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Recruiting the rest of 2016 and Beyond.

DanL53

HR Legend
Sep 12, 2013
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To expand on my thoughts from the Charlie Moore thread. I can understand the feeling of urgency that some have to sign a kid like Moore. I think the main point seems to be that for Iowa to keep moving up in the Big Ten we've got to start signing top players out of state. And right now there are some recruits that look like they fit that need. Cook, Huerter, Simpson, Moore, maybe Rakocevic, a couple others. Just from what appears to be the most need, point guard, and the most likely to land, Moore, we're talking about him. But this is more about all of them.

Going into the sixth season that McCaffery has been Iowa's coach, that means we've had five classes actually appear on the court that Coach Fran had a hand in recruiting. Just to name one from each class. Basabe, White, Woodbury, Jok, Uhl. Two things to notice:

1) Every single player that Rivals ranked in their top 150 came from the state of Iowa.
2) Every year the program has advanced.

Now it's great to talk about moving up. But consider this. Not a single Iowa player from Jok's class was ranked in the top 150. Nor was there one in Uhl's class. And there wasn't one in our latest class, 2015. That's three years of a pretty tough drought. Yet again, every year the program has advanced. And while one could say that Gesell, Woody, Oglesby and Uthoff have all played a significant role, haven't we had some valuable contributions from some others as well? Others that arrived as unranked three stars.

My earlier point, "But too be honest, as much as I'd love to get Moore I think this is getting a little blown up. As in, more important than it really is."

Alright, what do I mean by more important than it really is?

After the 2011/12 season we were the team that couldn't defend. An 8-10 team that finished 197th on KenPom (defense). And we fans as a group noticed.
After the 2012/13 season we were the team that couldn't shoot straight. Somehow our defense got fixed. But our offense had dropped from 35th to 51st on KenPom. (Worse still, go back and look at our shooting percentages.)
After the 2013/14 season we were the team that collapsed at the end of the year. We could win close games. And how were we going to replace our only go to guy, Marble?
After the 2014/15 season, just this very last year, we were shrinking to pint sized peons. Now the upcoming season hasn't been played, but we don't look so terribly pint sized after all.

(More coming)
 
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There's always something. Uhl's class had folks calling for an assistant to be fired. And it wasn't a stellar year but Uhl has shown good promise, Ellingson appears to be a shooter, and looking back maybe it was all those guys on the team and no spots obviously open making a difference? That, and the drought of local talent. Always something. How can we possibly replace White and Olaseni? This one gives me the happy smiley face as yes, how are we going to replace two unranked three stars when we just brought in five freshmen unranked three stars and a Juco? Why isn't anyone worrying about replacing top 150 Oglesby? (And I don't mean to pick on Josh, this is just an example of expectations and worries.)

So, this recruiting thing. Every year Iowa has improved under McCaffery. (Someday I'm bound to miss saying that, but it is the nature of college ball to sooner or later have a down year. Hopefuly not in 2015/16 but as tough as the Big Ten is, it could happen.) We've done it signing only top 150 guys from the state, and when for three years straight there were none of those! In the meantime, Iowa has slowly expanded it's influence into other recruiting markets.

So let's talk about something significant. We've owned the state. Remarkably, Pemsl, McCaffery, Wieskamp and a McCaffery again. 2016-2019 we appear to have already cornered the most likely top 150 guys in Iowa! Toss Kriener in there who may be pushing that level, probably won't get there, but all told it is pretty clear that securing Iowa has been done.

So, with all that, from this post and the first, how is it one Charlie Moore is the make or break moment in Iowa moving up another notch? Why the doubts that if we miss on him we've missed our best or only or last or whatever chance? How many times have we heard about misses in the past and shouldn't all those failures have sunk us to some terrible depth in the RPI?

But it hasn't. Because over and over the program has overcome these horrible tragedies and managed though the miracle of magic to improve. Yet no, still no top 150 kid from out of the state of Iowa.

Will it happen? Certainly. Does it need to happen? Yes, eventually, so that someday when the state is bountiful in recruits for a couple years those young men from Ohio or Siberia or Mars can come in to be part of something special.

But does it need to happen with one Charlie Moore? I'm asking, when are we going to start assuming the best, not the worst? Some folks like to think I'm overly optimistic. I don't mind that label, but how often does Iowa have to improve before I was as it turns out a realist? So it's too early to count on Williams, but not too early to label Moore a program changing point guard?

In all honesty I don't know how high McCaffery can take the Iowa program. We have certain limitations such as being a small state and suffering a lack of recent tradition. Some things we can change, others we never will. I don't know not only how high, but how often McCaffery can have us reasonably thinking, "This could be the year." I suspect it will happen about as often as those years that our state offers up special players. I guess we'll find out.

But in the meantime. I know that missing on one player is not be the end of our progression. Charlie Moore, and every other target we identify, we will get our share. We've been getting our share! 12-6 in the Big Ten last season was nothing to complain about. Any recruit, hit or miss? Yes, it's great when he hit them, but not the end of the world when we miss.

I look forward to the day that we Iowa fans can watch the recruitment of a Charlie Moore with the presumption that it would be best for him to come to Iowa, but we can succeed without him. When a Charlie Moore, should he happen to look at this site, would read about how much we want him, love to have him, but in the end if he goes elsewhere we will be the team he wishes he were on, not the team wishing he were here. ;)
 
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McCaffery clearly came in with a "get the best players out of the state EVERY year" mentality and he hasn't backed away from it. I like the strategy bc the state surprisingly produces some good BB talent but I am really am looking forward to Fran landing a couple of highly ranked out of state studs...he is on the brink and it will happen, just a matter of when.
 
In all honesty I don't know how high McCaffery can take the Iowa program. We have certain limitations such as being a small state and suffering a lack of recent tradition. Some things we can change, others we never will. I don't know not only how high, but how often McCaffery can have us reasonably thinking, "This could be the year." I suspect it will happen about as often as those years that our state offers up special players. I guess we'll find out.

. ;)
I think last year we were either:
a) One good outside shooter
or
b) One good power forward

away from being a sweet 16 team. If Mike would have been 100% boy that would have helped. He came back to play well in the ncaa tourney but he just didn't have his shot. I humbly believe that Fran can do what Ryan did for Wisconsin. Unfortunately Fran had 3 years of rebuilding to do when he got here. Bo stepped into an already good team.
 
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The beautiful thing about college basketball is that young players can contribute. If we don't land Moore, there are other big fish in the sea every year. Failing to sign Moore does NOT mean Williams is our PG for 40 mins every game for the next four years.
 
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At some point, Iowa WILL have a crappy year of producing in-state talent. At that point, we need to make sure we have in-roads to other states made and can get the recruits we need to, if not improve, then keep treading water (I'm happy with a tourney invite every year, honestly - get us the opportunity to make magic happen).

Like Dan, I'm not worried - but I want us to pop the damn cherry already and get a stud non-Iowa recruit. It'll happen - just feels like it should happen for 2016.
 
At some point, Iowa WILL have a crappy year of producing in-state talent. At that point, we need to make sure we have in-roads to other states made and can get the recruits we need to, if not improve, then keep treading water (I'm happy with a tourney invite every year, honestly - get us the opportunity to make magic happen).

Like Dan, I'm not worried - but I want us to pop the damn cherry already and get a stud non-Iowa recruit. It'll happen - just feels like it should happen for 2016.

I don't understand your premise that Iowa will have a crappy year of instate talent. Last I looked we didn't take an in state recruit in 14 or 15!

Gessel Woody and Jok are huge pieces to the team, but there was a gap of instate talent after those guys. The instate talent is actually coming down the line in 16 and beyond.
 
The instate talent is actually coming down the line in 16 and beyond.

Right - but there will be gaps again. And to maintain where we're at, we need to get ourselves more in-roads into states that have more than 3 million people. And I think Fran has done that - bigger and bigger presence in Illinois, getting there in Wisconsin and Minny, and some east-coast connections as well.
 
With Hutton and Moss, Fran has swung open the door to Chicago again and that should pay big dividends going forward whether or not he lands Charlie Moore.
 
With Hutton and Moss, Fran has swung open the door to Chicago again and that should pay big dividends going forward whether or not he lands Charlie Moore.

Yeah, that Illinois pipeline is probably the biggest thing to happen to Iowa BB recruiting in a while. And with a stud like Wieskamp coming in down the road (along with C and P Mac, also high-end recruits), we can make actual promises that the higher-end recruits won't be on an island if they do decide to come here. Great stuff.
 
Yeah, that Illinois pipeline is probably the biggest thing to happen to Iowa BB recruiting in a while. And with a stud like Wieskamp coming in down the road (along with C and P Mac, also high-end recruits), we can make actual promises that the higher-end recruits won't be on an island if they do decide to come here. Great stuff.
This year's class made some significant progress getting some talent from some great out-of-state HS teams. Moore would appear to be just what the doctor ordered along with Cook, but neither are must haves. I do think we need a quality PG and another big in the class to give Fran a complete arsenal to work with, but they don't have to be named Moore and Cook. I think the curtain cracked open last year in Chicago, and I think we have a great shot at Moore. We are also right there with Cook. The future would sure look bright if they both chose wisely.:)
 
Following recruiting is fun but frustrating because inevitably you lose out more often than you land one. Looking back at the Fran era if you rely on recruiting rankings then you have wonder how the heck iowa has managed to have the success it has. Maybe because Fran and his staff can coach a little bit? Maybe the rankings and stars are a very inexact science? We all want the big out of state recruit and I am extremely hopeful we land Cook and Moore. If we do the expectations for the next several years will go through the roof. That may be unfair but I think Fran is up to the challenge. I mostly just follow recruiting on this board but each time we "lose" a recruit Fran seems to have a back up. When the recruit last year to Indiana (forgot the name) then we get Moss.. Dale Jones seemed to pop up out of nowhere last spring. So after the Sept 19 Pitt game I will be checking here and Twitter hoping for commitments from those two, if it doesn't happen it doesn't mean a step backwards. I don't think anyone, even Fran detractors, will say he won't keep working extremely hard to get the next on his list.
 
Great post Jumpshot! If there were a Casino in Vegas that had a game where you evaluate the basketball talent, and all that comes with it? Winner take all? Fran would make a fortune. He's brought Iowa back into competitive basketball in the Big Ten not by flashy, and questionable, star recruits. But by working hard to find and get, guys that want to play at Iowa and can play for McCaffery.
 
Moss was a four star by ESPN. And Tyler Cook would be a heck of a get. Jon Rothstein would say so much Montrezl Harrell in Tyler Cook. Wieskamp is a special player. A lot to like about the future at Iowa.
 
Following recruiting is fun but frustrating because inevitably you lose out more often than you land one. Looking back at the Fran era if you rely on recruiting rankings then you have wonder how the heck iowa has managed to have the success it has. Maybe because Fran and his staff can coach a little bit? Maybe the rankings and stars are a very inexact science? We all want the big out of state recruit and I am extremely hopeful we land Cook and Moore. If we do the expectations for the next several years will go through the roof. That may be unfair but I think Fran is up to the challenge. I mostly just follow recruiting on this board but each time we "lose" a recruit Fran seems to have a back up. When the recruit last year to Indiana (forgot the name) then we get Moss.. Dale Jones seemed to pop up out of nowhere last spring. So after the Sept 19 Pitt game I will be checking here and Twitter hoping for commitments from those two, if it doesn't happen it doesn't mean a step backwards. I don't think anyone, even Fran detractors, will say he won't keep working extremely hard to get the next on his list.


I think Iowa's talent is a little of both Fran's being able to evaluate players, and his great coaching. You gotta love it so far. And the talent levelvet will only get better now that we are on the map.

Are both Moore and Cook visiting on the 19th?
 
Starting to recruit Chicago is big.

Now the next step is to be consistently in the top of the Big Ten and the buzz that goes with that in the national and regional press.

Then finally to start winning a few games in the NCAA 's ... With the assumption we will be there each year.

Then a 4-Star will start to fall our way every year.
 
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