This Is Why People Are Pissed Off At Capitalism

[What Would Jesus Do?]

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/21/b...ncrease-in-a-drugs-price-raises-protests.html

Specialists in infectious disease are protesting a gigantic overnight increase in the price of a 62-year-old drug that is the standard of care for treating a life-threatening parasitic infection.

The drug, called Daraprim, was acquired in August by Turing Pharmaceuticals, a start-up run by a former hedge fund manager. Turing immediately raised the price to $750 a tablet from $13.50, bringing the annual cost of treatment for some patients to hundreds of thousands of dollars.

“What is it that they are doing differently that has led to this dramatic increase?” said Dr. Judith Aberg, the chief of the division of infectious diseases at the Icahn School of Medicine at Mount Sinai. She said the price increase could force hospitals to use “alternative therapies that may not have the same efficacy.”

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Our laws - but not our constitution - allow this sort of bad behavior.

The constitution places limits on how long this sort of "property" can be owned, and by whom. There's no way that the founders were thinking of hedge funds owning the rights for 62+ years when they wrote:

The Congress shall have Power ... To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries;

62 years hardly qualifies as "limited times." That was more than an average lifetime back then. And a hedge fund never invented or discovered these drugs. Some scientist or scientists did.

 

[HawkMD]

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/21/b...ncrease-in-a-drugs-price-raises-protests.html

Specialists in infectious disease are protesting a gigantic overnight increase in the price of a 62-year-old drug that is the standard of care for treating a life-threatening parasitic infection.

The drug, called Daraprim, was acquired in August by Turing Pharmaceuticals, a start-up run by a former hedge fund manager. Turing immediately raised the price to $750 a tablet from $13.50, bringing the annual cost of treatment for some patients to hundreds of thousands of dollars.

“What is it that they are doing differently that has led to this dramatic increase?” said Dr. Judith Aberg, the chief of the division of infectious diseases at the Icahn School of Medicine at Mount Sinai. She said the price increase could force hospitals to use “alternative therapies that may not have the same efficacy.”

This is going for many generic and branded drugs. Recently I prescribed a medicine that cost $200(back in the '90s it cost $5). The patient called back, saying she could not afford the medicine. It was going to cost her $2500. This cost change literally happened overnight. And without any change in the drug. We have been told this is happening because of consolidation of drug companies, both generic and branded. If so, we have antitrust laws that should be preventing this. Shouldn't our administration be enforcing these laws?

 

[22*43*51]

 

[Wahawk56]

This is going for many generic and branded drugs. Recently I prescribed a medicine that cost $200(back in the '90s it cost $5). The patient called back, saying she could not afford the medicine. It was going to cost her $2500. This cost change literally happened overnight. And without any change in the drug. We have been told this is happening because of consolidation of drug companies, both generic and branded. If so, we have antitrust laws that should be preventing this. Shouldn't our administration be enforcing these laws?

Liked just for the avatar.

 

[LifelongHawk]

Capitalism is fundamentally incompatible with health care, this is a great illustration.

Pharma corp executive's jobs are to maximize value, both profit and share price, and raising revenue has obvious benefit on both benchmarks. Price pointing to maximize return is the fundamental structural duty of the corporation and its executives, plenty of models and research to help. The market decides the pill costs 750.

The old price of 13.50 was an underutilized potential value, probably came about from return on investment pricing or socialist regulations on cost/price ratio. The hedge fund is simply winning at capitalism, creating value. Capitalism baby! Give those hedge funds more tax breaks!

The odd poor baby dying of an infectious parasite is unfortunate collateral damage.

 

[pablow]

We the people aren't helpless here. We took care of the dentist that murdered Cecil the lion. Why doesn't somebody publish this hedge funder's photo and address? Let the jerk feel the heat.

 

[Vroom_C14]

During the presidential campaign, Barack Obama promised to "allow Americans to buy their medicines from other developed countries if the drugs are safe and prices are lower outside the U.S." But such a provision was not included in the final health care law that passed both chambers of Congress and was signed by the president.

The motivation for the promise came from an existing trend of Americans crossing the Canadian border to buy cheaper prescription drugs. Yet for the most part, it remains illegal for Americans to buy prescription drugs there -- for safety reasons, the Food and Drug Administration says.

But in the wake of negotiations with the prescription drug industry -- one of the first big health industry players to support the White House's health care reform effort -- Obama's drug importation promise faded into the background. Now, with passage, it's officially off the table.

 

[Titanhawk2]

Our laws - but not our constitution - allow this sort of bad behavior.

The constitution places limits on how long this sort of "property" can be owned, and by whom. There's no way that the founders were thinking of hedge funds owning the rights for 62+ years when they wrote:

The Congress shall have Power ... To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries;

62 years hardly qualifies as "limited times." That was more than an average lifetime back then. And a hedge fund never invented or discovered these drugs. Some scientist or scientists did.

But after 62 years, our system allows anybody to make it. What if it costs more than $13.50 to make?

 

[aflachawk]

During the presidential campaign, Barack Obama promised to "allow Americans to buy their medicines from other developed countries if the drugs are safe and prices are lower outside the U.S." But such a provision was not included in the final health care law that passed both chambers of Congress and was signed by the president.

The motivation for the promise came from an existing trend of Americans crossing the Canadian border to buy cheaper prescription drugs. Yet for the most part, it remains illegal for Americans to buy prescription drugs there -- for safety reasons, the Food and Drug Administration says.

But in the wake of negotiations with the prescription drug industry -- one of the first big health industry players to support the White House's health care reform effort -- Obama's drug importation promise faded into the background. Now, with passage, it's officially off the table.

When you look at this one small thing and compare it to all the benefits Capitalism brings to a society compared to the the other systems, it's pretty small potatoes.

 

[DrVenkman]

True that is a horrid example. Is this a med that is covered under most plans? im sure i could look it up. This is great example of why HMOs have no chance over the long term. Insuring this kind of idiocy is impossible.

Also quite ironic that the doctor cited is at the Ichan School of Medicine. Icahn being one of the purest capitalists in the world of hedge fund managers.

 

[pablow]

During the presidential campaign, Barack Obama promised to "allow Americans to buy their medicines from other developed countries if the drugs are safe and prices are lower outside the U.S." But such a provision was not included in the final health care law that passed both chambers of Congress and was signed by the president.

The motivation for the promise came from an existing trend of Americans crossing the Canadian border to buy cheaper prescription drugs. Yet for the most part, it remains illegal for Americans to buy prescription drugs there -- for safety reasons, the Food and Drug Administration says.

But in the wake of negotiations with the prescription drug industry -- one of the first big health industry players to support the White House's health care reform effort -- Obama's drug importation promise faded into the background. Now, with passage, it's officially off the table.

Yes, we hear nothing but empty promises from our ruling elite. Obama is just another big talker. There's nothing exceptional about him.

 

[LuteHawk]

Health care in our hospitals and medical drugs from our
pharmacies have a monopoly. The inflation of prices in
these fields has crippled the American economy for the
past 35 years. There is no deterrent to keep prices
competitive for the consumer. As a result health insurance
keeps going up with no sensible relief in sight.

 

[86Hawkeye]

True that is a horrid example. Is this a med that is covered under most plans? im sure i could look it up. This is great example of why HMOs have no chance over the long term. Insuring this kind of idiocy is impossible.

Also quite ironic that the doctor cited is at the Ichan School of Medicine. Icahn being one of the purest capitalists in the world of hedge fund managers.

Well, we all know that these evil capitalists are not good for society.

 

[86Hawkeye]

Health care in our hospitals and medical drugs from our
pharmacies have a monopoly. The inflation of prices in
these fields has crippled the American economy for the
past 35 years. There is no deterrent to keep prices
competitive for the consumer. As a result health insurance
keeps going up with no sensible relief in sight.

You could afford your drugs without the government, if it wasn't for the government.

 

[theiacowtipper]

But after 62 years, our system allows anybody to make it. What if it costs more than $13.50 to make?

The article I read is that the company is controlling distribution, prohibiting anyone from engineering the drug.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

You could afford your drugs without the government, if it wasn't for the government.

What an absurd idea. Sure the government can mess things up as well as improve them but, on balance, your claim seems way off the mark.

Yeah, a lot of things government does drive up prices. Safety laws, for example. Truth in advertising laws, for another. But, personally, I'd rather pay a bit more to get safe drugs that are what they say they are.

Let the free market handle it and that simply won't be reliably true. And even to the extent that the market may drive out the bad actors, how many deaths and poorly treated illness will that take?

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Well, we all know that these evil capitalists are not good for society.

It "sounds" a quite silly when you try to make a truth like that come across as trenchant sarcasm.

 

[SoonerBeAHawk]

Liked just for the avatar.

omg, that's the funniest avatar I've ever seen.

The Randy Moss one airing now is pretty funny.

 

[86Hawkeye]

What an absurd idea. Sure the government can mess things up as well as improve them but, on balance, your claim seems way off the mark.

Yeah, a lot of things government does drive up prices. Safety laws, for example. Truth in advertising laws, for another. But, personally, I'd rather pay a bit more to get safe drugs that are what they say they are.

Let the free market handle it and that simply won't be reliably true. And even to the extent that the market may drive out the bad actors, how many deaths and poorly treated illness will that take?

If you subsidize something, you will get more of it.

 

[Hoosierhawkeye]

This is why conservatives can't win on a regular basis. Because

What an absurd idea. Sure the government can mess things up as well as improve them but, on balance, your claim seems way off the mark.

Yeah, a lot of things government does drive up prices. Safety laws, for example. Truth in advertising laws, for another. But, personally, I'd rather pay a bit more to get safe drugs that are what they say they are.

Let the free market handle it and that simply won't be reliably true. And even to the extent that the market may drive out the bad actors, how many deaths and poorly treated illness will that take?

Based on the GM ignition issue. . . a ton.

The mob would say dead people tell no tales. . .

And then companies usually have enough money and media influence to convince people to write off those who might have to a chance to try and tell the truth.

The era of unregulated capitalism was pretty crappy for everyone except the Barons.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

If you subsidize something, you will get more of it.

That isn't even slightly responsive.

Is that what came up on your Conservative Magic 8 Ball?

Or perhaps you are reading the Ferengi Rules of Acquisition. I'm sure that's one of them.

 

[dandh]

Later in the linked story:

Daraprim, known generically as pyrimethamine, is used mainly to treat toxoplasmosis, a parasite infection that can cause serious or even life-threatening problems for babies born to women who become infected during pregnancy, and also for people with compromised immune systems, like AIDS patients and certain cancer patients.


Martin Shkreli, the founder and chief executive of Turing, said that the drug is so rarely used that the impact on the health system would be minuscule and that Turing would use the money it earns to develop better treatments for toxoplasmosis, with fewer side effects.

“This isn’t the greedy drug company trying to gouge patients, it is us trying to stay in business,” Mr. Shkreli said. He said that many patients use the drug for far less than a year and that the price was now more in line with those of other drugs for rare diseases.

“This is still one of the smallest pharmaceutical products in the world,” he said. “It really doesn’t make sense to get any criticism for this.”

 

[shank hawk]

It's not capitalism that is causing this problem, it's crony capitalism. Otherwise known as democracy in this country, and a close relative of socialism, fascism and communism.

http://therefusers.com/refusers-newsroom/how-big-pharma-controls-the-fda/#.VgC5Jpdmpgo

WWJD is nothing if not consistent. Constantly calling for the entity that is causing (or allowing) most of our societal problems to become bigger and more powerful. Our system of government is nothing but legalized, if not outright worshiped - prostitution. C'mon man: the whorehouse is full of............you guessed it - whores!!! It's what they do: perform favors for money.

Stop thinking everything would be better if we just had whores with better morals and values turning tricks. It doesn't work that way.

Follow the money.

 

[St. Louis Hawk]

The article I read is that the company is controlling distribution, prohibiting anyone from engineering the drug.

I don't know how that's possible (not saying you're wrong - article could be screwed up) I assume it was patented at one time. One can just pull the patent from the patent office and learn how to make it; they don't need a sample to reverse engineer.

 

[Herkmeister]

This is so stupid I can't believe it.

What people either fail to understand or are unwilling to understand is the intent of our founding fathers. The purpose of our government was to;

• Protect us (Military)
• Infrastructure (Roads)
• Greed Control (Stop Monopolies and atrocities like that mentioned above.)
• Be certain that all men are given the same opportunity regardless of age, color, or religion. We need to reward hard work and creativity. All this welfare was handled by churches and charities. Entitlements were not in their vision.

It is corrupt politicians on both sides that have destroyed this. Each party has been in control with little impact. In my opinion it is divisive politicians and people who take sides without the ability to truly analyze that have destroyed our country.

Capitalism has given the citizens of this country the highest quality of life the world has ever seen. Just think, if you live in a town with a HyVee and a Walmart, you can purchase almost anything 24 hours a day. If you want shrimp at 4:00 a.m., no problem. If you want batteries at 2:30 a.m., no problem. And the ONLY reason you have this is due to the financial rewards gained through capitalism.

You want to send a package over night? Who you gonna call? UPS or FedEx. The PO sure as hell isn't going to get it there on a timely basis. The government CANNOT DO ONE EFFING THING RIGHT. Why? No consequences. Only a dumb ass with an inability to analyze would ever think capitalism sucks. Does it need to be controlled? HELL YES HELL YES HELL YES. But it is the best system the world has ever known.

 

[HallofFame]

 

[JRHawk2003]

Will Rubio, et al be defending this guy shortly?

http://bigstory.ap.org/article/8230...test-families-want-stiff-sentence-peanut-exec

 

[theiacowtipper]

Later in the linked story:

Daraprim, known generically as pyrimethamine, is used mainly to treat toxoplasmosis, a parasite infection that can cause serious or even life-threatening problems for babies born to women who become infected during pregnancy, and also for people with compromised immune systems, like AIDS patients and certain cancer patients.


Martin Shkreli, the founder and chief executive of Turing, said that the drug is so rarely used that the impact on the health system would be minuscule and that Turing would use the money it earns to develop better treatments for toxoplasmosis, with fewer side effects.

“This isn’t the greedy drug company trying to gouge patients, it is us trying to stay in business,” Mr. Shkreli said. He said that many patients use the drug for far less than a year and that the price was now more in line with those of other drugs for rare diseases.

“This is still one of the smallest pharmaceutical products in the world,” he said. “It really doesn’t make sense to get any criticism for this.”

This is corporate America at its absolute worst. This drug was sold for years at a significantly lower price, but we saw the potential to make astronomically higher profits, in line with what other companies are getting away with, so we decided that these patients weren't being gouged deeply enough.
He goes on to say, "Trust us, pay our incredibly inflated prices because, really, none of that money is going to pay for my third yacht or my second vacation home. We have nothing but altruistic intentions. All of that money is going to save little babies in the Congo. Really it is."

 

[dandh]

This is corporate America at its absolute worst. This drug was sold for years at a significantly lower price, but we saw the potential to make astronomically higher profits, in line with what other companies are getting away with, so we decided that these patients weren't being gouged deeply enough.
He goes on to say, "Trust us, pay our incredibly inflated prices because, really, none of that money is going to pay for my third yacht or my second vacation home. We have nothing but altruistic intentions. All of that money is going to save little babies in the Congo. Really it is."

I don't know whether what he said is true or what you said is true. The truth is probably something in between. Both are just assertions, backed up without any substantial amount of evidence. I do know that his response wasn't included in the first post, and thought it was relevant to the discussion.

I also strongly suspect that this was done in concert with Hillary's current push against biotech firms. It would not surprise me at all if this story has political positioning as its primary motivation.

 

[Vroom_C14]

This is why conservatives can't win on a regular basis. Because
FIFY:

Based on the GM (Government Motors) ignition issue. . . a ton.

The Clinton' would say dead people tell no tales. . .

And then Lefties usually have enough money and media influence to convince people to write off those who might have to a chance to try and tell the truth.

The era of Bill C and Barack O. was pretty crappy for everyone except the Barons.