Texas AG On School Shootings: “God Has A Plan”

[RileyHawk]

They have to truly want forgiveness. They have to ask for it.

Check out Catholic.com. Thousands of articles there with answers. (Although I'm happy to answer questions as best as I can.)

So someone who has done heinous things can be absolved and get to Heaven by truly wanting forgiveness?

Yes, but not in a way that destroys our free will.

It's like when you asked your wife (if you have one) to marry you.

Did you put a gun to her head and demand she say yes? Or did you ask for her consent?

Which one is true love?

If He has the power, why wouldn't he use it to direct people who have done good throughout their life to live eternity in Heaven even if they have doubted His existence? Does God allow mistakes and errors to be made, sometimes terrible, terrible mistake, and then accepts them if they truly want forgiveness but denies those who have made few mistakes, one of which being that they have doubts? That doesn't seem like a forgiving, loving God. That seems like a narcissistic God.

How long do you believe humans have been on Earth and how did they get here?

 

[HawkFan1298]

Pardon my response format. I don't know how to separate the quotes.

"So someone who has done heinous things can be absolved and get to Heaven by truly wanting forgiveness?"

Yes, after a long stint in Purgatory.

"If He has the power, why wouldn't he use it to direct people who have done good throughout their life to live eternity in Heaven even if they have doubted His existence? Does God allow mistakes and errors to be made, sometimes terrible, terrible mistake, and then accepts them if they truly want forgiveness but denies those who have made few mistakes, one of which being that they have doubts? That doesn't seem like a forgiving, loving God. That seems like a narcissistic God."

I think that everyone gets enough evidence in this life to make a choice. Having doubts is normal. I don't really have any myself now but I did for about 15 years.

I believe everyone will get God's perfect justice.

Why not try Church, even if you have doubts? It's like 1 hour a week. Gradually, you make come to like it. And it's free!!!

Lastly, I'm all about the scientific consensus on the Big Bang Theory (developed by a Catholic priest, BTW.) so whatever science says about the age of humanity is good with me. What is it: 100,000 years?

 

[RileyHawk]

Pardon my response format. I don't know how to separate the quotes.

"So someone who has done heinous things can be absolved and get to Heaven by truly wanting forgiveness?"

Yes, after a long stint in Purgatory.

"If He has the power, why wouldn't he use it to direct people who have done good throughout their life to live eternity in Heaven even if they have doubted His existence? Does God allow mistakes and errors to be made, sometimes terrible, terrible mistake, and then accepts them if they truly want forgiveness but denies those who have made few mistakes, one of which being that they have doubts? That doesn't seem like a forgiving, loving God. That seems like a narcissistic God."

I think that everyone gets enough evidence in this life to make a choice. Having doubts is normal. I don't really have any myself now but I did for about 15 years.

I believe everyone will get God's perfect justice.

Why not try Church, even if you have doubts? It's like 1 hour a week. Gradually, you make come to like it. And it's free!!!

Lastly, I'm all about the scientific consensus on the Big Bang Theory (developed by a Catholic priest, BTW.) so whatever science says about the age of humanity is good with me. What is it: 100,000 years?

How long in purgatory and why? Is God punishing them even though He has forgiven them? That doesn't make sense.

People often haven't made any choice. A child, for instance. They don't know. Are you saying God will punish those that just aren't sure even if they are otherwise good people? That makes no sense either.

Do you believe a baby is born a sinner?

 

[HawkFan1298]

How long in purgatory and why? Is God punishing them even though He has forgiven them? That doesn't make sense.

People often haven't made any choice. A child, for instance. They don't know. Are you saying God will punish those that just aren't sure even if they are otherwise good people? That makes no sense either.

Do you believe a baby is born a sinner?

God doesn't punish, bro. We punish ourselves.

I dunno how long they would do in Purgatory. Time on the other side is different. It's like an eternal present moment.

I think all children under age 10 that die go straight to Heaven.

 

[DooBii]

How long in purgatory and why? Is God punishing them even though He has forgiven them? That doesn't make sense.

People often haven't made any choice. A child, for instance. They don't know. Are you saying God will punish those that just aren't sure even if they are otherwise good people? That makes no sense either.

Do you believe a baby is born a sinner?

No one is a "good person" when talking about the perfect nature of God.

 

[HawkFan1298]

No one is a "good person" when talking about the perfect nature of God.

Amen.

How many people are really good? Even saints admitted they had deep flaws.

 

[RileyHawk]

God doesn't punish, bro. We punish ourselves.

I dunno how long they would do in Purgatory. Time on the other side is different. It's like an eternal present moment.

I think all children under age 10 that die go straight to Heaven.

People don't make the choice to go to Hell or Purgatory, that's made for them. If a person truly has "free will" wouldn't they be allowed to choose whether they go to Heaven or Hell?

And why 10? Is that in the Bible?

 

[HawkFan1298]

People don't make the choice to go to Hell or Purgatory, that's made for them. If a person truly has "free will" wouldn't they be allowed to choose whether they go to Heaven or Hell?

And why 10? Is that in the Bible?

Humans choose their actions and God provides the justice.

10 is a bit of a random age. It's not in the Bible. It may be lower.

 

[RileyHawk]

Amen.

How many people are really good? Even saints admitted they had deep flaws.

Are you suggesting a person can never be "good" because they all have flaws? If that is the case, how do bad people get into Heaven?

 

[HawkFan1298]

Are you suggesting a person can never be "good" because they all have flaws? If that is the case, how do bad people get into Heaven?

I'm suggesting humans aren't as good as we think. Humans are masters of self-deception. We all do bad things every day, either in our heart or using our will.

I think that most people that go to Heaven take a trip through purgatory.

 

[HawkFan1298]

Are you suggesting a person can never be "good" because they all have flaws? If that is the case, how do bad people get into Heaven?

Would you ever consider going to Church?

If you find a good pastor, you would probably like asking them questions.

 

[RileyHawk]

Humans choose their actions and God provides the justice.

10 is a bit of a random age. It's not in the Bible. It may be lower.

So God has free will in His judgement and people really don't. Or are you saying God is not all powerful and able to determine who goes to Heaven?

 

[HawkFan1298]

So God has free will in His judgement and people really don't. Or are you saying God is not all powerful and able to determine who goes to Heaven?

I think people have free will. Adults do, at least.

 

[RileyHawk]

I'm suggesting humans aren't as good as we think. Humans are masters of self-deception. We all do bad things every day, either in our heart or using our will.

I think that most people that go to Heaven take a trip through purgatory.

But what about "free will"? And who are you to determine what is "good"?

What you've said is that a person could be "good" even in God's eyes but they won't go to Heaven if they have any doubts or confusion. To me, that does not seem loving or caring, it seems vindictive. Why would God be this selfish?

 

[RileyHawk]

Would you ever consider going to Church?

If you find a good pastor, you would probably like asking them questions.

I want to know your opinion and thinking.

 

[RileyHawk]

I think people have free will. Adults do, at least.

But they don't when choosing whether to go to Heaven or Hell. So, when it comes to the most important decision for all eternity, a person does not have free will. Kind of the old switcheroo there.

 

[HawkFan1298]

But what about "free will"? And who are you to determine what is "good"?

What you've said is that a person could be "good" even in God's eyes but they won't go to Heaven if they have any doubts or confusion. To me, that does not seem loving or caring, it seems vindictive. Why would God be this selfish?

I'm giving my opinion.

I don't think a person that's "good" won't go to Heaven if they have some doubts or confusion. I didn't claim that, I think.

 

[HawkFan1298]

But they don't when choosing whether to go to Heaven or Hell. So, when it comes to the most important decision for all eternity, a person does not have free will. Kind of the old switcheroo there.

They use their free will and if they love God with all their heart, mind, soul and love their neighbors as themselves, they go to Heaven.

God decides if they go to Heaven or not, based on their actions in this life.

 

[RileyHawk]

I'm giving my opinion.

I don't think a person that's "good" won't go to Heaven if they have some doubts or confusion. I didn't claim that, I think.

You did. You actually said no one is "good" because we all have flaws. I'm left wondering what the "non-good" people are doing to get into Heaven other than asking forgiveness from God? Are there no other requirements? No levels of "non-good" that are better than others?

 

[RileyHawk]

They use their free will and if they love God with all their heart, mind, soul and love their neighbors as themselves, they go to Heaven.

God decides if they go to Heaven or not, based on their actions in this life.

So God chooses. It's not free will.

Does God take into consideration other teachings that could confuse a person or especially a child of 10 or more anyway? Someone that is taught a different religion or no religion for that matter - they don't know any better. Do they have any chance to get into Heaven if they've never even heard of Jesus?

 

[HawkFan1298]

So God chooses. It's not free will.

Does God take into consideration other teachings that could confuse a person or especially a child of 10 or more anyway? Someone that is taught a different religion or no religion for that matter - they don't know any better. Do they have any chance to get into Heaven if they've never even heard of Jesus?

Well, humans don't have free will in the sense that they get to choose to go to Heaven if they live a sinful life. They can repent and trust in God's mercy.

There's a theological principle in the Catholic Church called "invincible ignorance" that teaches a person CAN be saved if they don't know about Jesus through no fault of their own.

For example, suppose there's a Chinese grandmother living in a small village in the mountains of western China. (I went to China in 2008, BTW, CSB. I saw a lady like this.)

She's 90 years old. She can't read or write. She's never left the village. She has no clue who or what Jesus is. She's "invincibly ignorant" through no fault of her own.

This Chinese grandmother loves all the kids in the village. She's very compassionate. When she dies, she has the possibility (I'd argue a very good possibility) of being saved even though she's ignorant of Jesus. That's only fair, IMO.

Unfortunately, invincible ignorance probably doesn't apply to modern day America.

Don't Be Ignorant About Invincible Ignorance!

One of the most dangerous things that we can get wrong in Catholic theology is what the Church means by "invincible ignorance."

www.catholic.com

 

[HawkFan1298]

You did. You actually said no one is "good" because we all have flaws. I'm left wondering what the "non-good" people are doing to get into Heaven other than asking forgiveness from God? Are there no other requirements? No levels of "non-good" that are better than others?

One has to love God with all their heart, mind and soul and love their neighbors as themselves as best as they can.

God takes care of the rest.

 

[RileyHawk]

Well, humans don't have free will in the sense that they get to choose to go to Heaven if they live a sinful life. They can repent and trust in God's mercy.

There's a theological principle in the Catholic Church called "invincible ignorance" that teaches a person CAN be saved if they don't know about Jesus through no fault of their own.

For example, suppose there's a Chinese grandmother living in a small village in the mountains of western China. (I went to China in 2008, BTW, CSB. I saw a lady like this.)

She's 90 years old. She can't read or write. She's never left the village. She has no clue who or what Jesus is. She's "invincibly ignorant" through no fault of her own.

This Chinese grandmother loves all the kids in the village. She's very compassionate. When she dies, she has the possibility (I'd argue a very good possibility) of being saved even though she's ignorant of Jesus. That's only fair, IMO.

Unfortunately, invincible ignorance probably doesn't apply to modern day America.

Don't Be Ignorant About Invincible Ignorance!

One of the most dangerous things that we can get wrong in Catholic theology is what the Church means by "invincible ignorance."

www.catholic.com

They don't have a choice no matter the life they lead. That's the point.

And she has "a chance"? Is it a spin of a giant Heaven wheel? What about non-Catholics? Or is uit only Catholics that can get into Heaven?

 

[HawkFan1298]

They don't have a choice no matter the life they lead. That's the point.

And she has "a chance"? Is it a spin of a giant Heaven wheel? What about non-Catholics? Or is uit only Catholics that can get into Heaven?

Their life is their choice, if that makes sense.

God decides. I like the odds of the Chinese grandmother who is invincibly ignorant.

Non-Catholics can definitely get to Heaven.

 

[RileyHawk]

Their life is their choice, if that makes sense.

God decides. I like the odds of the Chinese grandmother who is invincibly ignorant.

Non-Catholics can definitely get to Heaven.

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Their after-life is not their choice, and that is the ultimate goal, right?

Which Heaven do non-Catholics go to? The same as Catholics? Muslims? Buddhists? Is there one Heaven or is it segregated?

Does God judge all "non-good" people the same? One sin or a million, Hell. Terrible sin or minor one, Hell. Or are their grades of sin?

 

[HawkFan1298]

Their after-life is not their choice, and that is the ultimate goal, right?

Which Heaven do non-Catholics go to? The same as Catholics? Muslims? Buddhists? Is there one Heaven or is it segregated?

Does God judge all "non-good" people the same? One sin or a million, Hell. Terrible sin or minor one, Hell. Or are their grades of sin?

They would go to the same Heaven. It's not segregated.

There are venal and mortal sins. Mortal sins are much more serious.

Mortal and Venial Sin?

The most common Bible verse used against the very Ca...

www.catholic.com

 

[RileyHawk]

They would go to the same Heaven. It's not segregated.

There are venal and mortal sins. Mortal sins are much more serious.

Mortal and Venial Sin?

The most common Bible verse used against the very Ca...

www.catholic.com

But both keep you out of Heaven. So not any difference in the big picture.

How can a Muslim go to Christian Heaven? That doesn't make any sense.

 

[tarheelbybirth]

Remind me please: how are you not an atheist?!

An atheist is someone that lacks belief in God.

How are you not that?

There are millions...billions...of people who don't believe in your iteration of god. Are they all atheists?

I'm completely serious.

You're making some serious claims here about free will not existing.

I'm making zero claims about free will other than that it can't exist alongside some pre-determined "plan". See if you can figure out which of those two I believe in.

 

[HawkFan1298]

But both keep you out of Heaven. So not any difference in the big picture.

How can a Muslim go to Christian Heaven? That doesn't make any sense.

I don't think there is a "Christian" Heaven.

It's just Heaven.

 

[Drake__Mallard]

Well, humans don't have free will in the sense that they get to choose to go to Heaven if they live a sinful life. They can repent and trust in God's mercy.

There's a theological principle in the Catholic Church called "invincible ignorance" that teaches a person CAN be saved if they don't know about Jesus through no fault of their own.

For example, suppose there's a Chinese grandmother living in a small village in the mountains of western China. (I went to China in 2008, BTW, CSB. I saw a lady like this.)

She's 90 years old. She can't read or write. She's never left the village. She has no clue who or what Jesus is. She's "invincibly ignorant" through no fault of her own.

This Chinese grandmother loves all the kids in the village. She's very compassionate. When she dies, she has the possibility (I'd argue a very good possibility) of being saved even though she's ignorant of Jesus. That's only fair, IMO.

Unfortunately, invincible ignorance probably doesn't apply to modern day America.

Don't Be Ignorant About Invincible Ignorance!

One of the most dangerous things that we can get wrong in Catholic theology is what the Church means by "invincible ignorance."

www.catholic.com

Seems like an all powerful God would have gave everyone a chance to know about him.

Its not hard to see that the idea is man made and didnt reach everyone.

 

[RileyHawk]

I don't think there is a "Christian" Heaven.

It's just Heaven.

But the only way in is to worship your God and his son Jesus. Those that worship a different God - how do they get into Heaven?

 

[HawkFan1298]

Seems like an all powerful God would have gave everyone a chance to know about him.

Its not hard to see that the idea is man made and didnt reach everyone.

I definitely think everyone that lives an average lifespan gets enough evidence from God to know Him.

 

[HawkFan1298]

But the only way in is to worship your God and his son Jesus. Those that worship a different God - how do they get into Heaven?

Through invincible ignorance. I think God wants everyone to come to Heaven regardless.

 

[Drake__Mallard]

I definitely think everyone that lives an average lifespan gets enough evidence from God to know Him.

What evidence?

 

[HawkFan1298]

What evidence?

Jesus, the creation, personal experience, personal testimonies from others, etc, etc.

 

[RileyHawk]

Through invincible ignorance. I think God wants everyone to come to Heaven regardless.

But that only applies to people who know nothing about God. Muslims (and millions following other religions) know about God but have a different view of Him. According to you, they can't get into Heaven. Why not?

And if God wants everyone to come to Heaven, why does He prevent some from doing so?

Your arguments just don't make sense.

 

[RileyHawk]

Jesus, the creation, personal experience, personal testimonies from others, etc, etc.

Who gets this evidence? There are 7+ billion people in the world - where are all of them getting the "evidence".

 

[Drake__Mallard]

Jesus, the creation, personal experience, personal testimonies from others, etc, etc.

Other peoples faith is not evidence. There is no proof of Jesus being any more than a man and a biblical creation also has no evidence. Try again. What evidence is there?

 

[HawkFan1298]

But that only applies to people who know nothing about God. Muslims (and millions following other religions) know about God but have a different view of Him. According to you, they can't get into Heaven. Why not?

And if God wants everyone to come to Heaven, why does He prevent some from doing so?

Your arguments just don't make sense.

Muslims can definitely get to Heaven. Where did I say they could not?

"Allah" just means "God" in Arabic. I believe God hears their prayers 100%.

God doesn't prevent people from going to Heaven but many, if not most people, reject God through their actions.

Make sense?

 

[globalhawk]

I don't think there is a "Christian" Heaven.

It's just Heaven.

You have made up your own version of Christianity and don't understand why others don't agree with it.