TRAM to UNC

[YoungGun07]

I won't be surprised if we see the "prodigal son" return about a year before the next Olympic cycle. A different training style with Scott for the next couple of years, and then back to Terry.

If he doesn't come back, I think a TnT trained Gilman/Clark/Lee/McD beating Tony.

 

[pablow]

To be honest, I think it is about time someone combined the OSU room and training and technique with the Iowa style of training and technique. Congrats for Coleman Scott for putting this together and good luck to UNC.

It seems like it is a better approach to include all styles and get a hybrid style.

I can't wait - face-mushing on the edge of the mat.

 

[JBJRFL]

I can't wait - face-mushing on the edge of the mat.

I thought for sure a PSU fan would have delivered that line.

 

[pumpdog20]

Do any of you think this was already in the works before the Olympic Trials?? Only reason I ask is that I've never seen Tony give someone he wrestled against an extra handshake, a hug and compliments after the match like he did with Coleman.

Agreed based on the same observation.

 

[anon_0pi0cv8t1ggvb]

I won't be surprised if we see the "prodigal son" return about a year before the next Olympic cycle. A different training style with Scott for the next couple of years, and then back to Terry.

If he doesn't come back, I think a TnT trained Gilman/Clark/Lee/McD beating Tony.

It would actually be really fun if Gilman, Clark, Lee, McD, and possibly other Hawkeyes are all competing at the next Olympic trials. I know Ramos didn't think it was fun competing against Dennis, but it's fun for the fans having 2 Hawkeyes in the finals - knowing one is guaranteed to make the Olympics.

 

[wasdt21]

I think in his case it will be - would you rather watch your teammate wrestle in front of 15000 or you personally wrestle in front of 1500?

I was talking about the possibility of unc stealing any of our lightweight recruits.

 

[lookleft goright]

I was talking about the possibility of unc stealing any of our lightweight recruits.

I was referring to what Renteria would think concerning wrestling at the same weight as Lee and on the same team.

 

[wasdt21]

kid is strong and fearless, don't think he's scared, it would be a shame to waste all that talent sitting for 5 years. I just don't see that happening.

 

[PapaBearSLIM]

I won't be surprised if we see the "prodigal son" return about a year before the next Olympic cycle. A different training style with Scott for the next couple of years, and then back to Terry.

If he doesn't come back, I think a TnT trained Gilman/Clark/Lee/McD beating Tony.

So if he pulls a Dennis would he support Gilman/Clark pulling a Ramos?

 

[so cal hawkfan]

No way, no how is Cory Clark getting down to 57 kg (125.4 lbs) in 4 years. I imagine he walks around at about 145 now. He's a good sized 133 lber and certainly looked to be worse for wear when he was making the cut to 125 two years ago.

 

[championhawk]

No way, no how is Cory Clark getting down to 57 kg (125.4 lbs) in 4 years. I imagine he walks around at about 145 now. He's a good sized 133 lber and certainly looked to be worse for wear when he was making the cut to 125 two years ago.

He could make it if that is what he desires. He is smaller than Dennis or Coleman Scott.

 

[slicone]

No way, no how is Cory Clark getting down to 57 kg (125.4 lbs) in 4 years. I imagine he walks around at about 145 now. He's a good sized 133 lber and certainly looked to be worse for wear when he was making the cut to 125 two years ago.

maybe because he would have more than 1 hour recovery time, and the use of saunas and plastics are allowed. Ramos dropped no problem, didnt seem to hurt Coleman Scott, Dennis Cox or Green..(ok might have hurt Green a little)

 

[TarpHawk]

Do any of you think this was already in the works before the Olympic Trials?? Only reason I ask is that I've never seen Tony give someone he wrestled against an extra handshake, a hug and compliments after the match like he did with Coleman.

I think it's relatively easy to give someone an extra handshake, hug and compliments when you beat them. True colors show when they beat you.

 

[PapaBearSLIM]

No way, no how is Cory Clark getting down to 57 kg (125.4 lbs) in 4 years. I imagine he walks around at about 145 now. He's a good sized 133 lber and certainly looked to be worse for wear when he was making the cut to 125 two years ago.

If he is still walking around at 145 in 4 years he is indeed a 57kg.

 

[so cal hawkfan]

maybe because he would have more than 1 hour recovery time, and the use of saunas and plastics are allowed. Ramos dropped no problem, didnt seem to hurt Coleman Scott, Dennis Cox or Green..(ok might have hurt Green a little)

Ramos was a small 133lber and certainly would have wrestled 125 if not for McD already being there. It's hard for dudes to drop that much weight and be effective. Dennis had to resort to a strict diet of hemp, twigs, berries and TRam mojo to keep his weight down. Clark wrestled 126 in 2012 as a high school senior, then wrestled 125 his true and redshirt seasons in college. Many commented that he looked like he was cutting a lot of weight. He looks so much healthier and stronger at 133. That seems like an unhealthy amount of weight he would need to cut and try to be effective (See Brody thread for further)

 

[Azchief32]

I think Clark's problem wasn't the cut but in the how he was doing it. Tom alluded to it a few times in the season...once for sure after Cory gassed against ISU. I don't think Cory would have a problem with one, night before, weigh-in. The psychological factor alone helps.

 

[so cal hawkfan]

You may be right Chief, but I can't help but remember those post match interviews where he's lookin all pale and sucked up. I can't see how that gets easier 4 years from now.

 

[championhawk]

Ramos was a small 133lber and certainly would have wrestled 125 if not for McD already being there. It's hard for dudes to drop that much weight and be effective. Dennis had to resort to a strict diet of hemp, twigs, berries and TRam mojo to keep his weight down. Clark wrestled 126 in 2012 as a high school senior, then wrestled 125 his true and redshirt seasons in college. Many commented that he looked like he was cutting a lot of weight. He looks so much healthier and stronger at 133. That seems like an unhealthy amount of weight he would need to cut and try to be effective (See Brody thread for further)

You have strong opinions on some things you know little about. First this stuff with Clark when you have no idea how bad his diet was. That was funny but to say a guy won't do as good because he won't work as hard or isn't as tough is just sad. You are a better poster than that.

 

[so cal hawkfan]

You are absolutely right, I don't know whether he had a strict diet of Mac N' Cheese and Doritos or not, my observation is that physically he looked terrible, sickly. A bit like Grothus looked last year. His results kinda point to him being better suited to wrestle up than down. 5th at 125 then runner-up twice at 133. I have been wrestling and coaching wrestling for over 25 years. I'm not saying it's impossible, just highly unlikely that at 26 years of age, Cory could compete and be effective at a weight which was a pound lighter than what he wrestled in high school. When the frenzy first started and everyone thought Grothus was a lock for the finals at 141, I posted, "Didn't he wrestle 145 in High School, like 4 and half years ago and now he's gonna wrestle 141?" Unless you have a guy who's a little chubby I just don't see it. Not trying to offend anyone or be negative just my opinion based on experience.

 

[letsgohawks44]

You may be right Chief, but I can't help but remember those post match interviews where he's lookin all pale and sucked up. I can't see how that gets easier 4 years from now.

I'm not saying it'll be easy, but it'll be completely different with night before weigh ins.

 

[moug]

You are absolutely right, I don't know whether he had a strict diet of Mac N' Cheese and Doritos or not, my observation is that physically he looked terrible, sickly. A bit like Grothus looked last year. His results kinda point to him being better suited to wrestle up than down. 5th at 125 then runner-up twice at 133. I have been wrestling and coaching wrestling for over 25 years. I'm not saying it's impossible, just highly unlikely that at 26 years of age, Cory could compete and be effective at a weight which was a pound lighter than what he wrestled in high school. When the frenzy first started and everyone thought Grothus was a lock for the finals at 141, I posted, "Didn't he wrestle 145 in High School, like 4 and half years ago and now he's gonna wrestle 141?" Unless you have a guy who's a little chubby I just don't see it. Not trying to offend anyone or be negative just my opinion based on experience.

My recollection is that Brands came out and said it wasn't the "cut" but his nutrition. Of course one doesn't happen without the other. Specifically, he indicated the timing of when he was eating, more so than what. I can't interpret much further than that, but CC has even indicated in interviews his diet hasn't been as disciplined at times as it needs to be, but he is getting better.

 

[anon_0pi0cv8t1ggvb]

You are absolutely right, I don't know whether he had a strict diet of Mac N' Cheese and Doritos or not, my observation is that physically he looked terrible, sickly. A bit like Grothus looked last year. His results kinda point to him being better suited to wrestle up than down. 5th at 125 then runner-up twice at 133. I have been wrestling and coaching wrestling for over 25 years. I'm not saying it's impossible, just highly unlikely that at 26 years of age, Cory could compete and be effective at a weight which was a pound lighter than what he wrestled in high school. When the frenzy first started and everyone thought Grothus was a lock for the finals at 141, I posted, "Didn't he wrestle 145 in High School, like 4 and half years ago and now he's gonna wrestle 141?" Unless you have a guy who's a little chubby I just don't see it. Not trying to offend anyone or be negative just my opinion based on experience.

If Clark wants to compete internationally after college, it will be at 57kg. He is not nearly big enough for 65kg. A lot of people are able to cut more weight for international freestyle/greco competition than for NCAAs. More lax weight cutting rules and longer recovery time after weighing in.

Clark is only 5'5". He's not even a big 133 lber. He would be tiny at 65kg. A bunch of guys go from 133 to 57kg after graduating. Just this year, over half the field at 57kg were 133 in college - Ramos, Dennis, Colon, Graff, Scott, Garrett.

Clark is a 57kg period if he chooses to compete after NCAAs.

Edited: 57kg for the Olympic weight...he could compete at 60kg in other tournaments.

 

[so cal hawkfan]

If Clark wants to compete internationally after college, it will be at 57kg. He is not nearly big enough for 65kg. A lot of people are able to cut more weight for international freestyle/greco competition than for NCAAs. More lax weight cutting rules and longer recovery time after weighing in.

Clark is only 5'5". He's not even a big 133 lber. He would be tiny at 65kg. A bunch of guys go from 133 to 57kg after graduating. Just this year, over half the field at 57kg were 133 in college - Ramos, Dennis, Colon, Graff, Scott, Garrett.

Clark is a 57kg period if he chooses to compete after NCAAs.

Edited: 57kg for the Olympic weight...he could compete at 60kg in other tournaments.

Splitting hairs here but Clark is listed at 5'6" on the Iowa Wrestling roster. Frank Molinaro is 5'5", so is Logan Steiber. Zain Retherford is the same height as Cory.

 

[anon_0pi0cv8t1ggvb]

Splitting hairs here but Clark is listed at 5'6" on the Iowa Wrestling roster. Frank Molinaro is 5'5", so is Logan Steiber. Zain Retherford is the same height as Cory.

Steiber and Retherford both wrestled 141 in college, Molinaro 149. It's pretty clear that they have a different frame than Clark. There is no way Clark wrestles 65kg internationally...

 

[so cal hawkfan]

I agree with you Vodka, it's definitely a frame thing not a height thing. I also don't think he has much success at 57kg. Some guys are "tweeners" (stuck between two weights) He'll be great at 60kg if he decides to continue after college. They still wrestle that weight at the World Championships.

 

[championhawk]

You are bent that he can't do well at 125 even though many have spelled out the difference in 24 hour weigh ins. He is still a work in progress with diet and rest. He will have no problems making 125 if he wants to compete the next Olympic cycle. He will also be one tough SOB at 57 kg and nobody will want to draw him.

 

[PapaBearSLIM]

You are absolutely right, I don't know whether he had a strict diet of Mac N' Cheese and Doritos or not, my observation is that physically he looked terrible, sickly. A bit like Grothus looked last year. His results kinda point to him being better suited to wrestle up than down. 5th at 125 then runner-up twice at 133. I have been wrestling and coaching wrestling for over 25 years. I'm not saying it's impossible, just highly unlikely that at 26 years of age, Cory could compete and be effective at a weight which was a pound lighter than what he wrestled in high school. When the frenzy first started and everyone thought Grothus was a lock for the finals at 141, I posted, "Didn't he wrestle 145 in High School, like 4 and half years ago and now he's gonna wrestle 141?" Unless you have a guy who's a little chubby I just don't see it. Not trying to offend anyone or be negative just my opinion based on experience.

If Brody had day before weigh ins, only had to make the weight a couple times a year and never consecutively, 141 would have been a piece of cake.

 

[LaxHawk174]

I remember a tweet from Ramos prior to Worlds, saying Clark would compete at 59 KG greco after college, not sure if that was more tongue in cheek because they were talking about clarks headlock and reverse lift, but it could be some food for thought. If i recall correctly Clark was a pretty accomplished Greco wrestler prior to College.

 

[lookleft goright]

I think Clark is a better folk style wrestler than he would be a freestyler. people get to his legs and they idon'thave to finish to score in freestyle. Also, his riding skills would go to waste unless he has a great gut.

 

[Gobblin]

I think Clark is a better folk style wrestler than he would be a freestyler. people get to his legs and they idon'thave to finish to score in freestyle. Also, his riding skills would go to waste unless he has a great gut.

He does. Probably the second best one in the room. Cory will be an an extremely dangerous 57kg. Ask Ramos, Dennis, Gilman, or Terry.

 

[anon_0pi0cv8t1ggvb]

I think Clark is a better folk style wrestler than he would be a freestyler. people get to his legs and they idon'thave to finish to score in freestyle. Also, his riding skills would go to waste unless he has a great gut.

Letting people get to your legs is arguably less disadvantageous in freestyle than folkstyle because you can crotch lift, or dump their hips for a cheap two.

 

[Omahahawk86]

No way, no how is Cory Clark getting down to 57 kg (125.4 lbs) in 4 years. I imagine he walks around at about 145 now. He's a good sized 133 lber and certainly looked to be worse for wear when he was making the cut to 125 two years ago.

What do you think Coleman Scott or Graff walk at. I'd guess 150-155.

 

[Omahahawk86]

Coming out oh Hs Clarks best style by far was Greco. He has a nasty reverse lift. I Hope he goes the Greco route.

 

[anon_0pi0cv8t1ggvb]

Coming out oh Hs Clarks best style by far was Greco. He has a nasty reverse lift. I Hope he goes the Greco route.

Reverse lift is basically dead in Greco now with the new rule changes.

 

[Omahahawk86]

Reverse lift is basically dead in Greco now with the new rule changes.

Not really. There is still forced partere at the senior level.

You just can't start in the reverse lift. There are plenty of high level guys using it.

 

[anon_0pi0cv8t1ggvb]

Not really. There is still forced partere at the senior level.

You just can't start in the reverse lift. There are plenty of high level guys using it.

I don't think there was one reverse lift at the trials. In the last Olympic cycle you had to have a reverse gut to succeed. It's just a lot easier to counter when you don't get to start with the lock.

 

[Omahahawk86]

I don't think there was one reverse lift at the trials. In the last Olympic cycle you had to have a reverse gut to succeed. It's just a lot easier to counter when you don't get to start with the lock.

Sorry man but I have no idea what tournament you were watching. I saw at least twenty. Kendrick Sanders pry has the nastiest one. Thielke, Big Mango, Lester Etc still hit them all the time. Same with the foreigners.

http://www.flowrestling.org/video/7...-kendrick-sanders-nyac-vs-hunter-muskrat-ocwc

It's not that it's easier to counter it just takes an extra 2 seconds to get your lock. It's not that hard to get your lock on a reverse lift.

 

[anon_0pi0cv8t1ggvb]

Sorry man but I have no idea what tournament you were watching. I saw at least twenty. Kendrick Sanders pry has the nastiest one. Thielke, Big Mango, Lester Etc still hit them all the time. Same with the foreigners.

http://www.flowrestling.org/video/7...-kendrick-sanders-nyac-vs-hunter-muskrat-ocwc

It's not that it's easier to counter it just takes an extra 2 seconds to get your lock. It's not that hard to get your lock on a reverse lift.

I'll admit I wasn't watching Greco that closely other than a few guys and all of the finals matches....might have missed a bunch. You're right it's still a crucial move for Greco just not quite as prominent as it was last cycle.

 

[LaxHawk174]

Gilman/Lee and Clark on the Olympic freestyle and Greco team respectively in 2020. Sounds good to me