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hydroxychloroquine makes hospitalized patients substantially less likely to die.

Then you should probably be more "up to speed" on it, in contrast to what you post here.

Because the dexamethasone recommendation was based on "consistent" evidence (the study was even stopped prior to the recruitment planning, because the evidence was so convincing, it was considered "unethical" to deny that treatment to patients in the placebo groups).

The evidence on hydroxychloroquine has been "inconsistent", and in many studies, "problematic". And those are not the retracted studies.

ha you’re a joke. I’m all for dexamethasone. And I no longer have faith that HDQ is effective. I believe that the trend is also toward favorability on remdesivir.

But I also believe that HDQ isn’t as dangerous as a flawed study was suggesting and I also believe that we should continue to look at this drug along with any others that may have success. Medications sometimes need to be tried at different doses, started at different times in the course of illness to truly know. And because we have lots of hospitals and lots of COVID I believe that lots of things can be looked at at one time. My point all along is that because Trump injected himself into this, his suggested drug has become somewhat of a pariah. And I deplore anyone that turns away from looking into all options based on politics. And that 100% has played a role here. Should resources be directed at other medicines before HDQ? Yeah probably.

Don’t mistake my posts for cheerleading for HDQ either. Just cheerleading for neutrality.
 
ha you’re a joke. I’m all for dexamethasone. And I no longer have faith that HDQ is effective. I believe that the trend is also toward favorability on remdesivir.

But I also believe that HDQ isn’t as dangerous as a flawed study was suggesting

Stop referring to one "flawed analysis" of marketplace-data.

Multiple sites identified problems, firsthand, and published their findings; or, could identify no benefits vs. controls at lower doses.

Other sites continue HCQ protocols, using lower doses, or on lower risk/less sick people. As yet, just this one has indicated any semblance of benefits (and if you check their data, "age" has a much much higher correlation than HCQ benefits - and the control group contained patients with an average age 6 years higher than any treatment groups.

You're highly critical of that "one study", but I hear crickets from you when it comes to the doctor who pushed his "I've cured 700 patients with HCQ regimens and 0 deaths", that likewise became a media storm, and was never, ever backed up with data.
 
Stop referring to one "flawed analysis" of marketplace-data.

Multiple sites identified problems, firsthand, and published their findings; or, could identify no benefits vs. controls at lower doses.

Other sites continue HCQ protocols, using lower doses, or on lower risk/less sick people. As yet, just this one has indicated any semblance of benefits (and if you check their data, "age" has a much much higher correlation than HCQ benefits - and the control group contained patients with an average age 6 years higher than any treatment groups.

You're highly critical of that "one study", but I hear crickets from you when it comes to the doctor who pushed his "I've cured 700 patients with HCQ regimens and 0 deaths", that likewise became a media storm, and was never, ever backed up with data.


You can't stand it that you might be wrong. You keep harping on all the short term studies, and discontinued studies. Now we have a large, long term, well controlled study. If this study had shown negative results, you'd be the first person posting it and saying "I told you so".

You can't be objective. You only have two goals. First is that you are always right, even if you have to move the goalpost. Second is that anything that might be possibly good for Trump has to be wrong. You don't give a crap about what might be good news for everyone.
 
You can't stand it that you might be wrong. You keep harping on all the short term studies, and discontinued studies. Now we have a large, long term, well controlled study.

A) Trump WAS wrong. There was no evidence at the time he touted it to support his statement. Reread that as many times as you need to until it sinks in for you

B) One study isn't "irrelevant", but it is inconsistent with the bulk of the experience. To date, ONLY dexamethasone has been consistent in its positive impacts. HCQ has been a "mixed bag" - perhaps depending on the dosages, drug combos or populations. But it has been no "miracle drug" yet, and was a significant distraction in looking for other options.
 
A) Trump WAS wrong. There was no evidence at the time he touted it to support his statement. Reread that as many times as you need to until it sinks in for you

B) One study isn't "irrelevant", but it is inconsistent with the bulk of the experience. To date, ONLY dexamethasone has been consistent in its positive impacts. HCQ has been a "mixed bag" - perhaps depending on the dosages, drug combos or populations. But it has been no "miracle drug" yet, and was a significant distraction in looking for other options.

Trump didn't say it was a miracle drug. He said, "it's a possible game changer". Should he have said that? No, of course not. But as usual, you take things out of context to make a point. When you do that for a little thing like a Trump statement, that just proves how unobjective you are, and shows your true motives.

Like I said, you dismiss a large, comprehensive, study in favor of other smaller, less controlled, and discontinued studies. You accept anecdotal evidence if it suits you, and dismiss everything else if it doesn't.
 
You can't stand it that you might be wrong. You keep harping on all the short term studies, and discontinued studies. Now we have a large, long term, well controlled study. If this study had shown negative results, you'd be the first person posting it and saying "I told you so".

You can't be objective. You only have two goals. First is that you are always right, even if you have to move the goalpost. Second is that anything that might be possibly good for Trump has to be wrong. You don't give a crap about what might be good news for everyone.

Defend this nonsense:
 
Trump didn't say it was a miracle drug. He said, "it's a possible game changer". Should he have said that? No, of course not. But as usual, you take things out of context to make a point.

I didn't take him "out of context" at all.

He lied about it. Accept it. Repeat that to yourself until it sinks in.

He lied about "99% of cases are harmless". This is causing confusion among Americans who support him and prolonging this crisis. Stop giving him a "pass" for that.
 
"And I think it's going to be very exciting. I think it could be a game changer. And maybe not. Maybe not, but I think it could be, based on what I see, it could be a game changer. Very powerful, they’re very powerful," he said. ~ Donald Trump, 3/19/2020

Trump lies repeatedly every day. You are lying about what he actually said about HCQ.
 
"And I think it's going to be very exciting. I think it could be a game changer. And maybe not. Maybe not, but I think it could be, based on what I see, it could be a game changer. Very powerful, they’re very powerful," he said. ~ Donald Trump, 3/19/2020

Trump lies repeatedly every day.
So why are you "OK" with that?
based on what I see, it could be a game changer.

No "qualifiers" there. And he hadn't "seen" anything. There were NO studies which conclusively showed it.

This is the guy who is supposed to be leading America into fighting this, and you see no problems with him "lying every day" about it. That's simply crazy.
 
So why are you "OK" with that?
based on what I see, it could be a game changer.

No "qualifiers" there. And he hadn't "seen" anything. There were NO studies which conclusively showed it.

This is the guy who is supposed to be leading America into fighting this, and you see no problems with him "lying every day" about it. That's simply crazy.

"Maybe not" isn't a qualifier? Said twice? Once in the same sentence you are saying it isn't a qualifier.

I'm done with you today.
 
I’ll interpret the literature, the expert recommendations and the data and make my own decisions on how and what I do for my I patients. There is a reason it’s called evidenced based medicine not expert based medicine. You probably wouldn’t know this but the history of medicine is full of ‘experts’ that made recommendations that were wrong. So let’s let this all play out. I’ll change my practice as the evidence suggests and not enter into that analysis with preconceptions. But you wouldn’t have to worry about that as you’re just a guy with an IP and a lot of time.
final1_ju-1024x640.png


"You see that Jupiter-sized orb towering above all those other planets?"



That's HCQ - and it is NOT one of the drugs yet consistently demonstrated to improve outcomes from Covid

https://www.statnews.com/2020/07/06...ization-dominate-the-study-of-covid-19-drugs/

Still, experts say the analysis shows that huge amounts of energy have been expended on haphazard efforts, often without a clear strategy to improve the odds that results would actually inform the care of patients. Faced with intense pressure to develop drugs and vaccines at previously unimaginable speed to push back a global pandemic, researchers may have actually slowed down the rate of progress.

For instance, 237,000 patient volunteers were to be enrolled in studies of hydroxychloroquine or chloroquine. That’s 35% of the 685,000 patient volunteers whom researchers hoped would be enrolled in any study. Since patients willing to enter studies are one of the scarcest resources in medicine, this means that other potential treatments, such as ivermectin or favipiravir, were not studied.

That’s “excessive,” said Susan Desmond-Hellmann, former CEO of the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation. She noted that vaccines, in contrast, are being developed in a more methodical way — and wished that research on new drugs had been more organized, rather than simply trying whatever was available.
This is what happens, when you do not coordinate any response from the WH on addressing a pandemic. Huge wastes of resources; huge wastes of time.

“The lack of leadership around a clinical trial agenda in the US is one of the failures of the US’s pandemic response,” said Walid Gellad, director of the Center for Pharmaceutical Policy and Prescribing at the University of Pittsburgh. “If we had taken the U.K.’s strategy of a set of large pragmatic trials, prioritizing recruitment in those trials, we could have all the answers now that we’re waiting for.”

U.S. researchers rushed quickly into the battle against Covid-19. What was missing, it seems, was a general who could direct them in the fight.

And, no one could take this lead, w/o pissing off Trump if they didn't include HCQ as a main-stager. You hate it when people attack Trump; but this is clearly on him and the folks he has put in charge.
 
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