Please read and advise me of your opinion.
- Thread starter HumbleP1e
- Start date
I'm thinking Tatum should investigate some of the greatest wealth building programs in the history of the United States and explain how it doesn't continue to affect black families today?
TERRY GROSS: So what was the second Roosevelt administration, New Deal-era program that created or enforced housing segregation?
RICHARD ROTHSTEIN: The second major one was the Federal Housing Administration, which was established in 1934, the year after the Public Works Administration. And the Federal Housing Administration is well known today by many people as an agency that would not insure mortgages for African-Americans. It redlined communities. That was a minor part of what the federal government - what the FHA did in order to segregate metropolitan areas.
The most important role of the Federal Housing Administration was it subsidized mass-production builders of entire subdivisions, entire suburbs. And it did so with a requirement that no homes be sold to African-Americans and that every home in these subdivisions had a clause in the deed that prohibited resale to African-Americans. So these two programs combined worked to segregate metropolitan areas in a way that they otherwise would not have been segregated. The public housing program separated African-Americans from integrated neighborhoods. The Federal Housing Administration then subsidized white families to move out of urban areas into suburbs - all-white suburbs - where African-Americans were prohibited from following.
GROSS: And in what sense were African-Americans prohibited from following whites into the suburbs?
ROTHSTEIN: They were prohibited because the developers of these suburbs got bank loans on condition that they sell no homes to African-Americans. It was a federal requirement that they get these bank loans only on condition that they not sell to African-Americans. And the Federal Housing Administration required that deeds in these homes have what we now refer to as restrictive covenants, prohibitions on resale to African-Americans.
This was not an implicit program. It was not something that was hidden in any way. It was written out in the Federal Housing Administration's manuals that they gave to underwriters who were appraising properties for possible mortgage insurance. The involvement of the Federal Housing Administration in the development of these suburbs was very open, explicit and well-known. There was nothing secret about it.
https://www.jstor.org/stable/20108708?read-now=1&seq=3#page_scan_tab_contents
Tatum could also investigate how over a million black WWII veterans were not allowed to benefit from the GI Bill in ways that white vets used to build wealth.
He won't, of course. But he should.
TERRY GROSS: So what was the second Roosevelt administration, New Deal-era program that created or enforced housing segregation?
RICHARD ROTHSTEIN: The second major one was the Federal Housing Administration, which was established in 1934, the year after the Public Works Administration. And the Federal Housing Administration is well known today by many people as an agency that would not insure mortgages for African-Americans. It redlined communities. That was a minor part of what the federal government - what the FHA did in order to segregate metropolitan areas.
The most important role of the Federal Housing Administration was it subsidized mass-production builders of entire subdivisions, entire suburbs. And it did so with a requirement that no homes be sold to African-Americans and that every home in these subdivisions had a clause in the deed that prohibited resale to African-Americans. So these two programs combined worked to segregate metropolitan areas in a way that they otherwise would not have been segregated. The public housing program separated African-Americans from integrated neighborhoods. The Federal Housing Administration then subsidized white families to move out of urban areas into suburbs - all-white suburbs - where African-Americans were prohibited from following.
GROSS: And in what sense were African-Americans prohibited from following whites into the suburbs?
ROTHSTEIN: They were prohibited because the developers of these suburbs got bank loans on condition that they sell no homes to African-Americans. It was a federal requirement that they get these bank loans only on condition that they not sell to African-Americans. And the Federal Housing Administration required that deeds in these homes have what we now refer to as restrictive covenants, prohibitions on resale to African-Americans.
This was not an implicit program. It was not something that was hidden in any way. It was written out in the Federal Housing Administration's manuals that they gave to underwriters who were appraising properties for possible mortgage insurance. The involvement of the Federal Housing Administration in the development of these suburbs was very open, explicit and well-known. There was nothing secret about it.
https://www.jstor.org/stable/20108708?read-now=1&seq=3#page_scan_tab_contents
Tatum could also investigate how over a million black WWII veterans were not allowed to benefit from the GI Bill in ways that white vets used to build wealth.
He won't, of course. But he should.
I am astounded and very pleased by your efforts.Written by a former cop who writes books, pushes podcasts and sells t-shirts and whatnot on a website pushing a conservative agenda so he can profit off of dumb white people.
Among the stupid %*%* he’s said in order to sell %*%* to white cons and to be the token black con include:
-He thinks that Trump supporters face the same kinds of oppression and discrimination that gay people do.
https://blather.io/tweet/1170027931482984448
-He says that it’s not the Republican Party that’s racist but the “evil” Democrats who denigrate white cops
https://blather.io/tweet/1158472751872524288
-He simultaneously says outlawing assault rifles won’t save any lives because laws don’t do anything AND at the same time says Alabama’s law banning abortions has saved millions of people
https://blather.io/fallacies/brandon-tatum-decide-laws-curb-behavior-doublethink-logical-fallacy-742
-Drumpf can’t be a racist because he got a lot of votes
https://blather.io/tweet/1155416312690044928
For more of this guy dumb enough to be OIT and Northern (but also smarter than them because he’s making tons of bank off of dumb Magats) see here
Greatest Hits
https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Brandon_Tatum
- He thinks celebrities shouldn't talk about politics unless they're conservatives.[2]
- He says that racism isn't even a thing anymore but the Democratic Party is the most evil and racist party in America.[3]
- He claims that laws banning guns won't curb behavior but also says that Alabama's abortionban saved millions of unborn babies.[4]
- He claims to not divide people and that everyone should be loved the same yet insists that there's a crucial difference between legal and illegal immigrants.[5]
- He claims that the Democratic Party demonizeswhite people but also claims that it is the party of the KKK. According to him, Democrats hate white people but also think that they're superior. Weird, isn't it?[6]
- He claims that taxation is theft but blames people that he doesn't like for not being victims of that same kind of "theft."[7]
- He can't decide if one should be able to criticize America without having to move somewhere else.[9]
- He's still not sure if toxic masculinity exists.[10]
- Brandon, being the free speech warrior that he is, claimed that Kathy Griffin should have been jailed for joking about beheading Trump.[11][12]
- When Harvard rescinded its admission to Kyle Kashuv for using the n-word back in 2017, Brandon was more than happy to accept an apology. But, when Democratic governor of Virginia, Ralph Northam was caught wearing blackface in the 1980s, Brandon claimed that an apology wasn't enough. If Northam was a Trump sycophant, his apology would have been accepted.[13][14]
- He's still not sure if virtue signalling works.[15]
- He claims to fully embrace the Second Amendment but claims that having a firearm is enough of a reason to be shot by the police.[16]
- He claims to support prison reform despite also claiming that innocent people (Central Park Five
) should be in prison.[17]
Uh......maybe I'm wrong, but I think pretty much everyone who pushed the "like" button on any HROT post is white.
I don't have to apologize for white privilege but I do have to acknowledge it and make an attempt to destroy aspects of structural racism.
What I refuse to do is shut up and listen. This is the most ridiculous statement to come out of recent weeks. Difficult problems only get solved by difficult conversations.
What I refuse to do is shut up and listen. This is the most ridiculous statement to come out of recent weeks. Difficult problems only get solved by difficult conversations.
You could have saved a lot of effort cutting and pasting if you'd just called him a Tom.Written by a former cop who writes books, pushes podcasts and sells t-shirts and whatnot on a website pushing a conservative agenda so he can profit off of dumb white people.
Among the stupid %*%* he’s said in order to sell %*%* to white cons and to be the token black con include:
-He thinks that Trump supporters face the same kinds of oppression and discrimination that gay people do.
https://blather.io/tweet/1170027931482984448
-He says that it’s not the Republican Party that’s racist but the “evil” Democrats who denigrate white cops
https://blather.io/tweet/1158472751872524288
-He simultaneously says outlawing assault rifles won’t save any lives because laws don’t do anything AND at the same time says Alabama’s law banning abortions has saved millions of people
https://blather.io/fallacies/brandon-tatum-decide-laws-curb-behavior-doublethink-logical-fallacy-742
-Drumpf can’t be a racist because he got a lot of votes
https://blather.io/tweet/1155416312690044928
For more of this guy dumb enough to be OIT and Northern (but also smarter than them because he’s making tons of bank off of dumb Magats) see here
Greatest Hits
https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Brandon_Tatum
- He thinks celebrities shouldn't talk about politics unless they're conservatives.[2]
- He says that racism isn't even a thing anymore but the Democratic Party is the most evil and racist party in America.[3]
- He claims that laws banning guns won't curb behavior but also says that Alabama's abortionban saved millions of unborn babies.[4]
- He claims to not divide people and that everyone should be loved the same yet insists that there's a crucial difference between legal and illegal immigrants.[5]
- He claims that the Democratic Party demonizeswhite people but also claims that it is the party of the KKK. According to him, Democrats hate white people but also think that they're superior. Weird, isn't it?[6]
- He claims that taxation is theft but blames people that he doesn't like for not being victims of that same kind of "theft."[7]
- He can't decide if one should be able to criticize America without having to move somewhere else.[9]
- He's still not sure if toxic masculinity exists.[10]
- Brandon, being the free speech warrior that he is, claimed that Kathy Griffin should have been jailed for joking about beheading Trump.[11][12]
- When Harvard rescinded its admission to Kyle Kashuv for using the n-word back in 2017, Brandon was more than happy to accept an apology. But, when Democratic governor of Virginia, Ralph Northam was caught wearing blackface in the 1980s, Brandon claimed that an apology wasn't enough. If Northam was a Trump sycophant, his apology would have been accepted.[13][14]
- He's still not sure if virtue signalling works.[15]
- He claims to fully embrace the Second Amendment but claims that having a firearm is enough of a reason to be shot by the police.[16]
- He claims to support prison reform despite also claiming that innocent people (Central Park Five
I’m not shocked that you’re too stupid to understand that someone whose current sole business/means of making money is to act as a black voice for sad white Magats MAY not exactly have a worthy unbiased opinion. He’s literally paid and makes money to say %*%* like he this.
What a lot of white people may not want to think about is this: how much their lives suck, when they had the advantages of white privilege.
I wish I could have a gig like that. But only if I still get to post truth.
I'm not ruling out the possibility that LC is paid to post his nonsense. He didn't used to be so bad. Might just be senility. Might just be he's a victim (like a lot of us) of the increasing polarization. Might be that he's absorbed so much propaganda that he believes it. Or maybe he gets paid.
I wish I could have a gig like that. But only if I still get to post truth.
No. We need to see origins of the information that comes into a feed or across our screens, especially when someone is trying to promote a dictum.
It's so stupid because the only color bankers see is green. When I was in banking we went into the packing plants and marketed to the Hispanic workers and worked hard to get referrals from Hispanic people we had already made loans to. The bank would actively seek out Hispanic people to work in their bank as tellers and, my God, the Holy Grail, a Hispanic loan officer. Realtors, lenders, everybody is after the Hispanic market because it is $$$. Redlining and discrimination, pssttt, that's BS. Some of you need to spend some time inside a bank at loan committee meetings, or sit in on hiring interviews and be a part of that process.
If anything this is an economic issue, not a race issue. Banks love making loans. Opening up new markets to a new clientele is their dream. A banks job is to sell money, that is how they make money.
I don't like the term either. To me, the bigger issue is the biases we all carry with us. We have all been treated differently at times in our lives because of the color of our skin, gender, religious beliefs, income, beauty, weight, intelligence, athletic ability, etc. Here are some examples of biases that some people have: skinny people have biases against heavy people, smart people have biases against dumb people, people of one religious belief have biases against other religions (or even different denominations of essentially the same religion), light skin people have biases against dark skin people, There is certainly a pecking order when it comes to biases. If you are white, well off and good looking, you probably have not suffered from very many biases during your life time. If you are a low income black male, you have probably experienced quite a few biases during your life time. We all need to be cognizant of the biases we carry, and how we treat others because of these biases. We need to judge people by their character, work ethic, etc. and not by their looks, wealth, etc. If you learned that well off white man was a liar, cheater, and a wife beater, and that low income black man worked hard for a living and had high morals, who would your respect more?
Or a liar. "Hey, I'VE never had a problem so it isn't a real thing!"
I'll bet he'll even tell you he has some "black friends".
LC once again displaying those reportorial chops.
That's all great and true...but at the end of the day, the hard-working, low income black man is still less likely to qualify for the kind of financial aid that a similar hard-working low income white man would receive and he's far, far, far more likely to be pulled over for no reason and suffer at the hands of the justice system than a lying, cheating, wife-beating, well off white man. That even holds true for the similarly situated white man with whom he compares. The biases are deeply embedded.
Hey, Tar. I've never experienced poverty, so I'm pretty certain it doesn't exist!
While I can believe the being pulled over part of your thoughts here, I highly, highly doubt in today's society that the highlighted bolded part is true.
But were those Hispanic and black applicants denied a conventional loan because of their skin color or because they were a bad credit risk? If a white person with the same financial history applied for the same loan, were they granted the loan or were they denied as well? Details matter.
I clicked the link, but I'm not disabling my adblocker for some BS from Forbes.
Yep, The article even says that blacks and Hispanics have lower income and worse credit. Seems like reasonable criteria to go by. I was denied a loan once. It had nothing to do with my skin color and everything to do with having no established credit.
As if white people don't judge each other. I work in an office where women are the majority. I would be fired on the spot if I said even one of the things they state daily and usually in judgement of other women in the office. I am sure sexism exists but I am not so certain it is predominantly from men any longer. Walk into any Walmart in the country and you will see on full display the finery of the white race judging each other. White people even set up Facebook sites to joke about it and it is brutal. That doesn't even count the jokes like a county fair is where you can see the people that can't afford to make it to Walmart.
People judge each other and can be dicks. That isn't going to change. You think black people aren't harsh critics of other black people?
Reveal’s analysis included all records publicly available under the Home Mortgage Disclosure Act, covering nearly every time an American tried to buy a home with a conventional mortgage in 2015 and 2016. It controlled for nine economic and social factors, including an applicant’s income, the amount of the loan, the ratio of the size of the loan to the applicant’s income and the type of lender, as well as the racial makeup and median income of the neighborhood where the person wanted to buy property.
Credit score was not included because that information is not publicly available. That’s because lenders have deflected attempts to force them to report that data to the government, arguing it would not be useful in identifying discrimination.
In an April policy paper, the American Bankers Association said reporting credit scores would be expensive and “cloud any focus” the disclosure law has in identifying discrimination. America’s largest bank, JPMorgan Chase & Co., has argued that the data should remain closed off even to academics, citing privacy concerns.
At the same time, studies have found proprietary credit score algorithms to have a discriminatory impact on borrowers of color.
The “decades-old credit scoring model” currently used “does not take into account consumer data on rent, utility, and cell phone bill payments,” Republican Sen. Tim Scott of South Carolina wrote in August, when he unveiled a bill to require the federal government to vet credit standards used for residential mortgages. “This exclusion disproportionately hurts African-Americans, Latinos, and young people who are otherwise creditworthy.”
So they use data that they know is skewed against minorities in order to deny loans and then fight to keep THAT data secret.
While I agree that things such as rent, and cell phone bills would be valuable information to use, that is not discrimination against a race. Rather it is discrimination against poor people, unless those items somehow figure into a white person's application.
Let's try this again - they use evidence THEY KNOW is skewed against minorities. And THAT evidence, they refuse to disclose.
When the researchers "controlled for nine economic and social factors, including an applicant’s income, the amount of the loan, the ratio of the size of the loan to the applicant’s income and the type of lender, as well as the racial makeup and median income of the neighborhood where the person wanted to buy property" minorities received significantly fewer loans.
The acceptance rate is not income based and it's not loan request based and it's not loan/income ratio. The denials are not "discrimination against poor people". Similar white borrowers requesting the same kinds of loans for the same kinds of houses get approved. Minorities don't.
Nope. The discrimination is due to a poor credit score, not based on color of skin. Those same formulas caused me to be denied a loan ~25 years ago.
