RU Game Thread: Play Clock at Zero (Apologies Now Being Accepted)

[markfromj]

See link and sentence therein: "...the window created by the mechanics for the foul, a window that necessarily adds another second or so to the process."

Delay-of-game mechanics have an extra second or so built in

The Broncos believe that the officials missed a delay of game penalty during the Chiefs' game-winning drive on Monday night.

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

(Now, this is for the NFL. Still searching for a similar college statement. But your serve, those of you that were questioning me on this in the RU game thread.)

 

[markfromj]

Crickets.

 

[sober_teacher]

It’s been known for years that this is a poorly enforced rule, because of what you posted.

Imo, in this instance, it should have been a delay - I thought that split second elapsed between it hitting zero and official looking down to see if ball was snapped.

 

[Beattheohiostate]

That's an odd way to go about enforcing the college rule. It should be like the shot clock in basketball. When the 40 seconds expires, the ref should be wearing an earpiece and a buzzer should sound in his ear WHILE he's LOOKING at the ball. What they're doing now is BS and provides a clear path to questioning the integrity of the officiating.

 

[cidhawkeye]

Catch me up on what I missed. An NFL article from 2018 is being used in what regard for a college game in 2022?

 

[sober_teacher]

That's an odd way to go about enforcing the college rule. It should be like the shot clock in basketball. When the 40 seconds expires, the ref should be wearing an earpiece and a buzzer should sound in his ear WHILE he's LOOKING at the ball. What they're doing now is BS and provides a clear path to questioning the integrity of the officiating.

Yeah, you’d think there would be a better mechanism for the rule, rather than current method that effectively makes it a 41 second play clock.

 

[sober_teacher]

Catch me up on what I missed. An NFL article from 2018 is being used in what regard for a college game in 2022?

On Rutgers TD, play clock had hit zero before the ball was snapped, but was allowed due to the leeway given due to back judge looking at clock and then at the ball.

 

[jberesford]

And for another recent example it happened on the potential tying touchdown (had they gotten the 2 point conversion) for Tampa Bay in the closing minute against Green Bay yesterday. Pereira gave the explanation that the official in charge of that looks at the clock and when it hits zero he THEN looks to see if the ball is snapped. I get it leads to a split second of hesitation, but the examples we're talking about seem like very long moments of moving your eyes from one spot to another that for me at least would be a split second...

 

[DutchyFunStar]

And Iowa called on time out on the PAT for a play that isn't reviewable.

 

[cidhawkeye]

On Rutgers TD, play clock had hit zero before the ball was snapped, but was allowed due to the leeway given due to back judge looking at clock and then at the ball.

Ahh, got it. Thank you. Not sure the 2018 NFL article applies but I can see it.

 

[DodgerHawki]

And for another recent example it happened on the potential tying touchdown (had they gotten the 2 point conversion) for Tampa Bay in the closing minute against Green Bay yesterday. Pereira gave the explanation that the official in charge of that looks at the clock and when it hits zero he THEN looks to see if the ball is snapped. I get it leads to a split second of hesitation, but the examples we're talking about seem like very long moments of moving your eyes from one spot to another that for me at least would be a split second...

Yeah it's not the end of the world. But it does seem odd that football operates like this. Only explanation I can come up with is that they want to give benefit of doubt to the offense, allowing them to make changes and get a play off wherever possible. The NFL is very blatant, they easily give the offense an extra second+ if they need it.

In the offense's defense, it CAN be hard to get in a play in 40 seconds on a long gain. Getting the team up to the ball, right personnel on the field, etc. But it's weird about what the NFL chooses to emphasize and what it does not. Defense gets penalized if a 12th player still has one foot in the field of play if that guy is trying to get off the field. But the offense gets an extra beat to snap the ball?

 

[sober_teacher]

Yeah it's not the end of the world. But it does seem odd that football operates like this. Only explanation I can come up with is that they want to give benefit of doubt to the offense, allowing them to make changes and get a play off wherever possible. The NFL is very blatant, they easily give the offense an extra second+ if they need it.

In the offense's defense, it CAN be hard to get in a play in 40 seconds on a long gain. Getting the team up to the ball, right personnel on the field, etc. But it's weird about what the NFL chooses to emphasize and what it does not. Defense gets penalized if a 12th player still has one foot in the field of play if that guy is trying to get off the field. But the offense gets an extra beat to snap the ball?

This feels like one of those rules that is just archaic and dates back to when everything was analog. Doesn’t make sense that there isn’t a better way to do that now, or at least make it reviewable since it ought to be be pretty clear whether it was snapped in time or not.

 

[ItsAllBallBearingsNowadays]

I still for the life of me I can’t figure out why that wouldn’t be reviewable with all the other subjective plays that are reviewable. It seems pretty black-and-white whether they got the snap off in time. I’m sure officials would be in favor of it if you asked them.

 

[markfromj]

On Rutgers TD, play clock had hit zero before the ball was snapped, but was allowed due to the leeway given due to back judge looking at clock and then at the ball.

…,and many in the game thread tearing in to me for claiming that there is a second left when the clock hits zero.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

…,and many in the game thread tearing in to me for claiming that there is a second left when the clock hits zero.

Hey it's not your fault you can't help yourself in your quest to prove you are right.............which in this case, while you've provided evidence to support your claim, it's only further provided support for a need to address said issue.

Maybe that was your goal all along, and if so, congrats!!


If not well then lulz @ you.

 

[sober_teacher]

…,and many in the game thread tearing in to me for claiming that there is a second left when the clock hits zero.

Would help to show tenths of a sec…or have the outside of the play clock light up red just like in hoops when the clock expires.

 

[BigOHawk]

Would help to show tenths of a sec…or have the outside of the play clock light up red just like in hoops when the clock expires.

Does ball from center have to be moving or in QB's hands/air when playclock at zero? And yes, this should operate EXACTLY as college bball shotclock. Or least be reviewable since at some point a team will lose a game or win game either way on this playclock issue.

 

[markfromj]

Hey it's not your fault you can't help yourself in your quest to prove you are right.............which in this case, while you've provided evidence to support your claim, it's only further provided support for a need to address said issue.

Maybe that was your goal all along, and if so, congrats!!


If not well then lulz @ you.

The only time I need to prove I’m right is when others tell me I’m wrong in a “you’re dumb, I’m smart” way (e.g. “Past your bedtime, Mark”) (which while snarky, was in fact true).

I think it is important that dumb people be told they are so, so that they might try to improve.

 

[OILCHECKER]

…,and many in the game thread tearing in to me for claiming that there is a second left when the clock hits zero.

Well, technically, there isn't a second left.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

The only time I need to prove I’m right is when others tell me I’m wrong in a “you’re dumb, I’m smart” way (e.g. “Past your bedtime, Mark”) (which while snarky, was in fact true).

I think it is important that dumb people be told they are so, so that they might try to improve.

So are you gonna take your own advice?........

 

[LetsGoHawks83]

I understand the mechanics... and that was a delay of game EVERY TIME.

More than enough time to see the clock hit ZERO then look to see the ball had NOT snapped.

If it takes the ref a full second to see the clock at zero and then look to see if the ball has snapped.... Probably should go back and ref middle school, cause D1 football is going to be way too fast for you.

 

[BlackNGoldBleeder]

See link and sentence therein: "...the window created by the mechanics for the foul, a window that necessarily adds another second or so to the process."

Delay-of-game mechanics have an extra second or so built in

The Broncos believe that the officials missed a delay of game penalty during the Chiefs' game-winning drive on Monday night.

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

(Now, this is for the NFL. Still searching for a similar college statement. But your serve, those of you that were questioning me on this in the RU game thread.)

LMAO. That does not back up what you asserted.

 

[BlackNGoldBleeder]

The only time I need to prove I’m right is when others tell me I’m wrong in a “you’re dumb, I’m smart” way (e.g. “Past your bedtime, Mark”) (which while snarky, was in fact true).

I think it is important that dumb people be told they are so, so that they might try to improve.

Actually, mark, what I stated in the game thread was correct. There is usually a little grace period from when the clock hits zero and when the ball is actually snapped, as backed up by the article. The shit you were talking about, though, was and still is laughably stupid.

You sound smarter parroting “30 trillion.”

Give it a rest.

 

[BBHawk]

Actually, mark, what I stated in the game thread was correct. There is usually a little grace period from when the clock hits zero and when the ball is actually snapped, as backed up by the article. The shit you were talking about, though, was and still is laughably stupid.

You sound smarter parroting “30 trillion.”

Give it a rest.

A little "grace" period? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

 

[hawx]

Yeah it's not the end of the world. But it does seem odd that football operates like this. Only explanation I can come up with is that they want to give benefit of doubt to the offense, allowing them to make changes and get a play off wherever possible. The NFL is very blatant, they easily give the offense an extra second+ if they need it.

In the offense's defense, it CAN be hard to get in a play in 40 seconds on a long gain. Getting the team up to the ball, right personnel on the field, etc. But it's weird about what the NFL chooses to emphasize and what it does not. Defense gets penalized if a 12th player still has one foot in the field of play if that guy is trying to get off the field. But the offense gets an extra beat to snap the ball?

Defense should be allowed to take off the second the play clock hits zero.

But really, your examples help offenses and hurts defenses which is exactly what they want and why it is unlikely to ever change.

 

[anon_b29nm7v7dwp6r]

I think the ball should just automatically burst into confetti if the play clock hits zero and it’s not moving at all

 

[BlackNGoldBleeder]

A little "grace" period? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

🤷‍♂️😝

In other words, when the ref sees the play clock hit zero, the ball better be in the process of being snapped by the time he looks down. Hitting zero does not mean another full second passes before it’s a penalty as mark stated in the game thread.

 

[BBHawk]

🤷‍♂️😝

In other words, when the ref sees the play clock hit zero, the ball better be in the process of being snapped by the time he looks down. Hitting zero does not mean another full second passes before it’s a penalty as mark stated in the game thread.

Yup. Would have been nice if the ref would have looked.

 

[BlackNGoldBleeder]

Yup. Would have been nice if the ref would have looked.

It was definitely a penalty. To my untrained eye, the clock had hit zero and the ball wasn’t snapped for almost two seconds.

 

[uihawk82]

See link and sentence therein: "...the window created by the mechanics for the foul, a window that necessarily adds another second or so to the process."

Delay-of-game mechanics have an extra second or so built in

The Broncos believe that the officials missed a delay of game penalty during the Chiefs' game-winning drive on Monday night.

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

(Now, this is for the NFL. Still searching for a similar college statement. But your serve, those of you that were questioning me on this in the RU game thread.)

They discussed this rule during a pro game yesterday and it is the same as college. When the game clock hits zero the time is UP, period, but it takes a half a second for the back judge or whoever to look from the clock to the ball, so there is that little bit of time.

But in this situation, there was clearly in the hawk game a "lot" of time that went by when the clock hit zero before the snap.

I agree with others that in this day and age of wifi and cellular electronics for there not to be a notification buzz in the ear of the back judge and the at least one side judge so they can focus on the ball.

I mean billions of dollars are floating around college football

 

[farina1]

On Rutgers TD, play clock had hit zero before the ball was snapped, but was allowed due to the leeway given due to back judge looking at clock and then at the ball.

The play clock was at 00 for a good 2-3 seconds. Back Judge should be lit up by the Conference or take a job with Jersey Mike’s.

 

[bansheexyz]

You can add facemask, offsides and "late hits" to the list of should-be reviewable penalties. Remember when Iowa was called for bogus facemask and offsides vs Florida on an onside kick we recovered? Remember when Cooper Dejean got called two weeks ago for hitting Dekkers inbounds, which led to their winning score? It's a long streak of bullshit that sometimes decides games.

 

[uihawk82]

You can add facemask, offsides and "late hits" to the list of should-be reviewable penalties. Remember when Iowa was called for bogus facemask and offsides vs Florida on an onside kick we recovered? Remember when Cooper Dejean got called two weeks ago for hitting Dekkers inbounds, which led to their winning score? It's a long streak of bullshit that sometimes decides games.

And sometimes do baby steps and add some of these infractions like facemask calls and late hits to maybe the last 5 minutes of the first half and last 10 minutes of a game. See how that goes for a year or two and check the metrics of how often it is used etc etc before deciding whether to leave it as is, or make changes

 

[sober_teacher]

And sometimes do baby steps and add some of these infractions like facemask calls and late hits to maybe the last 5 minutes of the first half and last 10 minutes of a game. See how that goes for a year or two and check the metrics of how often it is used etc etc before deciding whether to leave it as is, or make changes

I don’t like leaving it based on what time of the game. Stuff that can be objectively determined, like player X lining up offside, or Clinton Solomon getting pulled down by his face mask…that stuff should be reviewable.