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RFK Jr.’s Prescription for Bird Flu on Farms: Let It Spread

Morrison71

HB Legend
Nov 10, 2006
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Robert F. Kennedy Jr., the nation's top health official, has an unorthodox idea for tackling the bird flu bedeviling U.S. poultry farms. Let the virus rip.

Instead of culling birds when the infection is discovered, farmers "should consider maybe the possibility of letting it run through the flock so that we can identify the birds, and preserve the birds, that are immune to it," Mr. Kennedy said recently on Fox News.

He has repeated the idea in other interviews on the channel.

Mr. Kennedy does not have jurisdiction over farms. But Brooke Rollins, the agriculture secretary, also has voiced support for the notion.

"There are some farmers that are out there that are willing to really try this on a pilot as we build the safe perimeter around them to see if there is a way forward with immunity," Ms. Rollins told Fox News last month.

Yet veterinary scientists said letting the virus sweep through poultry flocks unchecked would be inhumane and dangerous, and have enormous economic consequences.

"That's a really terrible idea, for any one of a number of reasons," said Dr. Gail Hansen, a former state veterinarian for Kansas.

Since January 2022, there have been more than 1,600 outbreaks reported on farms and backyard flocks, occurring in every state. More than 166 million birds have been affected.

Every infection is another opportunity for the virus, called H5N1, to evolve into a more virulent form. Geneticists have been tracking its mutations closely; so far, the virus has not developed the ability to spread among people.

But if H5N1 were to be allowed to run through a flock of five million birds, "that's literally five million chances for that virus to replicate or to mutate," Dr. Hansen said.

Large numbers of infected birds are likely to transmit massive amounts of the virus, putting farm workers and other animals at great risk.

"So now you're setting yourself up for bad things to happen," Dr. Hansen said. "It's a recipe for disaster."
 
H5N1 and H9N7 (both circulating now) have >10% and up to 50% mortality rates.

So, Covid will have looked like a Disney Trip if those take hold and RFK has "banned" mRNA vaccine development.
Moderna and Pfizer could probably get a vaccine tested w/in 6 months with even modest government support.

If RFK "bans" them, then the US literally won't have vaccines; Moderna and Pfizer will develop them for Canada. And you'll have millions of Americans driving to Toronto and Montreal to access them.
 
I have no issues with running studies on the idea to see if it is a successful method. I would also like to see studies run on flocks that get vaccinated for this flu (and with the mRNA vaccines, we can do this quickly enough now). Then let's compare the results. Also, when the "Let them die!" group loses 80% of the flock, I would also like to see a study on the economic impact that would have if it were to become policy.
 
I have no issues with running studies on the idea to see if it is a successful method. I would also like to see studies run on flocks that get vaccinated for this flu (and with the mRNA vaccines, we can do this quickly enough now). Then let's compare the results. Also, when the "Let them die!" group loses 80% of the flock, I would also like to see a study on the economic impact that would have if it were to become policy.
This would be devastating to export markets. Foreign buyers like the quality of US birds. If you send them diseased ones the market will suffer.
 
I have no issues with running studies on the idea to see if it is a successful method. I would also like to see studies run on flocks that get vaccinated for this flu (and with the mRNA vaccines, we can do this quickly enough now). Then let's compare the results. Also, when the "Let them die!" group loses 80% of the flock, I would also like to see a study on the economic impact that would have if it were to become policy.
Your idea will never work because it takes too much of a common-sense and truly scientific approach.

It’s 2025 and all thought and decisions are strictly binary!!! No independent thought or ideas of compromise!!!

Instead of letting the virus spread in a broad, controlled experiment to see if allowing mutations to occur (which gradually weaken) and allow for identification of immune responses - we just need to kill them all ok!!!

Screw your well thought out and overly scientific idea!!!
 
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Instead of letting the virus spread in a broad, controlled experiment to see if allowing mutations to occur (which gradually weaken)

Not how viruses work.

Literally HOW pandemics begin, with more chances to mutate into something more lethal.
If your premise were correct here, flu, Covid and every other virus would have "mutated" into something weaker over time, and fully disappeared.
 
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The idiots learned nothing from covid re: fresh air and sunshine.

Nope. Just keep euthanizing; that's the way to kill off the Chicken Sniffles.




2005?

Your link literally STATES THE OPPOSITE


THE Agriculture Department is discussing the possibility that poultry raised outdoors -- pasture-raised, free-range or organic -- would have to be confined indoors if the avian flu makes its way to the United States
 

Robert F. Kennedy Jr., the nation's top health official, has an unorthodox idea for tackling the bird flu bedeviling U.S. poultry farms. Let the virus rip.

Instead of culling birds when the infection is discovered, farmers "should consider maybe the possibility of letting it run through the flock so that we can identify the birds, and preserve the birds, that are immune to it," Mr. Kennedy said recently on Fox News.

He has repeated the idea in other interviews on the channel.

Mr. Kennedy does not have jurisdiction over farms. But Brooke Rollins, the agriculture secretary, also has voiced support for the notion.

"There are some farmers that are out there that are willing to really try this on a pilot as we build the safe perimeter around them to see if there is a way forward with immunity," Ms. Rollins told Fox News last month.

Yet veterinary scientists said letting the virus sweep through poultry flocks unchecked would be inhumane and dangerous, and have enormous economic consequences.

"That's a really terrible idea, for any one of a number of reasons," said Dr. Gail Hansen, a former state veterinarian for Kansas.

Since January 2022, there have been more than 1,600 outbreaks reported on farms and backyard flocks, occurring in every state. More than 166 million birds have been affected.

Every infection is another opportunity for the virus, called H5N1, to evolve into a more virulent form. Geneticists have been tracking its mutations closely; so far, the virus has not developed the ability to spread among people.

But if H5N1 were to be allowed to run through a flock of five million birds, "that's literally five million chances for that virus to replicate or to mutate," Dr. Hansen said.

Large numbers of infected birds are likely to transmit massive amounts of the virus, putting farm workers and other animals at great risk.

"So now you're setting yourself up for bad things to happen," Dr. Hansen said. "It's a recipe for disaster."
"Yet veterinary scientists said letting the virus sweep through poultry flocks unchecked would be inhumane and dangerous, and have enormous economic consequences."

1 - It's more humane to put healthy birds to death?
2 - It's not having economic consequences now?
3 - We tried it before so we know?
 
"Yet veterinary scientists said letting the virus sweep through poultry flocks unchecked would be inhumane and dangerous, and have enormous economic consequences."

1 - It's more humane to put healthy birds to death?

Yes.

It prevents spread to other nearby flocks, so they can start rebuilding immediately.
"letting it spread" can take weeks and allows the virus to continue mutating.

You cull flocks immediately, and whatever strains showed up can be contained/eliminated.

The idea was quickly bashed by experts, who noted it would be inhumane, a massive risk for farm workers, and worsen the economic hit to farmers, who would have to keep facilities closed down longer for the infection to spread naturally than if they quickly carried out controlled culls. Moreover, letting the virus spread uncontrollably in thousands or even millions of birds gives the virus countless opportunities to evolve and become more virulent.
Such a scenario is suspected to have happened recently at a poultry farm in Mississippi. This week, the USDA announced finding a new type of bird flu in a broiler chicken breeder flock: a highly pathogenic avian influenza H7N9. So far, the H7 strains seen circulating in wild birds this year have been low in pathogenicity, the USDA reported. But in the 46,000-bird flock in Mississippi, the virus was lethal. Experts told the LA Times that it's likely that the previously mild virus spread from wild birds into the breeder flock—which live much longer than birds grown for meat—and, over some time, the virus developed deadly features while preying on the captive poultry.
 
2005?

Your link literally STATES THE OPPOSITE


THE Agriculture Department is discussing the possibility that poultry raised outdoors -- pasture-raised, free-range or organic -- would have to be confined indoors if the avian flu makes its way to the United States
The video demonstrated the idiocy of 'our' government, which evidently learned nothing from covid-era stupidity.

The NYT article demonstrated how far back this idiocy goes; imagine thinking it's healthier for birds to be shoo-shooed inside instead of getting fresh air, food and sunshine. That was the same idiotic approach taken during covid.

To be expected from a covidiot.
 
Not how viruses work.

Literally HOW pandemics begin, with more chances to mutate into something more lethal.
If your premise were correct here, flu, Covid and every other virus would have "mutated" into something weaker over time, and fully disappeared.
Mutation never adds new genetic material. It only is a degradation of existing genetic material. A mutation may present a new challenge that can cause harm but eventually it wanes.

Therefore, as time goes on, it eventually produces only a weaker virus.

Exactly what we are seeing with COVID.
 
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Mutation never adds new genetic material.

LOLWUT?
My GOD you people are ****ing science illiterate!!!

For flu, it absolutely does. Flu strains exchange genetic material as part of their mutation processes. It's called "reassortment".


Influenza viruses, which have a segmented RNA genome, can exchange genetic material through a process called reassortment, where different strains coinfect a cell and combine their RNA segments, leading to new virus strains.

Here's a more detailed explanation:

  • Segmented Genome:
    Unlike viruses with a single DNA or RNA molecule, influenza viruses have a genome made up of eight separate RNA segments.
  • Reassortment:
    When a cell is infected with two different influenza strains, the viral RNA segments can mix and match during the assembly of new viruses.

  • New Strains:
    This reassortment can result in new strains with a combination of genes from both parental viruses, potentially leading to viruses with new characteristics, including increased virulence or the ability to infect new hosts.

  • Antigenic Shift:
    Reassortment is a major cause of "antigenic shift," a sudden, large change in the influenza virus that can lead to pandemics.

  • Examples:
    The 1957 "Asian flu" and 1968 "Hong Kong flu" pandemics were caused by reassortment between avian and human influenza viruses.

  • Evolutionary Significance:
    Reassortment is a key driver of influenza virus evolution and adaptation, allowing the virus to rapidly diversify and evade the human immune system.
  • Reassortment vs. Drift:
    While reassortment is a rapid change, influenza viruses also evolve more slowly through mutations, a process called "antigenic drift".
 
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Oh goodie, we’re racing towards another pandemic. I was wondering when things were going to get exciting again

Yup

Literally just need a couple workers infected with a regular flu strain to get exposed to, and infected by a bird flu variant in one of RFK's "virus farm labs".

Re-assortment gets you a combo-flu that will spread among humans, and have all the exceptional mortality rates of bird flu (10% to 50% mortality per past examples). It'll make Covid look like a Disney vacation.
 
LOLWUT?
My GOD you people are ****ing science illiterate!!!

For flu, it absolutely does. Flu strains exchange genetic material as part of their mutation processes. It's called "reassortment".


Influenza viruses, which have a segmented RNA genome, can exchange genetic material through a process called reassortment, where different strains coinfect a cell and combine their RNA segments, leading to new virus strains.

Here's a more detailed explanation:

  • Segmented Genome:
    Unlike viruses with a single DNA or RNA molecule, influenza viruses have a genome made up of eight separate RNA segments.
  • Reassortment:
    When a cell is infected with two different influenza strains, the viral RNA segments can mix and match during the assembly of new viruses.
  • New Strains:
    This reassortment can result in new strains with a combination of genes from both parental viruses, potentially leading to viruses with new characteristics, including increased virulence or the ability to infect new hosts.
  • Antigenic Shift:
    Reassortment is a major cause of "antigenic shift," a sudden, large change in the influenza virus that can lead to pandemics.
  • Examples:
    The 1957 "Asian flu" and 1968 "Hong Kong flu" pandemics were caused by reassortment between avian and human influenza viruses.
  • Evolutionary Significance:
    Reassortment is a key driver of influenza virus evolution and adaptation, allowing the virus to rapidly diversify and evade the human immune system.
  • Reassortment vs. Drift:
    While reassortment is a rapid change, influenza viruses also evolve more slowly through mutations, a process called "antigenic drift".
Correct, viruses cannot create new genetic information. They can mix all day long but eventually, there is only so much information to mix with. The combinations are huge but not infinite.
 
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Correct, viruses cannot create new genetic information. They can mix all day long

FALSE

They ALSO can mutate and "create new genetic information"

But the "mixing" is where the large majority of the risk is.
All you need is a cell infected with a transmissable flu, and a highly lethal bird flu variant.

Literally WHY you want to cull herds of chickens infected, before that H5N1 flu can encounter a human version.
 
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Your idea will never work because it takes too much of a common-sense and truly scientific approach.

It’s 2025 and all thought and decisions are strictly binary!!! No independent thought or ideas of compromise!!!

Instead of letting the virus spread in a broad, controlled experiment to see if allowing mutations to occur (which gradually weaken) and allow for identification of immune responses - we just need to kill them all ok!!!

Screw your well thought out and overly scientific idea!!!
The only 'benefits' of culling are short term; it leads to genetically susceptible birds, higher overall mortality and elevated virulence of various influenzas.

'Unculled' flocks evolve genetic resistance that makes them hardier and more able to respond to re-emerging flus.

Don't expect the government to ever figure this out.
 
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Robert F. Kennedy Jr., the nation's top health official, has an unorthodox idea for tackling the bird flu bedeviling U.S. poultry farms. Let the virus rip.

Instead of culling birds when the infection is discovered, farmers "should consider maybe the possibility of letting it run through the flock so that we can identify the birds, and preserve the birds, that are immune to it," Mr. Kennedy said recently on Fox News.

He has repeated the idea in other interviews on the channel.

Mr. Kennedy does not have jurisdiction over farms. But Brooke Rollins, the agriculture secretary, also has voiced support for the notion.

"There are some farmers that are out there that are willing to really try this on a pilot as we build the safe perimeter around them to see if there is a way forward with immunity," Ms. Rollins told Fox News last month.

Yet veterinary scientists said letting the virus sweep through poultry flocks unchecked would be inhumane and dangerous, and have enormous economic consequences.

"That's a really terrible idea, for any one of a number of reasons," said Dr. Gail Hansen, a former state veterinarian for Kansas.

Since January 2022, there have been more than 1,600 outbreaks reported on farms and backyard flocks, occurring in every state. More than 166 million birds have been affected.

Every infection is another opportunity for the virus, called H5N1, to evolve into a more virulent form. Geneticists have been tracking its mutations closely; so far, the virus has not developed the ability to spread among people.

But if H5N1 were to be allowed to run through a flock of five million birds, "that's literally five million chances for that virus to replicate or to mutate," Dr. Hansen said.

Large numbers of infected birds are likely to transmit massive amounts of the virus, putting farm workers and other animals at great risk.

"So now you're setting yourself up for bad things to happen," Dr. Hansen said. "It's a recipe for disaster."
They really missed the boat by not naming it H3N1
 
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FALSE

They ALSO can mutate and "create new genetic information"

But the "mixing" is where the large majority of the risk is.
All you need is a cell infected with a transmissable flu, and a highly lethal bird flu variant.

Literally WHY you want to cull herds of chickens infected, before that H5N1 flu can encounter a human version.
Viruses can’t create on their own. Viruses can mix & mingle to combine information but they cannot create new genetic information.
 
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but they cannot create new genetic information.
They sure can, through mutations.

But the risks at poultry farms (at least for humans) are an H5N1 variant mixing with a regular human flu virus.
And the longer you keep infected chickens alive that are around humans, the higher those risks get.

You seem to want to quadruple down on the stupids here.
 
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Sooooooooooooo...there are "some farmers" out there that want to try this, huh? Well, hell...sounds good enough for us!

Ladies and Gentlemen, I present to you Robert F. Kennedy, Donald Trump's choice as the United States Secretary of Health and Human Services. Our nation's "top health official" - with his no doubt vast expertise at dealing with the serious and complicated medical issues facing this nation and it's 300+ million people residing in it...

...his advice here is to do absolutely, positively nothing about it.
 
Guess which 'scientist' said these things:

"The surveillance is going to be so intense that it is very unlikely that there is going to be the type of situation we see everywhere from Nigeria to Indonesia." (he said, regarding avian flu).

"American poultry farmers keep birds isolated, reducing the potential for them to have contact with wild birds. In addition, Americans generally have less contact with poultry or their droppings. Backyard poultry is far less common in the United States than in many of the countries battling avian flu, such as Indonesia."

(He) likened the US poultry system's security to that in Europe. In Western Europe, H5N1-positive wild birds have been found in multiple countries over several months, but the virus has struck only a couple of poultry farms—one in France and one Germany.

In the United States... "It won't be what you see in countries in which there is no regulation, in which there is no incentive to compensate farmers, in which the people, who are so poor, when they see their chickens are getting infected they immediately sell them or they don't tell anybody because they don't want them culled."
(He) also said the avian flu virus is not likely to change very quickly into a form that it can spread quickly from person to person, potentially sparking a pandemic, according to the AP. Acquiring this ability will require a series of genetic changes, which could make the virus less virulent.

"It is entirely conceivable that this virus is inherently programmed that it will never be able to go efficiently from human to human," he was quoted as saying. "Hopefully the epidemic (in birds) will burn itself out, which epidemics do, before the virus evolves the capability of being more efficient in going from human to human."
 
Guess which 'scientist' said these things:

"The surveillance is going to be so intense that it is very unlikely that there is going to be the type of situation we see everywhere from Nigeria to Indonesia." (he said, regarding avian flu).

"American poultry farmers keep birds isolated, reducing the potential for them to have contact with wild birds. In addition, Americans generally have less contact with poultry or their droppings. Backyard poultry is far less common in the United States than in many of the countries battling avian flu, such as Indonesia."

(He) likened the US poultry system's security to that in Europe. In Western Europe, H5N1-positive wild birds have been found in multiple countries over several months, but the virus has struck only a couple of poultry farms—one in France and one Germany.

In the United States... "It won't be what you see in countries in which there is no regulation, in which there is no incentive to compensate farmers, in which the people, who are so poor, when they see their chickens are getting infected they immediately sell them or they don't tell anybody because they don't want them culled."
(He) also said the avian flu virus is not likely to change very quickly into a form that it can spread quickly from person to person, potentially sparking a pandemic, according to the AP. Acquiring this ability will require a series of genetic changes, which could make the virus less virulent.

"It is entirely conceivable that this virus is inherently programmed that it will never be able to go efficiently from human to human," he was quoted as saying. "Hopefully the epidemic (in birds) will burn itself out, which epidemics do, before the virus evolves the capability of being more efficient in going from human to human."

Why do you continue to post 20-year old material?
It's not remotely relevant to the fact we now have that virus HERE and an administration that seems to have zero interest in tracking it.
 
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The only 'benefits' of culling are short term; it leads to genetically susceptible birds, higher overall mortality and elevated virulence of various influenzas.

'Unculled' flocks evolve genetic resistance that makes them hardier and more able to respond to re-emerging flus.

Don't expect the government to ever figure this out.
Can't eat the meat or eggs from those flocks. Who is paying the bill to keep these flocks in the millions alive, or to remove all traces of the virus contamination from the facility? I'm not sure the contaminated manure can be spread, and might need hauled to an incinerator.

There is a reason whole flocks are culled and also why doing so is the standard procedure.

Test treatments in a national lab, universities, or at drug companies if those have been victims of DOGE.
 
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Can't eat the meat or eggs from those flocks. Who is paying the bill to keep these flocks in the millions alive, or to remove all traces of the virus contamination from the facility? I'm not sure the contaminated manure can be spread, and might need hauled to an incinerator.

There is a reason whole flocks are culled and also why doing so is the standard procedure.

Test treatments in a national lab, universities, or at drug companies if those have been victims of DOGE.
You did not know? It's Biden's fault. He did his own research.
 
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Some good old-fashioned fear porn for the hysterical among us. 😱

Now, a year later, the country is, in Russo’s words, “a pot of swirling virus with every species thrown in the middle.” Multiple strains of H5N1 are burning uncontrolled through cattle herds and poultry flocks in almost every region. Farmers have been forced to euthanize millions of chickens, turkeys, and ducks. Pet food made from infected meat has been linked to the deaths of multiple house cats, and the list of species testing positive for bird flu grows longer every day: squirrels and raccoons, dolphins and deer mice, polar bears and rats, skunks and alpacas. In November and December, at an animal sanctuary in Washington, 20 big cats died of the virus, including four cougars, four bobcats, and a tiger.

 
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