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Putin Murders a Major Opponent

h-hawk

HR King
Gold Member
Jan 29, 2002
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Hitler Jr strikes again.



"Moscow (CNN)Russian
opposition leader Boris Nemtsov was shot four times and killed by an
unknown assailant in central Moscow on Friday evening, a law enforcement
agency told Russian state news agency Itar Tass.
He
was deputy prime minister in the late 1990s under President Boris
Yeltsin and had been one of current President Vladimir Putin's most
vocal critics.
His death comes a day
before a large opposition rally was going to take place in Moscow.
Nemtsov, who was in his mid-50s, had been arrested several times in the
past for speaking out against the Kremlin."

CNN
 
Remember when a lot of people - especially cons - were saying they wished Obama could be more like Putin?

That Putin, he doesn't eff around. He's looking at you next, Yats.
 
Rallying around the wrong president
I've been fascinated of late by Republican praise of Russian President Vladimir Putin, but as Rachel noted on the show last night, Rudy Giuliani appears to have taken this affection to a new level. For those who can't watch clips online, here's the former mayor talking to Fox's Neil Cavuto yesterday.
GIULIANI: Putin decides what he wants to do and he does it in half a day, right? He decided he had to go to their parliament. He went to their parliament. He got permission in 15 minutes.

CAVUTO: Well, that was kind of like perfunctory.

GIULIANI: But he makes a decision and he executes it, quickly. Then everybody reacts. That's what you call a leader. President Obama, he's got to think about it. He's got to go over it again. He's got to talk to more people about it.[/QUOTE]
It's not unusual, during a time of crisis, for Americans to rally behind a president. In Giuliani's case, the trouble is the New York Republican appears to be rallying behind the wrong president[/I].

That said, it's nevertheless important to appreciate the fact that, in Giuliani's mind, the mark of an effective leader is seen in someone who acts unilaterally, invades a country, and doesn't stop to think too much about it. Real leaders, the argument goes, simply act - then watch as "everybody reacts."

But here's the follow-up question for Giuliani and other conservatives swooning over Putin: if President Obama did act that way, wouldn't you be calling him a lawless, out-of-control tyrant?
[/URL]

We've talked many times about the underlying contradictions embraced by Obama's detractors. The president's critics have presented two competing caricatures, both of which are wrong, but more importantly, both of which incongruous.

Dana Milbank picked up on the theme today.
President Obama is such a weak strongman. What's more, he is a feeble dictator and a timid tyrant.

That, at any rate, is Republicans' critique of him. With Russia's invasion of Ukraine, Obama's critics pivoted seamlessly from complaining about his overreach to fretting that he is being too cautious. Call it Operation Oxymoron.

Last Wednesday, I sat in a House hearing and listened to Republicans describe Obama exercising "unparalleled use of executive power" and operating an "uber-presidency." They accused him of acting like a "king" and a "monarch," of making the United States like a "dictatorship" or a "totalitarian government" by exercising "imperial" and "magisterial power."

But after events in Ukraine, this very tyrant was said to be so weak that it's "shocking."[/QUOTE]
Once again, the right is going to have to pick a caricature and go with it. Obama can be a power-hungry dictator, ruthlessly wielding power, or he can be a weak pushover, afraid to act. He can't be both.

For that matter, Republicans can long for an authoritarian leader, who acts without thinking or regard for consensus, or they can embrace a more deliberative style of leadership that cares about partnerships and checks and balances.

At this point, the right can't seem to make up its mind.


move along. nothing to see here
 
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Republican pundit Pat Buchanan thinks he and Russian President Vladimir Putin might be kindred spirits.
In a column published Tuesday on the conservative website TownHall.com and entitled "Is Putin One Of Us?" Buchanan praised the Russian leader's opposition to same-sex marriage and suggested it shows Putin might be a "paleoconservative."
Pat Buchanan Thinks Vladimir Putin Might Be A Conservative Hero
"In the culture war for mankind's future, is he one of us?" Buchanan wrote.
Citing statements made by the Russian leader, Buchanan wrote that it's clear Putin thinks equating "traditional marriage and same-sex marriage" is akin to equating "good with evil." Buchanan lauded the position as "moral clarity" on Putin's part.
"President Reagan once called the old Soviet Empire 'the focus of evil in the modern world.' President Putin is implying that Barack Obama's America may deserve the title in the 21st century," wrote Buchanan. "Nor is he without an argument when we reflect on America's embrace of abortion on demand, homosexual marriage, pornography, promiscuity, and the whole panoply of Hollywood values."
Buchanan went on to note Putin was not wrong in his assertion that the "new immorality" has been "imposed undemocratically" because "abortion and homosexual acts" were legalized in this country by "unelected justices."
In conclusion, Buchanan pointed to global opposition to gay rights, including the recentreinstatement of a law criminalizing gay sex in India as evidence Putin is speaking for many around the world.
"While his stance as a defender of traditional values has drawn the mockery of Western media and cultural elites, Putin is not wrong in saying that he can speak for much of mankind," Buchanan wrote.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/pat-buchanan-thinks-vladimir-putin-might-be-a-conservative-hero
 
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Giuliani sounds like the sort who would have been pro Mussolini because he made the trains run on time.
 
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Originally posted by naturalmwa:
Giuliani sounds like the sort who would have been pro Mussolini because he made the trains run on time.
You have to crack a few eggs to make an omelet.
 
Hmmmm. I wonder where our cons are. Shouldn't they be complaining about a liberal circle jerk?

Now that we've had fun at the expense of cons who lined up to moan about how effective Putin was in comparison with Obama, maybe we should think about this case.

Do we think Putin ordered this?

Do we have any idea why? Having previously served under Yeltsin hardly seems like sufficient reason to bring on the drones (or whatever was used). Speaking out against the Kremlin? If he'd been arrested for that before, why not just arrest him again? Why bother killing him.
 
Originally posted by What Would Jesus Do?:
Remember when a lot of people - especially cons - were saying they wished Obama could be more like Putin?

That Putin, he doesn't eff around. He's looking at you next, Yats.
The reason was/is that Obama is really THAT bad.
 
Originally posted by hawkbleeder:

Originally posted by What Would Jesus Do?:
Remember when a lot of people - especially cons - were saying they wished Obama could be more like Putin?

That Putin, he doesn't eff around. He's looking at you next, Yats.
The reason was/is that Obama is really THAT bad.
I see you're drinking tonight. Hyperbole is fun for all and how we roll around here, but you don't honestly think this right?
 
Originally posted by What W...us Do?:
Remember when a lot of people - especially cons - were saying they wished Obama could be more like Putin?

That Putin, he doesn't eff around.  He's looking at you next, Yats.

So the cons cast him as a hero, but you have been a Putin apologist. Funny you and the hard core cons align so closely and support the same man.

Posted from Rivals Mobile
 
Originally posted by What Would Jesus Do?:
Hmmmm. I wonder where our cons are. Shouldn't they be complaining about a liberal circle jerk?

Now that we've had fun at the expense of cons who lined up to moan about how effective Putin was in comparison with Obama, maybe we should think about this case.

Do we think Putin ordered this?

Do we have any idea why? Having previously served under Yeltsin hardly seems like sufficient reason to bring on the drones (or whatever was used). Speaking out against the Kremlin? If he'd been arrested for that before, why not just arrest him again? Why bother killing him.
If the polls are correct, Putin is very popular, in part due to standing up to the West. He is growing bolder and probably figured why bother to jail the guy again when I can just get rid of him. This is Putin's MO.

"While such contract street killings were commonplace in Moscow in the
1990s, the violence had dwindled under Mr. Putin, making the killing of
Mr. Nemtsov all the more shocking. He is by far the most prominent
public figure to die in such a fashion, though just one in a string of
murders of opponents of Mr. Putin, most notoriously the journalist Anna
Politkovskaya, the human rights researcher Natalia Estemirova and the
security service defector Aleksandr V. Litvinenko. And while low-level
criminals have been detained in some cases, the investigations in Russia
never traced back to those who ordered the murders."

Probably not a coincidence that the victim was to be at a large anti-government rally tomorrow. God I hate Putin. Why does Russia have to suffer dictator after dictator.

Boris Nemtsov Silenced
 
Originally posted by h-hawk:

Originally posted by What Would Jesus Do?:
Hmmmm. I wonder where our cons are. Shouldn't they be complaining about a liberal circle jerk?

Now that we've had fun at the expense of cons who lined up to moan about how effective Putin was in comparison with Obama, maybe we should think about this case.

Do we think Putin ordered this?

Do we have any idea why? Having previously served under Yeltsin hardly seems like sufficient reason to bring on the drones (or whatever was used). Speaking out against the Kremlin? If he'd been arrested for that before, why not just arrest him again? Why bother killing him.
If the polls are correct, Putin is very popular, in part due to standing up to the West. He is growing bolder and probably figured why bother to jail the guy again when I can just get rid of him. This is Putin's MO.

"While such contract street killings were commonplace in Moscow in the
1990s, the violence had dwindled under Mr. Putin, making the killing of
Mr. Nemtsov all the more shocking. He is by far the most prominent
public figure to die in such a fashion, though just one in a string of
murders of opponents of Mr. Putin, most notoriously the journalist Anna
Politkovskaya, the human rights researcher Natalia Estemirova and the
security service defector Aleksandr V. Litvinenko. And while low-level
criminals have been detained in some cases, the investigations in Russia
never traced back to those who ordered the murders."

Probably not a coincidence that the victim was to be at a large anti-government rally tomorrow. God I hate Putin. Why does Russia have to suffer dictator after dictator.
If someone shows up at my door or calls me and asks me if I approve of Putin's performance I'd say yes. Bad time to say no if you live in Russia.
 
The spin is that Western agents killed Nemtsov to destabilize Putin's government.
 
I have never been a fan of Putin. Couldn't the argument be made that our current administration uses similar tactics using the government instead of a gun to defeat their enemy? Using the IRS and executive orders using the government as their weapon of choice.
 
Originally posted by rocketclone:
I have never been a fan of Putin. Couldn't the argument be made that ALL[/B] administrations uses similar tactics using the government instead of a gun to defeat their enemy? Using the IRS and executive orders using the government as their weapon of choice.
fify
 
Originally posted by THE_DEVIL:

Originally posted by rocketclone:
I have never been a fan of Putin. Couldn't the argument be made that ALL[/B] administrations uses similar tactics using the government instead of a gun to defeat their enemy? Using the IRS and executive orders using the government as their weapon of choice.
fify
So try addressing what I said. Has the current administration used the IRS to attack their opponent? Used the executive order?
 
Originally posted by ricflair4LIFE:
Not to worry. He says he's looking into it.
Putin investigation - Fair and Balanced
wink.r191677.gif
 
I posted this last week, but it's particularly relevant to this discussion.

I literally can't watch this without actually laughing aloud.

Giuliani is a cancer to the US. Pat Buchanan is also a complete disaster.

The R's on Fox are truly nuts. What a disgusting group of dumb mother chuckers.

Daily SHow
 
Where is the evidence that Putin sanctioned this hit? I smell a rat. Sounds like the CIA/media is trying to whip up Boobus Americanus into a frenzy demanding a war with Russia.
 
Originally posted by rocketclone:

Originally posted by THE_DEVIL:

Originally posted by rocketclone:
I have never been a fan of Putin. Couldn't the argument be made that ALL[/B] administrations uses similar tactics using the government instead of a gun to defeat their enemy? Using the IRS and executive orders using the government as their weapon of choice.
fify
So try addressing what I said. Has the current administration used the IRS to attack their opponent? Used the executive order?
I know you will find this hard to believe, but there has been nothing close to proof that Obama had anything to do with the IRS issues. Not even anybody in his admin unless you consider abybody in the executive branch of the federal govt as his admin.
 
The IRS is under the pres control. So his folks that he appointed had nothing to do with it?
 
Originally posted by What Would Jesus Do?:
Originally posted by lucas80:
The spin is that Western agents killed Nemtsov to destabilize Putin's government.
That can't possibly be true. We never meddle in other countries.
It took a while, but you finally got there.
 
The good news is that unlike Hitler, Putin does not seem like the type to kill millions of people he doesn't like due to their religion and race. The bad news is Putin appears to want to rebuild the buffer zone of countries separating Russia from the West, believes in an inflammatory state run media that labels all those opposed to him as traitors of the state, and believes imprisoning and even murdering people to further his goals is just fine.

It is fascinating, if depressing, to see how closely Putin is following the Hitler playbook. Anyone who is curious in the details should check out the chapters on the Rhineland, Austria and Czechoslovakia in The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich written by the pride of Coe College - William L Shire.
 
Originally posted by h-hawk:
The good news is that unlike Hitler, Putin does not seem like the type to kill millions of people he doesn't like due to their religion and race. The bad news is Putin appears to want to rebuild the buffer zone of countries separating Russia from the West, believes in an inflammatory state run media that labels all those opposed to him as traitors of the state, and believes imprisoning and even murdering people to further his goals is just fine.

It is fascinating, if depressing, to see how closely Putin is following the Hitler playbook. Anyone who is curious in the details should check out the chapters on the Rhineland, Austria and Czechoslovakia in The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich written by the pride of Coe College - William L Shire.
Good comments about Putin.

Do you also check how we or some of our allies compare with the Hitler playbook?
 
Originally posted by What Would Jesus Do?:


Originally posted by h-hawk:
The good news is that unlike Hitler, Putin does not seem like the type to kill millions of people he doesn't like due to their religion and race. The bad news is Putin appears to want to rebuild the buffer zone of countries separating Russia from the West, believes in an inflammatory state run media that labels all those opposed to him as traitors of the state, and believes imprisoning and even murdering people to further his goals is just fine.

It is fascinating, if depressing, to see how closely Putin is following the Hitler playbook. Anyone who is curious in the details should check out the chapters on the Rhineland, Austria and Czechoslovakia in The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich written by the pride of Coe College - William L Shire.
Good comments about Putin.

Do you also check how we or some of our allies compare with the Hitler playbook?




Putin is closer to Stalin than Hitler. Stalin used to knock off opponents in this manner. Putin wants a return to a traditional Russian totalitarian government.

Nemtsov was a reformer. He wanted a different direction for Russia with greater liberties for the average Russian.

This is a dark time for Russia. I am sure Putin wants to rule for some time to come and will put down any thoughts otherwise.

This post was edited on 3/1 5:12 PM by wildcatdad
 
As far as the West and the Hitler Playbook - IMHO the NATO response against Putin thus far fortunately only hints at the memory of PM Chamberlain and of the disorganized French government bending over backwards to appease Hitler. It is encouraging that NATO appears to be sticking together even if it is only economic restrictions. I do think that the West has probably written off the Eastern Ukraine and Crimea. If Putin goes after more I hope NATO makes him bleed for it. (And I think we should arm the Ukraine so they can defend the rest of their country.)

Putin is probably in between Hitler and Stalin as far as expansion is concerned. Hitler wanted to take as much as possible, Putin probably wants the buffer states back, and from what I have read about WWII, for the most part Stalin was pretty much concerned with protecting what he had . Though he invaded Poland with Hitler's encouragement and then Finland without Hitler's approval. After the war of course, the USSR kept the "liberated" countries and turned them into a buffer of vassal states so the next war would not be fought on Russian soil.

What do the other WWII buffs think?
 
President Barack Obama called on Russia's government to perform a "prompt, impartial and transparent" investigation to bring the perpetrators to justice. Obama called Nemtsov a "tireless advocate" for the rights of Russian citizens.

Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko called Nemtsov a personal friend and a "bridge" between the two countries. He said on his Facebook that he hopes the killers will be punished.

Reading this leads me to believe that the west has its fingerprints all over this. Obama is not being diplomatic here and should keep his yap shut. This is none of his business. Then his newly appointed puppet in Ukraine chimes in as well. They are stirring up trouble in Russia.
 
Originally posted by h-hawk:
The good news is that unlike Hitler, Putin does not seem like the type to kill millions of people he doesn't like due to their religion and race. The bad news is Putin appears to want to rebuild the buffer zone of countries separating Russia from the West, believes in an inflammatory state run media that labels all those opposed to him as traitors of the state, and believes imprisoning and even murdering people to further his goals is just fine.

It is fascinating, if depressing, to see how closely Putin is following the Hitler playbook. Anyone who is curious in the details should check out the chapters on the Rhineland, Austria and Czechoslovakia in The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich written by the pride of Coe College - William L Shire.
The bold print is true. It was Putin the Peacemaker who staved off war in Syria when Obama and Kerry were determined to ignite war with more lies.
 
Originally posted by h-hawk:
As far as the West and the Hitler Playbook - IMHO the NATO response against Putin thus far fortunately only hints at the memory of PM Chamberlain and of the disorganized French government bending over backwards to appease Hitler. It is encouraging that NATO appears to be sticking together even if it is only economic restrictions. I do think that the West has probably written off the Eastern Ukraine and Crimea. If Putin goes after more I hope NATO makes him bleed for it. (And I think we should arm the Ukraine so they can defend the rest of their country.)

Putin is probably in between Hitler and Stalin as far as expansion is concerned. Hitler wanted to take as much as possible, Putin probably wants the buffer states back, and from what I have read about WWII, for the most part Stalin was pretty much concerned with protecting what he had . Though he invaded Poland with Hitler's encouragement and then Finland without Hitler's approval. After the war of course, the USSR kept the "liberated" countries and turned them into a buffer of vassal states so the next war would not be fought on Russian soil.

What do the other WWII buffs think?
Seeing as Obama has invaded and/or bombed 7 sovereign countries during his tenure, who do you think he most likely resembles? I'm trying to think who is worse than Stalin...then put Obama just above that guy.
 
I agree. The cons should be on here ripping Snowden for choosing Putin over Obama. Especially considering the fact that if Snowden decides to "come out", Putin will most likely have him arrested. How long before Putin takes him out?
 
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