Have to agree with the poster I think in the other thread that asked do we really want Robbins if he can’t have his uncle holding his hand?
Robbins to Vandy and no momentum from regular season
- Thread starter Ihawkhoops
- Start date
Well, we have no momentum because we really did nothing in March. We won a 1st Rd game, but nobody cares what seed you are unless you are part of a MAJOR upset.
And there's no IFs about it. We whiffed on the transfer portal. Nobody of note that will immediately impact the roster while making Iowa a potential B10 contender once again, is transferring here.
And Joe is probably leaving, so now I have to readjust my predictions for next year to fringe NCAA team as an 8/9 at the very best.
Fun times when Iowa can't have nice things!
Well, we have no momentum because we really did nothing in March. We won a 1st Rd game, but nobody cares what seed you are unless you are part of a MAJOR upset.
And there's no IFs about it. We whiffed on the transfer portal. Nobody of note that will immediately impact the roster while making Iowa a potential B10 contender once again, is transferring here.
And Joe is probably leaving, so now I have to readjust my predictions for next year to fringe NCAA team as an 8/9 at the very best.
Fun times when Iowa can't have nice things!
Iowa isn’t even a bridesmaid when it comes to attracting recruits- Iowa is rarely even invited to the wedding.
Four star 6’4” combo guard Skeeter Valentine from Waterloo wouldn’t even have Iowa in his Top Ten, but sure as shit schools like Northwestern, ISU and Braskey are.
There is definitely some sort of stigma surrounding the Iowa hoops program but these slights are rarely brought up by recruits and coaches, but rather the fans.
Can you give us a quick breakdown of the B1G schools or other schools who were very active and successful in Frans first 7 years using transfers?
Yep. We have to do all the hard work here.
Not sure the relevance of going back to Fran's first 7 years. All Sweet 16 teams had transfers--most multiple. Gonzaga had Nemhard (Florida) and Cook Jr. (Southern Illinois) and that is Gonzaga. 11 years and 0 second round wins for Fran but he doesn't need the portal? There are only 3 options: 1) Evolve as a coach / change system to fit talent you CAN recruit: 2) Get better at recruiting or 3) Supplement recruiting with 1-2 transfers as needed. Fran has gone 0-3.
I get it. That is why I posted two-weeks ago there was no chance he was coming to Iowa oh and because 247 Sports said 100% Vandy but the Franatics went off on me. So here we go again with Fran chasing rainbows. Knows the kid went to MN because his uncle got hired. Has to suspect his uncle will land somewhere and high probability Liam follows. Roll out the red carpet and do your level best but have options given Fran has to know (at least) what you, me and anyone with internet access knows about Robbins + his uncle right?
I think Fran would go all in on Buddy Boeheim only to express surprise he picked Syracuse.
So for those who think Fran has a plan, is the JW decision the domino we have been waiting to fall in order for Fran to execute said plan? Is Fran going to give us some news this week?
Fran has to see that the football coach has molded an identity with the fanbase that is proud of being a 2/3 star program. Did Ferentz do that because those players are all he could get or because the fan base doesn't believe they deserve better? Maybe both?
" 11 years and Fran has done little / nothing in the transfer space."
"There is an 11 year trend here, not 2-3. "
Perhaps because you use those years to further your narrative. Transfers and the portal weren't tremendously important at THAT time.
"There are only 3 options: 1) Evolve as a coach / change system to fit talent you CAN recruit: 2) Get better at recruiting or 3) Supplement recruiting with 1-2 transfers as needed. Fran has gone 0-3."
Stick with this part. Fran does need to evolve. When you lump 11 years of transfer issues together when the portal wasn't a thing and he actually landed one of the more prominent transfers during that time frame(very aware of those circumstances) you diminish your point. The facts are on your side but when you choose to embellish to support your position you take away from your point.
Do you have insider knowledge of what Fran is or isn’t doing? It takes two to tango and in the end it’s the players’ choice. You can blame FM all you want, but he can’t force them to come to Iowa.
We had several years of crap under the previous 2 coaches. Fans stopped buying tickets and attending games. That stigma stuck for quite a while and to some extent, it is still going on. McC has done a LOT to bring Iowa back to respectability. Even with the way Iowa exited the tournament last year, they are FAR more respected than they were when McC took over. And for those who think that McC is satisfied? I think you aren't paying attention. If you think a coach as passionate about the games and his players as McC is is satisfied with losing, you are purposely ignorant.
Pretty much. And because I am a fan, I guess I'll spill the beans.
Iowa does have certain disadvantages when it comes to building a championship-caliber hoops program, but it's not like they can't be overcome. I do think that Iowa is holding itself back and is nowhere near their true potential. The results from the 70s and 80s have proven this. I honestly think if Lute stayed even 5 more seasons, the Hawks would have nabbed a natty (or another FF appearance at the very least).
Fran does have a reputation and it's not something something only Iowa fans (or even B1G fans in general) are privy to. I scoped out a UNC message board a while back and the general consensus is that he's an "assclown", "bush league", and "glad he's not our coach". I imagine that many other fanbases feel the same way, particularly those that Iowa has played against recently. You can guarantee that just about every other D1 coach knows about Mac's reputation and probably ask recruits questions like, "Do you really want to play for that jerk?" or "You have way more talent than his kids, so why sit behind them?"
There is some talent that isn't all that far from Iowa City. Chicago, MSP, Milwaukee, even Des Moines all have D1 quality players. But the Hawkeyes just don't register on their radar and many would rather play for a program their parents have to book flights for than playing for a team just 4 hours away. Sometimes that can't be helped and the kids just want to make a name for themselves away from home, but sometimes there's something (or perhaps, someONE) at Iowa that just doesn't resonate.
I certainly get this criticism, but aside from his tirades with the officials and occasional skirmishes with the media, what does Fran do that gives him a worse reputation than other coaches, such as Brad Underwood or known cheaters like John Calipari and Bill Self?
Izzo isn't an "assclown"? Underwood? Duke's coach (can't spell it) has that reputation, he said to be more profane Knight. I keep hammering this. The university accepts average/ above average because the fans accept it. How many people are on here defending a coach they don't know personally, who is a millionaire? Fran can defend himself. His record is HIS record. We have seen worse at Iowa. I just can't understand fans who don't want to expect better. I don't care who the coach is when it happens, I just want them to be better.
I think that's a fair question to ask. Who knows how he would have settled in (or not) at IOWA. If he really needs Uncle Ed on the bench and in the practice gym constantly... chances are he wouldn't have been happy here or performed to his potential.
There's also the chance that given the opportunity to be more independent he may have grown more...personally, academically and athletically at IOWA. (what college is all about, or least used to be, IMHO). But we and he will never know.
As it is, we have guys who want to be here (one of which was ready to leave home a year early) and maybe another 6'9" guy if Rebraca chooses IOWA. We're in better shape for '21-'22 than we were a month ago.
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There is no denying that Iowa is in a better spot than they were under the Alford/Lick regimes, but 10+ years in, Fran has yet to prove that he can get to the next level. His high-octane offense is fun to watch and wins games, but rarely wins when it counts. I have no doubts that he is as frustrated as we are that he can't get over the hump, but the buck still stops with Fran. He's either got to increase the talent level, or he's got to make better coaching adjustments to the talent that he does have because he hasn't proven that he can get it done yet (and yes, that's much easier said than done).
I don't disagree with this at all, but I think a-hole coaches that win and win often have much longer leashes than a-hole coaches that aren't as successful.
Do you really think that your continuing posts declaring martyrdom is a good look for you? And we all get it....You hate McCaffery. Maybe to save yourself some angst, you should follow a different team until he's gone.
Yep we need a coach who can get us to the next level. I want more from the program than a second round tournament exit every year. Look at all the mid major coaches who get their teams to the sweet 16, we need to move on from Fran and hire one of those guys.
We don’t have any bag men. Of course the NCAA is a joke when it comes to compliance or at a minimum, slow to react for cheaters.
Fran's philosophy is to recruit a high school projects and watch them improve during his 4 years at Iowa. This method gives him satisfaction of seeing his recruits grow each year.
Unfortunately, does the majority of Iowa fans think, this method of maintaining the Iowa basketball program, will advance Iowa to a second round win in the NCAA tournament? Note: it hasn't worked but once at Iowa in 41 years.
Fran even stated that he thinks the portal, and transfers in general is a terrible way to build a program and as he is finding out, other programs are achieving major success in going that route and the ones that are losing out are the programs like Iowa, that refuse to except change.
The results of Fran's philosophy is keeping Iowa from achieving a goal that all Division 1 schools are striving to obtain and the hard work that Iowa coaches and players go through, throughout the season ends up in disappointment and sorrow for everyone including the fans.
How long should Iowa stay with a coach that refuses to except change and allow other programs to gain an advantage by using recruiting methods that are excepted practices in todays college recruiting and are a vast majority of Iowa fans OK with how Fran is recruiting his players and keeping Iowa relevant but not contending for a Big Ten Championship or a deep run in the NCAA tournament?
Unfortunately, does the majority of Iowa fans think, this method of maintaining the Iowa basketball program, will advance Iowa to a second round win in the NCAA tournament? Note: it hasn't worked but once at Iowa in 41 years.
Fran even stated that he thinks the portal, and transfers in general is a terrible way to build a program and as he is finding out, other programs are achieving major success in going that route and the ones that are losing out are the programs like Iowa, that refuse to except change.
The results of Fran's philosophy is keeping Iowa from achieving a goal that all Division 1 schools are striving to obtain and the hard work that Iowa coaches and players go through, throughout the season ends up in disappointment and sorrow for everyone including the fans.
How long should Iowa stay with a coach that refuses to except change and allow other programs to gain an advantage by using recruiting methods that are excepted practices in todays college recruiting and are a vast majority of Iowa fans OK with how Fran is recruiting his players and keeping Iowa relevant but not contending for a Big Ten Championship or a deep run in the NCAA tournament?
What's the incentive for Fran to embrace the portal, or do anything else different in the recruiting process for that matter? He's nearing typical retirement age and he's got a contract that will take him there. He's been well rewarded to date with raises and extensions for what he's done so far.
Of course he wants to win. But he has no need to think about the next job. He can have a nice transition to retirement in 3 years or so without having to change.
Of course he wants to win. But he has no need to think about the next job. He can have a nice transition to retirement in 3 years or so without having to change.
Well the "portal" has hardly closed. There are 11 centers and 44 power forwards (for the "we don't need a center" caucus). Why don't the haters wait until we see the final results.
And remember, guys that want a coaching change got what they wanted 22 years ago. An unmitigated disaster for Iowa basketball. Again I say, even a dog doesn't put its paw in the same fire twice.
And remember, guys that want a coaching change got what they wanted 22 years ago. An unmitigated disaster for Iowa basketball. Again I say, even a dog doesn't put its paw in the same fire twice.
lolz
That “unmitigated disaster” at least won two Big Ten Tourney titles. Fran has won nothing in 11 years.
Not a single thing.
Zero hardware in over a decade. Not even two wins in the NCAA tourney. Not even an NIT title. Not even a crappy pre-conference schedule tourney title.
*CORRECTION: Iowa won the 2K Empire Classic tourney in 2018.
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McC has won more NCAA games at Iowa than either of the previous 2 coaches did.
Oh, did you forget that? How effing surprising.
So, when we fire McC do you want Alford or Lickliter? Alford destroyed our program, left it in ashes and Lick obviously completely lacked the ability for a turn around. That's what's usually happens when you drive off winning coaches in pursuit of the hypothetical coach that might win more, or he might destroy your program.
In 8 years Alford made it to the second round once, with Davis players still starting. Last six years, two appearances and 0 wins. Alford inherited a Sweet 16 team, made no attempt to retain some of the guys with eligibility so he could bring in champs like Joe Fermino, promptly drug Iowa into a losing conference record. Didn't have a winning conference record until year 5, and the overall record was so poor two of the winning conference seasons didn't qualify for the NCAA and one, Alford's last year, didn't even make the NIT. The loss of interest, by fans, donors and the national basketball community, in Iowa basketball was perhaps the worst harm Alford did. Between the criminals, the transfers, the academic disqualifications, the forced red shirts Alford made Iowa a punch line.
Lick's performance speaks for itself, including the dumpster fire of a roster left behind. Yet McC was back in the NIT in his second season and the NCAAs in his fourth.
So, I'll take the six NCAA appearances in the last 8 seasons (2020 is effectively a qualification for purposes of this discussion) and four NCAA wins over the previous 11 years, 3 appearances and 1 win, now 20 years ago.
So who's the surer bet to win more than McC at Iowa than the reigning NCoY, coming off a second Sweet 16 in six seasons in a one bid conference, that is loved by the players and recommended by almost every pundit during the search to replace the previous golden boy of coaching coming off his own Sweet 16 8 years previously at a mid major with twenty coaching offers when lucky Iowa bagged him a couple of weeks after losing in the Sweet 16?
You think there's some magic coach waiting somewhere for that call from Iowa. A guy that consistently recruits 4*s, wins the BTT and hits the Sweet 16 every couple of years and you're willing to risk all of the progress in digging out of the worst hole in Iowa basketball history for that magic guaranteed winner. The only realistic question that could possible come to mind is: does he ride a unicorn or Pegasus?
This guy here is spot on right. Why fire an average coach when the fanbase has so many like him willing to accept average. Fear of taking risks fan base. "Hey we only lost by 5 to Ohio State this year, and we played former walk-ons!" "We can't compete with the big boys because we don't have bag men."
I'll give Nebraska fans a little credit. At least they believe they deserve better than average. Iowa fans are terrified of talking to the hot chick, so they settle for the one that will talk to them. In Fran's case he barely can stand this fan base himself, heck even Ferentz doesn't give but the bare minimum access to his program, like it's some big secret what they are doing.
Want better. Want better for yourself. Want better for your recreational interests. Until the majority of this fanbase wants better, the university will settle for "good enough."
Yup. Top 10 most of the year, even with injuries to starters, us just not good enough for a blue blood like Iowa. We have a history of final 4s and national championships to maintain!
😉
Who was a hotter coaching chick than Steve Alford in 1999? Who could have possibly been a hotter coaching chick than Todd Lickliter 8 years later?
Your expectations are exceedingly unrealistic. I'd love to have better but I look at the recent history and detest that more so I'm willing to plug along. There are about 340 teams that would have traded seasons with Iowa so that's not "average". It may not be great but it certainly much better than average.
Old dogs on long roads know much. Whose the magic coach that guarantees improvement, you never answered that question.
Last time Iowa fired a coach for the reasons you are pushing, that coach took Iowa to it's last Sweet Sixteen. We haven't sniffed it since until this year. Iowa was a few injuries short of making it this year. We'll get there faster with this head coach than if we change horses again.
A crappy pre conference tournament like the 2K Empire Classic in 2018? You remember, or probably not, when Iowa beat the mighty Ducks from Oregon and all of their athletes. Teams like Oregon, who Iowa never competes with. After beating Oregon, Iowa went on to crush UConn for the championship.
No you’re right. Iowa has never won a crappy pre conference tournament.
Indeed. I missed that defunct 2K tourney champ banner raising. 😆. Too crappy to continue.
I guess Fran really does have an impressive body of work after all.
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