him a butt**** if he also relapses. Alcohol would be the worst in my opinion too. Drug dealer on every corner.

I really hope you aren't dealing with addicts with your above response.
@fredjr82 , there is literally a liquor store directly next door to my AA meeting site. Just can't make this shite up.
 
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jasonrann

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Apr 11, 2007
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Ooof, good luck jason...sounds like a tough one. Have you been boozing on the regular or was it just the occasional bender with buddies?

I had cut back in a MAJOR way, a couple beers/shots/week for the past six months. That might sound like a lot, but I could easily do a 750/day without blinking prior to that. College buddy and I went two full days. My eyes were definitely bigger than my stomach.
 
Mar 11, 2020
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People relapse all the time and as a "addiction counselor" you should know that. You should offer the person positive reinforcement instead of calling him a butt**** if he also relapses. Alcohol would be the worst in my opinion too. Drug dealer on every corner.

I really hope you aren't dealing with addicts with your above response.
Like I said, there will be plenty of people to offer tots and pears. I want him to succeed and success here, is living as long as possible as a father and husband. It isn't the relapse that makes people a "butt****" it's the common tactic of an addict finding ways to justify or remove remorse, like if he "comes back in 6 months". Addicts have enough friends, there is always someone to axillary a beer with and talk about how they have it so much different than anyone else. By thr time an addict gets to a counselor, often times, what they really need is someone to tell them they are not going to see their daughters wedding because they keep chasing booze.
 
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fredjr82

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Nov 13, 2007
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Like I said, there will be plenty of people to offer tots and pears. I want him to succeed and success here, is living as long as possible as a father and husband. It isn't the relapse that makes people a "butt****" it's the common tactic of an addict finding ways to justify or remove remorse, like if he "comes back in 6 months". Addicts have enough friends, there is always someone to axillary a beer with and talk about how they have it so much different than anyone else. By thr time an addict gets to a counselor, often times, what they really need is someone to tell them they are not going to see their daughters wedding because they keep chasing booze.

OK, but only if it becomes a pattern. If he comes back and says he F'd up again and then continues to drink I agree. Falling off the wagon isn't uncommon, in fact it's probably likely
 

HawkCapt1912

HR All-American
Oct 3, 2001
3,442
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Former DBQer in WDM
OK, but only if it becomes a pattern. If he comes back and says he F'd up again and then continues to drink I agree. Falling off the wagon isn't uncommon, in fact it's probably likely
It’s all up to him and where he perceives his rock bottom to be. Some are high bottom drunks and make the necessary changes. Others are low bottom drunks and have to lose shit, or worse, before changing. Some lose everything and don’t change at all. I was a high bottom drunk but have witnessed the other two.
Change will not be made with crisis.
 

luvmyhawks

HR Legend
Mar 22, 2005
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I had cut back in a MAJOR way, a couple beers/shots/week for the past six months. That might sound like a lot, but I could easily do a 750/day without blinking prior to that. College buddy and I went two full days. My eyes were definitely bigger than my stomach.

‘Not to be an enabler here, but I wouldn’t even consider 2 beers and 2 shots per week as a moderate drinker. That’s pretty light imo. Anyway. Take good care brother.
 
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HawkeyeShawn

HR Heisman
Nov 9, 2001
7,115
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I am 52 and was seriously worried about my future. I at least found out my heart is in good shape, nothing enlarged, chest x-ray came back clean. I am going to hit my annual physical next month to make sure the rest is alright.

I am curious, how did he find out about the cirrhosis? Is that something that comes up on a test?
Blood tests. He’s been a function alcoholic for, at least the last 30 years of his life. Started having issues with pee, stool and vomiting. ignored it for quite a while, then finally saw a doc.
 
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