Max Murrell
- Thread starter GunnerHawk
- Start date
It would be nice if we could start recruiting kids that are better than Aaron White.
Yeah he was terrible at Iowa.
If you want Iowa to get better, we have to recruit better. That’s all I am saying.
White’s arguably the best player Iowa has had in the past 12 years (though I predict Wieskamp will surpass him). We have had a lot of higher ranked players but none of them had the drive and mental fortitude that White had. White is a bad example. We need a lot more White’s
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Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt.
I get what he's trying to say. Aaron White was a special exception. No one could have predicted the type of impact White would have on the Iowa program.
I think the 2014 and 2015 recruiting classes really set the program back a couple years. Things have improved a lot since then.
White’s not a bad example. If this program is ever going to turn a corner, you need to have higher expectations. I am not going to apologize for not being happy winning one game in the NCAA tournament every 4 years.
White’s arguably the best player Iowa has had in the past
Yeah, I know I think I understand too and I agree with you. But White is just a poor example.
He is a bad example and I think you are confused at the point you are trying to make. Plus, Iowa has won more then 1 game on the NCAA Tournament over the last 4 years.
White was not highly recruited but through his own drive, along with the help of the staff, he made himself into an All Big Ten player. If this team had 5 Aaron White players starting (tough, self-driven, fearless), Iowa would in fact “turn a corner).
Probably true, but it's just a toothless argument. You can say that same thing about like EVERY SINGLE TEAM that doesn't win a national championship on a regular basis.
If ISU wants to make it to an elite eight, they have to recruit better players!
If Purdue wants to make it to a final four, they have to recruit better players!
If Michigan State wants to actually win a championship again, they have to recruit better players!!
So it was the All B1G player, that sank more FT's than any other Hawkeye and was more than solid in scoring and rebounding, that was holding them back.
IMO it's more to do with quantity not quality. To compete for a B1G title and a deep run in the NCAA Tourney, you need to have quality depth 6 or 7 deep. It's taken time, but I think Fran has finally built the program to a place where he can put more talent on the floor 1-5.
How I see this discussion is that Fran needs to have a bar for athleticism. If players aren't at a White, Marble, Wieskamp level athletically ( would love to see more Cook's) then Fran has no business offering. Fran continues to miss first on athleticism and after that 2 and 3 really don't matter. I suspect Iowa's dunks will decrease by 95% this season with no Cook.
I suspect Iowa’s turnovers will decrease by 95% with Cook gone as well
Wow, better than AW? Great player, Great Hawkeye!
Shows that Fran has a good eye for talent and can develop those young men. Olaseni is another example. Heck, Marble and Jok were 3 star players who became all Big Ten.
Iowa doesn’t need better players than AARON White, Iowa needs more players like Aaron White. ****, can you imagine if they had two or three guys like that at the same time?
The truth is, if White were the exact same player at Iowa, but we had beaten Kansas for his services, not one person would say Iowa needs to shoot higher.
The truth is, if White were the exact same player at Iowa, but we had beaten Kansas for his services, not one person would say Iowa needs to shoot higher.
White had zero to do with our lack of athleticism, etc. on the perimeter. Get better guards that can defend and break down a defense and the things you want Iowa to accomplish will happen.
Yeah, Iowa needs a lot of guys who are better than the, what, 2nd or 3rd leading scorer in school history...
Geez...
Like 6 underclassmen will see significant minutes this year. That doesn't bode well for turnover numbers.
Cook's athleticism with a BB IQ would be great.
Hard to say with Cook. I think he gets a little too much criticism from some for being selfish or trying to impress NBA scouts. He never developed anything resembling a mid-range game and his free throw shooting was mediocre.I think he forced a lot due to a lack of play makers around him and Fran's infatuation with non-guards trying to create for others. Similar issues with Moss driving the ball. It wasn't something he was good at when he arrived in IC and it did not improve after 3 years + a red shirt season. Cook would have been better served to be a recipient of assists from guards capable of breaking the D down but since Iowa didn't have those players, Cook tried to be some Fran version of Draymond Green IMO.
I love AW but the fact is he never really improved in IC, and his shooting seemed to get worse over his career.
Never developed a left hand but did gain some lbs. in four years.
Any shortcomings he did not improve I solely put on this coaching staff. Seems to me no one has really ever improved for Fran in IC.
Never developed a left hand but did gain some lbs. in four years.
Any shortcomings he did not improve I solely put on this coaching staff. Seems to me no one has really ever improved for Fran in IC.
Going from unheralded recruit to first team B1G, I’d say he improved plenty. I think Olaseni, Clemmons, and Marble all improved dramatically during their time.
Maybe agree to disagree on this one.
Are you referring to Aaron White?! If so, I seriously have to question what you are talking about and I think your facts need to be checked.
And as has been been proven many times in many threads, there are many examples of players that have improved under Fran and staff.
Tyler was a team guy. He was asked to do more off the dribble because he was one of few on the team that had that ability. Who else did you want to try to drive their man?
I thought TC played very well in the NBA Summer League just playing his game. Didn't have to try to do too much. Still think he's got some work to do on rebounding and defense and both his issues are easily teachable. He's got to learn to get position early, to be more instinctive and beating guys to their spots. I have never had a doubt that TC will some day play in the NBA because he works hard and has a desire to be there. He is now 100% a full time basketball player and if you saw his FT's in the Summer League he looked very good at the line.
Are you sure about your data?
White went from:
- 11.1 ppg, 5.7 reb, 50.4% FG, 28% 3-pt, 70% FT as a freshman
- 16.4 ppg, 7.3 reb, 52.1% FG, 36% 3-pt, 82% FT as a senior
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Wow, the facts say that he improved A LOT......he really developed significantly over his career. I would give the coaches a lot of credit for that...but most goes to Aaron because every player has to work hard on their own to do what the coaches tell them to do to make those improvements....every player.
With a couple of people on here seeming to want to create the "Fran and staff are terrible-can't develop players" theme...I just wish people would look at reality. Could they be better at developing players, sure. I think Dr. Tom and staff seemed to do a slightly better job at this, but this staff does reasonably well. They recruit a very high level character and student team who are generally good offensive players......I think a BJ Armstrong type of leader could take us to the next level. BJ was an incredibly hard and smart worker.
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Is there any validity to the statements about Aaron White and Jarrod Uthoff not getting along when they were team mates?
No one hates Iowa players as much as Iowa "fans."
A lot of crap being thrown in this thread. None of it sticks.
Max Murell would be a good get.
Max Murell would be a good get.
Yes. If you need proof all you needed was to read all the negative comments about Uthoff that were posted by White's family member/friend on here.
But I never heard or got the feeling it affected their play together, more just 2 guys that didn't get along very well.
My observation is that they are just two very different types of people, both on and off the court.
I'm sure it happens all the time. You don't need to be best buddies to be good/effective teammates.
