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Irritated by the reaction to Mollie Tibbett’s death

unoHawkeye

HR Legend
Jul 30, 2015
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It is extremely frustrating to me to see people politicizing Mollie's death. The fact of the matter is that this is not an illegal immigration issue. It is a human issue. "Had he not been in the United States, Mollie wouldn't be dead." If this is your initial reaction, then you are missing the bigger picture. What if Cristhian Rivera had never made it to the U.S. or had been deported? Then somebody capable of brutally murdering a teenage girl is living in Mexico instead of the U.S. If a Mexican girl gets murdered in a similar fashion and it never makes American media, is that better than it happening in our country? My opinion is that it is not, because if all lives matter, then all lives absolutely matter.

Let's say that there ends up being ~15,000 homicides in the United States this year. (In 2015, there were 17,793 according to the CDC which was the basis for my number) It's borderline laughable to me how every time one or two of these 15,000 is reported in the media, there is a new policy that needs to be instilled, or a current one changed.

Do you want to see change in the United States? The answer does not lie in policy. I am socially liberal, but the "It's not the gun, it's the person using it" line frequently used by conservatives to defend gun rights rings true to me (this shouldn't spark a gun debate, because I certainly agree with strong regulation/restrictions on guns). If you want to play a role in the effort to drop that 15,000 number, then educate your kids, your family, and your peers and teach them to value and respect human life. If you do this, then you are doing your part to keep your community safe, and certainly doing more than posting policy BS on social media. Those who choose not to demonstrate this respect, such as Rivera, should face swift and severe punishment. However, I have yet to see suggested policy on HROT or Twitter or Facebook ever actually accomplish anything. Instead, it makes the poster look self-centered and intent on using a tragedy to push their political agenda.

Again, irritating. How about we mourn for Mollie and her family, hope that Rivera faces the punishment that he deserves, and shove it with the politics?
 
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If dude was in Mexico where he belongs she would be alive. So simple yet you dont get it
It really is this simple, and yet liberals will come up with every excuse under the sun to deflect. Illegal immigrants are often the WORST of immigrants. Legal immigrants (like my friends), have worked hard, paid their fees, and gone through hell to get here. They are more likely to be the BEST immigrants, where as illegals often are the scum of the earth from Latin America. THIS IS NOT ABOUT IMMIGRATION. This is about ILLEGAL immigration.
 
If dude was in Mexico where he belongs she would be alive. So simple yet you dont get it
I just hope you bring this same energy for the other 14,999 homicide victims in the United States and stand up for them individually.

Sorry, but just because you or I feel more personal attachment to Mollie, doesn’t make her death any more tragic than the others’. And keeping murderers in Mexico is hardly a solution unless, again, you feel that American lives are more important than Mexican. That is why I tried to express that this is an issue not pertaining to boundaries or borders.
 
It really is this simple, and yet liberals will come up with every excuse under the sun to deflect. Illegal immigrants are often the WORST of immigrants. Legal immigrants (like my friends), have worked hard, paid their fees, and gone through hell to get here. They are more likely to be the BEST immigrants, where as illegals often are the scum of the earth from Latin America. THIS IS NOT ABOUT IMMIGRATION. This is about ILLEGAL immigration.
Never in my post did I defend illegal immigration
 
It is extremely frustrating to me to see people politicizing Mollie's death. The fact of the matter is that this is not an illegal immigration issue. It is a human issue. "Had he not been in the United States, Mollie wouldn't be dead." If this is your initial reaction, then you are missing the bigger picture. What if Cristhian Rivera had never made it to the U.S. or had been deported? Then somebody capable of brutally murdering a teenage girl is living in Mexico instead of the U.S. If a Mexican girl gets murdered in a similar fashion and it never makes American media, is that better than it happening in our country? My opinion is that it is not, because if all lives matter, then all lives absolutely matter.

Let's say that there ends up being ~15,000 homicides in the United States this year. (In 2015, there were 17,793 according to the CDC which was the basis for my number) It's borderline laughable to me how every time one or two of these 15,000 is reported in the media, there is a new policy that needs to be instilled, or a current one changed.

Do you want to see change in the United States? The answer does not lie in policy. I am socially liberal, but the "It's not the gun, it's the person using it" line frequently used by conservatives to defend gun rights rings true to me (this shouldn't spark a gun debate, because I certainly agree with strong regulation/restrictions on guns). If you want to play a role in the effort to drop that 15,000 number, then educate your kids, your family, and your peers and teach them to value and respect human life. If you do this, then you are doing your part to keep your community safe, and certainly doing more than posting policy BS on social media. Those who choose not to demonstrate this respect, such as Rivera, should face swift and severe punishment. However, I have yet to see suggested policy on HROT or Twitter or Facebook ever actually accomplish anything. Instead, it makes the poster look self-centered and intent on using a tragedy to push their political agenda.

Again, irritating. How about we mourn for Mollie and her family, hope that Rivera faces the punishment that he deserves, and shove it with the politics?

Reotto bookmarks post for next mass shooting. Faux outrage is faux outrage. I wonder how long you will let those families mourn.
 
Reotto bookmarks post for next mass shooting. Faux outrage is faux outrage. I wonder how long you will let those families mourn.
It’s gonna be sitting in your bookmarks for a long time. You won’t catch me on here talking politics after a tragedy.

I’d rather focus on providing resources and education to troubled/impoverished individuals (or doing a better job of putting them in a position where they can’t hurt anybody, as was the case with the Parkland shooter) and setting the next generation up to be better off than mine instead of sitting around on social media arguing ways that we can move murderers to a different country or try to take away their weapon of choice.

Sorry to disappoint, but it’s okay to think outside the left vs right talking points when discussing solutions to violence/murder
 
It’s gonna be sitting in your bookmarks for a long time. You won’t catch me on here talking politics after a tragedy.

I’d rather focus on providing resources and education to troubled/impoverished individuals (or doing a better job of putting them in a position where they can’t hurt anybody, as was the case with the Parkland shooter) and setting the next generation up to be better off than mine instead of sitting around on social media arguing ways that we can move murderers to a different country or try to take away their weapon of choice.

Sorry to disappoint, but it’s okay to think outside the left vs right talking points when discussing solutions to violence/murder

Feel free to think outside the box, but I prefer to take care of vets, homeless and other Americans before I am going to worry about if this psychopath would kill a girl in Mexico which BTW is a huge jump in logic. Bring your jump to conclusions mat. You can’t prove that AT ALL. Your postulation is tenable at best.
 
Feel free to think outside the box, but I prefer to take care of vets, homeless and other Americans before I am going to worry about if this psychopath would kill a girl in Mexico which BTW is a huge jump in logic. Bring your jump to conclusions mat. You can’t prove that AT ALL. Your postulation is tenable at best.
You yourself literally just called him a psychopath and in the same sentence said it was a “huge jump in logic” to speculate that if he has no regard for human life in America that he would have no regard for human life in Mexico.

And it’s not either/or. You can do the things I mentioned while still taking care of the vets and homeless
 
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You yourself literally just called him a psychopath and in the same sentence said it was a “huge jump in logic” to speculate that if he has no regard for human life in America that he would have no regard for human life in Mexico.

And it’s not either/or. You can do the things I mentioned while still taking care of the vets and homeless

Really? So you think in Iraq a thief would steal just as if he was in America even though the judicial outcome and repercussions vary so widely?

The guy is a POS, but if you think you can guess what he would do in Mexico and say he would do the same to a Mexican young lady you are not only dense but a complete waste of any rational responses.

To put a finer point on this. Take any list of serial killers which I think we all would agree are psychopaths. How many avoided getting caught? Why? Would the punishment or threat of getting caught in another nation further inhibate those urges?

Sorry probation in America for a thief and losing your hand in the Middle East seems like motivation enough to reconsider. Mexico still has a large vigilante justice to it and less law and order; would that make him pause? I don’t know, but I don’t have to prove it would make him pause. You have to prove he is messed up enough it wouldn’t matter. Odd for someone you just found out about today to make such an assertion.
 
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Really? So you think in Iraq a thief would steal just as if he was in America even though the judicial outcome and repercussions vary so widely?

The guy is a POS, but if you think you can guess what he would do in Mexico and say he would do the same to a Mexican young lady you are not only dense but a complete waste of any rational responses.

To put a finer point on this. Take any list of serial killers which I think we all would agree are psychopaths. How many avoided getting caught? Why? Would the punishment or threat of getting caught in another nation further inhibate those urges?

Sorry probation in America for a thief and losing your hand in the Middle East seems like motivation enough to reconsider. Mexico still has a large vigilante justice to it and less law and order; would that make him pause? I don’t know, but I don’t have to prove it would make him pause. You have to prove he is messed up enough it wouldn’t matter. Odd for someone you just found out about today to make such an assertion.
Considering that the United States has over twice the population of Mexico but half the homicides, I would say that the repercussions of being caught in Mexico aren’t doing a very good job of stopping crime. Certainly it wouldn’t give me any reason to believe that somebody who would give up their life and freedom in America by inhumanely killing a girl, wouldn’t do the same in Mexico.

If you feel that this makes me “dense” or “a waste of rational response” then so be it. I’m already over it
 
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It’s gonna be sitting in your bookmarks for a long time. You won’t catch me on here talking politics after a tragedy.

I’d rather focus on providing resources and education to troubled/impoverished individuals (or doing a better job of putting them in a position where they can’t hurt anybody, as was the case with the Parkland shooter) and setting the next generation up to be better off than mine instead of sitting around on social media arguing ways that we can move murderers to a different country or try to take away their weapon of choice.

Sorry to disappoint, but it’s okay to think outside the left vs right talking points when discussing solutions to violence/murder
So when will you be heading for the inner city? They need to hear your message.
 
It is extremely frustrating to me to see people politicizing Mollie's death. The fact of the matter is that this is not an illegal immigration issue. It is a human issue. "Had he not been in the United States, Mollie wouldn't be dead." If this is your initial reaction, then you are missing the bigger picture. What if Cristhian Rivera had never made it to the U.S. or had been deported? Then somebody capable of brutally murdering a teenage girl is living in Mexico instead of the U.S. If a Mexican girl gets murdered in a similar fashion and it never makes American media, is that better than it happening in our country? My opinion is that it is not, because if all lives matter, then all lives absolutely matter.

Let's say that there ends up being ~15,000 homicides in the United States this year. (In 2015, there were 17,793 according to the CDC which was the basis for my number) It's borderline laughable to me how every time one or two of these 15,000 is reported in the media, there is a new policy that needs to be instilled, or a current one changed.

Do you want to see change in the United States? The answer does not lie in policy. I am socially liberal, but the "It's not the gun, it's the person using it" line frequently used by conservatives to defend gun rights rings true to me (this shouldn't spark a gun debate, because I certainly agree with strong regulation/restrictions on guns). If you want to play a role in the effort to drop that 15,000 number, then educate your kids, your family, and your peers and teach them to value and respect human life. If you do this, then you are doing your part to keep your community safe, and certainly doing more than posting policy BS on social media. Those who choose not to demonstrate this respect, such as Rivera, should face swift and severe punishment. However, I have yet to see suggested policy on HROT or Twitter or Facebook ever actually accomplish anything. Instead, it makes the poster look self-centered and intent on using a tragedy to push their political agenda.

Again, irritating. How about we mourn for Mollie and her family, hope that Rivera faces the punishment that he deserves, and shove it with the politics?
Kinda sounds like you are politicizing...
 
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She's gone full GOP campaign beast mode. It's time to ratchet up the folksy twang, get tough on law and order and start chanting "tax cuts!"

This could get real fun now that we know his employer is a prominent Republican, former farm Bureau President, former member of the Board of Regent s and candidate for Secretary of state.
 
This uno dude, wow. So we should keep illegal aliens with a propensity for vioience in the US, to help out poor Mexico? Phuck that. Americans arent pouring over the border into Mexico and arent murdering thier citizens.....and if we were you can bet Mexico would deal with that situation harshly. We should put our military on our southern border exactly like Mexico does on theirs
 
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Reynolds comment was disappointing. It will help her win, but honestly I thought she was a nicer person than that.
 
My question for the OP is he just as frustrated when people do the same thing after a mass shooting when it comes to gun control?

If so kudos
I am. We need less guns and to stop illegal immigration.

Thousands of people in this country would still be alive if we cared enough.

I don’t give a shot about Mexico murders. They should fix that.
 
I am. We need less guns and to stop illegal immigration.

Thousands of people in this country would still be alive if we cared enough.

I don’t give a shot about Mexico murders. They should fix that.
What do you make of the fact that the family that employed the killer are prominent Republicans?
 
What do you make of the fact that the family that employed the killer are prominent Republicans?
It’s going to depend on if he had fake papers. If they knew he was illegal and said nothing, Republicans will be pissed off for sure. The funny part is that if this farmer would have notified the police he was illegal, liberals would protest it and say he was cruel.

If I was a politician, I would want to make sure it was okay with her family to discuss further than Ts and Ps. Like that Kate girl
 
It’s going to depend on if he had fake papers. If they knew he was illegal and said nothing, Republicans will be pissed off for sure. The funny part is that if this farmer would have notified the police he was illegal, liberals would protest it and say he was cruel.

If I was a politician, I would want to make sure it was okay with her family to discuss further than Ts and Ps. Like that Kate girl
He passed e-vertify and was categorized as being in good standing. Sorry, but the illegal jumping the border angle doesn't seem to fly here.
 
Feel free to think outside the box, but I prefer to take care of vets, homeless and other Americans before I am going to worry about if this psychopath would kill a girl in Mexico which BTW is a huge jump in logic. Bring your jump to conclusions mat. You can’t prove that AT ALL. Your postulation is tenable at best.

And yet you are able to prove that she would still be alive if this dude were in Mexico. Would you be so kind as to prove it for me? TIA.
 
It's easy to politicize things like this (and mass shootings) because the real root issue is difficult to tackle, but surrounding issues seem relatively easy, yet so divisive. In this case, enforcing immigration laws already on the books would greatly reduce the odds that deaths like Mollie's happen (It could also be argued that someone who isn't allowed to live as a law-breaker may be less likely to break other laws, contra to OP's point that this guy would be a killer no matter where he lives).

In the case of guns, it seems making guns less available to those more likely to commit crimes would reduce the number of mass/senseless shootings. The right can't handle this because all they see is a slippery slope to taking all the guns away,

Things get politicized because there are tangible, simple things that can be done but people can't get on the same page about taking action. It's the world we live in.

The right solution to immigration and guns, of course is to enforce the laws on the books regarding immigration, get a handle on who's coming into the country, and make sure appropriate background checks are completed on anyone who buys a gun, and do everything you can to be sure the mentally ill/unstable can't get their hands on one. Even if it means building a wall or creating a little more paperwork for law abiding citizens to get a gun.
 
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This uno dude, wow. So we should keep illegal aliens with a propensity for vioience in the US, to help out poor Mexico? Phuck that. Americans arent pouring over the border into Mexico and arent murdering thier citizens.....and if we were you can bet Mexico would deal with that situation harshly. We should put our military on our southern border exactly like Mexico does on theirs

It’s going to depend on if he had fake papers. If they knew he was illegal and said nothing, Republicans will be pissed off for sure. The funny part is that if this farmer would have notified the police he was illegal, liberals would protest it and say he was cruel.

If I was a politician, I would want to make sure it was okay with her family to discuss further than Ts and Ps. Like that Kate girl

What's it like, when your uncle is also your dad? I mean, do you guys need some sort of meal assistance program, a therapy dog? Someone to wipe your chin? Or are you high functioning for morons?
 
This uno dude, wow. So we should keep illegal aliens with a propensity for vioience in the US, to help out poor Mexico? Phuck that. Americans arent pouring over the border into Mexico and arent murdering thier citizens.....and if we were you can bet Mexico would deal with that situation harshly. We should put our military on our southern border exactly like Mexico does on theirs
Not sure where you came up with that question but I definitely never said anything like that.
 
What's it like, when your uncle is also your dad? I mean, do you guys need some sort of meal assistance program, a therapy dog? Someone to wipe your chin? Or are you high functioning for morons?


You always add so much. Is it really necessary to call names?
 
It’s gonna be sitting in your bookmarks for a long time. You won’t catch me on here talking politics after a tragedy.

I’d rather focus on providing resources and education to troubled/impoverished individuals (or doing a better job of putting them in a position where they can’t hurt anybody, as was the case with the Parkland shooter) and setting the next generation up to be better off than mine instead of sitting around on social media arguing ways that we can move murderers to a different country or try to take away their weapon of choice.

Sorry to disappoint, but it’s okay to think outside the left vs right talking points when discussing solutions to violence/murder

Ummmmmmm........... you just did.
 
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