RECRUITING
- Thread starter chuck285
- Start date
Makes sense. What's odd is in high school I had a buddy who parents worked for Simpson, there was a long list of Schools he could go to for free, including a Syracuse for example. But Iowa, UNI and ISU were not. Must be a private college vs a state board of regents thing.
As far as Nelson, Luckily Terry is the highest ast paid coach. If he cant pay for his kid on what he is making now, he needs a new contract to raise his base salary to whatever is needed to get around Nelson ever counting towards 9.9.
It's virtually certain that some do. Academic scholarships are granted in denominations as small as 1500 (for example only as it varies by institution) and can reach up to full tuition. I'm sure we have kids that qualify for some level of academic scholarship. HS grades and ACT/SAT scores don't have to be spectacular to qualify for some academic scholarship and we have plenty of good students on the team.
First off there are hundreds of ways to help pay off ones student loans so that the NCAA would never know. Jobs that pay far more than they should would be one example.
Second, I stated that I was just using Nevils as an example. I have no idea how much scholarship money he gets or if his family is wealthy or poor.
First off, I am going to assume that you know that some of the things that you hear are true, and that you realize that this kind of thing happens at our universities all over this country every year, usually in other sports.
Secondly, I am going to assume that you are smart enough to understand that people talk, to other people and friends that are outside your little click in Happy Valley.
Third, I don't go to the bars in Iowa City.
Do I have proof that it is happening? No. Have I heard that it is and has, and is being looked into by the NCAA? Yes.
Okay, you wouldn't answer my first question, so how about this one? How many degrees of separation are there between a supposed NCAA snitch and you? Here, it can look like this:
- NCAA Employee
- Friend of NCAA employee
- Another friend of an NCAA employee
- An Iowa City bartender
- A drunk, disgruntled Hawkeye fan at midnight on Saturday.
- WEH8ST8HAWK
You seem kinda sensitive about this issue.
Let's see, am I sensitive when teams/programs/people/issues that I support are undermined by people spreading rumors and innuendo about those things? Yeah, I guess I am. WEH8ST8 has nothing but "whisper around the valley" BS that he has yet to substantiate, so if asking him to verify his sources is being sensitive, then, yes, I'm sensitive.
4.5. Thai Massage therapist who not only has a Kung Fu like grip but is a huge fan of college wrestling. Either that or she was saying to eat Kale heated.
You see, if that bit of information was mentioned at the moment of the happy ending, you could see how one's recollection of it might be skewed. (No offense to all of the Thai licensed massage therapists who are only on the up and up.)
Well that will certainly hurt his feelings.
Holy cow. I thought there were some sensitive people over on BWI, but this one takes the cake for all of the ignores I have ever received on any board, plus Twitter. Wasn't directed at him, wasn't ad hominem, the strongest language that was used was "BS." I don't get it.
I don't agree with the rumors or whatever...lacking any proof or credible word from someone I know,how could I? Just for sour grapes?
Something you Penn Staties need to get used to, though, is that that success will always bring detractors and rumors of cheating. It's a message board. Now, can we get back to discussing how Gilman is Satan's son and how Iowa guys don't have personality and are robots who don't have fun?
Lol, undermined. Because if anything is going to undermine the Penn State wrestling program, it's this message board. Fricking cess pool I tell ya.
That's an interesting scenario, especially considering the 3-yr audit of PSU Athletics recently conducted by Sen. Mitchell.
It isn't against the rules so why would it even have been on the radar?
I'm not one to call it a loop hole. I think it is just so tough to enforce, as several have mentioned, it's legal. More power to PSU for having the resources to get this done.
If boosters from any school. Ok. St., PS, Iowa or any other were to provide any inducement to encourage or actually have a recruit sign it is not a loop hole it is a violation of NCCA regulations. Thoes inducements could be immediate or future promises, doesn't matter. Boosters are considered just as liable as are members of the schools athletic or academic community. I am in no way saying any schools is doing anything to violate NCAA rules at this time because I have no first hand knowledge of it being done. Just saying it would be a violation.
So, because I should get used to it means I should just overlook it and move on, without calling out the perp? I'll look to you guys for advice and guidance on how to do that, because many of you do it so well. Do you have any mentors in mind?
Also, I have made ZERO negative comments about Gilman on any of the sites that I frequent this year. I probably made one on his duals body slam last year, but absolutely nothing this year.
You see, it's that kind of friendly attitude that might convince me to stay, so we can discuss wrestling. Thanks!
So, because I should get used to it means I should just overlook it and move on, without calling out the perp? I'll look to you guys for advice and guidance on how to do that, because many of you do it so well. Do you have any mentors in mind?
Also, I have made ZERO negative comments about Gilman on any of the sites that I frequent this year. I probably made one on his duals body slam last year, but absolutely nothing this year.
The Gilman and Iowa robot thing has been a narrative for a long time coming from your fan (and others). Metcalf to Ramos to Gilman, bad sports blah, blah, blah...the robot thing is funny because there are a lot of diverse personalities at Iowa...You have Gilman and then Sammy Brooks. So no, just speaking to how narratives get built by opposing fan bases...it's going to happen whether you like it or not. You can come on here and piss in the wind answering multiple posts or say your piece and move on. I have learned that as well.
I guess my point is that I think the coach from Bucknell got suspended for violations. No thread on here because who gives a damn about Bucknell? Like it or not, PSU is the beauty queen everybody wants to call fat. Imo, it's rationalizing but what the hell do I know.
I kinda think it's primarily the Hawk nation that is fixated on the measurements of the Lions.
Gotta be honest, I don't know that I've heard the robot thing. Gilman's antics, yes, but not robot. I'll have to pay closer attention.
I also hadn't heard about Wirnsberger. That hits close to home, as I live in Lewisburg, he has kids in our youth program, yada, yada. Not the first time Bucknell has been in trouble. Last time involved recruitment of Mike Garcia, whose kid now goes to a local HS, and is an absolute stud.
So, yeah, I'll probably say my piece and move back into the shadows, lurking. Funny thing is, I'll guarantee that if we all met up over a beer this conversation would have a completely different flavor. WEH8ST8 would make his comment, I'd tell him he's full of shit, you'd have some philosophical wisecrack and wasdt would stew over in a corner because he thinks nobody from PSU can be as nice of a guy as I am.
I mispoke when it came to specific coaches kids. I shouldn't have used any concrete examples. I said I didn't know each schools financial situation, just that it was well within the rules for a Coach's kid to get tuition assistance that would not count against schlorship limits so long as that same benefit was offered to all like employees. I caused some confusion there when I did not mean to. That was my mistake and I wanted to clarify that I did not know how each of those indivbidual schools handle those situations, but that it wouldn't be against the rules if those kids didn't have to pay tuition.
As for the organization's that are supporting the sport helping athletes during grey shirt and red shirt seasons. That is a situation that has come up and Cael has been asked about it. I said PSU is not breaking the rules. However, the rules are going to change. I can elaborate on that situation, but all you really have to do is ask any PSU wrestling booster, it gets brought up all the time. GoFundMe accounts and the like have never been addressed directly by the NCAA. They will be.
I stated I didn't know how any of those schools currently handle tuition assistance for employees. That was my mistake as I made it seem like I was using concrete examples of what was actually happening. I didn't mean to cause that confusion. I was merely trying to say that all three of those kids could go to school and pay no tuition and it would not be a violation of any rules.
I was informed of Ohio State's policy that was at one point negotiated into a certain union contract for some University employees and at another time they had a system where employees earned credits over time. I don't know their current system. I said I had no information on what benefits existed at OU or OSU. However, was told by a couple people that some benefits did exist at both schools. I said whatever they are, they are not secret and a quick call to human resources at any of the schools would easily find out the specifics.
Again, I misspoke on that element and didn't mean to.
Boosters are not "supporting" the sport if they are in any way providing financial assistence to a college athlete. Either as an inducement to enroll or as help after enrollment. When living out of state and considered a booster could not even have an athlete over to watch a game if we were recruiting him. Pretty sure GOFUNFME accounts dont have to be addressed directly to be in violation if financial assistence is provided in any way. Just a matter if the school/booster is caught or not.
Woah! That is not what I meant at all. That would 100% be a violation and a major one. What I was talking about refers to athletes that are competing and training while not using up their eligibility. I most often hear it called "grey shirting" as opposed to a "red shirt" where the athletes 5 year service clock has started during a red shirt season. So, we have two different situations and two different sets of rules and benefits to consider. I don't want to write a novel, but I also want to be much more clear as people went in a much different direction than I was referring to.
So, the issue that has come up, is that some "Grey Shirts" have received some assistance during their "Grey Shirt" season in order to help them get to open tournaments. This includes transportation, tournament fees, gear, really anything that an athletes competing for Penn State during one of their years during their 5 year window of service time would not have to worry about as the wrestling program would cover those expenses. Well, some organizations have formed and collected money, volunteers, and other resources to help wrestling tournaments or to help the sport grow by helping get more athletes out competing. Those organizations have then made contributions to help those athletes, It is a fine line between an impermissible benefit and a completely legal one. This was ruled completely legal for the time being so long as it is not coordinated by anyone involved with the program in any way shape or form and that includes boosters. It is a very slippery slope though.
Then you have rules for when an athletes is on red shirt and competing and a similiar situation for someone who is competing in different styles such as Freestyle or Greco during the off season. The questions regarding this seems to center around GoFundMe accounts being created and people donating to help someone compete. Without PSU being involved and the athletes never getting any money. Again, very fine lines. However, nothing that anyone at PSU has done (that is talked about in public at least) is a violation. Some people think it absolutely should be a violation though.
I didn't go into a tremendous amount of detail originally because I am not privileged to all of the transactions that have taken place and exactly how they were permitted under the existing rules. However, what I do know is that some rules are going to be changing to address some of these situations that have occurred. I am not making wild accusations.
If there is beer involved, than there would be a lot of philosophical wisecracks.
X amount of minutes I'll never get back................ but let me summarize this thread for those who came in late as I did.
Nobody knows jack shit about anything relative to Scholarships, Title IX, loopholes, in-state or out of state tuition, employee's children discounts or potential NCAA violations.
There you go. You're welcome.
Nobody knows jack shit about anything relative to Scholarships, Title IX, loopholes, in-state or out of state tuition, employee's children discounts or potential NCAA violations.
There you go. You're welcome.
That s where the idea of this being a loophole comes up. Organizations that support a sport can assist in making events in that sport happen. That can be financial support for a wrestler to travel somewhere to compete. If a booster provided that it is a clear violation. Wrestling teams are limited in what they are allowed to contribute to backups and red shirting wrestlers going to opens and in many cases that is nothing. So, a red shirting athlete or a backup wrestler has to foot the bill themselves, including transportation, just to go get some matches. That is a major reason why we see many of the no starters get very few matches.
You were close, but you forgot the "Penn State fans are sensitive assholes" part. But, I ain't mad.
Now, wasdt, I know, deep down, you're a nice guy, too. You have this outer shell of meanness and bravado, but ultimately, you're just a big teddy bear on the inside. Heck, over beers, you might even crack a smile, assuming your facial muscles can still move in that direction. I'll make a joke about a mutual enemy, Minnesota, for example, and them wrestling really relaxed this season, and you won't be able to help yourself.
The term booster covers a broad class of people. Anyone who is a fan of a school is a booster in the eyes of the NCAA. As long as a booster provides a benefit to all potential wrestlers, such as a travel van to a tourney open to anyone to ride, then it is not a specific benefit to one school, but one that supports the sport in general. Is that what you are getting at? I don't see a problem with that scenario as long as it is non specific benefits.
