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Times Editorial: G.O.P.: Save Your Candidates From Themselves

cigaretteman

HB King
May 29, 2001
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Reeling after Mitt Romney’s loss to Barack Obama in 2012, the Republican Party gathered for a soul-searching exercise called the Growth and Opportunity Project.

Project leaders surveyed thousands of Republican voters, technical experts and elected officials. They talked with hundreds of disaffected Republicans and 2,000 Republican Hispanic voters to learn what went wrong.

In a 97-page report, they concluded: “The Republican Party needs to stop talking to itself. We have become expert in how to provide ideological reinforcement to like-minded people, but devastatingly we have lost the ability to be persuasive with, or welcoming to, those who do not agree with us on every issue.” Here’s what the study said about presidential debates: “No debate will be meaningful if it is not challenging, vigorous and fair.”

Late Sunday, representatives of a dozen Republican presidential candidates, who were frothing over their treatment in last week’s debate, shut the Republican National Committee out of a meeting during which they essentially chucked its earlier guidance out the window. To please Donald Trump, who pledges to build a 1,000-mile wall between the United States and Mexico and boycott any debate sponsored by the Spanish-language TV network Telemundo, these Republicans want to scrap the only debate to be hosted by Latino media.

They agreed on kid-glove treatment for Fox News, the G.O.P.’s go-to outlet for “ideological reinforcement to like-minded people.” For other outlets interested in hosting a debate, they’re finalizing a list of demands. If these candidates get their way, they’ll ban media behaviors, including: asking the candidates to raise their hands to answer a question (Donald Trump again); asking yes/no questions “without time to provide a substantive answer”; showing audience or moderator reaction to candidates’ answers; and showing “an empty podium after a break (describe how far away the bathrooms are).”

Doesn’t this list leave too much to chance? What about hiding dangerous extension cords beneath the carpeting? And shouldn’t those vying to lead the free world be protected from word association games or geography bee questions?

Granted, the debate last week included some loopy questions. But nearly every time a candidate complained about the media, it was after he or she was asked to explain a policy proposal or past action that’s of legitimate concern to voters. The debaters seemed to find it unfair to ask that they explain how they might simultaneously slash taxes and the federal deficit; deport 10 million people overnight; or cut the tax code from 70,000 pages to three. Alas, too many in a field of 14 contenders seem to have concluded that advancing wild ideas and attacking those who would question them are good ways to get attention.

In 2013, the Republican National Committee recognized that the party’s chances were endangered by such demagogy. The party “is increasingly marginalizing itself, and unless changes are made, it will be increasingly difficult for Republicans to win another presidential election in the near future,” the party’s report concluded. “When someone rolls their eyes at us, they are not likely to open their ears to us.”

Now it’s the R.N.C. that has been marginalized. If malcontent candidates get their way, the party leadership will be all but shut out of the planning for debates, a chief means for Americans to hear and weigh the ideas of the candidates. The debates are too important to be guided by a daffy document drafted by hotheads, demanding media outlets pledge” that the temperature in the debate hall “be kept below 67 degrees.”

The ridiculous manifesto drafted Sunday is undergoing revision. The R.N.C. would do well to exert whatever influence it has. It is the party’s job, not the media’s, to save the Republican presidential candidates from themselves.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/03/opinion/gop-save-your-candidates-from-themselves.html?ref=opinion
 
All of the online prediction markets have the Republicans losing the WH by at least 20 points. Granted, we still have a year to go, but unless something starts changing for them and changing fast, the GOP will once again have to ask permission to enter the Oval Office. Stuff like this doesn't help.
 
Reeling after Mitt Romney’s loss to Barack Obama in 2012, the Republican Party gathered for a soul-searching exercise called the Growth and Opportunity Project.

Project leaders surveyed thousands of Republican voters, technical experts and elected officials. They talked with hundreds of disaffected Republicans and 2,000 Republican Hispanic voters to learn what went wrong.

In a 97-page report, they concluded: “The Republican Party needs to stop talking to itself. We have become expert in how to provide ideological reinforcement to like-minded people, but devastatingly we have lost the ability to be persuasive with, or welcoming to, those who do not agree with us on every issue.” Here’s what the study said about presidential debates: “No debate will be meaningful if it is not challenging, vigorous and fair.”

Late Sunday, representatives of a dozen Republican presidential candidates, who were frothing over their treatment in last week’s debate, shut the Republican National Committee out of a meeting during which they essentially chucked its earlier guidance out the window. To please Donald Trump, who pledges to build a 1,000-mile wall between the United States and Mexico and boycott any debate sponsored by the Spanish-language TV network Telemundo, these Republicans want to scrap the only debate to be hosted by Latino media.

They agreed on kid-glove treatment for Fox News, the G.O.P.’s go-to outlet for “ideological reinforcement to like-minded people.” For other outlets interested in hosting a debate, they’re finalizing a list of demands. If these candidates get their way, they’ll ban media behaviors, including: asking the candidates to raise their hands to answer a question (Donald Trump again); asking yes/no questions “without time to provide a substantive answer”; showing audience or moderator reaction to candidates’ answers; and showing “an empty podium after a break (describe how far away the bathrooms are).”

Doesn’t this list leave too much to chance? What about hiding dangerous extension cords beneath the carpeting? And shouldn’t those vying to lead the free world be protected from word association games or geography bee questions?

Granted, the debate last week included some loopy questions. But nearly every time a candidate complained about the media, it was after he or she was asked to explain a policy proposal or past action that’s of legitimate concern to voters. The debaters seemed to find it unfair to ask that they explain how they might simultaneously slash taxes and the federal deficit; deport 10 million people overnight; or cut the tax code from 70,000 pages to three. Alas, too many in a field of 14 contenders seem to have concluded that advancing wild ideas and attacking those who would question them are good ways to get attention.

In 2013, the Republican National Committee recognized that the party’s chances were endangered by such demagogy. The party “is increasingly marginalizing itself, and unless changes are made, it will be increasingly difficult for Republicans to win another presidential election in the near future,” the party’s report concluded. “When someone rolls their eyes at us, they are not likely to open their ears to us.”

Now it’s the R.N.C. that has been marginalized. If malcontent candidates get their way, the party leadership will be all but shut out of the planning for debates, a chief means for Americans to hear and weigh the ideas of the candidates. The debates are too important to be guided by a daffy document drafted by hotheads, demanding media outlets pledge” that the temperature in the debate hall “be kept below 67 degrees.”

The ridiculous manifesto drafted Sunday is undergoing revision. The R.N.C. would do well to exert whatever influence it has. It is the party’s job, not the media’s, to save the Republican presidential candidates from themselves.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/03/opinion/gop-save-your-candidates-from-themselves.html?ref=opinion

Please summarize.
 
Don't believe the NYT want the Republicans to save themselves.

You know Tex, if there was a Republican Party that existed any more, The Times would be squarely behind it. The GOP has moved much further right than the Dems have moved to the left.
In fact, if there was a Republican Party any more, I could see myself as an "independent" who might have supported several of their candidates. I am not a right-wing libertarian who seen conspiracy around every turn, therefore I cannot be a 21st century Republican.
 
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You know Tex, if there was a Republican Party that existed any more, The Times would be squarely behind it. The GOP has moved much further right than the Dems have moved to the left.
In fact, if there was a Republican Party any more, I could see myself as an "independent" who might have supported several of their candidates. I am not a right-wing libertarian who seen conspiracy around every turn, therefore I cannot be a 21st century Republican.
Their is a party you just don't like it.

I doubt the NYT would be squarely behind the Republicans since the last Republican they endorsed for President was Ike. Of the 29 elections since 1900 the Times has endorsed Republicans 6 times and Democrats 23.
 
Please summarize.

GOP Candidates are a bunch of overgrown children who won't listen to the adults. They like hanging out with their gang of friends who think they're cool, but most people think they're obnoxious douchebags. The adults tried to tell them how to avoid looking so douchy, but they told the adults to screw off. Now they're wondering why not everyone likes them, even though they continue to act like douchebags.
 
"We have become expert in how to provide ideological reinforcement to like-minded people...."

"They agreed on kid-glove treatment for Fox News, the G.O.P.’s go-to outlet for 'ideological reinforcement to like-minded people.'”
There you go.

What I found interesting and different in the 3rd debate were the occasional anti-corporate references. Just a few, and no fear that they will start to sound like Bernie Sanders over night. But they were making some similar noises - interleaving a few "big bad corporation" complaints in with their standard "big bad government" litany.

No, nobody with a brain would have been convinced. But let's not forget - as the GOP seemed to have forgotten for the last several years - that the Tea Party folks started out being very unhappy with the banks and brokers who raped the economy and stole their jobs and homes.

Democrats, meanwhile, really ought to pay attention. The GOP is simply better at lying than the Dems are - despite significant efforts to catch down to their level by the Dems. Which is to say that I wouldn't expect the GOP to stay clumsy on these points. Since the GOP base has been largely plugging their ears and singing la-la-la-la whenever Bernie speaks, they won't know that there is a real candidate espousing these values.
 
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Their is a party you just don't like it.
I'm not sure how much I buy this. A real party doesn't support guys like Carson and Trump. Those two alone have more support than the rest of the candidates combined. How does something like that happen? A real party doesn't have to force members to take leadership roles, because nobody wants to have to put up with all the infighting. A real party doesn't have the majority of its voters openly admit that they want to have nothing to do with any established members.

If the Republican party is still a party, it is a fractured shadow of its former self. Quite sad to see the party of Lincoln turn into the party of Trump.
 
All of the online prediction markets have the Republicans losing the WH by at least 20 points. Granted, we still have a year to go, but unless something starts changing for them and changing fast, the GOP will once again have to ask permission to enter the Oval Office. Stuff like this doesn't help.

That's actually more reliable indicators than any polling is right now. Of course, this has as much meaning as a predicted weather report for next election day. However, if you ever want to cut through the noise of the spin, look at these. No matter what people want to believe, people don't effe with their money.
 
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That's actually more reliable indicators than any polling is right now. Of course, this has as much meaning as a predicted weather report for next election day. However, if you ever want to cut through the noise of the spin, look at these. No matter what people want to believe, people don't effe with their money.


Absolutely the markets can shift. But the closer we draw to the election, the more accurate these markets become. It should certainly be a great concern to the Republicans, at least at this point, that the markets seem so confident in them losing. They've got a large hole to dig themselves out of. Drama doesn't seem like a good shovel.
 
I'm not sure how much I buy this. A real party doesn't support guys like Carson and Trump. Those two alone have more support than the rest of the candidates combined. How does something like that happen? A real party doesn't have to force members to take leadership roles, because nobody wants to have to put up with all the infighting. A real party doesn't have the majority of its voters openly admit that they want to have nothing to do with any established members.

If the Republican party is still a party, it is a fractured shadow of its former self. Quite sad to see the party of Lincoln turn into the party of Trump.
The same party that won the Senate and increased their hold on the House and yes the election cycle lined up well for the Republicans but they still won elections that most believed they would not and held the ones they were supposed to for the most part.

This is the big weakness I see for Democrats is their belief that their victory is inevitable. With the Republicans I think you are seeing the distrust with Washington play out in the form of support for Trump and Carson.

I remember not so long ago a fractured Democratic Party and their story line that this represented their great diversity of thought and opinions.
 
The same party that won the Senate and increased their hold on the House and yes the election cycle lined up well for the Republicans but they still won elections that most believed they would not and held the ones they were supposed to for the most part.

The ONLY reason that occurred was the 2009 perfect storm that gave the GOP control of many state houses. They proceeded to perfect gerrymandering that gave them many, many safe seats. In 2012, 51 percent of North Carolina voters cast their ballots for a Democratic U.S. House candidate. And four out of 13 seats - 31% - actually went to Democrats.

In the process of all this the GOP has sent their party down the rabbit hole in search of more and more "conservative" candidates. You can't run in those safe seats as a moderate Repubber...you'll get hammered by the Tea Party. So the GOP becomes more stridently wingnutty and guys like Trump and Carson find traction.
 
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The ONLY reason that occurred was the 2009 perfect storm that gave the GOP control of many state houses. They proceeded to perfect gerrymandering that gave them many, many safe seats. In 2012, 51 percent of North Carolina voters cast their ballots for a Democratic U.S. House candidate. And four out of 13 seats - 31% - actually went to Democrats.

In the process of all this the GOP has sent their party down the rabbit hole in search of more and more "conservative" candidates. You can't run in those safe seats as a moderate Repubber...you'll get hammered by the Tea Party. So the GOP becomes more stridently wingnutty and guys like Trump and Carson find traction.
You do realize you are talking about the same North Carolina that in 2014 voted out their Democratic incumbent senator and replaced her with a Republican.

We can cherry pick results to try and prove our points if you want but I will stand by my opinion that liberals are way over confident that they will walk away with the next election cycle.

Like a winning sports team that starts believing all the good press they get.
 
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You do realize you are talking about the same North Carolina that in 2014 voted out their Democratic incumbent senator and replaced her with a Republican.

We can cherry pick results to try and prove our points if you want but I will stand by my opinion that liberals are way over confident that they will walk away with the next election cycle.

Like a winning sports team that starts believing all the good press they get.

If wishes were fishes...

In this case, it's not the press. It's money.
 
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As hard as I've been on Trump, I'm glad he's still making noise. He's said 2-5 things that I really like, and hopefully those are things that can be adopted by whoever the nominee is (same with Rubio).

I don't see it necessarily as a problem that Trump/Carson are leading. Santorum was leading 3 months from now last time (or, rather, he at least won Iowa).

The problem I see is there is no Romney to come in behind him. It's amazing that I'm openly saying that I wish they had Romney back. These guys make him look so good lol.
 
Their is a party you just don't like it.

I doubt the NYT would be squarely behind the Republicans since the last Republican they endorsed for President was Ike. Of the 29 elections since 1900 the Times has endorsed Republicans 6 times and Democrats 23.

The GOP has swerved to the right(severely) in 1964 and Goldwater. Nixon got the nomination by moving right in his campaign and governing from the center. Reagan noted how Nixon won, and campaigned the same way and then he adopted the Christian "moral majority" and added them to his right wing base. Since then, this is the GOP formula for national elections.......The Times supported Ike as he had a real idea for America,,,The Times was treated shabbily by Nixon from day one and reacted accordingly.......Then the GOP moved harder right.....They have supported many GOP state and national office candidates...It just didn't go The Post "wacko" right wing route.
 
The ONLY reason that occurred was the 2009 perfect storm that gave the GOP control of many state houses. They proceeded to perfect gerrymandering that gave them many, many safe seats. In 2012, 51 percent of North Carolina voters cast their ballots for a Democratic U.S. House candidate. And four out of 13 seats - 31% - actually went to Democrats.

In the process of all this the GOP has sent their party down the rabbit hole in search of more and more "conservative" candidates. You can't run in those safe seats as a moderate Repubber...you'll get hammered by the Tea Party. So the GOP becomes more stridently wingnutty and guys like Trump and Carson find traction.
This link has some success for both parties in the 2015 results. This is why I think you need to take a step back from the demise of the Republican party theme you are running with.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...s-score-huge-victories-in-off-year-elections/
 
trump kicks arse, ben carson kicks arse. we need trump as prez and ben carson as vp, problem solved
 
The same party that won the Senate and increased their hold on the House and yes the election cycle lined up well for the Republicans but they still won elections that most believed they would not and held the ones they were supposed to for the most part.

This is the big weakness I see for Democrats is their belief that their victory is inevitable. With the Republicans I think you are seeing the distrust with Washington play out in the form of support for Trump and Carson.

I remember not so long ago a fractured Democratic Party and their story line that this represented their great diversity of thought and opinions.
In 2014, everything was going the GOP's way. Obama was an unpopular President and a liability, The Dems still owned the Senate and WH, so any blame for lack of progress fell on their backs, and the Dems had to defend twice as many Senatorial seats as the R's. Few thought they would do well with such structural problems.

Fast forward to 2016 and the script has flipped. Obama is more popular and Dems don't have to distance themselves from him (in fact some are openly supporting him again), the GOP owns both chambers of Congress so they are now getting the blame for any stalled progress, and now it's the GOP having to defend twice as many Senatorial seats as the Dems. And of course we can add to all of this the miserable candidates the GOP is running. Things will be just as tough for the 2016 GOP as they were for the 2014 Dems, if not tougher.
 
This link has some success for both parties in the 2015 results. This is why I think you need to take a step back from the demise of the Republican party theme you are running with.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...s-score-huge-victories-in-off-year-elections/
Admittedly, these elections are cyclical. The way our system is set up is to favor the minority party for upcoming elections, while disfavoring the majority. And as far as I can tell, it's the GOP's year to eat it. You can't try defending 24 Senatorial seats to the Dems 10, deal with turning tides on a variety of social issues, deal with shouldering the blame for any Congressional problems, and think yourself to be in a good starting position.

Maybe the GOP can pull it out somehow, but their road will be many times harder than the Dems.
 
Admittedly, these elections are cyclical. The way our system is set up is to favor the minority party for upcoming elections, while disfavoring the majority. And as far as I can tell, it's the GOP's year to eat it. You can't try defending 24 Senatorial seats to the Dems 10, deal with turning tides on a variety of social issues, deal with shouldering the blame for any Congressional problems, and think yourself to be in a good starting position.

Maybe the GOP can pull it out somehow, but their road will be many times harder than the Dems.
Certainly it will be harder for Republicans.

My argument simply centers on liberals believing that the Republican party is done. The argument seems to ignore when Republicans win and only focuses on when they lose. When Republicans won in 2014 it came as a surprise and shock to liberals. The funny thing is if the Democrats win back the senate in 2016 it will be spun as a the Democrats have the pulse of the nation and the Republicans don't but when the Republicans won in 2014 it was a fluke. IMHO a party has lost ground when the lose when they shouldn't and not win when they should.
 
Certainly it will be harder for Republicans.

My argument simply centers on liberals believing that the Republican party is done. The argument seems to ignore when Republicans win and only focuses on when they lose. When Republicans won in 2014 it came as a surprise and shock to liberals. The funny thing is if the Democrats win back the senate in 2016 it will be spun as a the Democrats have the pulse of the nation and the Republicans don't but when the Republicans won in 2014 it was a fluke. IMHO a party has lost ground when the lose when they shouldn't and not win when they should.
Oh, I agree that they party itself isn't done. Eventually it will adapt. But the party as we know it today is done. Cyclical, or not, eventually the GOP will have to start supporting civil rights like gay marriage, stop blaming immigrants for all our problems, and return to true conservatism, which is the idea of rules and order, instead of the chaos that factions like the Tea Party support.
 
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Oh, I agree that they party itself isn't done. Eventually it will adapt. But the party as we know it today is done. Cyclical, or not, eventually the GOP will have to start supporting civil rights like gay marriage, stop blaming immigrants for all our problems, and return to true conservatism, which is the idea of rules and order, instead of the chaos that factions like the Tea Party support.
This is another view on this subject.

http://www.vox.com/2015/11/4/9669918/democrats-elections-crisis

Don’t believe the Democratic Party is in crisis? Then read this tweet.
Updated by Ezra Klein on November 4, 2015, 1:20 p.m. ET @ezraklein

TWEET (107) SHARE (38) writes, as a "brutal reality check for the Democratic Party" — and one with real consequences for Obamacare and climate change.

Under President Obama, Democrats have lost 900+ state legislature seats, 12 governors, 69 House seats, 13 Senate seats. That's some legacy.
  • For more on the Democratic Party's downballot crisis, read Matt Yglesias's feature onthe subject.
  • Political scientist Phil Klinkner has a more optimistic take for Democrats: "There's nothing wrong with the Democrats that losing the presidency probably won't fix," hewrites.
  • But Lee Drutman thinks the party's fortunes are darker: In a fascinating analysis, he argues that America is entering "a reinforcing feedback loop of growing inequality and Republican rule."
 
Things are very different on the national scale vs. the state or local level. At the state and local level, it is easy to gerrymander districts into favorable formats and it doesn't take much superpac money to flood a race. Dark money is much more effective at the local level because there aren't as many progressive groups, or financing, to fight it.

At the national level, there is no gerrymandering. You can't isolate the democratic vote into three counties and leave the rest up for the GOP. All they can do is try to make it harder for working people to vote (which they do). Super PAC money is less effective because everyone is watching and BS is called out very quickly. Ultimately, so much is exposed that people lose faith in the GOP candidate. At least, that's what happened in the last two election cycles.

So yes, at the local level the Democrats have a lot of problems. But nationally, the GOP is having problems because they can't hide from their policy positions and/or muddy the waters with disinformation campaigns. That keeps capable candidates from running (otherwise, why don't one of the Koch brothers just run for themselves?). Jeb is the closest thing to a credible candidate the GOP has and his campaign is as good as over.
 
This is another view on this subject.

http://www.vox.com/2015/11/4/9669918/democrats-elections-crisis

Don’t believe the Democratic Party is in crisis? Then read this tweet.
Updated by Ezra Klein on November 4, 2015, 1:20 p.m. ET @ezraklein

TWEET (107) SHARE (38) writes, as a "brutal reality check for the Democratic Party" — and one with real consequences for Obamacare and climate change.

Under President Obama, Democrats have lost 900+ state legislature seats, 12 governors, 69 House seats, 13 Senate seats. That's some legacy.
  • For more on the Democratic Party's downballot crisis, read Matt Yglesias's feature onthe subject.
  • Political scientist Phil Klinkner has a more optimistic take for Democrats: "There's nothing wrong with the Democrats that losing the presidency probably won't fix," hewrites.
  • But Lee Drutman thinks the party's fortunes are darker: In a fascinating analysis, he argues that America is entering "a reinforcing feedback loop of growing inequality and Republican rule."

I think this article was more focusing on the GOP in the scope of a general presidential election, not necessarily on local elections or specific issues. But you're right, the Democratic party certainly has its share of PR issues.
 
Things are very different on the national scale vs. the state or local level. At the state and local level, it is easy to gerrymander districts into favorable formats and it doesn't take much superpac money to flood a race. Dark money is much more effective at the local level because there aren't as many progressive groups, or financing, to fight it.

At the national level, there is no gerrymandering. You can't isolate the democratic vote into three counties and leave the rest up for the GOP. All they can do is try to make it harder for working people to vote (which they do). Super PAC money is less effective because everyone is watching and BS is called out very quickly. Ultimately, so much is exposed that people lose faith in the GOP candidate. At least, that's what happened in the last two election cycles.

So yes, at the local level the Democrats have a lot of problems. But nationally, the GOP is having problems because they can't hide from their policy positions and/or muddy the waters with disinformation campaigns. That keeps capable candidates from running (otherwise, why don't one of the Koch brothers just run for themselves?). Jeb is the closest thing to a credible candidate the GOP has and his campaign is as good as over.

So basically your saying that Republicans buy all their victories and Democrats win based solely on their positions on the issues? I love the lefts only argument for losing elections at a record pace at all levels of Government since Obama has been in office is gerrymandering. It's kind of like the Republicans always shouting BENGHAZI when the name Hillary comes up. GERRYMANDER!!! Its the lefts boogeyman.
 
So basically your saying that Republicans buy all their victories and Democrats win based solely on their positions on the issues? I love the lefts only argument for losing elections at a record pace at all levels of Government since Obama has been in office is gerrymandering. It's kind of like the Republicans always shouting BENGHAZI when the name Hillary comes up. GERRYMANDER!!! Its the lefts boogeyman.

You putting words in my mouth aside, the difference between Benghazi and gerrymandering is gerrymandering is demonstrably true.
 
Things are very different on the national scale vs. the state or local level. At the state and local level, it is easy to gerrymander districts into favorable formats and it doesn't take much superpac money to flood a race. Dark money is much more effective at the local level because there aren't as many progressive groups, or financing, to fight it.

At the national level, there is no gerrymandering. You can't isolate the democratic vote into three counties and leave the rest up for the GOP. All they can do is try to make it harder for working people to vote (which they do). Super PAC money is less effective because everyone is watching and BS is called out very quickly. Ultimately, so much is exposed that people lose faith in the GOP candidate. At least, that's what happened in the last two election cycles.

So yes, at the local level the Democrats have a lot of problems. But nationally, the GOP is having problems because they can't hide from their policy positions and/or muddy the waters with disinformation campaigns. That keeps capable candidates from running (otherwise, why don't one of the Koch brothers just run for themselves?). Jeb is the closest thing to a credible candidate the GOP has and his campaign is as good as over.
This line of thinking is where I see the biggest danger for Democrats. Its gerrymandering, its ignorant voters, its local vs. national, its the Koch brothers, its always something.

Gerrymandering is one of my favorite excuses you guys use - totally ignores that you have lost more than 20% of the governorship and 13% of the senate seats something gerrymandering does not change.

I really think Democrats believe all the press they get.
 
Ugh, whatever. You're right. The GOP is great and healthy. Nothing to worry about. You all just keep thinking that. Don't change a thing.
 
You are struggling with comprehension here.

No, I get what you are doing. You are trying to make yourself feel better about the complete disaster that is Republican Party by trying to point out that it isn't all a bed of roses on the Democrat side either. None of this changes the fact that every candidate the GOP is throwing up there is unelectable. It's not that you can't get a Republican capable of winning the election, it's that the GOP will never nominate anyone capable of winning a national election because there's too many crazy people dictating the direction of the party.
 
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I'm not predicting the demise of the GOP. I'm predicting that the party will lose the ability to govern on a national scale. You're already seeing it.

But there is no evidence of that. The only spot the Republicans don't own right now is the presidency. There are many other offices at the national level other than presidency. So what you are saying is not supported by facts. If anything the Democrats are on the verge of losing the ability to govern at national level especially when Rubio defeats Hillary next November.
 
But there is no evidence of that. The only spot the Republicans don't own right now is the presidency. There are many other offices at the national level other than presidency. So what you are saying is not supported by facts. If anything the Democrats are on the verge of losing the ability to govern at national level especially when Rubio defeats Hillary next November.

They can't run the House. Numbers don't matter here.
 
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I'm not predicting the demise of the GOP. I'm predicting that the party will lose the ability to govern on a national scale. You're already seeing it.
I think both parties are losing the ability to govern on a national scale and perhaps that is not a bad thing.
 
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