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Jesus is quoted as saying: "You will know them by their fruits."

Republicans have staked their claim for years that they are the party of Jesus. Try to keep up.

The thing that's funny, how many of their mouthpieces have either multiple marriages or been caught, in the act, of cheating on their spouses ( or both).

Yeah, great morals (that constantly gets overlooked or excused away by the rank and file).
 
The thing that's funny, how many of their mouthpieces have either multiple marriages or been caught, in the act, of cheating on their spouses ( or both).

Yeah, great morals (that constantly gets overlooked or excused away by the rank and file).
That's what happens when you buy into the religion and focus more on what said religion is against than what its for.
 
May those who love us, love us
And those who don’t love us,
May God turn their hearts.
And if He doesn’t turn their hearts
Then may He turn their ankles
So we will know them by their limping.
Where is this from? Cause it’s pretty funny.
 
Hey some need a crutch, others don't. Simple as that
didwejustbecomebestfriends.gif

Totally agree. I think church and religion is great for some folks. Personally, I think organized religion is a scam. Why does the Catholic Church need hundreds of millions of dollars (estimate?)? Joel Olsteen is a snake. He's a con man of epic proportions.

If you're a believer, why do you need to gather and tithe to praise your God/god?
 
If you're a believer, why do you need to gather and tithe to praise your God/god?
It’s a method of discipline God teaches to rely less on your worldly possessions and to rely more on God.

God does not need your money, His victory has been secured already.

The mission of the church will go on one way or the other. With, or without your dollars. Some pastors will teach to give, regardless of what organization. Just give and live on less and to trust that your Father in heaven will provide for your needs.

FWIW - my wife (no pics) and I have tithed for over 15 years now and we have tried to grow above and beyond each year a little more. I’d be lying if I said it was easy. It was not, especially at first. But, I have learned to rely on less and that effect on my life as a whole has been tremendous. I used to give begrudgingly, now I am full of joy each time I write the checks.

It doesn’t stop at money either. Your time is also of vital importance (worship = where you spend your time and your treasure afterall). I try to keep up with 8 hrs a week with various programs. That’s not easy either but the same principle applies and it has transformed me into a much better man over the years.

It’s never been about money. It’s about building you into a stronger person who becomes closer to God.
 
It’s a method of discipline God teaches to rely less on your worldly possessions and to rely more on God.

God does not need your money, His victory has been secured already.

The mission of the church will go on one way or the other. With, or without your dollars. Some pastors will teach to give, regardless of what organization. Just give and live on less and to trust that your Father in heaven will provide for your needs.

FWIW - my wife (no pics) and I have tithed for over 15 years now and we have tried to grow above and beyond each year a little more. I’d be lying if I said it was easy. It was not, especially at first. But, I have learned to rely on less and that effect on my life as a whole has been tremendous. I used to give begrudgingly, now I am full of joy each time I write the checks.

It doesn’t stop at money either. Your time is also of vital importance (worship = where you spend your time and your treasure afterall). I try to keep up with 8 hrs a week with various programs. That’s not easy either but the same principle applies and it has transformed me into a much better man over the years.

It’s never been about money. It’s about building you into a stronger person who becomes closer to God.

I still don't understand why you cannot build a strong relationship with God and let God build you into a stronger person without gathering together in a church (large or small).

Do you at least agree that the Joel Olsteens of the world are snakes and con men?
 
Joel Osteen only has a high school education. He never
received a college diploma or a theological seminary degree.
He is a fraud who preaches the "Health & Wealth Gospel."
Osteen believes that if you have enough faith in God, He will
give you good health and earthly riches.

Bottom Line: It is a cruel hoax to tell someone with terminal
cancer that they need more faith to have good health.
 
I still don't understand why you cannot build a strong relationship with God and let God build you into a stronger person without gathering together in a church (large or small).

Do you at least agree that the Joel Olsteens of the world are snakes and con men?
And let us not neglect meeting together, as some people do, but encourage one another, especially now that the day of his return is drawing near. Hebrews 10:25

Basically, it's a strength in numbers thing.

To your second question, yes. Osteen and all "prosperity gospel" preachers are lower than snakes.
 
I still don't understand why you cannot build a strong relationship with God and let God build you into a stronger person without gathering together in a church (large or small).

Do you at least agree that the Joel Olsteens of the world are snakes and con men?
Yep, there are con men and false teaching. But for every snake oil salesman out there, there are a thousand others doing good work.

Joel gets the headlines but don’t focus on him.

The church is vital. It is Jesus’s bride. The church is community. It’s not a building for praise (well it is) but more so you need to think of it as a hospital for the faithful and for the hopeful.

Being a Christ follower is a daily commission. Being in Biblical community is part of what it takes to maintain your faith. We’re all broken and Christians are no exception. We go to church (hospital) to get examined, adjusted, strengthened, and to help others.

You can try to be an alone Christian, but it does not work and ultimately it is not what God calls us to be according to scripture.

Hebrews 10 comes to mind.
 
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If you're a believer, why do you need to gather and tithe to praise your God/god?
The gathering is more than just Worship...it also for discipleship as well as fellowship.

Tithing...or "giving" as I tend to simply call it is a benevolent act that extends way past religious practice. We give money to our church, we sponsor a child in Africa, we give $$ to supplement my mother's paltry income and we have an "envelope system" where we give $100 sealed in an envelope to a random stranger each month. Basically, the Lord has blessed our family so we try to bless others when/where we can.
 
Christians gather together each week to worship the Lord.
This fellowship with other Christians serves to build one
another up in their Christian faith. It is good to have some
friends who are Christians and share the same values. Yes,
church members can become good friends with one another.
 
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Yep, there are con men and false teaching. But for every snake oil salesman out there, there are a thousand others doing good work.

Joel gets the headlines but don’t focus on him.

The church is vital. It is Jesus’s bride. The church is community. It’s not a building for praise (well it is) but more so you need to think of it as a hospital for the faithful and for the hopeful.

Being a Christ follower is a daily commission. Being in Biblical community is part of what it takes to maintain your faith. We’re all broken and Christians are no exception. We go to church (hospital) to get examined, adjusted, strengthened, and to help others.

You can try to be an alone Christian, but it does not work and ultimately it is not what God calls us to be according to scripture.

Thank you for your answer. I suppose if scripture tells you that's the way it should be you don't question it as you're a believer. That makes sense. Again, thank you. Also, I have some great, technically gospel songs by definition, but country songs about God and believing that I love. Here are a couple you may enjoy.



 
Christians gather together each week to worship the Lord.
This fellowship with other Christians serves to build one
another up in their Christian faith. It is good to have some
friends who are Christians and share the same values. Yes,
church members can become good friends with one another.
They also come together to network, see and be seen, build or sustain status in their community, etc. Whether they actually share the same values is arguably dubious. Yes, this is the cynical perspective, but it is as true as is yours that is more optimistic and idealistic.
 
No, it's not as simple as that. Personally, I sometimes wish the atheists were right. I tried really hard to be one. It was just too offensive to my intellect.

How do you mean atheist? I think one has to live a very charmed or terrible life to, without society's prodding, come to believe a personal god has them and the rest of humanity in mind.
 
100% some people do this. Fake Christians. I know some of them.
This is true but it’s not our job to judge (let alone the job of a non-Christian) to judge these people.

The church doesn’t grow from within. The church is good to have the ill of society come in and listen to the preacher man. And maybe, one day the Holy Spirit will convict the heart of that man to become a better person.

No man, nor any church can convict a heart. Only the Holy Spirit can do that.

For what it is worth, the pews at my church have former drug addicts, criminals, & wife abusers. They’re all welcome and they have all repented. It’s awesome to see a heart so damaged turn completely around and be full of hope & joy. Even more amazing is the wife of the dude that hit her for years. To see her heart full of Jesus’s compassion and forgiveness is even more a testament to the power of God’s love. If we are being honest, we all want that kind of love.
 
This is true but it’s not our job to judge (let alone the job of a non-Christian) to judge these people.

The church doesn’t grow from within. The church is good to have the ill of society come in and listen to the preacher man. And maybe, one day the Holy Spirit will convict the heart of that man to become a better person.

No man, nor any church can convict a heart. Only the Holy Spirit can do that.

For what it is worth, the pews at my church have former drug addicts, criminals, & wife abusers. They’re all welcome and they have all repented. It’s awesome to see a heart so damaged turn completely around and be full of hope & joy. Even more amazing is the wife of the dude that hit her for years. To see her heart full of Jesus’s compassion and forgiveness is even more a testament to the power of God’s love. If we are being honest, we all want that kind of love.

I love this nonsense. Unlikely human love as evidence of God's love. But everything wrong in the world is the absence of God. She should have left him years ago and he doesn't deserve forgiveness.
 
This is true but it’s not our job to judge (let alone the job of a non-Christian) to judge these people.

The church doesn’t grow from within. The church is good to have the ill of society come in and listen to the preacher man. And maybe, one day the Holy Spirit will convict the heart of that man to become a better person.

No man, nor any church can convict a heart. Only the Holy Spirit can do that.

For what it is worth, the pews at my church have former drug addicts, criminals, & wife abusers. They’re all welcome and they have all repented. It’s awesome to see a heart so damaged turn completely around and be full of hope & joy. Even more amazing is the wife of the dude that hit her for years. To see her heart full of Jesus’s compassion and forgiveness is even more a testament to the power of God’s love. If we are being honest, we all want that kind of love.
Lol. Weird pivot.
 
I love this nonsense. Unlikely human love as evidence of God's love. But everything wrong in the world is the absence of God. She should have left him years ago and he doesn't deserve forgiveness.
Jesus washed Judas’s feet knowing he was going to betray him. Thems was some nasty feet too.

Thats the kind of love that this world needs. You want a better planet? That’s what it will take to get there.
 
Jesus washed Judas’s feet knowing he was going to betray him. Thems was some nasty feet too.

Thats the kind of love that this world needs. You want a better planet? That’s what it will take to get there.

Christianity would, above almost any other outcome, have encouraged that woman to stay in that abusive relationship. What about the guys who don't find Jesus and stop beating their wives? Is it because I'm holding out?
 
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Christianity would, above almost any other outcome, have encouraged that woman to stay in that abusive relationship. What about the guys who don't find Jesus and stop beating their wives? Is it because I'm holding out?
I think you’re making quite the straw man here. I’m not aware of any segment of Christianity that would say a woman must stay with an abusive husband. I think it is fair to say that there is a role for law enforcement in a situation like this. Heck, many Christians are LEO’s!

In the example I cited, the woman fled. She had to. The man went to prison. He did hard time and paid the price. He was released and found the church. He repented. His wife was alone for years. When he changed, she let him back into her life (on her terms I might add). He agreed and they have been together since. After prison, the man almost committed suicide due to the overwhelming guilt and shame. He felt worthless. He found his worth and redemption in Jesus Christ.

This is one anecdote of course and not every story ends with a happy ending. But this one proved to me how powerful God’s love is.
 
I call this loving your mother and doing the right thing. This, to me, has nothing to do with religion.
Depends on your perspective. I believe God will bless me by doing so (and has), BUT I don't do it in an attempt to earn favor, or for a blessing. I also believe wholeheartedly an Atheist can give to his/her mother just as easily, so no it has nothing to do with religion.
 
How do you mean atheist? I think one has to live a very charmed or terrible life to, without society's prodding, come to believe a personal god has them and the rest of humanity in mind.

It depends what you mean by "personal god." If you mean Heavenly Santa or the Invisible Sky Wizard, then that is obviously foolish. If you mean God in terms of a higher level of consciousness that exists outside of time, space, and matter, the same God Albert Einstein sought to know the mind of as it relates to the cosmic mysteries, then that's a much different conversation.

We could also talk about Jesus of Nazareth as God incarnate, or the works of the Holy Spirit that has transformed countless lives, or even the rudimentary belief in God-consciousness that takes God as an acronym for "Good Orderly Direction," if we want to engage in a more constructive dialogue on the topic of "God." That's of course assuming you want to move past the polemical condescension and iconoclasm prevalent in a lot of your posts on this topic.

Regardless, I don't have a need to convince anyone of "God" anymore than I felt a need to find "God" in the sense of filling something visceral within. I will say that has slowly manifested over time, but that was never the primary objective. I sought reason over feelings, and it was my intellect, limited as it may be, that led me to acceptance of God, whether I liked it or not.
 
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I think you’re making quite the straw man here. I’m not aware of any segment of Christianity that would say a woman must stay with an abusive husband. I think it is fair to say that there is a role for law enforcement in a situation like this. Heck, many Christians are LEO’s!

In the example I cited, the woman fled. She had to. The man went to prison. He did hard time and paid the price. He was released and found the church. He repented. His wife was alone for years. When he changed, she let him back into her life (on her terms I might add). He agreed and they have been together since. After prison, the man almost committed suicide due to the overwhelming guilt and shame. He felt worthless. He found his worth and redemption in Jesus Christ.

This is one anecdote of course and not every story ends with a happy ending. But this one proved to me how powerful God’s love is.

And what do the stories with the unhappy endings "prove" to you?
 
It depends what you mean by "personal god." If you mean Heavenly Santa or the Invisible Sky Wizard, then that is obviously foolish. If you mean God in terms of a higher level of consciousness that exists outside of time, space, and matter, the same God Albert Einstein sought to know the mind of as it relates to the cosmic mysteries, then that's a much different conversation.

We could also talk about Jesus of Nazareth as God incarnate, or the works of the Holy Spirit that has transformed countless lives, or even the rudimentary belief in God-consciousness that takes God as an acronym for "Good Orderly Direction," if we want to engage in a more constructive dialogue on the topic of "God." That's of course assuming you want to move past the polemical condescension and iconoclasm prevalent in a lot of your posts on this topic.

Regardless, I don't have a need to convince anyone of "God" anymore than I felt a need to find "God" in the sense of filling something visceral within. I will say that has slowly manifested over time, but that was never the primary objective. I sought reason over feelings, and it was my intellect, limited as it may be, that led me to acceptance of God, whether I liked it or not.

By personal god I of course mean a god like the one in Christianity who created you and knows all your thoughts but also gave you free will and will use that as a basis for judging you, his creation. One gets accused of being condescending for putting it like that but it's not inaccurate.
 
By personal god I of course mean a god like the one in Christianity who created you and knows all your thoughts but also gave you free will and will use that as a basis for judging you, his creation. One gets accused of being condescending for putting it like that but it's not inaccurate.
God be like, “Enuff with tha oh-peez mom already” then be like, “wait I put them thoughts in there wait theyz my thoughts?? Wait, uh, shit...”
 
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