how many good ballhandlers do we have?
- Thread starter hawksense
- Start date
Mike is good. Sapp is pretty good. Fleming seems to be pretty good, but we need to see him against B1G competition to really see how good he is. Uthoff and Uhl are above average for 6'9" players. Woody is actually a pretty good passer for a big guy, but I don't want to see him dribbling the ball. I haven't seen the other new players enough to really know. I am hopeful that Williams and Moss will be good ball handlers, and Hutton pretty good. Unless he has improved, Jok is not a very good ball handler.
Woodbury is a good passer. He handles that part very well. Ball handling is more than just dribbling. In fact, with Fran's motion offense, and spacing, passing is far more critical. Although a good dribble drive now and then helps too.
I would say most of our team is good at ball handling. Fran recruits players that can handle the ball above average for their positions. PG we may be average. But definitely adequate. Every other position we are no less than average.
Overall, I would say MG, AC, JU, Uhl, Woody. As for what we have heard about the newbies this summer, Fleming, Ellingson and Williams for sure. I believe Baer & Hutton were too, but I cannot remember what was said about their ball handling skills, nor Wagner. Moss has looked good passing in video, and he can definitely dribble drive.
Not surprisingly, that is about the whole dang team. Fran has put an emphasis on two main characteristics, IMHO, for recruits - players that can handle the ball and are long. And he has done that quite well. Fran rocks!
I would say most of our team is good at ball handling. Fran recruits players that can handle the ball above average for their positions. PG we may be average. But definitely adequate. Every other position we are no less than average.
Overall, I would say MG, AC, JU, Uhl, Woody. As for what we have heard about the newbies this summer, Fleming, Ellingson and Williams for sure. I believe Baer & Hutton were too, but I cannot remember what was said about their ball handling skills, nor Wagner. Moss has looked good passing in video, and he can definitely dribble drive.
Not surprisingly, that is about the whole dang team. Fran has put an emphasis on two main characteristics, IMHO, for recruits - players that can handle the ball and are long. And he has done that quite well. Fran rocks!
IMO Top 5 In order
Gesell
Clemmons
Williams
Fleming
Moss / Ellingson
No surprise that the top 3 are PGs, Williams still a bit of TBD vs. B10 competition I think. Gessell is the best IMO - good/very good. Clemmons is right there also. I hope Jok has improved - not bad, I would rate him average, same for Ellingson. I do think that Hutton and Uhl are above average to good ball handlers for a Forward. If the opponent is pressing, though, you want Gesell and/or Clemmons to have possession of the ball, with trap assistance from any of the other players listed.
Gesell
Clemmons
Williams
Fleming
Moss / Ellingson
No surprise that the top 3 are PGs, Williams still a bit of TBD vs. B10 competition I think. Gessell is the best IMO - good/very good. Clemmons is right there also. I hope Jok has improved - not bad, I would rate him average, same for Ellingson. I do think that Hutton and Uhl are above average to good ball handlers for a Forward. If the opponent is pressing, though, you want Gesell and/or Clemmons to have possession of the ball, with trap assistance from any of the other players listed.
I would say that the real measure of ball handling is turnovers or assist to turnover ratio. Really anything else is subjective. Look at Wisconsin for instance. I would not say they are or have been overly athletic or high level slashers but they know what they are good at and they don't try to do so much.
I think Jok is a good ball handler when he is in the flow of the game. When he tries to do too much, he becomes a bad ball handler and turns it over. Much of being a good ball handler is self awareness and typically that comes with age and good coaching.
That is why many people believe Connor will be a point guard because he knows what he is good at and puts others in position to succeed. Does that mean he is a good ball handler? It does in Wisconsin's system and the seem to have done alright.
Assist to turnover is not a bad indicator. But it is not a precise measurement for ball handling, IMO. If it were, then Uhl is our top returning player, followed by Woody and then Jok. And the top 3 ball handlers, they are not...
I would say asst/To would apply better towards the PG spot. Since they are the ones forcing the ball and handling it more trying to create offense.
I would say asst/To would apply better towards the PG spot. Since they are the ones forcing the ball and handling it more trying to create offense.
I actually can't stand the ball handling of our guards. It's been improved for Gessel and sapp but still a little off. gessel looks like he's dribbling high all the time, can't stand that. Looks terrible. I like joks handle a lot but he thinks he's the shit with it and then gets careless. I'm just spouting off here, but seriously, ball handling is about where your body is. Keep it close. Get your body into your defender with your shoulder if you have to to create space. Too many players think they have to outrun defenders all the time. Ain't going to happen. Gessel has a too much of that mind set. As an offensive player you need to initiate contact if you have to. Gessel has that wide body to be great at that but still plays like he's running away from people. It'll be the reason why he doesn't go further with his career.
Gesell is only "dribbling high" when he's 30 ft out right before the screens and cuts. He rarely turns the ball over in the half-court and the offense almost never stops at him. A PG who routinely "dribbles high" gets picked off at the top of the key every other possession. Clemmons (like Gesell) does very well in the half-court on both ends. Sometimes he gets a little too excited on the offensive break. Jok's handles are easily the most suspect of the three. Jok's an excellent shooter and he's used that threat to be able to drive on over-extended defenders, but he's still not a reliable ball-handler or passer on the break (I think he'll get there, he experienced a lot last year).
Williams looks great in his highlight tapes. He's a competitor. He has the size to become a versatile defender (and a threat everywhere on the break), and he looks like he can learn to run the point in an aggressive half-court offense. He talks like a gym rat in his interviews too. He likes playing basketball and he's going to be good at it.
Agreed. A good indicator for me is to use my own eyes and my own brain, and when it's painful to watch them dribble, they aren't very good at it. Uhl doesn't scare me that way, Woody and Jok most definitely do.
Uhl made me nervous at moments last year. But he will improve, as will Jok. Hopefully both improve a LOT.
Woody... had better stick to passing.
I don't want flashy ball handlers who get nothing accomplished. Ball handling is about what you accomplish - break a trap, get an assist, draw a defender, get into the lane, move the ball up court quicker than defense gets in position, get a defender out of position, draw a foul, get an open shot, create an opening for a teammate, wear down a defender, etc.
Who gets the most done with the fewest turnovers is who I rate as good ball handlers. If you turn the ball over while getting little down, you sit on my bench, or on someone else's bench.
Who gets the most done with the fewest turnovers is who I rate as good ball handlers. If you turn the ball over while getting little down, you sit on my bench, or on someone else's bench.
Well we don't have any flashy ball handlers, so no worries there. Similar to your sentiments, I'll settle for competent ball handlers, preferably all of them.
I think we will be fine. We could have had a little more/better ball handling last year. That said, None of the players we lost were not in our top 4-5 for ball handling. Maybe JO. But I would put MG, AC, Uthoff and Woody ahead of him.
Uhl & Jok should be equally as good as him this coming season. Then you have the newbies and they all seem to have decent handles on the passing, dribbling, driving fronts. How that translates to the college game, we will see. If half of them turn out to be a JO equal or better, then we are sitting on the best ball handling team that Fran has ever had at Iowa, overall.
Uhl & Jok should be equally as good as him this coming season. Then you have the newbies and they all seem to have decent handles on the passing, dribbling, driving fronts. How that translates to the college game, we will see. If half of them turn out to be a JO equal or better, then we are sitting on the best ball handling team that Fran has ever had at Iowa, overall.
Jok is the one whose hands I like to see the ball in least, except for the catch and shoot.
Agree that Woodbury is an above average passer for a true center. Also, he should almost never bring the ball below the level of his chest.
No one else otherwise gives me great concern with their ball handling abilities.
Agree that Woodbury is an above average passer for a true center. Also, he should almost never bring the ball below the level of his chest.
No one else otherwise gives me great concern with their ball handling abilities.
Jok does scare me occasionally. Let's hope that the improvement from Sophomore to Junior season is significant. Otherwise, just like you said - catch & release. That really is all we need.
While I absolutely agree Pete needs to tighten up his handles, how many games did he open catching on the wing/baseline and a quick dribble drive for a pullup jumper to start games last year? It seems it was when he tried to take it all the way to the hole in traffic that he struggled more.
