New Senior Big Board on Flo - Daton Fix #1, Spencer Lee #2
- Thread starter OL119
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Lee being #2 in his class is better. In 6 years AZchief can talk how brands took a lower ranked kid coming out of HS and coached him up to a 4x NCAA champ.
Pic is a little fuzzy..........
but you might want to do a little work on your nose hairs before coming back...........thanks.
BBwretler - completely understand if you only watch Iowa wrestling. Then you are set without them and I don't disagree with you. However, if you want to watch international wrestling, high school wrestling from around the country, other college wrestling duals and tournaments not normally shown, Flo is great. You said subscribe, I have. Have for about 2 years now and have loved it. Personally, the goofy stuff they do (#1 141 lber last year etc.) doesn't bother me. Being able to watch all the wrestling I want is great.
Hell, part of me is jealous I didn't do this and could make money following the sport I love. Maybe that's where some of the angst comes in. I've never understood why everyone is so mad they charge for things. Everyone is mad when they aren't the ones making money on some idea. Hell, I say kuddos to those who go off their ass, took a chance, worked hard and made money doing it to bring us a product I love. It's not at the expense of others. You don't want to pay, you don't have too and you have the same access you did before flo, so why are people mad at them. I don't feel it's at my expense. I'm more than happy to pay what they charge to watch wrestling. Most of you probably pay more monthly for your TV plan than you would for a year of Flo. Sorry for the rant.
yeah, we did have a segment on FRL about it. archive hasn't been posted yet.
my point was this - i didn't see it that way, i didn't agree with the change, and i don't agree with the rationale. but i turned the big board over to Nomad. it's his deal. he talked to me about it before hand and i said that if he thought that Daton would have a better college career than he should rank it that way. i can't fault him for that. he's a good wrestling evaluator and he's earned it. he should be doing rankings that just appease and/or default to my judgment.
as to HR - the above is the whole story. where the 'tin foil hats' come in is when you guys refer to click bait. it's always 'click bait' when it's something HR doesn't agree with. as if we'd actually change rankings to get the 40 posters on HR in a tizzy. i mean, get real.
my point was this - i didn't see it that way, i didn't agree with the change, and i don't agree with the rationale. but i turned the big board over to Nomad. it's his deal. he talked to me about it before hand and i said that if he thought that Daton would have a better college career than he should rank it that way. i can't fault him for that. he's a good wrestling evaluator and he's earned it. he should be doing rankings that just appease and/or default to my judgment.
as to HR - the above is the whole story. where the 'tin foil hats' come in is when you guys refer to click bait. it's always 'click bait' when it's something HR doesn't agree with. as if we'd actually change rankings to get the 40 posters on HR in a tizzy. i mean, get real.
Smalls - Maybe i'm misunderstanding what you are saying, so I apologize if I am. Are you telling me that you don't see any uptick in traffic with certain things you guys post or say? I'm assuming you track that stuff. We do at our company and some topics drive traffic and some don't. Maybe I overestimated the Hawk fan base, but PSU and Iowa would be your largest targets I would assume, at least in college. Again, maybe I'm overestimating that and your target/appeal is really a broader base of High School/College in general. Or are you saying you would never slightly inflate a topic to generate some conversation? If you don't, kudos to you.
to suggest we sacrifice the integrity of stories or rankings for clicks is ridiculous. to suggest we conspired to 'frame' the gilman-terao thing is bizarre, and frankly, giving too much credit to our ingenuity.
our HS and recruiting rankings have no peer. to think we'd sacrifice that reputation is, once again, outlandish.
maybe, just maybe, it's just an opinion y'all don't agree with.
every parent in the world thinks it's 'bias' when their kid is ranked lower than they should be.
and now y'all just took that a step further and contend that it's for 'clicks'.
our HS and recruiting rankings have no peer. to think we'd sacrifice that reputation is, once again, outlandish.
maybe, just maybe, it's just an opinion y'all don't agree with.
every parent in the world thinks it's 'bias' when their kid is ranked lower than they should be.
and now y'all just took that a step further and contend that it's for 'clicks'.
Have the Big Board PFP always been projections on how well these kids would do in college? If that's the case than wouldn't Yianni's season ending injury be a bit of a concern? I thought Berge's ranking went down a bit until after his full recovery. I could be wrong.
If it's about one kid's projected success for the next five years as opposed to who is the better wrestler right now regardless of weight, than there's no way anyone can fault the pfp rankings outside of Nomad.
I'm a big fan of Flo, but I understand it's a business. There's no arguing that Flo got more traffic today because of the switch in rankings from 1 and 2 as opposed to keeping the rankings the way they were (which you even agree they should have been). Either way, we're talking about it, and I'm sure it's not just us 40 HR posters that are just talking about it.
So, good on Flo for always mixing the pot and keeping the discussions going. It's what you do. To deny that is a little disingenuous.
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If Lee has 2-3 tight matches could he move back to number one? Any chance of that - or should I put antennas back on and hold tight?
Smalls - Hey, I seriously wasn't bashing your approach. We build up stories to drive traffic, that's what the world does. We don't lie, cheat or steal, but we do talk up a story. "The 10 best...." I love my Hawks, but I haven't lived in Iowa for 20 years and have wrestling interest all over the country. I love your guys product and i understand why you think I was questioning your integrity. I wasn't. If you have two ways that make equal sense, but one makes a story and the other doesn't, I just assumed most companies trying to drive traffic would do that here and there. Maybe you missed me defending Flo above and assumed I just hated Flo. I don't. I'll be hated here for that though i'm sure. I was asking a serious question and didn't see it as an integrity thing but I appreciate your stance and sticking to your guns.
Smalls you are awfully concerned about what 40 posters on message board are saying. Don't you hve something better to do right now? Try to act a little more professional will ya? Trashing all of HR isnt exactly doing that. Move along now
If a Flo Iowa slight comes out and HR is not around to hear it, does it make a sound?
You are clearly concerned.. Infact im sure someone on Flo is typing up a mean tweet about it right now. Once again you have yourself worked up about what a few posters here(not all of HR) have typed to pass their time today. Quit being so sensitive! Get yourself an ice cream cone and chill out.
Willie,
If Lobdell has already done a set of rankings or more than a set, and changed the ranking based on no new evidence, that's flawed process and also you have to understand that people would look side-eyed at a change like that.
If it was his first ranking, them it's more understandable, even if I disagree.
If Lobdell has already done a set of rankings or more than a set, and changed the ranking based on no new evidence, that's flawed process and also you have to understand that people would look side-eyed at a change like that.
If it was his first ranking, them it's more understandable, even if I disagree.
Talk from Hawk fans is a good thing, even if it is paranoid.
It's when you don't hear anything from us is when you should get really worried. Than, that just means we don't care what you think.
Really it comes down to his reasoning for the change is weak. More than an Iowa slight, I think it is him stretching to make P4P his own. The fact that it is gonna no doubt stir the hornets nest is icing on the cake.
1) Lee is a three time world champ, (Dayton is not)
2) He has a ton of great wins, including ones in the world championship against guys that would have been world champs if not for Spencer Lee. (Dayton has a lot of good wins too)
3) He has beast skills on top, that will undoubtedly translate to a ton of bonus points in college.(Not sure about this with Dayton)
4) He is most likely a career 125lber, which is recruiting gold. (Also not sure about this with Dayton)
Really Dayton's best case for being #1 is he did beat Lee 2 times the most recent meeting. Although this comes with somewhat of a *, since it was pretty obvious that it was not Lee's ideal weight when he proceeded to win a Jr World title 8lbs lighter.
1) Lee is a three time world champ, (Dayton is not)
2) He has a ton of great wins, including ones in the world championship against guys that would have been world champs if not for Spencer Lee. (Dayton has a lot of good wins too)
3) He has beast skills on top, that will undoubtedly translate to a ton of bonus points in college.(Not sure about this with Dayton)
4) He is most likely a career 125lber, which is recruiting gold. (Also not sure about this with Dayton)
Really Dayton's best case for being #1 is he did beat Lee 2 times the most recent meeting. Although this comes with somewhat of a *, since it was pretty obvious that it was not Lee's ideal weight when he proceeded to win a Jr World title 8lbs lighter.
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When I clicked on the new rankings link, I thought something drastic happened over the weekend. Lee lost an exhibition match over the weekend or something. IDK.
It stood out to me, because in my mind, Lee is without question the best wrestler in High School right now.
Even if Lee was going to psu and gave a top ten list of why Iowa sucks in his announcement video, I'd still say without a doubt, Lee is the best pfp.
But, this ranking on Flo seems to be based on the projected success of college careers, which changes things a bit.
Both Lee and Fix will have outstanding college careers, no doubt
Lee wasn't tested behind by 4+ at junior worlds to come back and win?
I think he lost to Nick his 8th grade year and came back to beat him his Freshman year. I believe the only losses were to Daton at Cadet Trials...5-5 (criteria) and by a couple of points.
My point in posting was not to rationalize the change in rankings - which we're back on now.
That's Nomad's to defend. I already said i didn't agree with it.
My reason for posting - for the umpteenth time - is to dispute any accusation of ulterior motive.
you guys are conspiracy theorists. And now i see Vak is in the club.
That's Nomad's to defend. I already said i didn't agree with it.
My reason for posting - for the umpteenth time - is to dispute any accusation of ulterior motive.
you guys are conspiracy theorists. And now i see Vak is in the club.
If you really think everyone here is way off base why the major protest? You shouln't really care what a mere "40 people" as you say, are concerned or unhappy about. "Me thinks your dost protest too much". Oh, and as for the rebuttal with reason: the only rational I have seen seems to be that there is no reason. Even you said that.
Azchief32, my daughter lives in Tucson and I was just there before christmas and will be back this spring. If you are still around we should have a drink and talk Iowa wrestling. Spent quite a bit of time in the room a number of years ago.
Have "no peer?" Uh... have you heard of intermat? If not you should check out their site, they are the generally accepted best rankers for all things high school and recruiting for wrestling.
Smalls, you're good people. I always appreciate the fact you don't go into hiding, and come on here to defend FLO. I love FLO for what it is, the best source for wrestling we've ever had. I also know, that you guys know that Iowa and Penn State fans basically keep the lights on over there. I have no illusions that FLO loves Iowa fans.
I still think your boy's article was nothing more than to be edgy. That's not tin foil. That's an opinion, just like Nomad's.
I still think your boy's article was nothing more than to be edgy. That's not tin foil. That's an opinion, just like Nomad's.
appreciate the words.
but the track record here is that everything that HR doesn't agree with was done for an ulterior motive.
I have a question for you since you are so adamant about defending yourself. Is this the only sight you have to do this on or are there others as well? You seem to indicate or at least imply that this is the only site that takes offense, wrongly, as to what you post.
Yes, there are two places/occurrences where/when i have to defend myself
1) whiny parents that think their kid should be ranked higher
2) HR where they take offense to everything
god's honest truth - the only two instances so incredibly difficult.
1) whiny parents that think their kid should be ranked higher
2) HR where they take offense to everything
god's honest truth - the only two instances so incredibly difficult.
"Everything"?? Sharpen your senses a bit. A lot of people on this website pay Flo good hardworking Iowa money for Flo's service including myself. I enjoy the service i pay for and am far from a fearsome "40" member conspiracy theorist group you speak of.
Some people(not just here) believe that Flo has a track record of "stirring the pot" if you will. Thats part of what a large media outlet like flo has to deal with. Don't be surprised when people yack about it a bit. And don't belittle all of the HR for a few complaints. Especially when many of us here pay you $$.
Some people(not just here) believe that Flo has a track record of "stirring the pot" if you will. Thats part of what a large media outlet like flo has to deal with. Don't be surprised when people yack about it a bit. And don't belittle all of the HR for a few complaints. Especially when many of us here pay you $$.
So high school parents and this site? If we are the only college site it might tell you something...other than that we are being so "bad". Maybe there is just a slight bias by your publication. I can't believe OK St, or PS fans are any less zealous. You sort of walked right into that one.
Willie, I'm glad you post here and I hope you don't stop. I wouldn't worry too much about HR. We are all good peeps and sometimes we just take offense to somethings. It's just easy to do. Also without naming names, can you give us a crazy/absurd comment you have gotten from a parent?
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