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"I just wish we could all be united like after 9/11"

ConvenientParking

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Jun 28, 2016
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Apologies in advance for psycho rant


Can someone make this fairly common sentiment make more sense to me? So we united along nationalistic lines on 9/11-9/12, waved the flags, sang the songs, did the candlelight vigils. I see the appeal of this and the feelings it produces. But doesn't what actually happened as a result matter even more?


After uniting the American people, we largely approvingly (for quite a while) watched our government (who lied to us about a lot of different things the whole time) kill hundreds of thousands of people who had nothing to do with 9/11 (including refusing the Taliban's offer to give up Bin Laden so we could ultimately unsuccessfully pursue regime change). We further destabilized much of the middle east including being entirely responsible for creating the Iraqi insurgency, and committed a few war crimes in the process. We willingly became a mass surveillance state at home, and strengthened our alliance with Saudi Arabia who we eventually found out actually provided support for 9/11. The we seemingly never gave most of this second thought (excluding cranks like me) other than to remember how proud and united we were to see America's mayor deliver a punchline on SNL and George Bush throw a strike for all of us in Yankee stadium. The unity was gone by the 2004 election but we followed the path our unity led to for years and years after the unity vanished.

I'm not saying a repeat of the disastrous middle east wars is what has to happen if we find ourselves in a situation where we feel united like after 9/11 for whatever reason but I really think my last paragraph are things people should remember and consider when they pine for the unity in the early aftermath of 9/11.

If we want more unity in a secular (thank goodness) society, we don't have to let old money elites pick some type of enemy nation or institution for us to unite against. Perhaps we should stop demonizing and eradicating the types of public institutions that have largely been a massive success in improving the lives of common people and work hard together in good faith to fix the issues that arise within them not because of a lack of profit motive but because because things change and people are imperfect and corruption exists everywhere (especially in private enterprise). Rather than scrapping the idea of having public institutions providing valuable, essential services, we could unite around working to improve their shortcomings so we might one day boast about people receiving world class education without going into debt, having an infant mortality rate that's not completely embarrassing when compared with our closest peers, not having families lose their homes/file bankruptcy/ruin their credit over medical debt.

If that stuff cannot unite us, but war can, we are fukt
 
Fully agree. The social climate in the country after 9/11 was as icky as I’ve ever seen it, and it was the beginning of the suckiness we see now. I was a 23 year old contrarian in 2001 and I felt no unity, only this weird feeling that all these people I had grown up around had lost their minds, the feeling hasn’t fully passed.

The real tragedy of 9/11 was how much it broke America’s brain.
 
Fully agree. The social climate in the country after 9/11 was as icky as I’ve ever seen it, and it was the beginning of the suckiness we see now. I was a 23 year old contrarian in 2001 and I felt no unity, only this weird feeling that all these people I had grown up around had lost their minds, the feeling hasn’t fully passed.

The real tragedy of 9/11 was how much it broke America’s brain.

I was 12 and I really did feel the unity. Same at 13.5 watching Shock and Awe unfold behind the safety of my TV screen. I actually feel worse about that second one because the American Catholic Church, who I still vaguely belonged to at the time, was adamant in their opposition to intervention in Iraq and you go back and read statements from the ACC at the time and nearly everything they said was true but they had no credibility left with anyone by then.

Part of me is glad I was as young as I was so I don't have to feel so naive for wanting to believe the president and the various media outlets. Since there were no radicals of any sort in my family or community talking about the ideas in Manufacturing Consent or other such critiques of corporate media there to teach me such skepticism, why wouldn't I believe the president and trust the news? They got those jobs because they're the best at them, right, because America is a meritocracy, right?

I couldn't take any criticism of Bush admin in that era seriously until I had an older cousin I'd always liked come home from serving in Iraq and saw him immediately dive in to antiwar activism
 
Fully agree. The social climate in the country after 9/11 was as icky as I’ve ever seen it, and it was the beginning of the suckiness we see now. I was a 23 year old contrarian in 2001 and I felt no unity, only this weird feeling that all these people I had grown up around had lost their minds, the feeling hasn’t fully passed.

The real tragedy of 9/11 was how much it broke America’s brain.
I remember unity. I think Rush Limbaugh and FOX broke brains.
 
Fully agree. The social climate in the country after 9/11 was as icky as I’ve ever seen it, and it was the beginning of the suckiness we see now. I was a 23 year old contrarian in 2001 and I felt no unity, only this weird feeling that all these people I had grown up around had lost their minds, the feeling hasn’t fully passed.

The real tragedy of 9/11 was how much it broke America’s brain.
I guess it depends on how you define "after 9/11" because the immediate aftermath was unifying; unitfying the country in grief, shock, and a collective resolve to stand together against terrorism. There was a strong sense of national unity and solidarity, evident in the outpouring of support for victims and their families, and in the bipartisan cooperation that followed in addressing security and recovery efforts.

However, over time, the aftermath of 9/11 also highlighted divisions, particularly in debates over national security measures, civil liberties, and military interventions abroad. Those discussions arguments often polarized public opinion and political discourse, reflecting differing views on how best to respond to the threat of terrorism while safeguarding fundamental American rights (Patriot Act, etc.). Thank God Twitter didn't exist back then.
 
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Outer Limits episode - Architects of Fear.

The world has entered a Cold War-like setting in which nuclear holocaust appears imminent. In the hope of staving off an apocalyptic military confrontation between nations, an idealistic group of scientists working at United Labs plans to stage a fake alien invasion of Earth in an effort to unite all humanity against a perceived common enemy.
 
I guess it depends on how you define "after 9/11" because the immediate aftermath was unifying; unitfying the country in grief, shock, and a collective resolve to stand together against terrorism. There was a strong sense of national unity and solidarity, evident in the outpouring of support for victims and their families, and in the bipartisan cooperation that followed in addressing security and recovery efforts.

However, over time, the aftermath of 9/11 also highlighted divisions, particularly in debates over national security measures, civil liberties, and military interventions abroad. Those discussions arguments often polarized public opinion and political discourse, reflecting differing views on how best to respond to the threat of terrorism while safeguarding fundamental American rights (Patriot Act, etc.). Thank God Twitter didn't exist back then.

This.

For some time the unity was tremendous. I lived in NJ at the time, and my family made a point of going into the city frequently in the aftermath, as sort of a defiant gesture that we weren’t going to live in fear (because the fear was also palpable at that time.)

Everywhere you went there was a sense of warmth and togetherness that was amazing. I went to a pre-season college basketball game at MSG, and when the NYC Fire Department band played the National Anthem the whole stadium cheered wildly at the introduction, sang along loudly, and cheered wildly at the end. I had goosebumps like I’d never had before.

It took a long time, and it occurred gradually, for us to become divided again.

To the OP’s point, however, the togetherness did allow us to be deceived by the government and persuaded to support wholly unjustified actions that killed thousands of innocent people and caused us to lose the goodwill that we had from the entire world for a brief time. We set Iran, in particular, back decades.
 
And to this day we still have to remove our shoes at the airport.

I really want to meet you and have a lemonade, but you make this too easy for me sometimes.

Talk about uniting the country and you bitch about having to take your shoes off at the airport. You live a hard life.


 
Won't happen again. We've diverged into 3 nations. The hard left, the hard right, and the shrinking middle. The first 2 are a group of misfits who've lost critical thinking skills and believe whatever they are told to believe within their echo chambers. They only thing they share is a belief that the other is trying to destroy them and the country.
 
Capitalism baby. It's how you keep a caste system in place. You don't go to Universal or Disney without a Fast Pass if you can afford it either.
Wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait. It's the "shrinking middle" who are critical of capitalism and think about economics/politics in terms of class/caste in a similar vein as Marx and other 19th century leftist thinkers? If you're going to insult us looney left, you shouldn't get to co-opt our lunacy bro. What gives?
 
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It took a long time, and it occurred gradually, for us to become divided again.

To the OP’s point, however, the togetherness did allow us to be deceived by the government and persuaded to support wholly unjustified actions that killed thousands of innocent people and caused us to lose the goodwill that we had from the entire world for a brief time. We set Iran, in particular, back decades.
And it's not just the government...it's millionaire/billionaires behind the scenes as well. I've seen many rational posters on here who feel strongly about abolishing lobbyists. Power and money, more than anything, are keeping this country divided and they count on (thrive off, rather) people being uneducated and easily manipulated.

People, en masse, are dumb.
 
Wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait. It's the "shrinking middle" who are critical of capitalism and think about economics/politics in terms of class/caste in a similar vein as Marx and other 19th century leftist thinkers? If you're going to insult us looney left, you shouldn't get to co-opt our lunacy bro. What gives?
Speak English mother ****er!!!
 
Speak English mother ****er!!!
English Translation: Hold on. So, it's the "shrinking middle" who criticize capitalism and approach economics and politics through the lens of class or caste, much like Marx and other 19th-century leftist thinkers? If you're going to mock us on the far left, you shouldn't get to adopt our radical views, bro. What's up with that?

Old English Translation: Verily, hold, hold, hold, hold, hold, hold, hold, hold. Art it the "shrinking middle" who doth critique capitalism and approach economics and politics through the lens of class or caste, akin to Marx and other 19th-century leftist thinkers? If thou dost intend to jest at us on the far left, thou shouldst not presume to appropriate our radical views, brother. What be the reason for this?
 
English Translation: Hold on. So, it's the "shrinking middle" who criticize capitalism and approach economics and politics through the lens of class or caste, much like Marx and other 19th-century leftist thinkers? If you're going to mock us on the far left, you shouldn't get to adopt our radical views, bro. What's up with that?

Old English Translation: Verily, hold, hold, hold, hold, hold, hold, hold, hold. Art it the "shrinking middle" who doth critique capitalism and approach economics and politics through the lens of class or caste, akin to Marx and other 19th-century leftist thinkers? If thou dost intend to jest at us on the far left, thou shouldst not presume to appropriate our radical views, brother. What be the reason for this?
Yeah. I'm an enigma.
 
And it's not just the government...it's millionaire/billionaires behind the scenes as well. I've seen many rational posters on here who feel strongly about abolishing lobbyists. Power and money, more than anything, are keeping this country divided and they count on (thrive off, rather) people being uneducated and easily manipulated.

People, en masse, are dumb.
Economic disparity has long been this nation’s #1 point of division. Post WW2 “boom of the middle class” because of government programs and the rise of suburbia gave America 30 years of respite from this economic war, but @Reaganimics/Trickle down/Supply side economics have enabled the age old war to begin anew. Low interest rates and the Bush/Trump tax cuts further alienated the rich from the poor.
 
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