More US Troops and Weapons In Europe? Now with POLL.

Do you approve?


  • Total voters
    57
Nov 28, 2010
79,240
32,492
113
Maryland
Do we really need to do this? Why?

How will we pay for this?

What will it do to inflation and the US economy?

Biden announces enhanced U.S. posture in Europe​

MADRID — President Biden said the United States will enhance its force posture in Europe — including the first permanent U.S. forces on NATO’s eastern flank — in response to Russia’s invasion of Ukraine.

The new U.S. military deployments include a permanent headquarters for the U.S. 5th Army Corps in Poland — a move that Russian President Vladimir Putin has long resisted — as well as additional rotational combat brigades to Romania; enhanced rotational deployments to the Baltic region; increasing the number of destroyers stationed at Rota, Spain, from four to six; and deploying two additional F-35 squadrons to the United Kingdom.

 
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Finance85

HR Legend
Oct 22, 2003
17,322
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Biden has to prop up the MIC until the next war. He has to justify the increase in defense spending he asked for after the withdrawal from the 'Stan.
 

soybean

HR King
Sep 30, 2001
52,960
17,357
113
My main point in this thread is that now is not the time to think we can deal with the Russians on the cheap. No one can have any doubts now that Putin is intent on fulfilling his dream of reconstituting the Russian empire in the mold of the Soviet Union of his boyhood. And we are fast learning that there is still a place in the 21st century for conventional military forces. Putin is the kind of guy that doesn't need anything even close to a legitimate excuse to act, he is fully capable of making excuses up.
 

FAUlty Gator

HR Legend
Oct 27, 2017
29,723
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Have we gamed this out? What’s the end game? Russia is now taking out all cultural centers. There’s only so much defense Ukraine can play before everything is gone. They either need to fire a missile at the Kremlin or surrender.
 

HawkeyeGenius

HR All-American
Gold Member
Nov 25, 2021
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Putin has proven he is unhinged enough to go nuclear. I'd have never said that in the build up to this. I think that is why the US and NATO have really walked a line with this. If this was Iran for example, then I think the US would have acted right at the start.
 

bhawk24bob

HR Legend
Jul 8, 2001
17,506
5,256
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Putin has proven he is unhinged enough to go nuclear. I'd have never said that in the build up to this. I think that is why the US and NATO have really walked a line with this. If this was Iran for example, then I think the US would have acted right at the start.

Putin has not proven that he is unhinged enough to go nuclear, stop with the hyperbole

The half-assing that the US has done over this while seemingly all of mainland Western Europe has sat by idly has basically led to the destruction of Ukraine. History is not going to look kindly down upon the US for all of the pointless devastation that has occurred to that country, nor is it going to look good when famine hits.
 

lucas80

HR King
Gold Member
Jan 30, 2008
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Biden has to prop up the MIC until the next war. He has to justify the increase in defense spending he asked for after the withdrawal from the 'Stan.
:rolleyes:
Make up your mind. Is Biden a raging incompetent or a multi level strategist?
 

lucas80

HR King
Gold Member
Jan 30, 2008
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Good. It’s time to be robust. I’d prefer more naval assets on the ready to act to free up shipping lanes and to seize plundered grain shipments. I’d prefer more air assets in Europe, and a division on standby to ship to Europe.
 

hwk23

HR All-American
Nov 22, 2010
3,917
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Have we gamed this out? What’s the end game? Russia is now taking out all cultural centers. There’s only so much defense Ukraine can play before everything is gone. They either need to fire a missile at the Kremlin or surrender.
The pentagon wants it to go on as long as possible but not to escalate into a big war. The state department wants to win at all costs. The fed and the treasury, the economists, want it over 4 months ago.
 
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Mar 11, 2020
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Good. It’s time to be robust. I’d prefer more naval assets on the ready to act to free up shipping lanes and to seize plundered grain shipments. I’d prefer more air assets in Europe, and a division on standby to ship to Europe.
It's just money right....
 

soybean

HR King
Sep 30, 2001
52,960
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Good. It’s time to be robust. I’d prefer more naval assets on the ready to act to free up shipping lanes and to seize plundered grain shipments. I’d prefer more air assets in Europe, and a division on standby to ship to Europe.
I think it is very close to the time we should move a carrier offshore.
 

Finance85

HR Legend
Oct 22, 2003
17,322
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Wasted money and effort.

I was partially wrong about the Ukraine, so I could be wrong here. There's a ton of difference though.

If we truly believe Putin will move past Ukraine, we shouldn't need a lot of defensive weapons, just some powerful offensive weapons that can be deployed quickly.
 
Mar 11, 2020
20,029
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If Biden gets us in a land war against Russia or China he will in fact go down as the worst president in history.


I don't think he will... I don't thinknhe is the worst right now... but I drew that line at the start of Ukraine vs Russia and I'm sticking to it.




Not even Chris could justify getting into a war with them over land on the other side of the world.
 

86Hawkeye

HR Legend
Gold Member
Dec 12, 2001
41,017
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Jokes aside:


Putin is desperate and needs a reason to excuse any action moving forward. At minimum this is horrible timing.
It's perfect timing to demonstrate that Putin's actions have backfired on him strategically. Makes him look weak not being able to prevent or stop NATO expansion and forward deployment. Actually proves that Russia's actions caused NATO expansion (not the other way around), virtually doubling the length of NATO common borders with Russia.

At any rate, Russia has stopped justifying the unprovoked attack on Ukraine as being due to NATO expansion. It's about empire building.
 
Nov 28, 2010
79,240
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Actually proves that Russia's actions caused NATO expansion (not the other way around), virtually doubling the length of NATO common borders with Russia.
You aren't wrong, but soon we'll be on the hook to defend that doubled border - which. let's remember, is just Finland's border, a country with a population of under 6 million.

Who's the winner here?

NATO has been struggling to find a mission to justify it's costs and giant bureaucracy for the last 30 years - ever since the USSR collapsed.

It's a monstrous military power and, while many of its members are democracies, not all are and it's not a democratic organization.

And now it's stronger and richer than ever.

What could possibly be wrong with that?

Not anti-NATO, just concerned.
 
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Rifler

HR Legend
Jan 26, 2011
24,440
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Putin isn't moving beyond Ukraine,... Christ, he can barely handle Ukraine...
 
Nov 28, 2010
79,240
32,492
113
Maryland
If you look at how people are voting, this is an interesting poll. Rather less partisan than many polls here.

My guess is that 10-15 years ago, this would have divided more on party lines, and that the Rs would be more supportive, the Ds less so.

Why? Well, 15 years ago we were at or near the worst of the Iraq war. While 10 years ago was before Crimea had been snapped up by Putin.

Which is to say that 10-15 years ago a lot of us - especially Ds - were sick of war, and most of us weren't all that worried about Russia.
 
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Finance85

HR Legend
Oct 22, 2003
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If you look at how people are voting, this is an interesting poll. Rather less partisan than many polls here.

My guess is that 10-15 years ago, this would have divided more on party lines, and that the Rs would be more supportive, the Ds less so.

Why? Well, 15 years ago we were at or near the worst of the Iraq war. While 10 years ago was before Crimea had been snapped up by Putin.

Which is to say that 10-15 years ago a lot of us - especially Ds - were sick of war, and most of us weren't all that worried about Russia.
I think some of the votes are still partisan, and a lot of the votes are because the aggressor is Russia. Russia isn't nearly as powerful as anyone would have guessed, and Russia is the favorite bogeyman for war mongers on the right and left.
 

NorthDSMHawk

HR Heisman
Oct 24, 2016
6,113
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Ankeny
Sure is awesome we keep subsidizing Europe's defense so they can move towards their pseudo-utopian societies while our education, healthcare system, and infrastructure keep getting worse.
 
Nov 28, 2010
79,240
32,492
113
Maryland
Sure is awesome we keep subsidizing Europe's defense so they can move towards their pseudo-utopian societies while our education, healthcare system, and infrastructure keep getting worse.
Yep. Seems to me that at some point we might want to move there to receive the benefits we pay for but can't get here.

Who's with me?