New York City is expected to require proof of vaccination for indoor dining and fitness.

[FAUlty Gator]

Although I suspect the statistic you didn't actually cite or link is bullshit...

Whoops...

COVID-19: Data on Vaccines - NYC Health

www1.nyc.gov

I'd bet way less than that don't have, ID's and we are claiming they are oppressed for "not being able to vote". What's it gonna be when they're not allowed to work or eat...soon to be or shop or attend church? Oppressed? Not according to the label makers, I bet.

 

[ANYCHawk]

Same as a voter ID. You should be ok with that.

voting is a right, going to a restaurant is not, smart guy

 

[Hawkeye_311]

65% of African Americans in NYC aren't vaccinated. The sight of restaurant and other businesses in NYC not allowing African Americans to enter should make for good TV.

 

[ANYCHawk]

65% of African Americans in NYC aren't vaccinated. The sight of restaurant and other businesses in NYC not allowing African Americans to enter should make for good TV.

Again, NYC has been doing that for 100 years

 

[Urohawk]

voting is a right, going to a restaurant is not, smart guy

I think you and I are on the same page??? I think voter IDs are a form of vote suppression. If you're going to support requiring voter IDs it's hard to complain about needing a vaccine card to go to a gym or restaurant. It was in response to everyone saying, "Papers please"

 

[binsfeldcyhawk2]

Boston mayor compares vaccine passports to documentation required during slavery, birtherism

Boston Mayor Kim Janey (D) compared the idea of requiring vaccine verification to the practice of having to show one's papers during slavery and the Jim Crow era, as well as the more recent birtherism conspiracy theory.

thehill.com

 

[Camhawk2012]

Theres a pay wall for this article but…

So a an unvaccinated carryout customer can go into a restaurant, walk around, go to the bathroom, chill by the jukebox, lollygag with the same waitstaff but only when they sit down to eat is when the vaccine proof is mandated

 

[MepoDawg#]

Theres a pay wall for this article but…

So a an unvaccinated carryout customer can go into a restaurant, walk around, go to the bathroom, chill by the jukebox, lollygag with the same waitstaff but only when they sit down to eat is when the vaccine proof is mandated

Makes sense.

 

[silasstarr]

Good call.

I keep a pic of my vaccine card on my smartphone at all times.

Semi-related, our company just mandated you show proof of vaccination or you have to wear a mask everywhere inside. I also like this - helps me identify the dummies around me.

How is that? Many people that are fully vaccinated still wear masks.

 

[silasstarr]

I'm fully vaccinated but don't like heading down that road.

We are already down that road. You are tracked now more than anytime in history, you just don’t have someone saying ‘papers please’.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Only 31

Only 31% of blacks in NYC have the vaccine. This is going to punish them the most. Will they be allowed to claim unemployment because they refuse to get vaccinated and now aren’t allowed to work? Should they?

Whether or not your number is correct, those are reasonable questions.

It's pretty clear this is the "stick" part of the equation - the part that has been lacking for too long.

Some blacks may have better reasons for being suspicious of government medical treatments, but even those who fall into this category need to get on board.

My opinion is that if you can't work because you won't get vaccinated, and you don't have a legit medical reason, then you should not be eligible for COVID benefits, including unemployment. That hard line needs to be moderated, of course, where children are involved.

I know that sounds harsh coming from a certified lefty, but sometimes the good of the many is the overriding good.

We've already spent 18 months following a mostly least-intrusive path, and that has lead to hundreds of thousands of extra deaths. Time to get serious.

And, yes, I understand that some think this variant is less deadly - and should, therefore, warrant less intrusive measures. But the much higher transmissibility argues against that view.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

How is that? Many people that are fully vaccinated still wear masks.

Fair point. Although I wonder if "many" is the correct quantifier.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

He would be proud of you

De Blasio isn't sending armies of black shirts out to beat up or kill people who disagree.

Is it an exercise of authority? Of course it is.

Is it warranted? Almost certainly, although that can be - and is being - debated.

That's not fascism. And it doesn't smell like a camel's nose under the tent flap, either. But, as with any exercise of authority it needs to be questioned and needs to be justified. Personally, I think the justification is clear. But, by all means, keep your eye on it for mission creep or abuse.

 

[torbee]

How is that? Many people that are fully vaccinated still wear masks.

Not at our office. Literally zero masks for the last month or so, until the new policy went into effect. Now about 40 percent appear to have to wear them due to not presenting a vaccine card to HR.

 

[MnPete]

Boston mayor compares vaccine passports to documentation required during slavery, birtherism

Boston Mayor Kim Janey (D) compared the idea of requiring vaccine verification to the practice of having to show one's papers during slavery and the Jim Crow era, as well as the more recent birtherism conspiracy theory.

thehill.com

I think what this topic is really dancing around is the concept of discrimination based upon disparate treatment versus discrimination based upon disparate impact. The former is intentional while disparate impact is unintentional. Assuming that the low vaccination rates for blacks and other minorities in NYC are true, this policy is clearly an example of discrimination based upon disparate impact as the effect will be clearly disproportionately felt by minorities. Additionally, if the primary tracking for this policy becomes an app on a smartphone, one could also argue that the assumption that everyone has access to a smartphone could also have a disparate impact on low-to-moderate income individuals who may not be able to afford such a device.

If such policies were implemented by large bank’s as an example, the Elizabeth Warren’s, AOC’s and Bernie Sanders of the world would be all over this.

 

[torbee]

If such policies were implemented by large bank’s as an example, the Elizabeth Warren’s, AOC’s and Bernie Sanders of the world would be all over this.

You got a link to them expressing outrage about this:

Goldman Sachs, Wells Fargo ask US staff to report vaccination status

Goldman is requiring its employees to record the date they received their shots and the manufacturer of the vaccine, but they won't have to show proof. Wells stressed that response is voluntary.

www.bankingdive.com

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Not at our office. Literally zero masks for the last month or so, until the new policy went into effect. Now about 40 percent appear to have to wear them due to not presenting a vaccine card to HR.

What we need is a tattoo pigment that fades when antibody levels get high enough.

Then tattoo a dickpic on the foreheads of the dicks who won't get vaccinated.

 

[torbee]

What we need is a tattoo pigment that fades when antibody levels get high enough.

Then tattoo a dickpic on the foreheads of the dicks who won't get vaccinated.

I was very disappointed to see the number of unvaxxed at our office. Including my boss 🙄

 

[abby97]

Odd how the left wants vaccine cards to live ones life, but voter IDs are racist?

 

[hexumhawk]

De Blasio isn't sending armies of black shirts out to beat up or kill people who disagree.

Is it an exercise of authority? Of course it is.

Is it warranted? Almost certainly, although that can be - and is being - debated.

That's not fascism. And it doesn't smell like a camel's nose under the tent flap, either. But, as with any exercise of authority it needs to be questioned and needs to be justified. Personally, I think the justification is clear. But, by all means, keep your eye on it for mission creep or abuse.

 

[ANYCHawk]

Odd how the left wants vaccine cards to live ones life, but voter IDs are racist?

Vaccine card, free.
Voter ID, not free

Going to restaurant, broadway are not rights
Voting is.

I know this is a hard concept for you to grasp, but please try.

 

[ANYCHawk]

De Blasio isn't sending armies of black shirts out to beat up or kill people who disagree.

Is it an exercise of authority? Of course it is.

Is it warranted? Almost certainly, although that can be - and is being - debated.

That's not fascism. And it doesn't smell like a camel's nose under the tent flap, either. But, as with any exercise of authority it needs to be questioned and needs to be justified. Personally, I think the justification is clear. But, by all means, keep your eye on it for mission creep or abuse.

The health department did it a year ago during the lockdown. It's basically just them enforcing the rule again.

 

[MnPete]

You got a link to them expressing outrage about this:

Goldman Sachs, Wells Fargo ask US staff to report vaccination status

Goldman is requiring its employees to record the date they received their shots and the manufacturer of the vaccine, but they won't have to show proof. Wells stressed that response is voluntary.

www.bankingdive.com

Not sure I understand your point here.

 

[FAUlty Gator]

De Blasio isn't sending armies of black shirts out to beat up or kill people who disagree.

Is it an exercise of authority? Of course it is.

Is it warranted? Almost certainly, although that can be - and is being - debated.

That's not fascism. And it doesn't smell like a camel's nose under the tent flap, either. But, as with any exercise of authority it needs to be questioned and needs to be justified. Personally, I think the justification is clear. But, by all means, keep your eye on it for mission creep or abuse.

Are you sure? Isn’t that how Eric Garner died? DeBlasio’s Black Shirts enforcing his loose cigarette rules?

 

[ANYCHawk]

I think what this topic is really dancing around is the concept of discrimination based upon disparate treatment versus discrimination based upon disparate impact. The former is intentional while disparate impact is unintentional. Assuming that the low vaccination rates for blacks and other minorities in NYC are true, this policy is clearly an example of discrimination based upon disparate impact as the effect will be clearly disproportionately felt by minorities. Additionally, if the primary tracking for this policy becomes an app on a smartphone, one could also argue that the assumption that everyone has access to a smartphone could also have a disparate impact on low-to-moderate income individuals who may not be able to afford such a device.

If such policies were implemented by large bank’s as an example, the Elizabeth Warren’s, AOC’s and Bernie Sanders of the world would be all over this.

Lots of big words and none of its true.

The vaccine mandidate is being applied equally regardless of one's race or background. Have the vaccine your good, don't and stay home. The rule is equal across races. That means there is no discrimination.

What a subset does across an evenly applied rule is their issue and not an argument of discrimination.

You'd have to say whites and asians have to be vaccinted and blacks don't for discrimination to be in play.

 

[torbee]

Not sure I understand your point here.

I misunderstood your post at first. I thought you were saying Bernie and the Squad would be hostile to large banks mandating vaccine compliance. I see now that was not what you were saying, my bad. 👍🏻

 

[MnPete]

Lots of big words and none of its true.

The vaccine mandidate is being applied equally regardless of one's race or background. Have the vaccine your good, don't and stay home. The rule is equal across races. That means there is no discrimination.

What a subset does across an evenly applied rule is their issue and not an argument of discrimination.

You'd have to say whites and asians have to be vaccinted and blacks don't for discrimination to be in play.

You clearly do not understand disparate impact. It is not just a big word, it is in fact a very real component in the application of equity.

 

[ANYCHawk]

You clearly do not understand disparate impact. It is not just a big word, it is in fact a very real component in the application of equity.

I do.

But again, leagally, that's not discimination. A subset that is more impacted by a rule, if the rule is applied fairly across all protected group, is not being discriminated against.

If you argued it, every judge would laugh you out of the courtroom.

It would be like saying a bicylce helmet law is discriminatory because more white people ride bikes. As long as you said everybody has to wear a helmet, there is no discrimination.

 

[MnPete]

I do.

But again, leagally, that's not discimination. A subset that is more impacted by a rule, if the rule is applied fairly across all protected group, is not being discriminated against.

If you argued it, every judge would laugh you out of the courtroom.

It would be like saying a bicylce helmet law is discriminatory because more white people ride bikes. As long as you said everybody has to wear a helmet, there is no discrimination.

This will be my final rebuttal here but look up the case law. Neutral policies that have a disproportionate adverse impact on members of a protected class can be determined to be discriminatory. For example, a strength requirement might screen out a disproportionate number of female applicants for a job. These things are litigated every day.

 

[ANYCHawk]

roportionate adverse impact on members of a protected class can be determined to be discriminatory. For example, a strength requirement might screen out a disproportionate number of female applicants for a job. These things are litigated every day.

If that was true no law would ever exist because someone is being adversely impaced. Try agian.

Drug laws would all be tossed.
Nuisances laws non existant.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

I was very disappointed to see the number of unvaxxed at our office. Including my boss 🙄

Turn off all surveillance cams.

Release the knockout gas.

Administer dickpic tattoo to offenders while they're out.

OK, don't actually tattoo them, but how about an ink stamp?

 

[naturalbornhawk]

I listened to the first two minutes. This guy makes a lot of observations about how Puerto Rico is being run like a police state. Compares it similarly to East Berlin. My friend is in Puerto Rico and having a blast. She doesn't appear to be getting shot by guards while she climbs the wire.

The East Berlin comment is somewhat of an exaggeration (for now), but here is some more context. Specifically, move it to 19:20:

 

[MepoDawg#]

Vaccine card, free.
Voter ID, not free

Going to restaurant, broadway are not rights
Voting is.

I know this is a hard concept for you to grasp, but please try.

The government pays for the vaccine (card), it isn’t free. Also, an ID card costs less than the vaccine, at least in Iowa.

 

[ANYCHawk]

The government pays for the vaccine (card), it isn’t free. Also, an ID card costs less than the vaccine, at least in Iowa.

 

[silasstarr]

Not at our office. Literally zero masks for the last month or so, until the new policy went into effect. Now about 40 percent appear to have to wear them due to not presenting a vaccine card to HR.

I was back in Iowa City last month and it was a little surprising seeing hardly anyone with a mask on indoors. It's a bit different out east.

 

[torbee]

I was back in Iowa City last month and it was a little surprising seeing hardly anyone with a mask on indoors. It's a bit different out east.

And Iowa City far-and-away the MOST masked community in Iowa.

 

[naturalbornhawk]

East stands = vaccinated, West stands = unvaccinated?

less filling - tastes great

 

[abby97]

Lots of big words and none of its true.

The vaccine mandidate is being applied equally regardless of one's race or background. Have the vaccine your good, don't and stay home. The rule is equal across races. That means there is no discrimination.

What a subset does across an evenly applied rule is their issue and not an argument of discrimination.

You'd have to say whites and asians have to be vaccinted and blacks don't for discrimination to be in play.

Just like voter ID's aren't racist, so we agree on something.

 

[MepoDawg#]

Prove me wrong. Thus if the government pays for the vaccine then the taxpayers (we the people) pay for it.

 

[ANYCHawk]

Prove me wrong. Thus if the government pays for the vaccine then the taxpayers (we the people) pay for it.

That is the most round about stupid argument I've ever heard.

If you want to make that argument, voting is a paradox. Poll taxes are illegal, but we pay for voting machines, therefore paying poll taxes therefore making voting illegal.