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Kerkvliet Reopens Recruiting

As far as the overrecruiting goes, the real issue is, a top recruit like Nevills could have had his pick of top schools and scholly money. Now, he is stuck in a rough situation all because he lost 1 match 3-2 to the guy ranked right with Kerkvliet.

Also, as was already mentioned, 285s don't have the luxury of moving around weights to make room. See Thomas Haines!
 
Thomas was in our club in PA,Renegade Force, entirely different story. How many programs recruit QBs, RBs and all positions? Even basketball. Why should wrestling be any different? Competition pushes people to improve. You don’t promise people a spot. I know Iowa doesn’t either. You better believe someone is after your spot. The desire to take the spot and keep it pushes people to perform. Competing every day makes us better. Recruiting over is a crazy term. This isn’t daddy’s dual teams. You earn the spot and you fight to keep it. You better know going to a Big10 school, someone wants your spot. That’s life.
 
I have heard this 10-15 year pitch come out of the psu camp a few times now. Seems like a big pitch Cael must be giving. But really if you are a stud and want to go wrestle for the NLWC after wrestling at another college my guess is them in particular will find some room for you. Same with HWC or these other RTCs. You are not stuck at the college you wrestled at for 10-15 years.
 
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Thomas was in our club in PA,Renegade Force, entirely different story. How many programs recruit QBs, RBs and all positions? Even basketball. Why should wrestling be any different? Competition pushes people to improve. You don’t promise people a spot. I know Iowa doesn’t either. You better believe someone is after your spot. The desire to take the spot and keep it pushes people to perform. Competing every day makes us better. Recruiting over is a crazy term. This isn’t daddy’s dual teams. You earn the spot and you fight to keep it. You better know going to a Big10 school, someone wants your spot. That’s life.
The big difference in this conversation is numbers. 9.9 to be exact.
 
I think kids/ young adults like to stay in the area they attended college, it would seem they would do better with camps and job opportunities. Have you been through the recruiting process? You seem to be way off from what actually takes place. The interactions are far from scary. These schools are presenting their pitch for your child to attend their school. No threats or crazy stuff. They might bug the hell out of you but that’s as bad as it gets.
 
I have heard this 10-15 year pitch come out of the psu camp a few times now. Seems like a big pitch Cael must be giving. But really if you are a stud and want to go wrestle for the NLWC after wrestling at another college my guess is them in particular will find some room for you. Same with HWC or these other RTCs. You are not stuck at the college you wrestled at for 10-15 years. Seems kind of like a scare tactic

With all due respect, Don, I have seen you make this claim (about post-graduate employment promises, or cash) 10-15 times, but you have yet to disclose any sources, other than an unnamed parent of a wrestler at OkieSt.

If whatever is going on is so outrageous, why all the anonymity? And yes, I do understand the ramifications of blowing up the RTC operations.
 
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that don't make it right

Of course it's right. How can a wrestling fan NOT appreciate the concept of competion, getting better and a "may the best man win" attitude? When Big 10 champ and NCAA qualifier Blake Rasing got recruited over and beat out by Bobby Telford I didn't cry a tear even though I knew the kid personally. Why? Because that's how the cookie crumbles. That's sports. If Turk is on the team this season and Murin beats him out, is anyone going to livid with Brands that he dared go out and find someone better? Heck no.

A wise man once said "You get what you earn." If you're not the best man at your weight in any wrestling room in the country, you didn't earn the spot. Someone is better so they start, you don't.
 
the “with all due reapect” that is usually followed with something outrageous. The RTCs are separate from the colleges and there are strict rules to keep them separate. The money and coaches, everything is separate. Not sure how they can use them to cheat, however, if a kid is serious about freestyle or greco? It’s a definate draw to be able to train in those styles. But the finances are a non issue.
 
Of course it's right. How can a wrestling fan NOT appreciate the concept of competion, getting better and a "may the best man win" attitude? When Big 10 champ and NCAA qualifier Blake Rasing got recruited over and beat out by Bobby Telford I didn't cry a tear even though I knew the kid personally. Why? Because that's how the cookie crumbles. That's sports. If Turk is on the team this season and Murin beats him out, is anyone going to livid with Brands that he dared go out and find someone better? Heck no.

A wise man once said "You get what you earn." If you're not the best man at your weight in any wrestling room in the country, you didn't earn the spot. Someone is better so they start, you don't.
I saw the exact words spoken in the documentary “Iowa, The Season” you gotta earn it! Agreed!
 
the “with all due reapect” that is usually followed with something outrageous. The RTCs are separate from the colleges and there are strict rules to keep them separate. The money and coaches, everything is separate. Not sure how they can use them to cheat, however, if a kid is serious about freestyle or greco? It’s a definate draw to be able to train in those styles. But the finances are a non issue.

I don't disagree with any of that. My point was that a poster (Don) has repeatedly made claims about "hearing of" funny business at PSU (by way of NLWC) but has yet to credit a source, other than a parent of an OkieSt recruit. At some point, after years of this going on, you have to question the veracity of the claim when there has been no action taken against the school or its unofficially affiliated RTC.

Hence, the evidence supports your contention (contrary to Don's) that the University and the RTC are playing by the rules and keeping everything separate.
 
I don't disagree with any of that. My point was that a poster (Don) has repeatedly made claims about "hearing of" funny business at PSU (by way of NLWC) but has yet to credit a source, other than a parent of an OkieSt recruit. At some point, after years of this going on, you have to question the veracity of the claim when there has been no action taken against the school or its unofficially affiliated RTC.

Hence, the evidence supports your contention (contrary to Don's) that the University and the RTC are playing by the rules and keeping everything separate.
I don’t have any idea what you are talking about as far as the okie state situation. And I have said what I have heard here before.
 
Gotcha, I’m new to the complaining, but having just went through the recruiting process, these schools watch what they say and do. Especially PSU, due to the constant allegations. Nothing was ever insinuated to us or promised. most of these kids and parents know each other and it’s much easier for them to communicate which makes it that much more difficult to have a school cheating!
 
at least one person on this board listened closely. that's literally what i said "at what point is the talent gap wide enough that it's 'ok'''

lol. you guys are pretty predicable.

Thanks for impugning the whole board. Most of the posters didn't listen to what you said and, not to bust your bubble, most don't hang on your every word. Speaking of predictable.
 
Really? When you recruit over the person, and that person doesn’t leave the program, it’s a disaster for recruiting financially speaking Having Murin, Turk, Happel and Renteria may very well cost us Abe Assad. So, you might want to rethink how over-recruiting wins titles. If PSU gets Kerk and Neville’s doesn’t leave - that should hurt them in recruiting down the road (but not the slush fund of course).
So you’re saying Cael doesn’t recruit over kids considering he’s racking up so many National titles.

So what are we arguing about here?
 
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rossel 33 said:

I didn't make up that ranking FT. FLO has 2 rankings for HS. Nevills was ranked #12 p4p on FLO's 4/10/18 National HS Rankings, still on their site. They have a different ranking for Nevills on their 2018 "Big Board" where he comes in at #22.


Didn't say you made it up, that's a straw argument. What I did say was you were misleading by using an outdated ranking which is absolutely correct. Nevills was ranked #22 when Kirk opened up his commitment. You saying he was #12 was an attempt to make them appear closer then they are just so you can criticize it.

You kinda missed the point anyway. Since Costello was not highly ranked, it seemed a stretch for FLO to compare recruiting a highly ranked wrestler after having already gotten a much lower ranked wrestler, to PSU pursuing very highly ranked Kerkvliet after already having a highly ranked hwt recruit in Nevills.

No, you missed the point, see Willie's post addressing this; and Nevills isn't a highly ranked recruit. Iowa has been getting guys in the 20s all the time and all you do is sulk about it and complain how unfair because they can't compete with the top 10 guys. Can't have it both ways though we sure know you try.

And you also missed my point that recruiting over guys in general is not a big issue for me, it was more a question of how can PSU keep apparently endless funds available to keep getting so many top tier recruits. But then I know in the past you provided this board with a hypothetical funding scheme. Basically pulled numbers out of your azz, not based on anything factual.

See Mr. Brooks comments on the subject. That's how they do it!
 
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I saw the exact words spoken in the documentary “Iowa, The Season” you gotta earn it! Agreed!

You explained it well Mr. Brooks. I’d caution you to just proceed with caution on message boards as a parent, not worth it. You’re always welcome on BWI, I’d only view on HR and not post if I were you. It never goes well for parents . WeAre
 
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6800213043_dba1ff190e_b.jpg
That looks more like art to me. Can you post something a little more conclusive? :)
 
9.9 is true, but lots of parent don’t need scholarships and they don’t take them. Lots of these parents are already paying tuition, so it’s no big deal. There are lots of factors that could be taking place. It doesn’t have to be cheating.
No, it doesn't have to be cheating, and PSU isn't the first school to have a parent pay out of pocket instead of taking a full ride for their clearly full ride level athlete son, for the betterment of the team.

They are however in my opinion the first school to "apparently" do it to this degree.

It's also a lot easier to take if Little Johnny is sitting on the bench at Alabama, if all of his bills are being paid for by the school. Or at Kentucky with Calipari. That's an entirely different animal when it comes to Wrestling, Baseball, etc.

Iowa Wrestling has a spoiled fan base without question, and I've said from the beginning of the PSU run, that Iowa just has to get better to beat them. Quit crying and get to work. That is still true, and if the playing field is level (history tells us it rarely is), that should happen in my opinion.

Now all that said, I'm old school to the core, and I've seen a lot of ducks in my lifetime, and my observations in that timeframe are to this day.........

If it walks like a duck, and talks like a duck, it's a duck. I've been proven correct on that assessment far more than I've been proven wrong.

Admittedly I don't know a lot about you or your son, but from what little I have read he seems like a fine young man, and has clearly worked his tail off. So at the end of the day I wish you both well.
 
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Let's say Gable pins Cass three times this year, next year Gable wants to transfer to Iowa, you guys are telling me, you'd want TnT to turn him down?
Glad you got one PSU like for this...but that is not RECRUITING over someone. There was no recruiting involved. “Gable wants to transfer...”
 
You explained it well Mr. Brooks. I’d caution you to just proceed with caution on message boards as a parent, not worth it. You’re always welcome on BWI, I’d only view on HR and not post if I were you. It never goes well for parents . WeAre
BWI is no different than HR. It's an anonymous message board where anyone with internet access can post a comment.
 
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Johnbrooks said:
Absolutely no talk or funny money. 100% by the book at PSU. Great staff and the kids are awesome. I’m a big Iowa fan, can’t love wrestling without appreciating the Hawks. The rivilry is great for the sport and keeps the fans engaged. We embrace competition in our house. Always have!

That’s great news.
It's not news, or at least shouldn't be. It just doesn't fit the HR agenda. The "PSU is cheating" stuff has grown into urban legend on this board, without a scrap of real evidence to support the claim, sort of like people who believe the moon landings were faked. It's what people want to believe, perhaps because such rationalization makes them feel better, so they choose to believe it.

And by the way, you should add tOSU to the list of schools that must be cheating. Their recruiting is right there with that of PSU, or damn close.
 
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From a parents point of view, bring in all the talent you can. I don’t care if it’s my kids weight, if you can’t win to get into the lineup? You
Can’t win national and world titles. That’s the mindset. Being the best means you don’t worry about who is behind you or in front. You get it done. Don’t come to these programs if someone has to promise you a spot.
99.9% of us have never been around world class athletes to understand their mindset. I’d like to call it 83% but that wouldn’t be accurate. You obviously are and certainly get it. They also don’t understand how premier college wrestling coaches run their programs and go about business. That’s why so many in this thread sound so ignorant. Hopefully you can forgive us and overlook the stupidity you are seeing here.
 
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At this point, I’m only concerned with what we’re doing, and we’re headed squarely in the right direction. The coaching staff, wrestlers, administration, and fans are all on the same page like never before and there’s unprecedented momentum behind Iowa wrestling and the HWC. Recruiting is on target and we’ll have the world’s best training facility in place within a couple of years or so, which will be another massive boost.

Whether other programs are operating within the rules or not, I see us winning national team titles soon, and we’re doing it the right way. That’s what matters, and that’s where my energy and attention are focused. No sense in ruminating on what we can’t control. We’re on the right track regardless of what others are doing.
 
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You explained it well Mr. Brooks. I’d caution you to just proceed with caution on message boards as a parent, not worth it. You’re always welcome on BWI, I’d only view on HR and not post if I were you. It never goes well for parents . WeAre
You know, you can always take yourself and the rest of your Penn State crew back to that second- rate board. Oh wait, you won't, because it sucks and that's why you all come here to begin with.
 
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I guess it depends on what a coach tells the recruit and his parents. IMO, some coaches are flat-out dishonest and word gets around. Reap what you sow.
Is word about Cael not getting around fast enough? Considering he still pulls in top recruits? Is that what you guys are doing here? Helping the word get around??
 
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You know, you can always take yourself and the rest of your Penn State crew back to that second- rate board. Oh wait, you won't, because it sucks and that's why you all come here to begin with.
We come here for a laugh. We let you guys decide whether we laugh with you or at you....
 
Mr. Brooks may very well be telling the truth(as he sees it). But, would he have posted any differently if it wasn't? Would we expect the father of a top commit to throw them under the bus before he has even started?

Wow. A parent of a well respected wrestler comes to the board, gives first hand knowledge of a situation many of you speculate about and you Insinuate he’s a liar. Well done MSU
 
Mr. Brooks may very well be telling the truth(as he sees it). But, would he have posted any differently if it wasn't? Would we expect the father of a top commit to throw them under the bus before he has even started?
This is how you say someones lying without calling them a liar.The truth(as he sees it) and, what would you expect him to say can be used in any situation
 
It is actually very basic.

1.) the truth "as he sees it" only means that he only knows how things have worked with his family, unless he has been involved with every other recruit.

2.)a dad coming on here to deny any wrongdoing has to be taken with a grain of salt(no matter how small the grain). Simple common sense says that the same exact argument would be used by someone involved in any wrongdoing.

Now, to be clear. I highly doubt PSU is doing something straight up wrong. They may be operating in a grey area or 2, but that is just being smart.

7 out of 8 says all that needs to be said.
 
Wow. A parent of a well respected wrestler comes to the board, gives first hand knowledge of a situation many of you speculate about and you Insinuate he’s a liar. Well done MSU

This is how you say someones lying without calling them a liar.The truth(as he sees it) and, what would you expect him to say can be used in any situation

MSU is not an Iowa guy but just a poster on this board who many times, gives the anti Iowa opinion and gets a lot of flack for it. I have no reason to doubt John, but that doesn't mean that MSU is wrong. John admires Cael and PSU...so much so that his son is going there. But a recruit's (and their family) relationship is just one segment of many.

That cracking sound is hell freezing over as I defend MSU.
 
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