SI article on NIL

[IRONBIRD]

NIL, ‘booster banks’ and recruiting wars: For some, it doesn’t add up - Sports Illustrated

Stakeholders across college sports are divided over the benefits of NIL and whether opening the door to big money donors is a good thing.

www.si.com

Look, anyone with 1/2 a brain knew this was going to be a disaster/problem. Many just kept at the old stupid talking point about college kids getting paid. College athletes who earn scholarships are getting paid indirectly and getting paid well!

Now it is a total fiasco with no proper rules or rhythm/ reason. As predicted this will go from bad to worse very quickly! The only question left is how it will be corrected in the end?

 

[BIG10MANIAC]

Cap it.... Make a rule that the most any college athlete can earn is $50K per year or something reasonable like that. Problem solved (Mostly) but this at least evens the playing field so fair judgment can be used when picking a school. If a kid knows he's gonna make the same no matter where he goes then all schools have even footing again...

 

[grapplefann]

NIL, ‘booster banks’ and recruiting wars: For some, it doesn’t add up - Sports Illustrated

Stakeholders across college sports are divided over the benefits of NIL and whether opening the door to big money donors is a good thing.

www.si.com

Look, anyone with 1/2 a brain knew this was going to be a disaster/problem. Many just kept at the old stupid talking point about college kids getting paid. College athletes who earn scholarships are getting paid indirectly and getting paid well!

Now it is a total fiasco with no proper rules or rhythm/ reason. As predicted this will go from bad to worse very quickly! The only question left is how it will be corrected in the end?

Gonna be a mess sooner or later. Money changes things.

 

[burk11]

Caveat Venditor/Let the Seller Beware. Is there an implied warranty (product liability) that comes with any of these NIL guys? Has anyone seen a NIL contract, I have not.

Caveat Emptor/Let the Buyer Beware. Is the integrity of the NIL product strictly the resposibility of the buyer. What happens if I buy a lemon? Can I get my money back.

 

[el dub]

Caveat Venditor/Let the Seller Beware. Is there an implied warranty (product liability) that comes with any of these NIL guys? Has anyone seen a NIL contract, I have not.

Caveat Emptor/Let the Buyer Beware. Is the integrity of the NIL product strictly the resposibility of the buyer. What happens if I buy a lemon? Can I get my money back.

So, are you saying snaps on Instagram featuring athletes in exotic locales with hookers and blow could potentially be an issue?

 

[burk11]

So, are you saying snaps on Instagram featuring athletes in exotic locales with hookers and blow could potentially be an issue?

Not really, I didn't consider that. But, you have raised the issue.

 

[24 so far]

Gonna be a mess sooner or later. Money changes things.

Are you Cyndi Lauper by any chance? 😏

 

[24 so far]

Caveat Venditor/Let the Seller Beware. Is there an implied warranty (product liability) that comes with any of these NIL guys? Has anyone seen a NIL contract, I have not.

Caveat Emptor/Let the Buyer Beware. Is the integrity of the NIL product strictly the resposibility of the buyer. What happens if I buy a lemon? Can I get my money back.

The Oakland Raiders say no. They "bought" a lemon and took it in the proverbial shorts. That lemons name is Jamarcus Russell. (there are other examples but he's the poster child, IMO)

 

[el dub]

Not really, I didn't consider that. But, you have raised the issue.

Lol Not wrestlers so much. Prolly Florida man.

 

[82bordeaux]

The Oakland Raiders say no. They "bought" a lemon and took it in the proverbial shorts. That lemons name is Jamarcus Russell. (there are other examples but he's the poster child, IMO)

They still haven't learned.

Henry Ruggs III arrested on charge of DUI resulting in death, released by Raiders

Wide receiver Henry Ruggs III will be charged with DUI resulting in the death of another person following his involvement in a traffic collision at approximately 3:39 a.m. PT on Tuesday in Las Vegas, police announced. The Raiders announced late Tuesday ni

www.nfl.com

 

[grapplefann]

Are you Cyndi Lauper by any chance? 😏

No, but like you, I'm old enough to remember her.
And she wasn't wrong.

 

[HawkeyePA]

I read an article on the CBSSPORTS.com site that Nick Saban , Coach of Alabama Football warned of this unchecked NIL model in College football..... Now this seems kind of absurd because the Alabama FB program has been the precursor for the PSU Wrestling model as of late , when it comes to getting all of the top recruits . I personally think these teams that have been doing it LONG BEFORE the rest of their respective adversaries are now shocked at how the rest of the sports world is paying out. It will get much worse before it gets any better because it will take a Bell weather event to cause enough negative Publicity to elicit change.

 

[T8KUDWN]

No, but like you, I'm old enough to remember her.
And she wasn't wrong.

"Money Changes Everything" or "Girls Just Wanna Have Fun"???

 

[grapplefann]

"Money Changes Everything" or "Girls Just Wanna Have Fun"???

Yes on number one. For number two, everyone just wants to have fun.

 

[el dub]

Yes on number one. For number two, everyone just wants to have fun.

You’re making it sound like she said, “just girls want to have fun.”

 

[T8KUDWN]

Yes on number one. For number two, everyone just wants to have fun.

My weak attempt at some humor this morning.... lol

 

[98lberEating2Lunches]

This just in, "F*N is no longer a taboo word in the cesspool." 😉

 

[grapplefann]

My weak attempt at some humor this morning.... lol

You were just having F**.

 

[AFHawk86]

SEC, Pac-12 commissioners seek NIL help in D.C.

SEC commissioner Greg Sankey and Pac-12 commissioner George Kliavkoff met with U.S. senators on Thursday to ask for legislative help surrounding name, image and likeness policies.

www.espn.com

 

[Old_wrestling_fan]

Curious about this aspect of NIL...if there are no signed contracts associated with the transfer of funds...what is to stop a player from accepting $$'s for the use of their NIL at say School #1 and then proceeding to transfer to School #2, so as to gain even more NIL money?

Is it happening that the NIL money is being "fronted" with the expectation, but no contractual obligation, that the player continues to rep a given product? If so, I suspect that there could be new meaning coming to the phrase "double dipping".

It could just be too that I am not understanding exactly how these deals are being transacted, but it does seem like the "wild west" out there now related to NIL.

 

[98lberEating2Lunches]

if there are no signed contracts associated with the transfer of funds...what is to stop a player from accepting $$'s for the use of their NIL at say School #1 and then proceeding to transfer to School #2, so as to gain even more NIL money?

Nothing. The language in any legitimate NIL cannot depend on participation in the sport at the school. The quid pro quo is supposed to be for a service where the payment is for that service.

 

[98lberEating2Lunches]

SEC, Pac-12 commissioners seek NIL help in D.C.

SEC commissioner Greg Sankey and Pac-12 commissioner George Kliavkoff met with U.S. senators on Thursday to ask for legislative help surrounding name, image and likeness policies.

www.espn.com

NCAA wants to have its cake and eat it too. If students were employees then an employment contract could implement employer rules. But the NCAA does not want student athletes to be treated as employees (for some reason, perhaps increased costs).

Being employees would allow student athletes to unionize and bargain collectively. Furthermore, school conferences or the NCAA could theoreticallly implement mechanisms like a salary cap through collective bargaining.

In the long run I would not be surprised if NIL causes Power 5 D1 athletics to move toward treating student athletes as employees. I don't really understand why preserving amateur status is valued so highly by some.

 

[burk11]

SEC, Pac-12 commissioners seek NIL help in D.C.

SEC commissioner Greg Sankey and Pac-12 commissioner George Kliavkoff met with U.S. senators on Thursday to ask for legislative help surrounding name, image and likeness policies.

www.espn.com

Well, that’s interesting. I appreciate the congress of United States of America is incredibly busy cracking the major problems of the day. Off the top, a couple concerns that immediately come to my mind; immigration, voting integrity/election security, environmental protection/climate change, government spending, marriage equality, welfare reform, public education, infrastructure rebuilding, jobs, housing, Supreme Court security/leaks, Black Lives Matter, Critical Race Theory, The 1619 Project, and least we forget the war in Ukraine. Whoops almost forgot, many elected leaders will soon be busy banning books.

So, solving the NCAA’s Name, Image, Likeness sticky-wicket should be relatively simple. What could go wrong?

The NCAA delegates noted in the posted article will meet with Senator Marsha Blackburn. Take note that Senator Blackburn is assigned to the Senate Judiciary Committee. A committee which reviews/considers federal court appointments, including the Supreme Court of the United States. And that committee plays a key role in 1st Amendment/Civil Liberty issues.

Well, that’s interesting. What could go wrong.

 

[el dub]

Nothing. The language in any legitimate NIL cannot depend on participation in the sport at the school. The quid pro quo is supposed to be for a service where the payment is for that service.

Interesting take, but I’m not sure it’s accurate. (Maybe I’m just not getting it.)

NIL can be argued to be more than service, I’m guessing. The image of SL in a PSU singlet might cause unhappiness with arrangement?

Or an athlete doing stupid things in public to tarnish image might affect quality of “service,” provided by use of NIL?

 

[98lberEating2Lunches]

Interesting take, but I’m not sure it’s accurate. (Maybe I’m just not getting it.)

NIL can be argued to be more than service, I’m guessing. The image of SL in a PSU singlet might cause unhappiness with arrangement?

Or an athlete doing stupid things in public to tarnish image might affect quality of “service,” provided by use of NIL?

Getting permission to use school logos is a separate issue. Some schools may allow it only after reviewing and approving a specific NIL.

I saw Ferrari wearing orange but not Ok State logos in at least one of his "more questionable" social media posts.

How many of Spencer's or DeSanto's T-shirts actually have the Hawkeye logo? I don’t recall many, even if they were largely black with gold.

I've only seen RBY wearing a PSU singlet when he wrestled the Barstool sports guy who is recovering from some addiction. I would think that kind of use might be approved.

When paying wrestlers to do a clinic, advertise, or participate in an autograph session, I don't see why they'd need to wear their school's gear.

 

[24 so far]

Well, that’s interesting. I appreciate the congress of United States of America is incredibly busy cracking the major problems of the day. Off the top, a couple concerns that immediately come to my mind; immigration, voting integrity/election security, environmental protection/climate change, government spending, marriage equality, welfare reform, public education, infrastructure rebuilding, jobs, housing, Supreme Court security/leaks, Black Lives Matter, Critical Race Theory, The 1619 Project, and least we forget the war in Ukraine. Whoops almost forgot, many elected leaders will soon be busy banning books.

So, solving the NCAA’s Name, Image, Likeness sticky-wicket should be relatively simple. What could go wrong?

The NCAA delegates noted in the posted article will meet with Senator Marsha Blackburn. Take note that Senator Blackburn is assigned to the Senate Judiciary Committee. A committee which reviews/considers federal court appointments, including the Supreme Court of the United States. And that committee plays a key role in 1st Amendment/Civil Liberty issues.

Well, that’s interesting. What could go wrong.

Got a better idea? Let's have it.

 

[el dub]

Getting permission to use school logos is a separate issue. Some schools may allow it only after reviewing and approving a specific NIL.

I saw Ferrari wearing orange but not Ok State logos in at least one of his "more questionable" social media posts.

How many of Spencer's or DeSanto's T-shirts actually have the Hawkeye logo? I don’t recall many, even if they were largely black with gold.

I've only seen RBY wearing a PSU singlet when he wrestled the Barstool sports guy who is recovering from some addiction. I would think that kind of use might be approved.

When paying wrestlers to do a clinic, advertise, or participate in an autograph session, I don't see why they'd need to wear their schools gear.

The students are the school related images. I’m not talking about team logos. In some cases, I’m sure school donors will tie NIL contracts with students to team affiliation. ?

 

[98lberEating2Lunches]

NIL contracts with students to team affiliation

Again, this would seem to violate the NCAA's NIL rules. NILs cannot be based on participation or performance.

The student is to use their name, image and likeness (separate from the school). It's the student athlete's NIL of themself untied to their athletic endeavors at the school (although the school can allow). In general, to be most competitive, I think most schools would allow, unless the NIL did not reflect positively on the university.

Sure, there may be an implicit understanding between a prospective student athlete and one who may wish to entice their commitment or transfer. But nothing in that arrangement should necessarily guarantee them a spot on the team. That is ultimately the head coach's decision.

NILs were never intended to be part of any recruitment process. The pending NCAA additional guidance reemphasises this point. A University still controls the ability of its student athletes in so much as the student athlete's activity ostensibly represents the school, such as through wearing a team jersey.

 

[IRONBIRD]

Was another article by SI following this up. Was talking about possible new rules and regulation by NCAA coming? This turned into a mess real fast!

I have to see if I can find and post or maybe someone else saw it and can post?

FOUND BELLOW

 

[IRONBIRD]

Task force to big-money boosters: NIL sanctions could be coming - Sports Illustrated

College administrators are finalizing guidelines expected to clarify that boosters and booster-led collectives are prohibited from involvement in recruiting, sources tell SI.

www.si.com

 

[98lberEating2Lunches]

Task force to big-money boosters: NIL sanctions could be coming - Sports Illustrated

College administrators are finalizing guidelines expected to clarify that boosters and booster-led collectives are prohibited from involvement in recruiting, sources tell SI.

www.si.com

Yes. This is what I was referring to as pending additional guidance.

These NIL directives and collectives are supposed to act without coordination with the university, much like Political Action Committees and a candidate's campaign. I see a lot of similarities between the two. Those familiar with a program's or candidate's needs will more often hit the desired mark than not.

 

[HawkFan1986]

Yes. This is what I was referring to as pending additional guidance.

These NIL directives and collectives are supposed to act without coordination with the university, much like Political Action Committees and a candidate's campaign. I see a lot of similarities between the two. Those familiar with a program's or candidate's needs will more often hit the desired mark than not.

The words supposed to is doing a lot of heavy lifting here, and quite frankly, I’m not sure it’s got the frame to support all that weight. Once money was introduced to the collegiate athlete schools and individuals were going to find a way to exploit it. This was always the likely outcome.

Now it appears the NCAA has some legislating to do, or they turn everyone loose and college sports becomes the Wild Wild West. We shall see. Does this go to the Supreme Court…again, I could see it heading that way. That or we might see the “power five” beak away from the NCAA. If that happens first round picks might just be taking a pay cut to play in the NFL and NBA. I can see it now, headline reads number 1 pick files for bankruptcy after rookie contract isn’t big enough to support his previously established lifestyle.

 

[IRONBIRD]

This is getting stupid even by NCAA standards! They opened up a can of worms with what has to be considered no real thought going into it at all. I mean a bunch of grade school kids could have done a better job. What in all hell do they plan on doing now? The way they put this NIL crap together, left it wide open to what you now see happening.

What can they do? They either have to now go back and make new rules or try and say old rules are being broken. The way I see it right now, I do not see any wrong doing(according to NIL) by anyone paying these kids. Wealthy people with nothing better to do with their cash, can buy or try to buy, whomever they want as it stands. How do you tell them, "no that was not the intent." ???

Also, if a kid is approached and offered a bunch of $$$$$, how can they now tell him he can't take it? Guy wants to give a 5 star athlete a deal- say a cool Mil to use his name, well that is the N in NIL!!!

I wonder if some big Tech companies could "buy" a MIT kid who is working on some new projects and bring him over to a school that they are connected with?

 

[98lberEating2Lunches]

The words supposed to is doing a lot of heavy lifting here, and quite frankly, I’m not sure it’s got the frame to support all that weight.

I tend to agree. Some may choose to be obtuse to intent when wording and infrastructure to support meaningful enforcement is lacking. That is something many seem to have anticipated.

This was always the likely outcome.

It appears to be the outcome in some places and sports more than others.

If it was an anticipated possibility that was likely and the people running the NCAA are at least as smart as the average Rivals poster, it stands to reason the NCAA's approach could've been to force the "pay-for-play" paradigm and those inclined to skirt rules and guidance into the light of day. In my mind, that would be strategically masterful.

Given the Supreme Court ruling, I understand the NCAA's fear is primarily one of potential liability should it presume to enforce their own rules / guidance in a way that limits a student athlete's ability to earn.

Like most, if not all, circumstances of the living, the current one is impermanent.

 

[el dub]

If it was an anticipated possibility that was likely and the people running the NCAA are at least as smart as the average Rivals poster, it stands to reason the NCAA's approach could've been to force the "pay-for-play" paradigm and those inclined to skirt rules and guidance into the light of day. In my mind, that would be strategically masterful.

Like most, if not all, circumstances of the living, the current one is impermanent.

Similar to bringing cannabis growers in NoCal out into the light of day when legalization occurred, perhaps? Lol

 

[burk11]

A very interesting article by Laine Higgins appearing in today's Wall Street Journal. University of Kansas "Collectives" apparently able to pool monies and pay athletes for quasi- basketball stuff. A good read, recommend. Link.

The Alumni ‘Collectives’ Placing Cash within the Pockets of School Athletes - Hybrid Tip

The Kansas Jayhawks gained the NCAA males’s basketball title in early April. A couple of weeks later, members of the staff are on a barnstorming tour that can allow them to monetize their success in a approach that was by no means doable till now. Members of the title staff stand to...

hybridtip.com

 

[Impossible Is Nothing]

The NCAA is very reluctant to end up on the losing end of another antitrust action, which is why there hasn't been much effort to enforce the existing guidelines. Any move to cap amount or method of compensation will run afoul of the Alston ruling, as well as any number of state laws. This is why the current play is to seek federal legislation that would regulate athlete compensation via NIL as well as athlete employment status: https://www.si.com/college/2022/05/...nate-nil-legislation-athlete-employment-pitch

Absent a federal law, the free market reigns. There will likely be some correction in the not-too-distant future, as NIL providers (individual firms or donor pools) get a better sense of what the ROI is on some of these deals. Somewhat ironically, the solution to the NIL free-for-all may be full employee status for athletes, as that would allow universities a greater degree of control over athletes' endorsement and other outside activities.

 

[IRONBIRD]

The NCAA is very reluctant to end up on the losing end of another antitrust action, which is why there hasn't been much effort to enforce the existing guidelines. Any move to cap amount or method of compensation will run afoul of the Alston ruling, as well as any number of state laws. This is why the current play is to seek federal legislation that would regulate athlete compensation via NIL as well as athlete employment status: https://www.si.com/college/2022/05/...nate-nil-legislation-athlete-employment-pitch

Absent a federal law, the free market reigns. There will likely be some correction in the not-too-distant future, as NIL providers (individual firms or donor pools) get a better sense of what the ROI is on some of these deals. Somewhat ironically, the solution to the NIL free-for-all may be full employee status for athletes, as that would allow universities a greater degree of control over athletes' endorsement and other outside activities.

You are then talking PROFESSIONAL ATHLETES are you not?

 

[burk11]

Impossible Is Nothing,
Your commentary would appear to be very close to spot-on. I enjoyed reading. There are few good solutions for the NCAA in this NIL dilemma (meaning favorable options for NCAA). Coherent federal legislation would be a partisan war. And likely challenged in court. This bell cannot be 'unrung'.

 

[el dub]

A very interesting article by Laine Higgins appearing in today's Wall Street Journal. University of Kansas "Collectives" apparently able to pool monies and pay athletes for quasi- basketball stuff. A good read, recommend. Link.

The Alumni ‘Collectives’ Placing Cash within the Pockets of School Athletes - Hybrid Tip

The Kansas Jayhawks gained the NCAA males’s basketball title in early April. A couple of weeks later, members of the staff are on a barnstorming tour that can allow them to monetize their success in a approach that was by no means doable till now. Members of the title staff stand to...

hybridtip.com

Thanks for the link. Really interesting article.

As an aside, it’s the most poorly written article I’ve ever seen. It almost looks like it was written in another language and auto translated (badly) to English..