The fact is...

[lionlover]

that Sanderson & Ryan are located in two of the best wrestling states (In terms of producing All Americans in College) in the country. Moreover, they are close to other top tier recruiting locations. It's mostly about location.

Cael had that ISU team as high as 3rd in the nation. But, call him a traitor or whatever you want to call him, but the fact is that the man knew that he could win if he went to Penn State...and he did. So, how can you refute the location aspect?

Prior to Cael coming to PSU, all of the team national championships (except a few) were won west of the Mississippi. So, the kids that PSU and OSU were losing to the west are now staying home (There are exceptions). Why should a kid travel hundreds of miles to Iowa and OSU, when they can stay and wrestle at an equally high level within reasonable driving distance of their family/supporters?

I think that TnT and John Smith are just as good a coach as Sanderson & Ryan are. But, you now start off at a disadvantage logistically when you try to recruit a kid out of Ohio or PA.

You guys have had the luxury of having the greatest wrestling coach in the history of college wrestling. Dan Gable's name drew the best to Iowa. But, Gable didn't have the competition that TnT now has. I am not saying that Gable would not be winning championships. I am just saying it's a different time. I think TnT are terrific coaches. I don't think any other coaches could do a better job than what they are doing imo.

 

[Omahahawk86]

That's fair. If the state of Iowa could put out a few top 20 p4p guys every year then we'd be in business.

 

[Mendoza77]

OP brings up Gable and recruiting. My question is: does/can Gable help with recruiting for the Hawks? Is that within NCAA rules? I'm not talking official visits to their homes on behalf of UI, but just a few phone calls, etc.

 

[TarpHawk]

OP brings up Gable and recruiting. My question is: does/can Gable help with recruiting for the Hawks? Is that within NCAA rules?

If Gable showed up at my house to say he wanted me to come to Iowa to wrestle, I'd come to Iowa to wrestle.

 

[LaxHawk174]

If Gable showed up at my house to say he wanted me to come to Iowa to wrestle, I'd come to Iowa to wrestle.

Can we send Dan Gable to Spencer Lees doorstep at midnight? We may yet have a chance..

 

[TarpHawk]

I know the Gable thing was said in jest, but...hmm...ponder, ponder...

 

[Omahahawk86]

I say we go Blue chips style. Anyone know any millionaire Iowa wrestling fans? I guarantee we can get someone a brand new John Deere for their dads farm.

 

[LaxHawk174]

I say we go Blue chips style. Anyone know any millionaire Iowa wrestling fans? I guarantee we can get someone a brand new John Deere for their dads farm.

I've seen Ashton Kutcher and Mila Kunis attend an Iowa Wrestling meet decked out in Hawkeye gear. Time to start sending tweets and writing letters, folks.

 

[LaxHawk174]

I know the Gable thing was said in jest, but...hmm...ponder, ponder...

Just to add a little more fuel to this awesome idea, in one of the emotional dumpster threads I recall seeing someone say that on the 5 man panel that Gable was on for the final day of NCAA's, somebody mentioned something to Gable about him going back to help out/coach or whatever it was, and Gable responded something like "I just might have to..". (Although not sure how accurate my transcription of said conversation is, a la the old game "Telephone".)

 

[rossel 33]

that Sanderson & Ryan are located in two of the best wrestling states (In terms of producing All Americans in College) in the country. Moreover, they are close to other top tier recruiting locations. It's mostly about location.

Cael had that ISU team as high as 3rd in the nation. But, call him a traitor or whatever you want to call him, but the fact is that the man knew that he could win if he went to Penn State...and he did. So, how can you refute the location aspect?

Prior to Cael coming to PSU, all of the team national championships (except a few) were won west of the Mississippi. So, the kids that PSU and OSU were losing to the west are now staying home (There are exceptions). Why should a kid travel hundreds of miles to Iowa and OSU, when they can stay and wrestle at an equally high level within reasonable driving distance of their family/supporters?

I think that TnT and John Smith are just as good a coach as Sanderson & Ryan are. But, you now start off at a disadvantage logistically when you try to recruit a kid out of Ohio or PA.

You guys have had the luxury of having the greatest wrestling coach in the history of college wrestling. Dan Gable's name drew the best to Iowa. But, Gable didn't have the competition that TnT now has. I am not saying that Gable would not be winning championships. I am just saying it's a different time. I think TnT are terrific coaches. I don't think any other coaches could do a better job than what they are doing imo.

-----

You make a good point lionlover, and very true. Having PA or OH as your neighborhood is a great starting position.

CA, given the lack of a prominent program, seems ripe for recruiting some real firepower. Varner, Delgado, Welch, McIntosh, Imar, Davis (d2), Pico - just to name a few from recent years. Iowa recently attracted Mejia and Turk, so maybe more can follow.

 

[HawkeyePA]

PSU has some awesome state talent...and Cael got a Texas boy and A California guy and some guys that fill in from NY and Utah and NC....the best WANT to come to wrestle and train with the best....Iowa needs to get back to the mentality that STEEL SHARPENS STEEL......bring in the Iowa STYLE kids...ATTACK>>>>ATTACK>>> and ATTACK AGAIN because you need to set the tone...not wait and counter....regardless of what other programs are doing we need to do it the way that is proven...OFFENSE WINS CHAMPIONSHIPS

 

[Hicksy87]

Just to add a little more fuel to this awesome idea, in one of the emotional dumpster threads I recall seeing someone say that on the 5 man panel that Gable was on for the final day of NCAA's, somebody mentioned something to Gable about him going back to help out/coach or whatever it was, and Gable responded something like "I just might have to..". (Although not sure how accurate my transcription of said conversation is, a la the old game "Telephone".)

Laxhawk, I read something about that also. Although, I heard someone mention that Gable was noticeably upset with the finals and final day performance of the Hawkeye wrestlers that he had to leave the panel room for a short period. I mentioned it in another post, I believe Gable is as involved as he can be with the Hawkeye program and that Brands confides in him regularly for advice.

 

[pumpdog20]

We really need a moderator to clean up and consolidate some of these threads. The same stuff getting regurgitated over and over.

We get it, recruiting is the issue.

 

[McK_Hawk]

I have heard that steel sharpens steel. I also know that unused steel tends to rust. I just don't get why a top ranked high school kid would want to go to a OSU or PSU to sit behind another top ranked kid (either delaying his start or not wrestling all 4 years) when he could go pretty much anywhere else and wrestle all 4 years on his terms. Just doesn't make much sense to me. I guess like they say in real estate....location is everything.

 

[jvclark]

If Gable showed up at my house to say he wanted me to come to Iowa to wrestle, I'd come to Iowa to wrestle.

Tarp:

I agree with you. But I am 48 years old. For a 17 year old high school kid is there a bigger name in wrestling than Cael? You could still argue Gable. And maybe more so 7 years ago before Cael went to Happy Valley. But now that he has five coaching titles to go along with his gold medal and 4-time undefeated seasons? Hard to beat that name recognition.

Remember when all of the accusations were out there went Cael went east? About the half million salary Etc? I remember reading back then that five(or was it six) of the ten national titles went to kids who grew up within a 5 hour driving radius of happy valley. Fact is, he barely has to get on a plane to do his recruiting. That is a huge built in advantage

By the way, lion lover. Good post

 

[lionlover]

If Gable showed up at my house to say he wanted me to come to Iowa to wrestle, I'd come to Iowa to wrestle.

Me too!!!

 

[lionlover]

Can we send Dan Gable to Spencer Lees doorstep at midnight? We may yet have a chance..

Frankly, I think Nico's win hurt your chances. I am not saying its over for you guys. But look at it this way:

Regardless of how much you hate Megaludis's style of wrestling, his career came to a "story book ending" when he won the national championship against a superior ranked Hawk.

Before this happened, TnT could point to their ability to produce champions at the 125 weight classification,while Cael has been able to develop on the higher weight classifications. Now, TnT can't use that argument. TnT has produced more champions at the weight, but it's not like Cael can't point to at least one. Last impression...is generally the lasting impression.

Plus, not only is Megaludis good friends with Lee, but they both wrestled in the same club. Now, you have Kemmerer (Sp?) with that same relationship, so that will help offset the Megaludis/Lee relationship.

But there is so much momentum now going with Megaludis story book ending that it just doesn't help you with Lee imo. Again, I am not saying you are going to lose Lee. But, it just got tougher for TnT.

 

[Pennstate1985]

I have heard that steel sharpens steel. I also know that unused steel tends to rust. I just don't get why a top ranked high school kid would want to go to a OSU or PSU to sit behind another top ranked kid (either delaying his start or not wrestling all 4 years) when he could go pretty much anywhere else and wrestle all 4 years on his terms. Just doesn't make much sense to me. I guess like they say in real estate....location is everything.

the devils advocate argument is that the wrestler should never dictate terms to the coach of an elite school. You lay out your development plan for the wrestler and try to get him to buy into it. If he doesn't, then move on.

 

[Sandor45]

Unpopular post alert.
We don't need Spencer Lee. Iowa lighweights will always be good. We have trouble with middle weights. That's what we need to focus on. Getting the super talents from 49 upwards.
If we don't get Lee, I'd take Teasdale in a heartbeat.

 

[LaxHawk174]

Unpopular post alert.
We don't need Spencer Lee. Iowa lighweights will always be good. We have trouble with middle weights. That's what we need to focus on. Getting the super talents from 49 upwards.
If we don't get Lee, I'd take Teasdale in a heartbeat.

Sure we don't 'need' Spencer Lee. But if he goes to PSU, I don't see us being able to compete with them for quite a while. Lee and Hall will be greats who will be worth about 50 pts together at every NCAA tournament.

 

[Sandor45]

Sure we don't 'need' Spencer Lee. But if he goes to PSU, I don't see us being able to compete with them for quite a while. Lee and Hall will be greats who will be worth about 50 pts together at every NCAA tournament.

Agreed. Should have made that point clear. We don't need Lee, but we definitely can't have him go to psu. I was fine with Iowa not being on Halls list cause psu wasn't on it initially either. The less whales psu gets, the more even the playing field is.
Right now, they've got a stacked deck and counting...

 

[255]

Using Gable is not a bad idea but in PA and the East, Cael is the big name.
Gable used his name to get the top guys in his day. That coupled with the fact he was changing how to train and wrestle. those two factors made those team great for 20 years.
Cael has the name to get the top guys to stay close to home. Difference is, he is not changing things the way Gable did. The way Gable changed training and competing was a huge part of his success. No one was doing it and it gave him a huge edge.
A lot of people are now year round, hard working and strong. That edge is not exclusive to one or two schools any more.
To get the top kids out of NJ, PA Ohio and a couple others is a huge challenge for an Iowa team right now. Iowa and Brands have a name but it is not as fresh in the minds of kids as Cael is. That is going to be a challenge to overcome for a while. There is no one out there who can do it right now. Cael has positioned himself perfectly in location and message. While it is fun to bash the Iowa coaches, we need to recognize that it is not just them. Cael is the flavor of choice right now and has his pick of PA. That alone is going to keep them tough. Brands can lock up Iowa and a couple states around but that will not be enough to reach the "Gable-esqu" level we apparently believe is possible.
The talent base is much more spread out than ever. So how do we "steal" these top recruits out? changing coaches is not the answer. Brands is doing a great job.

 

[championhawk]

Unpopular post alert.
We don't need Spencer Lee. Iowa lighweights will always be good. We have trouble with middle weights. That's what we need to focus on. Getting the super talents from 49 upwards.
If we don't get Lee, I'd take Teasdale in a heartbeat.

Having a stud like Meja would certainly lessen the pain of losing Lee. I will step out on a limb and say a 1-2 punch of Meja and Lee would out trophy any 125/133 tandem under Brands.

 

[MVPFAN]

Frankly, I think Nico's win hurt your chances. I am not saying its over for you guys. But look at it this way:

Regardless of how much you hate Megaludis's style of wrestling, his career came to a "story book ending" when he won the national championship against a superior ranked Hawk.

Before this happened, TnT could point to their ability to produce champions at the 125 weight classification,while Cael has been able to develop on the higher weight classifications. Now, TnT can't use that argument. TnT has produced more champions at the weight, but it's not like Cael can't point to at least one. Last impression...is generally the lasting impression.

Plus, not only is Megaludis good friends with Lee, but they both wrestled in the same club. Now, you have Kemmerer (Sp?) with that same relationship, so that will help offset the Megaludis/Lee relationship.

But there is so much momentum now going with Megaludis story book ending that it just doesn't help you with Lee imo. Again, I am not saying you are going to lose Lee. But, it just got tougher for TnT.

Megaludis was ranked and seeded higher plus came in as a two time runner up one time 3rd place vs Gilman with a 1 time 4th place. Not to mention he took a late red shirt just to fine tune. You are completely full of shit claiming some kind of storybook underdog win. Lee will pick who he picks. LOL at you friggin clowns.

 

[ih8iast8]

Frankly, I think Nico's win hurt your chances. I am not saying its over for you guys. But look at it this way:

Regardless of how much you hate Megaludis's style of wrestling, his career came to a "story book ending" when he won the national championship against a superior ranked Hawk.

Before this happened, TnT could point to their ability to produce champions at the 125 weight classification,while Cael has been able to develop on the higher weight classifications. Now, TnT can't use that argument. TnT has produced more champions at the weight, but it's not like Cael can't point to at least one. Last impression...is generally the lasting impression.

Plus, not only is Megaludis good friends with Lee, but they both wrestled in the same club. Now, you have Kemmerer (Sp?) with that same relationship, so that will help offset the Megaludis/Lee relationship.

But there is so much momentum now going with Megaludis story book ending that it just doesn't help you with Lee imo. Again, I am not saying you are going to lose Lee. But, it just got tougher for TnT.

Cinderella never took a year off to dodge an opponent she couldn't beat. If that's the fairytale Lee wants to follow, dodging bullets, you can have him.

 

[minnhawkeye]

In my opinion we really do need Lee. If he comes could turn him loose as freshman and redshirt Rentina and Meja and build them up to be 133 and 141. When Gillman and Clark graduate we will be hurting for a year and no need to be hurting and waste a year with Kem,Soensen and Young. Then if Lee needs a redshirt can take one later like Mega did. Just my 2cents.

 

[jvclark]

In my opinion we really do need Lee. If he comes could turn him loose as freshman and redshirt Rentina and Meja and build them up to be 133 and 141. When Gillman and Clark graduate we will be hurting for a year and no need to be hurting and waste a year with Kem,Soensen and Young. Then if Lee needs a redshirt can take one later like Mega did. Just my 2cents.

You are right. We need Lee... But really, every team needs a talent like Lee. He is, based on his credentials and attitude, a once in every ten years kind of talent. I have only seen him on video, but that is what he appears to be.