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*****Official Cubs 2017 thread*****

Ultimately, a MLB team is judged by how many World
Series Championships they have won. This puts the
New York Yankees at the top of the list. They have
won 27 World Series.

The next criterion for MLB team is the number of players
who are in the Hall of Fame at Cooperstown. Great Yanks
include Babe Ruth, Lou Gehrig, Joe DiMaggio, Mickey
Mantle, Yogi Berra, Whitey Ford, and soon to be Derek
Jeter and Mariano Riveria
 
Ultimately, a MLB team is judged by how many World
Series Championships they have won. This puts the
New York Yankees at the top of the list. They have
won 27 World Series.

The next criterion for MLB team is the number of players
who are in the Hall of Fame at Cooperstown. Great Yanks
include Babe Ruth, Lou Gehrig, Joe DiMaggio, Mickey
Mantle, Yogi Berra, Whitey Ford, and soon to be Derek
Jeter and Mariano Riveria

I can understand a Cards fan or any other NL Central fan in this thread. Shoot, I could understand an NL fan in general participating.

Why do you keep spouting off about the Yankees in this thread when no one gives a shit about the AL or the Yankees.

I love you, I really do because of your awkwardness, I've read it for a long time and it's awesome. But seriously, no one reading this thread gives a crap about the Yankees outside of "blah.. Yankees, and stuff"
 
I can understand a Cards fan or any other NL Central fan in this thread. Shoot, I could understand an NL fan in general participating.

Why do you keep spouting off about the Yankees in this thread when no one gives a shit about the AL or the Yankees.

I love you, I really do because of your awkwardness, I've read it for a long time and it's awesome. But seriously, no one reading this thread gives a crap about the Yankees outside of "blah.. Yankees, and stuff"
Personally, I joined this thread after the Yanks swept the Cubs last spring. I stayed because I was enamored with the arrogance of a few Cubs fans since then.
 
I can understand a Cards fan or any other NL Central fan in this thread. Shoot, I could understand an NL fan in general participating.

Why do you keep spouting off about the Yankees in this thread when no one gives a shit about the AL or the Yankees.

I love you, I really do because of your awkwardness, I've read it for a long time and it's awesome. But seriously, no one reading this thread gives a crap about the Yankees outside of "blah.. Yankees, and stuff"
Personally, I joined this thread after the Yanks swept the Cubs last spring. I stayed because I was enamored with the arrogance of a few Cubs fans since then.
 
Every professional sport has one team with a
legendary history that enthralls people. In
MLB it happens to be the New York Yankees.
 
I assure you, the Cards are entirely capable of giving away any and all ballgames this year.

The Cardinals are a fascinating team for a roster construction standpoint. They have a strong starting rotation - no true "ace" (Martinez has the talent, just needs to put it together), but a group of very solid pitchers. The bullpen is mediocre and from a position player standpoint they basically have a league average player at every spot. They have a couple of exceptions in Carpenter, Gyorko, and Fowler, but they have nothing close to a "star" or somebody who could grow into one. But because they don't have obvious holes, they are a competitive team.

Some Cardinal folks I follow would like to see the Cards package some of their surplus of solid MiLB prospects for a dynamic, middle-of-the-order bat. They believe the Cardinals are too cheap but we're able to get away with it for awhile because they hit on all of their prospects.
 
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Enthralled Yankees fans, yeah. But since the draft was initiated, it took an owner who didn't mind spending ungodly amounts of money to keep you relevant, and ever since he died I don't believe you've won anything since.

IMHO, there's a handful of franchises that are in better shape than the Yankees are right now cause the business model of baseball has changed.

Buying a championship doesn't exactly work like it used to. You have to actually draft and develop your own talent nowadays.

And other franchises do it better than the Yanks do right now.
 
Enthralled Yankees fans, yeah. But since the draft was initiated, it took an owner who didn't mind spending ungodly amounts of money to keep you relevant, and ever since he died I don't believe you've won anything since.

IMHO, there's a handful of franchises that are in better shape than the Yankees are right now cause the business model of baseball has changed.

Buying a championship doesn't exactly work like it used to. You have to actually draft and develop your own talent nowadays.

And other franchises do it better than the Yanks do right now.

I would argue that the Yankees have changed a lot since the death of George and are doing it different now. They have a ton of youth on the roster and really good talent in the minors. They will always have some high/over priced players.
 
The Cardinals are a fascinating team for a roster construction standpoint. They have a strong starting rotation - no true "ace" (Martinez has the talent, just needs to put it together), but a group of very solid pitchers. The bullpen is mediocre and from a position player standpoint they basically have a league average player at every spot. They have a couple of exceptions in Carpenter, Gyorko, and Fowler, but they have nothing close to a "star" or somebody who could grow into one. But because they don't have obvious holes, they are a competitive team.

Some Cardinal folks I follow would like to see the Cards package some of their surplus of solid MiLB prospects for a dynamic, middle-of-the-order bat. They believe the Cardinals are too cheap but we're able to get away with it for awhile because they hit on all of their prospects.

Excellent post. Solid but average players mostly brought up through the system. The other night all 9 starters were drafted players brought up through the farm system. Wainwright ( my all time favorite Cardinals ) is adjusting his game to his age, Lynn will be gone next year, Reyes will be back from TJ surgery and Luke Weaver is tearing up AAA again. Just got the 29th best prospect from Seattle for an injury prone Gonzalez. One star would be nice in the 3 or 4 spot but we will likely trudge on the Cardinal way with our home grown team, looking for a bargain player here and there.
 
Excellent post. Solid but average players mostly brought up through the system. The other night all 9 starters were drafted players brought up through the farm system. Wainwright ( my all time favorite Cardinals ) is adjusting his game to his age, Lynn will be gone next year, Reyes will be back from TJ surgery and Luke Weaver is tearing up AAA again. Just got the 29th best prospect from Seattle for an injury prone Gonzalez. One star would be nice in the 3 or 4 spot but we will likely trudge on the Cardinal way with our home grown team, looking for a bargain player here and there.

I was born in 1984 and the best Cardinal team of my lifetime was the 2004 group, that ran into a buzzsaw in the World Series.

Only one member of their starting rotation was a homegrown Cardinal, and only 2 of the 9 players with the most plate appearances weee homegrown Cardinals.

There only perfect way to build a team is for every draft pick to max their potential, which never happens.
 
The Cardinals are a fascinating team for a roster construction standpoint. They have a strong starting rotation - no true "ace" (Martinez has the talent, just needs to put it together), but a group of very solid pitchers. The bullpen is mediocre and from a position player standpoint they basically have a league average player at every spot. They have a couple of exceptions in Carpenter, Gyorko, and Fowler, but they have nothing close to a "star" or somebody who could grow into one. But because they don't have obvious holes, they are a competitive team.

Some Cardinal folks I follow would like to see the Cards package some of their surplus of solid MiLB prospects for a dynamic, middle-of-the-order bat. They believe the Cardinals are too cheap but we're able to get away with it for awhile because they hit on all of their prospects.

I would say they are a team of mostly replacement level players, hence the basically .500 record.
 
How are we feeling about probably getting Alex Avila? The Cubs either need to find trust in Victor Caratini, or find someone who can give Willson Contreras some rest.
 
I would say they are a team of mostly replacement level players, hence the basically .500 record.

Yep. Granted, vets like Carpenter/Piscotty/Fowler aren't having good years and them not staying healthy ain't helping. But their lineup is littered with guys entirely capable of putting up a golden sombrero fairly efficiently - all youngsters too.

The Cardinals badly need their positional org guys to provide both power and contact to compete because that's the model they built. They seem to be drafting and developing guys who can mash, but (so far) lack making enough contact - or guys who make good contact but don't hit for power.

No John Jay types for the most part. And glove work skills don't seem to enter into the equation much any more. "The better power hitter plays", but they all have to hit for lots of power to make up for the lack of contact.

Grichuk, DeJong, Vogt, Bader, and now O'Neill...are all basically the same batter. They can hit the ball a country mile, but are modern day K machines who have to walk 15% to be above replacement level. None of them are remotely close to that unfortunately, though O'Neill does show so far he will take a walk more then the rest.

That's why they took O'Neill for Gonzalez, and why Seattle felt he was expendable. Seattle's betting he won't make enough contact (along with desperately needing cost controlled pitching) - and St. Louis is seeing possibly a "better Grichuk" and has a system full of pitching.

Hell, Aledmys Diaz wasn't sent down cause he wasn't hitting, he was sent down cause his power evaporated.

That 6 walk inning yesterday...haven't had a game like that all year. You can get to the Cubs setup guys by making them throw strikes (which they are not great at, but serviceable), and yesterday the Cub relievers couldn't.

But it's been rare when the Cards are actually patient enough to take advantage.
 
Yep. Granted, vets like Carpenter/Piscotty/Fowler aren't having good years and them not staying healthy ain't helping. But their lineup is littered with guys entirely capable of putting up a golden sombrero fairly efficiently - all youngsters too.

The Cardinals badly need their positional org guys to provide both power and contact to compete because that's the model they built. They seem to be drafting and developing guys who can mash, but (so far) lack making enough contact - or guys who make good contact but don't hit for power.

No John Jay types for the most part. And glove work skills don't seem to enter into the equation much any more. "The better power hitter plays", but they all have to hit for lots of power to make up for the lack of contact.

Grichuk, DeJong, Vogt, Bader, and now O'Neill...are all basically the same batter. They can hit the ball a country mile, but are modern day K machines who have to walk 15% to be above replacement level. None of them are remotely close to that unfortunately, though O'Neill does show so far he will take a walk more then the rest.

That's why they took O'Neill for Gonzalez, and why Seattle felt he was expendable. Seattle's betting he won't make enough contact (along with desperately needing cost controlled pitching) - and St. Louis is seeing possibly a "better Grichuk" and has a system full of pitching.

Hell, Aledmys Diaz wasn't sent down cause he wasn't hitting, he was sent down cause his power evaporated.

That 6 walk inning yesterday...haven't had a game like that all year. You can get to the Cubs setup guys by making them throw strikes (which they are not great at, but serviceable), and yesterday the Cub relievers couldn't.

But it's been rare when the Cards are actually patient enough to take advantage.

I think there is still hope for Diaz. What I have learned is that it is very tough to judge a player until he has two Big League seasons under his belt. Diaz certainly is not as good of a hitter as he wasn't last year, and he is not as bad of a hitter as he has been this year. The bigger question with Diaz is position. They need to move him off of shortstop as he is one of the very worst in the league. They seem set at 2B and 3B and they have an outfields logjam, so unless he hits like he did last year, I'm not sure they can afford to play him at SS.
 
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The Yankees won their last 5 World Series Rings
due to home-grown talent like Derek Jeter, Mariano
Riveria, Jorge Posada, Andy Pettitte & Bernie
Williams.

Now the Yankees have some home-grown talent in
Aaron Judge, Gary Sanchez, Luis Severino, and Greg
Bird.
 
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