OT: Seven Kentucky Players Declaring for NBA Draft!

[DanL53]

http://www.wthr.com/story/28763598/record-7-kentucky-players-intend-to-enter-nba-draft

"The soon-to-be-former Wildcats gathered at their practice gym and said they will turn pro: 7-footers Willie Cauley-Stein and Dakari Johnson, twin guards Andrew and Aaron Harrison, freshman forwards Karl-Anthony Towns and Trey Lyles and freshman backup guard Devin Booker."

The good news is this should clear up the log jam of five star players waiting for their table at Kentucky.

 

[hooper56]

These is something so very very wrong about this. And they still could not win the national title, yet Cal is supposed to be a good coach. Any school that had the Kentucky Boo$ters could do the same thing.

 

[Cerro Gordo Hawk]

It's so pathetic how some of you are sooooooooooooooo jealous of programs like Kentucky. Is Coach Cal a snake? Yes he is. But I would like to be Kentucky, and win.

 

[fivecardstud14]

Re: OT: Seven Kentucky Players Declaring for NBA Draft!

Originally posted by Cerro Gordo Hawk:
It's so pathetic how some of you are sooooooooooooooo jealous of programs like Kentucky. Is Coach Cal a snake? Yes he is. But I would like to be Kentucky, and win.

Agreed. So much salt for Kentucky on this board & it's comical. Que the "I'd rather win with white boys who attend class" posts.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[fivecardstud14]

Re: OT: Seven Kentucky Players Declaring for NBA Draft!

Can't edit on phone. Was supposed to say "lose" instead of win.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[Tiggerhawk]

Originally posted by hooper56:
These is something so very very wrong about this. And they still could not win the national title, yet Cal is supposed to be a good coach. Any school that had the Kentucky Boo$ters could do the same thing.

No, it couldn't be done at any university college where the athletic department is not autonomous, where the administration has actual control over admissions, where boosters are not permitted to corrupt pervasively the university. To put it in harsh but factual words, the U of Kentucky is a shameless whore.

But the greater shame is that of the NCAA and the university & college presidents who are the final authority over the NCAA. They allow the boosters & the Kentucky athletic department to corrupt the NCAA, college basketball, and by extension not just college athletics but the values & integrity of higher education in America. There is no greater example of unpatriotic actions, because the distortions ultimately have serious adverse consequence on the educational & research functions that determine how well we will be able to compete in the world of the future.

Also to be emphasized, the shame is equally that of the television network whores, and the Federal Communications Commission that allows the broadcast media to seduce the willing college & university athletic programs.

In 1946, when the Big Ten (with the U of Iowa to its everlasting credit playing the most prominent role) promoted & directed successfully the transformation of the NCAA from an advisory organization to a governing body with rule-making & enforcement powers, predictably even then it was the U of Kentucky that led the fierce all-out effort of the SEC and Southwest Conference to prevent the changes from taking effect. The reason why UK did everything in its power in its vain effort to make sure there would never be a sheriff in town was obvious at the time: Kentucky was buying NCAA championships then just like now---and the first bad guys the new NCAA Committee on Infractions investigated, found guilty, and wrist-slapped was Adolph Rupp's UK Wildcats (no real sanctions were imposed on Rupp, Kentucky hoops, or the boosters: from the beginning the NCAA operated with two standards of justice---one for the rich & powerful, one for the little unimportant schools--- so it was urban, commuter school CCNY, a small-time first offender, that got hit hard with penalties a few years later (it was NOT a mere coincidence, that the school the NCAA's dominant large universities, especially in the South, that long had quotas for Jewish professors and students, chose to make an example was CCNY, with its heavily Jewish staff & student body, and its mostly Jewish basketball team).

The U of Kentucky was a foul cesspool even as American colleges & universities confronted the challenges of coping with the vast horde of veterans now enabled bythe GI Bill to seek a college degree at the dawn of the postwar world in 1945-46. It has continued to epitomize the disgraceful side of college sport with impunity and without interruption for almost 70 years since.


This post was edited on 4/9 9:10 PM by Tiggerhawk

 

[vincebrookins]

Kentucky didn't win. Just like Iowa, they lost their last game of the year. Kentucky is a basketball program - not a college program. I could, maybe, root for them if I had no ethics and only cared about winning. I respect the way Fran is running his program and it's much more satisfying to support a coach who does it the right way.

 

[Cerro Gordo Hawk]

For the love of God, get over yourselves. Duke does the same thing. Coach K must be snake in the grass, as well. I would like to see Fran start winning a conference championship, start winning some BIG conference games. Ethics, morals??? It's college basketball.

 

[Chewback]

Originally posted by Tiggerhawk:

Originally posted by hooper56:
These is something so very very wrong about this. And they still could not win the national title, yet Cal is supposed to be a good coach. Any school that had the Kentucky Boo$ters could do the same thing.

No, it couldn't be done at any university college where the athletic department is not autonomous, where the administration has actual control over admissions, where boosters are not permitted to corrupt pervasively the university. To put it in harsh but factual words, the U of Kentucky is a shameless whore.

But the greater shame is that of the NCAA and the university & college presidents who are the final authority over the NCAA. They allow the boosters & the Kentucky athletic department to corrupt the NCAA, college basketball, and by extension not just college athletics but the values & integrity of higher education in America. There is no greater example of unpatriotic actions, because the distortions ultimately have serious adverse consequence on the educational & research functions that determine how well we will be able to compete in the world of the future.

Also to be emphasized, the shame is equally that of the television network whores, and the Federal Communications Commission that allows the broadcast media to seduce the willing college & university athletic programs.

In 1946, when the Big Ten (with the U of Iowa to its everlasting credit playing the most prominent role) promoted & directed successfully the transformation of the NCAA from an advisory organization to a governing body with rule-making & enforcement powers, predictably even then it was the U of Kentucky that led the fierce all-out effort of the SEC and Southwest Conference to prevent the changes from taking effect. The reason why UK did everything in its power in its vain effort to make sure there would never be a sheriff in town was obvious at the time: Kentucky was buying NCAA championships then just like now---and the first bad guys the new NCAA Enforcerment office investigated, found guilty, and wrist-slapped was Adolph Rupp's UK Wildcats (no real sanctions were imposed on Rupp, Kentucky hoops, or the boosters: from the beginning the NCAA operated with two standards of justice---one for the rich & powerful, one for the little unimportant schools--- so it was urban, commuter school CCNY, a small-time first offender, that got hit hard with penalties a few years later (it was NOT a mere coincidence, that the school the NCAA's dominant large universities, especially in the South, that long had quotas for Jewish professors and students, chose to make an example was CCNY, with its heavily Jewish staff & student body, and its mostly Jewish basketball team).

The U of Kentucky was a foul cesspool even as American colleges & universities confronted the challenges of coping with the vast horde of veterans now able to seek a college degree at the dawn of the postwar world in 1945-46. It has continued to epitomize the disgraceful side of college sport with impunity and without interruption for almost 70 years since.

Wow. I would have given this a tl;dr except I actually DID read it. Or tried to. We need to come up with a code for "read the whole thing, didn't understand a word", or something like that.

 

[SSG T]

Re: OT: Seven Kentucky Players Declaring for NBA Draft!

When everyone but the players aren't getting rich off of them I'll start worrying about whether or not the one and done types are ruining the game. Until then, I'll enjoy watching really good players, even if they're only in the college game for a year. The problem isn't Kentucky, or Calipari, or those 7 players. The problem is the system. When you have a system where athletic departments, schools, coaches, networks, talking heads, broadcasters, pretty much everyone but the athletes are getting rich from those athletes performances, there is a major problem.


Unfortunately, that cow left the barn 60 years ago and you'll never find it, let alone get it back in the barn. Enjoy the show and hope that at some point those athletes will get a small share of what they earned.

 

[BlueHawk23]

Originally posted by Chewback:

Originally posted by Tiggerhawk:

Originally posted by hooper56:
These is something so very very wrong about this. And they still could not win the national title, yet Cal is supposed to be a good coach. Any school that had the Kentucky Boo$ters could do the same thing.

No, it couldn't be done at any university college where the athletic department is not autonomous, where the administration has actual control over admissions, where boosters are not permitted to corrupt pervasively the university. To put it in harsh but factual words, the U of Kentucky is a shameless whore.

But the greater shame is that of the NCAA and the university & college presidents who are the final authority over the NCAA. They allow the boosters & the Kentucky athletic department to corrupt the NCAA, college basketball, and by extension not just college athletics but the values & integrity of higher education in America. There is no greater example of unpatriotic actions, because the distortions ultimately have serious adverse consequence on the educational & research functions that determine how well we will be able to compete in the world of the future.

Also to be emphasized, the shame is equally that of the television network whores, and the Federal Communications Commission that allows the broadcast media to seduce the willing college & university athletic programs.

In 1946, when the Big Ten (with the U of Iowa to its everlasting credit playing the most prominent role) promoted & directed successfully the transformation of the NCAA from an advisory organization to a governing body with rule-making & enforcement powers, predictably even then it was the U of Kentucky that led the fierce all-out effort of the SEC and Southwest Conference to prevent the changes from taking effect. The reason why UK did everything in its power in its vain effort to make sure there would never be a sheriff in town was obvious at the time: Kentucky was buying NCAA championships then just like now---and the first bad guys the new NCAA Enforcerment office investigated, found guilty, and wrist-slapped was Adolph Rupp's UK Wildcats (no real sanctions were imposed on Rupp, Kentucky hoops, or the boosters: from the beginning the NCAA operated with two standards of justice---one for the rich & powerful, one for the little unimportant schools--- so it was urban, commuter school CCNY, a small-time first offender, that got hit hard with penalties a few years later (it was NOT a mere coincidence, that the school the NCAA's dominant large universities, especially in the South, that long had quotas for Jewish professors and students, chose to make an example was CCNY, with its heavily Jewish staff & student body, and its mostly Jewish basketball team).

The U of Kentucky was a foul cesspool even as American colleges & universities confronted the challenges of coping with the vast horde of veterans now able to seek a college degree at the dawn of the postwar world in 1945-46. It has continued to epitomize the disgraceful side of college sport with impunity and without interruption for almost 70 years since.

Wow. I would have given this a tl;dr except I actually DID read it. Or tried to. We need to come up with a code for "read the whole thing, didn't understand a word", or something like that.

tiggerhawk has a lot of lies and untrue statements that he likes to put into his posts, so you can usually count on a lot of gibberish and insanity taking up a large part of is ramblings.

for instance he states that kentucky face no ncaa sanctions during the point shaving scandal of the 1950s but they had to cancel an entire season. that sure seems like a sanction to me.

 

[clickhere 01]

Re: OT: Seven Kentucky Players Declaring for NBA Draft!

Originally posted by SSG T:
When everyone but the players aren't getting rich off of them I'll start worrying about whether or not the one and done types are ruining the game. Until then, I'll enjoy watching really good players, even if they're only in the college game for a year. The problem isn't Kentucky, or Calipari, or those 7 players. The problem is the system. When you have a system where athletic departments, schools, coaches, networks, talking heads, broadcasters, pretty much everyone but the athletes are getting rich from those athletes performances, there is a major problem.


Unfortunately, that cow left the barn 60 years ago and you'll never find it, let alone get it back in the barn. Enjoy the show and hope that at some point those athletes will get a small share of what they earned.

Good post

 

[RocknRollface]

Harrison twins declaring for the Dleauge.

They were supposed to be part of the greatest recruiting class ever lol. Better than fan 5. Not even remotely close.

 

[IamHawkeye]

Re: OT: Seven Kentucky Players Declaring for NBA Draft!

I'm not jealous of ole Kainuck. If I'm jealous of anyone, it might be Wisconsin, where Bo takes players, some not gathering that much notice and makes a team that wins. And most stay four years. Or maybe I'm jealous of MSU, has more star recruits than Wisky, but they too often stay four years, and win.. And no, you can't blame the kids that go pro, but, as my roommate said, how can there be room in the pros for all these kids. Are there that many retiring or cut.? Plus, not only these kids going pro, but the NBA mines Europe for pros. Maybe it;s time for the NBA to go the baseball route. I'd still watch college ball.

 

[DavenportHawk8]

What is their APR?? Don't you have to meet certain requirements in order be eligible for the NCAA tournament. If they are not graduating all their players, how can they be passing in the APR ranks?

 

[Tiggerhawk]

Originally posted by BlueHawk23:

Originally posted by Chewback:

Originally posted by Tiggerhawk:

Originally posted by hooper56:
These is something so very very wrong about this. And they still could not win the national title, yet Cal is supposed to be a good coach. Any school that had the Kentucky Boo$ters could do the same thing.

No, it couldn't be done at any university college where the athletic department is not autonomous, where the administration has actual control over admissions, where boosters are not permitted to corrupt pervasively the university. To put it in harsh but factual words, the U of Kentucky is a shameless whore.

But the greater shame is that of the NCAA and the university & college presidents who are the final authority over the NCAA. They allow the boosters & the Kentucky athletic department to corrupt the NCAA, college basketball, and by extension not just college athletics but the values & integrity of higher education in America. There is no greater example of unpatriotic actions, because the distortions ultimately have serious adverse consequence on the educational & research functions that determine how well we will be able to compete in the world of the future.

Also to be emphasized, the shame is equally that of the television network whores, and the Federal Communications Commission that allows the broadcast media to seduce the willing college & university athletic programs.

In 1946, when the Big Ten (with the U of Iowa to its everlasting credit playing the most prominent role) promoted & directed successfully the transformation of the NCAA from an advisory organization to a governing body with rule-making & enforcement powers, predictably even then it was the U of Kentucky that led the fierce all-out effort of the SEC and Southwest Conference to prevent the changes from taking effect. The reason why UK did everything in its power in its vain effort to make sure there would never be a sheriff in town was obvious at the time: Kentucky was buying NCAA championships then just like now---and the first bad guys the new NCAA Enforcerment office investigated, found guilty, and wrist-slapped was Adolph Rupp's UK Wildcats (no real sanctions were imposed on Rupp, Kentucky hoops, or the boosters: from the beginning the NCAA operated with two standards of justice---one for the rich & powerful, one for the little unimportant schools--- so it was urban, commuter school CCNY, a small-time first offender, that got hit hard with penalties a few years later (it was NOT a mere coincidence, that the school the NCAA's dominant large universities, especially in the South, that long had quotas for Jewish professors and students, chose to make an example was CCNY, with its heavily Jewish staff & student body, and its mostly Jewish basketball team).

The U of Kentucky was a foul cesspool even as American colleges & universities confronted the challenges of coping with the vast horde of veterans now able to seek a college degree at the dawn of the postwar world in 1945-46. It has continued to epitomize the disgraceful side of college sport with impunity and without interruption for almost 70 years since.

Wow. I would have given this a tl;dr except I actually DID read it. Or tried to. We need to come up with a code for "read the whole thing, didn't understand a word", or something like that.

tiggerhawk has a lot of lies and untrue statements that he likes to put into his posts, so you can usually count on a lot of gibberish and insanity taking up a large part of is ramblings.

for instance he states that kentucky face no ncaa sanctions during the point shaving scandal of the 1950s but they had to cancel an entire season. that sure seems like a sanction to me.

Typically, it your haste to slander you pick out one detail to claim is falsely reported by me to imply that my full account is filed with lies and untruths.

The truth is that the only untrue statements are those that you make in effort to give some substance to your personal attack.

(1) I DID NOT say KY "faced no ncaa sanctions". Quite the opposite. But my discussion WAS NOT ABOUT the LATER (1950s) point-shaving scandal at Kentucky.. That was another scandal which involved another separate investigation. This later inquiry was AFTER the earlier inquiry & sanctions against CCNY in 1950 to which I referred in my original post. I explicitly refer to the (July) 1946 conference that changed the NCAA from an ADVISORY committee to a GOVERNING body, and specify that its newly established Committee on Infractions imposed minor sanction (I refer to them as "wrist slapping" as a common colloquial expression for minor punishment). This first 1940s inquiry was about improper booster payments, NOT the later 1950-51 point-shaving affair (when the FBI investigation extended its initial investigation of point-shaving in NYC that involved CCNY players to other secondary & post-secondary chools including Kentucky).

(2) You are in error about how UK was forced to cancel the 1952-53 season. That "death penalty" was NOT IMPOSED by the NCAA: it was an official action of the Southeastern Conference (SEC) voted by the other member schools who were upset that the brazen fishbowl violations by UK were bringing a storm of national criticism down on all the members of the SEC.
There was also another NCAA Committee on Infractions inquiry in 1952 in conjunction with the federal govt criminal investigation. (former KY stars Ralph Beard, Alex Groza & Dale Barnstable were arrested by the FBI& charged with point-shaving in KY games back in 1948-49---3 & 4 years EARLIER; (Another player investigated was Connie Hawkins regarding high school games in NYC; Hawkins had already flunked out of Iowa as a 2nd semester freshman & returned to his NYC home before he became a "person of interest" to the FBI.)

In summary, (a) I specifically said that UK was the subject "a few year later" of the first investigation conducted by the new NCAA Committee on Infractions established in 1946; (b) i then mentioned that the first NCAA "major" sanctions were imposed upon CCNY in the 1950 investigation (since the subject was improper spending & illegal payments to athletes, I did not digress on the largely irrelevant subject of players shaving points for national book-makers); and (c) the 1952-53 UK basketball season was cancelled by the SEC: while the FBI/NCAA Committee on Infractions (often referred to as NCAA Enforcement Division) investigations in 1951-52 eventually resulted in an NCAA finding of a "major violation" by UK and penalties were imposed. The NCAA did NOT give UK the "death sentence). After the SEC told UK to cancel the season, the NCAA NOTIFIED member schools of the SEC action & RECOMMENDED that they avoid playing UK basketball for the duration of the ban. THAT IS ALL. A different scandal on another type of misbehavior. At another time. A ban imposed by another organization

All this 1950s scandal & investigations are, of course, OUTSIDE the scope,content & subject of my post.

Before your next reckless, ignorant, abusive personal attack you might have the requisite operating brain cells to make a minimnal inquiry to determine the actual facts before inventing your own fictions. The foundation you sorely need is an education into how to research, evaluate & interpret correctly.

THAT is usually undertaken primarily by the use of visual materials. B - O - O - K - S. On this topic I recommend you read CAREFULLY, TOTALLY Murray Sperber's book Glory. It is a unsympathetic history of the NCAA. witten by an English professor at Indiana (now retired I believe) about 20 to 30 years ago, but still very relevant to current NCAA affairs.

You apparently need more help than just a few reading references. You clearly have a problem understanding English language & meanings. Since you haven't a clue as what gibberish is, you could profitably not just look it up in Webster's International, but also as more fully elaborated as well as its etymology in the Oxford Dictionary of the English Language. Then read Lewis Carroll's Jabberwocky, get a vivid example. The paradox here is that if you learn to understand what gibberish is, then you might some day start making sense.

This post was edited on 4/9 10:54 PM by Tiggerhawk

Correction: I identified Murray Sperber's book on the history of the NCAA by a shorthand reference as "Glory". I've no excuse, assuming no one cared enough to want to read it I just used the heading to my notes, "glory" (I had made the notes for a project researching the "glory years" of the BT, 1946-1970, when it was most predominant in college sports). The actual title is Onward to Victory, and it was published in 1998. There is a new edition in 2014, which I have not seen, and don't know if it is a revised & updated version oor simply a reissue.

I do know it is obtainable from Amazon as a used book for a very cheap price, about five dollars including shipping. It is a classic, the definite study of the NCAAA, well worth buying & reading. But if you have access to a large, public library you should be able to get it there.

This post was edited on 4/10 5:04 PM by Tiggerhawk

 

[OnceAhawk]

Originally posted by DanL53:

http://www.wthr.com/story/28763598/record-7-kentucky-players-intend-to-enter-nba-draft

"The soon-to-be-former Wildcats gathered at their practice gym and said they will turn pro: 7-footers Willie Cauley-Stein and Dakari Johnson, twin guards Andrew and Aaron Harrison, freshman forwards Karl-Anthony Towns and Trey Lyles and freshman backup guard Devin Booker."

The good news is this should clear up the log jam of five star players waiting for their table at Kentucky.

I think the Harrison twins are overrated; will be interested to see if Stein develops an offensive game; jury is still out on Booker, too

so, there are 5 left? Ulis and who? i guess KY can now sign 8 five star recruits? yikes....

I wish kids were not eligible for the NBA until age 20 or 21 (similar to the NFL); there just has to be some balance in student and athlete; this one year thing (because of the NBA rule) is a joke; either let them in when 18 or if they sign a LOI, they must wait until at least 20

 

[OnceAhawk]

Originally posted by Chewback:

Originally posted by Tiggerhawk:

Originally posted by hooper56:
These is something so very very wrong about this. And they still could not win the national title, yet Cal is supposed to be a good coach. Any school that had the Kentucky Boo$ters could do the same thing.

No, it couldn't be done at any university college where the athletic department is not autonomous, where the administration has actual control over admissions, where boosters are not permitted to corrupt pervasively the university. To put it in harsh but factual words, the U of Kentucky is a shameless whore.

But the greater shame is that of the NCAA and the university & college presidents who are the final authority over the NCAA. They allow the boosters & the Kentucky athletic department to corrupt the NCAA, college basketball, and by extension not just college athletics but the values & integrity of higher education in America. There is no greater example of unpatriotic actions, because the distortions ultimately have serious adverse consequence on the educational & research functions that determine how well we will be able to compete in the world of the future.

Also to be emphasized, the shame is equally that of the television network whores, and the Federal Communications Commission that allows the broadcast media to seduce the willing college & university athletic programs.

In 1946, when the Big Ten (with the U of Iowa to its everlasting credit playing the most prominent role) promoted & directed successfully the transformation of the NCAA from an advisory organization to a governing body with rule-making & enforcement powers, predictably even then it was the U of Kentucky that led the fierce all-out effort of the SEC and Southwest Conference to prevent the changes from taking effect. The reason why UK did everything in its power in its vain effort to make sure there would never be a sheriff in town was obvious at the time: Kentucky was buying NCAA championships then just like now---and the first bad guys the new NCAA Enforcerment office investigated, found guilty, and wrist-slapped was Adolph Rupp's UK Wildcats (no real sanctions were imposed on Rupp, Kentucky hoops, or the boosters: from the beginning the NCAA operated with two standards of justice---one for the rich & powerful, one for the little unimportant schools--- so it was urban, commuter school CCNY, a small-time first offender, that got hit hard with penalties a few years later (it was NOT a mere coincidence, that the school the NCAA's dominant large universities, especially in the South, that long had quotas for Jewish professors and students, chose to make an example was CCNY, with its heavily Jewish staff & student body, and its mostly Jewish basketball team).

The U of Kentucky was a foul cesspool even as American colleges & universities confronted the challenges of coping with the vast horde of veterans now able to seek a college degree at the dawn of the postwar world in 1945-46. It has continued to epitomize the disgraceful side of college sport with impunity and without interruption for almost 70 years since.

Wow. I would have given this a tl;dr except I actually DID read it. Or tried to. We need to come up with a code for "read the whole thing, didn't understand a word", or something like that.

yeah, i got half way thru the 2nd paragraph before moving on

 

[OnceAhawk]

Re: OT: Seven Kentucky Players Declaring for NBA Draft!

Originally posted by clickhere 01:

Originally posted by SSG T:
When everyone but the players aren't getting rich off of them I'll start worrying about whether or not the one and done types are ruining the game. Until then, I'll enjoy watching really good players, even if they're only in the college game for a year. The problem isn't Kentucky, or Calipari, or those 7 players. The problem is the system. When you have a system where athletic departments, schools, coaches, networks, talking heads, broadcasters, pretty much everyone but the athletes are getting rich from those athletes performances, there is a major problem.


Unfortunately, that cow left the barn 60 years ago and you'll never find it, let alone get it back in the barn. Enjoy the show and hope that at some point those athletes will get a small share of what they earned.

Good post

c'mon man, everyone knows a cow does not live 60 years

you have to remember that college athletes now get the following:

Scott Dochterman of the Cedar Rapids Gazette said that as of 2013, an instate kid's schollie (tuition, room, board[/B]) is worth $17.6K; an outstate schollie is worth $35.8K. He said that both figures are about $4.2K behind in cost of attendance[/B].

As we know, with power 5 conference (SEC, B1G, ACC, Big 12, PAC 12) autonomy now in place, it appears all power 5 conference athletes, male and female, will get an additional cost of attendance payment each year. So, that makes the value of the scholarships this[/B]:

$21,800/yr for instate kids
$40,000/yr for out of state kids

Unlimited meals[/B] will add to the value of the scholarship (or it might be part of the $4,200 cost of attendance) because now the athletes don't have as big of an annual groceries expense.

Keep in mind, too, that a football player gets top shelf training[/B] from Strength and Conditioning Coach Doyle/his staff; the basketball players get top level training as well. If you bought personal training from the very best at a health club it would run you $100/hour. Scott said the value of this personal training is around $10,000 a year.

And, finally, I recently got advice from a trainer on developing meal plans that work with my training[/B]. The cost was $100/month. And you know the Iowa training staffs for the football and basketball players are giving advice to the athletes on what to eat and when to eat it.

Other freebies, as part of being a scholarship athlete:[/B]
* shirts, shorts, sweatshirts, sweat pants, socks, shoes from Nike, etc (what's that value?)
* free tutoring
* Anything I miss?

So, bottom line, the value of a scholarship for an out of state kid is easily around $50,000 per year. Not bad for an 18 year old.

Consider that every member of the Iowa women's field hockey team comes from out of state. Many of the sports at Iowa are made up of mostly out of state kids.

How much more can / should Iowa pay out to its student/athletes?

I think the numbers above make the "pay the players" debate so interesting; out of state kids are ALREADY "paid" around $46,000/yr at Iowa and it soon will be over $50,000/year! Think what private schools like Northwestern are currently "paying" both their instate and out of state athletes.

Thoughts?

 

[BlueHawk23]

Originally posted by Tiggerhawk:
THAT is usually undertaken primarily by the use of visual materials. B - O - O - K - S. On this topic I recommend you read CAREFULLY, TOTALLY Murray Sparber's book Glory. It is a unsympathetic history of the NCAA. witten by an English professor at Indiana (now retired I believe) about 20 to 30 years ago, but still very relevant to current NCAA affairs.

do u have a copy i can borrow? cause according to amazon, wikipedia and sperber's bio page no such book is available in print so maybe he gave you the only copy? thanks.

 

[DanL53]

Re: OT: Seven Kentucky Players Declaring for NBA Draft!

Originally posted by fivecardstud14:

Originally posted by Cerro Gordo Hawk:
It's so pathetic how some of you are sooooooooooooooo jealous of programs like Kentucky. Is Coach Cal a snake? Yes he is. But I would like to be Kentucky, and win.

Agreed. So much salt for Kentucky on this board & it's comical. Que the "I'd rather win with white boys who attend class" posts.

Posted from Rivals Mobile


The answer is pretty simple. Go be Kentucky fans.

It's funny each of you claim other Iowa fans are jealous, when you then make fun of those same fans for NOT WANTING to be like Kentucky. If anyone is jealous it seems to me it is the two of you.

Go! Enjoy! What's holding you back?

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

Re: OT: Seven Kentucky Players Declaring for NBA Draft!

Originally posted by fivecardstud14:
Can't edit on phone. Was supposed to say "lose" instead of win.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

Nope, too late. Can't take back what you said. Now we're gonna go shock the world and win a basketball national championship with 5 white guys, which would be unprecedented in today's game of college basketball............

Well done, fivecardstud14!

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

Originally posted by RocknRollface:
Harrison twins declaring for the Dleauge.

They were supposed to be part of the greatest recruiting class ever lol. Better than fan 5. Not even remotely close.

Probably not, but then again, they, and most other all-star recruiting classes like them, won't stick around to even find out.

Most of the Fab 5 went at least 2-3 years at Michigan. Nowadays, you only get one season to make a name for yourself in the college game. There's no legacy, no building of legends. Just flashes in the pan. That's what the game has become.

 

[icparkerhawk]

Originally posted by Cerro Gordo Hawk:
For the love of God, get over yourselves. Duke does the same thing. Coach K must be snake in the grass, as well. I would like to see Fran start winning a conference championship, start winning some BIG conference games. Ethics, morals??? It's college basketball.

You really think they're comparable?? How many wins have been wiped from Coach K's record? How many Final Four appearances has he had invalidated? Has Cal built up the reputation of being one of the best coaches in history over several decades? I'll hang up and listen.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[DavenportHawk8]

I think this is the sneaky way of sticking it to the NCAA. By allowing kids to play one year of NCAA basketball, they decided to gang up and all go to one team. Then after each year, they will declare and new wave of top recruits will come in. Basically a primer for the NBA??

I think at some point the NCAA just needs to say, "if you are ready for the NBA, come on in" and don't waste time with them going to college. This is pretty insane that so many freshman are opting for the NBA, I remember when Ricky Davis did it and I thought it was stupid to make him even play college ball. Just let them go if they think they are ready.

But I also feel that players who play professional over seas should not be allowed to come to the states and play. I don't care if they play for free over there, if they play against professional athletes they should lose their eligibility and have to stay pro. Just my 2 cents.

What is kentucky's graduation rate? Don't they have to maintain a certain level in order to eligible? I thought you had to graduate a certain amount of your team? If these 7 guys leave, that doesn't bode to well.

 

[Titanhawk2]

Originally posted by OnceAhawk:

Originally posted by DanL53:

http://www.wthr.com/story/28763598/record-7-kentucky-players-intend-to-enter-nba-draft

"The soon-to-be-former Wildcats gathered at their practice gym and said they will turn pro: 7-footers Willie Cauley-Stein and Dakari Johnson, twin guards Andrew and Aaron Harrison, freshman forwards Karl-Anthony Towns and Trey Lyles and freshman backup guard Devin Booker."

The good news is this should clear up the log jam of five star players waiting for their table at Kentucky.

I think the Harrison twins are overrated; will be interested to see if Stein develops an offensive game; jury is still out on Booker, too

so, there are 5 left? Ulis and who? i guess KY can now sign 8 five star recruits? yikes....

I wish kids were not eligible for the NBA until age 20 or 21 (similar to the NFL); there just has to be some balance in student and athlete; this one year thing (because of the NBA rule) is a joke; either let them in when 18 or if they sign a LOI, they must wait until at least 20

So if someone offered you a six figure job after your freshman year would you have said "no sir, I owe to my professors and TA's to stay in school a couple more years"? Any other student can leave whenever they want, why force athletes to stay?

 

[Cerro Gordo Hawk]

Re: OT: Seven Kentucky Players Declaring for NBA Draft!

DanL, like I said, it's college basketball. It's the system. It's horrible, AAU basketball is ruining college basketball. There is probably a certain level of cheating at several P5 conference schools. It is what it is.

 

[DavenportHawk8]

Re: OT: Seven Kentucky Players Declaring for NBA Draft!

Originally posted by Cerro Gordo Hawk:
DanL, like I said, it's college basketball. It's the system. It's horrible, AAU basketball is ruining college basketball. There is probably a certain level of cheating at several P5 conference schools. It is what it is.

Not only college, but high school as well.

I would not be surprised if in 10-15 years if there is not even a high school state championship. There were two kids who did not play for their local high school team this year. They instead used the time as a "rest" period so they could be fresh when AAU season kicked off again. They talked about how they get more "exposure" playing AAU, then they would playing high school basketball.

I don't agree with that all and I wish college coaches would put an emphasis on kids playing for their high school, but its pretty sad when a player gets recruited and the only person the coaches talk to is there AAU coach. Majority of these AAU coaches are only looking out for themselves and want something in return.

Not to mention most of these kids are playing year around now. What happened to the multi-sport athlete?? It amazes me how many kids start playing basketball at 2-3 grade and asked to play it year around. I know our neighbor kid has been throwing/catching and having hitting practices for baseball since last November. He goes something like 3-4 times per week! Talk about not gonna have an arm before he hits high school.

 

[OnceAhawk]

Originally posted by DavenportHawk8:
I think this is the sneaky way of sticking it to the NCAA. By allowing kids to play one year of NCAA basketball, they decided to gang up and all go to one team. Then after each year, they will declare and new wave of top recruits will come in. Basically a primer for the NBA??

I think at some point the NCAA just needs to say, "if you are ready for the NBA, come on in" and don't waste time with them going to college. This is pretty insane that so many freshman are opting for the NBA, I remember when Ricky Davis did it and I thought it was stupid to make him even play college ball. Just let them go if they think they are ready.

But I also feel that players who play professional over seas should not be allowed to come to the states and play. I don't care if they play for free over there, if they play against professional athletes they should lose their eligibility and have to stay pro. Just my 2 cents.

What is kentucky's graduation rate? Don't they have to maintain a certain level in order to eligible? I thought you had to graduate a certain amount of your team? If these 7 guys leave, that doesn't bode to well.

i don't know how you measure graduation rates when so many players are leaving by their 2nd year

 

[longliveCS40]

Originally posted by Chewback:

Originally posted by Tiggerhawk:

Originally posted by hooper56:
These is something so very very wrong about this. And they still could not win the national title, yet Cal is supposed to be a good coach. Any school that had the Kentucky Boo$ters could do the same thing.

No, it couldn't be done at any university college where the athletic department is not autonomous, where the administration has actual control over admissions, where boosters are not permitted to corrupt pervasively the university. To put it in harsh but factual words, the U of Kentucky is a shameless whore.

But the greater shame is that of the NCAA and the university & college presidents who are the final authority over the NCAA. They allow the boosters & the Kentucky athletic department to corrupt the NCAA, college basketball, and by extension not just college athletics but the values & integrity of higher education in America. There is no greater example of unpatriotic actions, because the distortions ultimately have serious adverse consequence on the educational & research functions that determine how well we will be able to compete in the world of the future.

Also to be emphasized, the shame is equally that of the television network whores, and the Federal Communications Commission that allows the broadcast media to seduce the willing college & university athletic programs.

In 1946, when the Big Ten (with the U of Iowa to its everlasting credit playing the most prominent role) promoted & directed successfully the transformation of the NCAA from an advisory organization to a governing body with rule-making & enforcement powers, predictably even then it was the U of Kentucky that led the fierce all-out effort of the SEC and Southwest Conference to prevent the changes from taking effect. The reason why UK did everything in its power in its vain effort to make sure there would never be a sheriff in town was obvious at the time: Kentucky was buying NCAA championships then just like now---and the first bad guys the new NCAA Enforcerment office investigated, found guilty, and wrist-slapped was Adolph Rupp's UK Wildcats (no real sanctions were imposed on Rupp, Kentucky hoops, or the boosters: from the beginning the NCAA operated with two standards of justice---one for the rich & powerful, one for the little unimportant schools--- so it was urban, commuter school CCNY, a small-time first offender, that got hit hard with penalties a few years later (it was NOT a mere coincidence, that the school the NCAA's dominant large universities, especially in the South, that long had quotas for Jewish professors and students, chose to make an example was CCNY, with its heavily Jewish staff & student body, and its mostly Jewish basketball team).

The U of Kentucky was a foul cesspool even as American colleges & universities confronted the challenges of coping with the vast horde of veterans now able to seek a college degree at the dawn of the postwar world in 1945-46. It has continued to epitomize the disgraceful side of college sport with impunity and without interruption for almost 70 years since.

Wow. I would have given this a tl;dr except I actually DID read it. Or tried to. We need to come up with a code for "read the whole thing, didn't understand a word", or something like that.

They already have that. It is "lol wut?"

 

[icparkerhawk]

Originally posted by OnceAhawk:

Originally posted by DavenportHawk8:
I think this is the sneaky way of sticking it to the NCAA. By allowing kids to play one year of NCAA basketball, they decided to gang up and all go to one team. Then after each year, they will declare and new wave of top recruits will come in. Basically a primer for the NBA?? 

I think at some point the NCAA just needs to say, "if you are ready for the NBA, come on in"  and don't waste time with them going to college. This is pretty insane that so many freshman are opting for the NBA, I remember when Ricky Davis did it and I thought it was stupid to make him even play college ball. Just let them go if they think they are ready. 

But I also feel that players who play professional over seas should not be allowed to come to the states and play. I don't care if they play for free over there, if they play against professional athletes they should lose their eligibility and have to stay pro. Just my 2 cents. 

What is kentucky's graduation rate? Don't they have to maintain a certain level in order to eligible? I thought you had to graduate a certain amount of your team? If these 7 guys leave, that doesn't bode to well. 

i don't know how you measure graduation rates when so many players are leaving by their 2nd year

I thought I read somewhere that players leaving to go pro didn't count against teams. Anybody able to confirm or deny that?
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[OnceAhawk]

Originally posted by Titanhawk2:

Originally posted by OnceAhawk:

Originally posted by DanL53:

http://www.wthr.com/story/28763598/record-7-kentucky-players-intend-to-enter-nba-draft

"The soon-to-be-former Wildcats gathered at their practice gym and said they will turn pro: 7-footers Willie Cauley-Stein and Dakari Johnson, twin guards Andrew and Aaron Harrison, freshman forwards Karl-Anthony Towns and Trey Lyles and freshman backup guard Devin Booker."

The good news is this should clear up the log jam of five star players waiting for their table at Kentucky.

I think the Harrison twins are overrated; will be interested to see if Stein develops an offensive game; jury is still out on Booker, too

so, there are 5 left? Ulis and who? i guess KY can now sign 8 five star recruits? yikes....

I wish kids were not eligible for the NBA until age 20 or 21 (similar to the NFL); there just has to be some balance in student and athlete; this one year thing (because of the NBA rule) is a joke; either let them in when 18 or if they sign a LOI, they must wait until at least 20

So if someone offered you a six figure job after your freshman year would you have said "no sir, I owe to my professors and TA's to stay in school a couple more years"? Any other student can leave whenever they want, why force athletes to stay?

I just feel that if you are a student athlete and you sign a LOI, you should be at least half way towards a degree before you can turn pro in the sport for which you signed the LOI

the NFL has age limits; why can't the NCAA LOI? The current NBA age limit should be age 20 or 21 (like the NFL).

thats just my opinion.

 

[OnceAhawk]

Re: OT: Seven Kentucky Players Declaring for NBA Draft!

Originally posted by Cerro Gordo Hawk:
DanL, like I said, it's college basketball. It's the system. It's horrible, AAU basketball is ruining college basketball. There is probably a certain level of cheating at several P5 conference schools. It is what it is.

Kobe Bryant would agree w/ you concerning AAU basketball

 

[OnceAhawk]

Re: OT: Seven Kentucky Players Declaring for NBA Draft!

Originally posted by DavenportHawk8:

Originally posted by Cerro Gordo Hawk:
DanL, like I said, it's college basketball. It's the system. It's horrible, AAU basketball is ruining college basketball. There is probably a certain level of cheating at several P5 conference schools. It is what it is.

Not only college, but high school as well.

I would not be surprised if in 10-15 years if there is not even a high school state championship. There were two kids who did not play for their local high school team this year. They instead used the time as a "rest" period so they could be fresh when AAU season kicked off again. They talked about how they get more "exposure" playing AAU, then they would playing high school basketball.

I don't agree with that all and I wish college coaches would put an emphasis on kids playing for their high school, but its pretty sad when a player gets recruited and the only person the coaches talk to is there AAU coach. Majority of these AAU coaches are only looking out for themselves and want something in return.

Not to mention most of these kids are playing year around now. What happened to the multi-sport athlete?? It amazes me how many kids start playing basketball at 2-3 grade and asked to play it year around. I know our neighbor kid has been throwing/catching and having hitting practices for baseball since last November. He goes something like 3-4 times per week! Talk about not gonna have an arm before he hits high school.

I think multi sport athletes are becoming a thing of the past. And when an athletec specializes, what comes with that are repetitive stress injuries; in your example, if you are throwing a ball around year round, your shoulder/elbow/etc joints are going to take a beating

 

[clickhere 01]

Originally posted by DavenportHawk8:
What is their APR?? Don't you have to meet certain requirements in order be eligible for the NCAA tournament. If they are not graduating all their players, how can they be passing in the APR ranks?

The most recent year listed for APR is 2012-2013 season:
Iowa -971
Kentucky-989

 

[clickhere 01]

Originally posted by DavenportHawk8:
I think this is the sneaky way of sticking it to the NCAA. By allowing kids to play one year of NCAA basketball, they decided to gang up and all go to one team. Then after each year, they will declare and new wave of top recruits will come in. Basically a primer for the NBA??

I think at some point the NCAA just needs to say, "if you are ready for the NBA, come on in" and don't waste time with them going to college. This is pretty insane that so many freshman are opting for the NBA, I remember when Ricky Davis did it and I thought it was stupid to make him even play college ball. Just let them go if they think they are ready.

But I also feel that players who play professional over seas should not be allowed to come to the states and play. I don't care if they play for free over there, if they play against professional athletes they should lose their eligibility and have to stay pro. Just my 2 cents.

What is kentucky's graduation rate? Don't they have to maintain a certain level in order to eligible? I thought you had to graduate a certain amount of your team? If these 7 guys leave, that doesn't bode to well.

Hyperbole. Duke could have 3 freshman go in the draft,Ohio State one,Syracuse,Arizona,etc...

Also, It's the NBA that's keeping the players out for a year, not the NCAA.

 

[icparkerhawk]

Originally posted by clickhere 01:

Originally posted by DavenportHawk8:
What is their APR?? Don't you have to meet certain requirements in order be eligible for the NCAA tournament. If they are not graduating all their players, how can they be passing in the APR ranks? 

The most recent year listed for APR is 2012-2013 season:
Iowa -971
Kentucky-989

I'm taking this as validation on my previous post. Guys leaving to go pro can't count. So you have 13 guys on roster, 7 go pro, 3 are token white guys on the end of the bench that graduate, the other three are wild cards that might graduate, might transfer or might go pro.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[rillo 62]

Originally posted by icparkerhawk:

Originally posted by clickhere 01:

Originally posted by DavenportHawk8:
What is their APR?? Don't you have to meet certain requirements in order be eligible for the NCAA tournament. If they are not graduating all their players, how can they be passing in the APR ranks?Â

The most recent year listed for APR is 2012-2013 season:
Iowa -971
Kentucky-989

I'm taking this as validation on my previous post. Guys leaving to go pro can't count. So you have 13 guys on roster, 7 go pro, 3 are token white guys on the end of the bench that graduate, the other three are wild cards that might graduate, might transfer or might go pro.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

If an athlete leaves early for the Pros or transfers,as long as their in good standing academically, they don't count against the APR.

 

[HoustonREDHawk]

Re: OT: Seven Kentucky Players Declaring for NBA Draft!

Originally posted by SSG T:
When everyone but the players aren't getting rich off of them I'll start worrying about whether or not the one and done types are ruining the game. Until then, I'll enjoy watching really good players, even if they're only in the college game for a year. The problem isn't Kentucky, or Calipari, or those 7 players. The problem is the system. When you have a system where athletic departments, schools, coaches, networks, talking heads, broadcasters, pretty much everyone but the athletes are getting rich from those athletes performances, there is a major problem.


Unfortunately, that cow left the barn 60 years ago and you'll never find it, let alone get it back in the barn. Enjoy the show and hope that at some point those athletes will get a small share of what they earned.

The cow has since had calves, who also had calves, who had calves... Except for the racism that existed in Coach Rupp's time, each generation of college basketball seems to get uglier, because the $$$$$$$$$ involved has grown exponentially. The NCAA is basically useless.

 

[Tiggerhawk]

Originally posted by BlueHawk23:

Originally posted by Tiggerhawk:
THAT is usually undertaken primarily by the use of visual materials. B - O - O - K - S. On this topic I recommend you read CAREFULLY, TOTALLY Murray Sparber's book Glory. It is a unsympathetic history of the NCAA. witten by an English professor at Indiana (now retired I believe) about 20 to 30 years ago, but still very relevant to current NCAA affairs.

do u have a copy i can borrow? cause according to amazon, wikipedia and sperber's bio page no such book is available in print so maybe he gave you the only copy? thanks.

I have corrected my vague & unsatisfactory reference in my previous post. The title is not Glory, that is just the heading on my summary notes that I used. The actual title is Onward to Victory. As i said, it was written a long time ago (the actual publication date was 1998), but your public or college library will have it. But you can still obtain it from Amazon, as there are always used copies available---you can get your own copy for less than five dollars including shipping.

I think you will enjoy reading it. It is easy reading, ordinary language & not stilted academic verbosity, and very detailed & informative about many other similar NCAA blunders in trying to enforce its arbitrary & distorted rules.

Sperber retired about a decade ago, but he is in fact still teaching---now as emeritus professor at Cal-Berkelely, and he is still writing frequently on college sports and their financial abuses.