ADVERTISEMENT

Why did it take so long to try and cripple ISIS?

TexMichFan

HB Heisman
Jul 13, 2002
7,943
3,910
113
We knew they were selling oil on the black market why not take out the fuel trucks and some infrastructure long ago?

http://news.yahoo.com/us-says-destroyed-116-islamic-state-fuel-trucks-193133278.html

US says it destroyed 116 Islamic State fuel trucks

WASHINGTON (AP) — In a new twist to an intensifying campaign to squeeze Islamic State oil revenues, U.S. warplanes have destroyed 116 oil-hauling trucks in eastern Syria that were a key part of a smuggling operation that brings the group an estimated $1.4 million a day.

The strike conducted Sunday and announced Monday was the first of its kind in more than a year of U.S.-led airstrikes in Syria. Four A-10 Thunderbolt II attack planes and two AC-130 Spectre gunships pounded the trucks as they clustered near Abu Kamal, a town close to the Iraqi border.

U.S. officials previously had said they avoided attacking fuel trucks out of concern for civilian casualties.

Navy Capt. Jeff Davis, a Pentagon spokesman, said that in an effort to warn the truck drivers to leave the area in advance of Sunday's attacks, leaflets were dropped and coalition planes conducted low-level "show of force" flights over the site.

Davis said the coalition had determined that more needed to be done to inhibit the Islamic State's generation of oil revenues in Syria and Iraq. The Treasury Department said last year that the group earned nearly $1 million a day from illicit oil sales; the Pentagon believes that sum has risen to nearly $1.4 million a day. Since the earliest days of the U.S.-led bombing campaign, some parts of the Islamic State's oil infrastructure have been attacked, but the effort is now intensifying.

"This part of it was designed to attack the distribution component of ISIL's oil smuggling operation," Davis said, referring to attacking the fuel trucks. "ISIL is stealing oil from the people of Iraq and Syria to fund its campaign of terror."

Although Sunday's strikes came just two days after the Paris attacks for which the Islamic State had claimed responsibility, Pentagon officials said there was no direct connection between the two events.

The attacks were part of a broader U.S.-led coalition campaign to cripple a key source of revenue for the Islamic State. Davis said it would take "some time" to fully realize the long-term effects of targeting key elements of the oil network.

"In the short term we know we are disrupting a significant source of funding that's being used to kill innocent people," he said.

Asked why the U.S. had waited so long to hit fuel trucks, which are highly vulnerable and easily targeted by air, Davis said the U.S.-led coalition has been mindful of civilian casualties and sought to limit damage to Syria's oil resources to preserve them for future generations.

"We're balancing that with the fact that this revenue is presenting a clear and present threat to Syrians today, in that it's being converted into funds which are being used for military equipment, which is being used to kill innocent civilians," Davis said.

Army Col. Steve Warren, a U.S. military spokesman in Baghdad, said last week that the U.S. has learned over time that the militants were quickly replacing or repairing damage to oil distribution centers and other infrastructure. In many cases, he said, within days of an airstrike the targeted piece of oil infrastructure was up and running again.

"We don't want to completely and utterly destroy these facilities to where they're irreparable," Warren said. "So what we've done is we've used very precise targeting, a very detailed analysis to strike certain parts of these facilities that will cause them to shut down for an extended period of time."

Warren said the military did detailed analysis to determine how to knock out the facilities for more than a day or two.

"We wanted them broken longer. Rather than 24 to 48 hours, we're looking at, you know, something that would take maybe a year to repair," he said.

The goal, he said, was to destroy machinery or facilities for which the militants don't have the needed replacement parts.

The overall campaign against oil infrastructure, dubbed Operation Tidal Wave II, is about 70 percent complete, Warren said. He said Army Lt. Gen. Sean MacFarland, the top U.S. commander in charge of the counter-Islamic State campaign, approved the operation, which was named after a World War II mission - Operation Tidal Wave, conducted against Nazi oil fields in Romania in August 1943.

___
 
Seems to me that the answers are in your own link.
We could have dropped leaflets the first day and then crippled a big revenue source - why would we not?

We let them rack up 350 million plus then decide it might be a good idea.
 
We could have dropped leaflets the first day and then crippled a big revenue source - why would we not?

We let them rack up 350 million plus then decide it might be a good idea.
I'm guessing that this wouldn't have been realistic. Firstly, you can't just drop leaflets out of planes on the first day and expect good results. You have to do a lot of intelligence gathering to determine where to drop the leaflets, to whom they should be dropped, and somehow let everyone involved know when, all while keeping it hidden from ISIS. This takes time.

To me, it's similar to our invasion of Normandy during WWII. That attack took the better part of a year to plan and execute. I can see why this would take time as well.
 
153173_600.jpg
 
Nice cartoon. It forgets to include the GOP and the rest of the world for not knowing how to deal with ISIS. This isn't an Obama problem. Nobody has a strategy against ISIS.

B.S. You go in and crush them. Sherman did it to the South. Eisenhower did it to the Nazis. We know how to do this.
 
Don't want to admit that there is no real strategy for dealing with ISIS, do you? Once again, this isn't an Obama problem. This is a world problem. Russia doesn't know what to do with ISIS. Turkey doesn't know what to do with ISIS. France doesn't know what to do with ISIS. And the Republicans don't know what to do with ISIS. So why are you pretending that Obama is unusual in this respect?
 
Don't want to admit that there is no real strategy for dealing with ISIS, do you? Once again, this isn't an Obama problem. This is a world problem. Russia doesn't know what to do with ISIS. Turkey doesn't know what to do with ISIS. France doesn't know what to do with ISIS. And the Republicans don't know what to do with ISIS. So why are you pretending that Obama is unusual in this respect?

Strategy is delivered by Leadership.

Obama has never been burdened with that trait.

You would think the leader of the Free World would be.
 
B.S. You go in and crush them. Sherman did it to the South. Eisenhower did it to the Nazis. We know how to do this.
I've brought this up multiple times, but we already tried the "crush them," strategy with the Taliban. It mostly failed. And do you know why it failed? Because terrorist groups don't have permanent addresses. You bomb one area, they sprout up in another.

Saddam, or Hitler, and the South all had permanent residences set up. They had more permanent forms of government. But ISIS doesn't. It's nomadic, just as the Taliban was.
 
B.S. You go in and crush them. Sherman did it to the South. Eisenhower did it to the Nazis. We know how to do this.

Crush what exactly? This is a belief system we are dealing with. These people want an all Islamic world and/or the end of the world. They are a death cult.

This is a Muslim problem and should be resolved by the majority of the people of this faith. We should absolutely help where we can, primarily humanitarian efforts and not as much bombing (i am for strikes when we are extremely certain of the target and as little collateral damage).

This may sound a bit unfair, but we always hear how a majority of Muslims are peaceful and I believe that to be true, but you don't see them rising up to deal with this crap. Where are the moderates, the liberals in this community? Unfortunately they are too scared to speak up as they'll most certainly be punished.

The world needs to step up and give the right people the voice and ability to squash this cult from within. It's for their own good as more Muslims die from other Muslims than any western attack or war
 
I've brought this up multiple times, but we already tried the "crush them," strategy with the Taliban. It mostly failed. And do you know why it failed? Because terrorist groups don't have permanent addresses. You bomb one area, they sprout up in another.

Saddam, or Hitler, and the South all had permanent residences set up. They had more permanent forms of government. But ISIS doesn't. It's nomadic, just as the Taliban was.

ISIS has an address. Unlike all the spooks that came before them, they wear uniforms and fly flags and have courtrooms and city halls and currency and all the other aspects of a nation.

So, we crush them.
 
Crush what exactly? This is a belief system we are dealing with. These people want an all Islamic world and/or the end of the world. They are a death cult.

This is a Muslim problem and should be resolved by the majority of the people of this faith. We should absolutely help where we can, primarily humanitarian efforts and not as much bombing (i am for strikes when we are extremely certain of the target and as little collateral damage).

This may sound a bit unfair, but we always hear how a majority of Muslims are peaceful and I believe that to be true, but you don't see them rising up to deal with this crap. Where are the moderates, the liberals in this community? Unfortunately they are too scared to speak up as they'll most certainly be punished.

The world needs to step up and give the right people the voice and ability to squash this cult from within. It's for their own good as more Muslims die from other Muslims than any western attack or war



ISIS has an address. Unlike all the spooks that came before them, they wear uniforms and fly flags and have courtrooms and city halls and currency and all the other aspects of a nation.

So, we crush them.
 
As I said in another thread, we have tried to sanitize war. If Patton would have had to work under these same restraints, we be typing this in German right now.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Mattski
Nice cartoon. It forgets to include the GOP and the rest of the world for not knowing how to deal with ISIS. This isn't an Obama problem. Nobody has a strategy against ISIS.

What exactly do you want the republicans to do. Last I checked the commander in chief was a democrat.
 
  • Like
Reactions: sijoint
Crush what exactly? This is a belief system we are dealing with. These people want an all Islamic world and/or the end of the world. They are a death cult.

This is a Muslim problem and should be resolved by the majority of the people of this faith. We should absolutely help where we can, primarily humanitarian efforts and not as much bombing (i am for strikes when we are extremely certain of the target and as little collateral damage).

This may sound a bit unfair, but we always hear how a majority of Muslims are peaceful and I believe that to be true, but you don't see them rising up to deal with this crap. Where are the moderates, the liberals in this community? Unfortunately they are too scared to speak up as they'll most certainly be punished.

The world needs to step up and give the right people the voice and ability to squash this cult from within. It's for their own good as more Muslims die from other Muslims than any western attack or war
In this respect, I agree with Hillary that this isn't primarily our fight. And the reason why it isn't primarily our fight is because it is largely beyond our control. We can send as many troops and planes as we want into Syrian, Iraq, and anywhere else we think ISIS is, and they will simply go underground until we leave, and pop back out strong as ever. And even if we do manage to completely obliterate ISIS, some other extremist group will just take their place. I'm sorry but traditional military offenses won't work for this problem.
 
No. America doesn't.

The world looks to the US for leadership.

It has been looking and not finding it for almost 8 years.
Convenient excuse for you to bitch about Obama, don't you think? Nobody in the world has a solution, including the Republicans, and yet Obama is still to blame. Do me a favor and save this complaint for the things that Obama can actually do something about.
 
Last edited:
Anonymous declares war on Islamic State after Paris attacks in chilling video: 'We will hunt you down
Hacker group [URL='http://www.mirror.co.uk/all-about/anonymous']Anonymous
have declared war against ISIS after the attacks in Paris on Friday night.

Posting a video on YouTube, the group said it would use its knowledge to "unite humanity" and warned the terrorists to "expect us".

Behind their signature mask, a spokesperson speaking in French said: "Anonymous from all over the world will hunt you down.

"You should know that we will find you and we will not let you go.

"We will launch the biggest operation ever against you.
[/URL]
 
I've brought this up multiple times, but we already tried the "crush them," strategy with the Taliban. It mostly failed. And do you know why it failed? Because terrorist groups don't have permanent addresses. You bomb one area, they sprout up in another.

Saddam, or Hitler, and the South all had permanent residences set up. They had more permanent forms of government. But ISIS doesn't. It's nomadic, just as the Taliban was.
Wait, oil/fuel storage tanks are permanent facilities.......and large targets.........easy to bomb. This is what they look like Huey.:D
newcastlemed.jpg


 
Last edited:
Convenient excuse for you to bitch about Obama, don't you think? Nobody in the world has a solution, including the Republicans, and yet Obama is still to blame. Do me a favor and save this complaint for the things that Obama can actually do something about.

Sure they do. You just don't like their solutions.
 
  • Like
Reactions: sijoint
Convenient excuse for you to bitch about Obama, don't you think? Nobody in the world has a solution, including the Republicans, and yet Obama is still to blame. Do me a favor and save this complaint for the things that Obama can actually do something about.

...and dear lord. How Libs can make a victim out of anyone.

Even the most powerful man in the world.

Your expectations are tragically low.
 
I've brought this up multiple times, but we already tried the "crush them," strategy with the Taliban. It mostly failed. And do you know why it failed? Because terrorist groups don't have permanent addresses. You bomb one area, they sprout up in another.

Saddam, or Hitler, and the South all had permanent residences set up. They had more permanent forms of government. But ISIS doesn't. It's nomadic, just as the Taliban was.

No we didn't try and crush them. We tried to defeat them as humanely as possible. We tried to minimize civilian casualties.

People like you are the first to point out how many Iraqi Civilians the US has killed in the Iraq war. How many? 100,000+. Do you ever wonder how many German civilians die in WW2? Probably not. Because it doesn't help your argument.

FYI, Millions of German civilians died during WW2. That's just Germany.

War is inhumane. If you want to destroy your enemy, you have to accept that an inhumane amount of civilians are going to die.
 
I'm guessing that this wouldn't have been realistic. Firstly, you can't just drop leaflets out of planes on the first day and expect good results. You have to do a lot of intelligence gathering to determine where to drop the leaflets, to whom they should be dropped, and somehow let everyone involved know when, all while keeping it hidden from ISIS. This takes time.

To me, it's similar to our invasion of Normandy during WWII. That attack took the better part of a year to plan and execute. I can see why this would take time as well.

Oh boy, you bring up Normandy?...you mean The Normandy...now you're trying to impress us? About a dozen different nations, troops storming 5 different beaches had to take a little more strategic planning and coordination than flying airplanes to bomb some fuel storage tanks. :eek:
 
I'm guessing that this wouldn't have been realistic. Firstly, you can't just drop leaflets out of planes on the first day and expect good results. You have to do a lot of intelligence gathering to determine where to drop the leaflets, to whom they should be dropped, and somehow let everyone involved know when, all while keeping it hidden from ISIS. This takes time.

To me, it's similar to our invasion of Normandy during WWII. That attack took the better part of a year to plan and execute. I can see why this would take time as well.
I think we could have found the oil transport trucks around the oil refineries.

We could have done everything we just did a year ago and did not.
 
Don't want to admit that there is no real strategy for dealing with ISIS, do you? Once again, this isn't an Obama problem. This is a world problem. Russia doesn't know what to do with ISIS. Turkey doesn't know what to do with ISIS. France doesn't know what to do with ISIS. And the Republicans don't know what to do with ISIS. So why are you pretending that Obama is unusual in this respect?
WWIII has begun.
 
Don't want to admit that there is no real strategy for dealing with ISIS, do you? Once again, this isn't an Obama problem. This is a world problem. Russia doesn't know what to do with ISIS. Turkey doesn't know what to do with ISIS. France doesn't know what to do with ISIS. And the Republicans don't know what to do with ISIS. So why are you pretending that Obama is unusual in this respect?


Russia has been bombing the hell out of them.....including using white phosphorus bombs.
 
On one hand - I'm really disapointed some of you place this at the feet of one man (our president)

On the other I'm very optimistic we get to vote again soon! I don't see any way these nasty cartoons get lobbed at Trump/Rubio/Cruz/Sanders/Clinton right? It's refreshing to know we will soon have a brilliant leader and galvanizing force. Looking forward to it
 
On one hand - I'm really disapointed some of you place this at the feet of one man (our president)

On the other I'm very optimistic we get to vote again soon! I don't see any way these nasty cartoons get lobbed at Trump/Rubio/Cruz/Sanders/Clinton right? It's refreshing to know we will soon have a brilliant leader and galvanizing force. Looking forward to it
"freedom from Obama day", will be a big party
 
  • Like
Reactions: Herkmeister
Article may be misleading as oil facilities themselves have been targeted all along. The problem is that these facilities are robust and can be repaired within 24 hours of being attacked. Going after the trucks should make it harder for ISIS since they will have to actually somehow replace the fuel trucks which themselves may now be continually targeted.
 
B.S. You go in and crush them. Sherman did it to the South. Eisenhower did it to the Nazis. We know how to do this.

Go in where? ISIS was heavy in Syria and the French and U.S. bombed the crap out of that country leading to mass migration of refugees (and terrorists, apparently) to Europe where, SHOCKINGLY, Paris became the site of the worst coordinated terrorist attack in the world since 9/11. I don't think obliterating their homelands is working all that effectively given that they just flee to the West and then become part of terrorist cells that can carry out terrorist attacks in Europe and the U.S. Intelligence and special forces operations make more sense -- and maybe stop bombing the crap out of the Middle East because it seems to always lead to migrations of militant radicals to the West. FWIW.
 
Go in where? ISIS was heavy in Syria and the French and U.S. bombed the crap out of that country leading to mass migration of refugees (and terrorists, apparently) to Europe where, SHOCKINGLY, Paris became the site of the worst coordinated terrorist attack in the world since 9/11. I don't think obliterating their homelands is working all that effectively given that they just flee to the West and then become part of terrorist cells that can carry out terrorist attacks in Europe and the U.S. Intelligence and special forces operations make more sense -- and maybe stop bombing the crap out of the Middle East because it seems to always lead to migrations of militant radicals to the West. FWIW.

This isn't your father's al Qaeda.

They've declared themselves to be a state. They fly flags. They wear uniforms. They maintain borders. They have a criminal justice system and a currency and all the other trappings of a country.

Therefore, we do in fact know where they are.
 
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT