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5 Month's Worth of Gaps Discovered in Hillary's Emails.

Not sure I would use candy in a jar as a comparison to emails that could contain information that is key to national security.....

Unfortunately, it seems to be the only analogy that can be understood by some of the posters here....

Just because the cost of candy changes from 'free' to '50 cents' doesn't make previous consumers of 'free' candy thieves.

And if some piece of information was NOT considered 'classified' when it was initially sent out via unsecured means, likewise implies that claiming it is 'classified' later doesn't make conveyors of that un-labled information 'spies' or 'guilty of acts of espionage', if the information sent at the time had no such designation.

As has been implied in legitimate news stories on this topic- the FBI's activities are focused primarily on the alleged 'classified' information, when it was identified as 'classified', when it was sent over non-secured channels (email or otherwise), and if it was subsequently identified as 'classified' within those channels when it was re-sent. The allegations in this thread are predominantly uninformed nonsense until there are formal facts relayed by investigative agencies, rather than the rampant speculation regurgitated here.
 
Wrong, it's you refusing to see any other view than your highly political one. Question, for those emails that are now considered classified did the content of the emails on Hilary's server change? Was the information in them any more confidential now than it was when they were sent/received?

Per your own (convoluted) logic here:

  • NSA sends you a regular mail envelope of non-classified material.
  • You receive that envelope and put it in a file.
  • 1 week later, NSA lists that same information as 'highly classified'.
  • 2 hours later, men in black suits arrive at your door with a warrant, search your house, and find the 'classified' information.
  • You go to jail for 30 years.

It has nothing to do with 'how confidential' the information is or was; it has everything to do with whether or not it was properly identified as 'classified' when it was sent/received.

The thing they will absolutely toast HC for is if she was the INITIAL SENDER of information that was considered 'classified' via regular email, regardless of which server it was sent from. She will go to jail if the information she conveyed was SOLELY described to her using secure channels and clearly identified as 'classified' information at the time she learned it.
 
Uh....no, they weren't. For ANY private email, the messages are stored on the server for the email provider, e.g. Google or AOL or whatever.

And it is now acknowledged that MANY State Dept employees used private emails, and that Google, etc., have many of those allegedly 'classified' emails on their servers as well.

HC's emails that were sent to .gov email addresses are by default stored on government servers. There is no indication provided by FBI as yet that HC's server was 'hacked'; some of her emails were, but that is not unique to her email or her server - routine email traffic is NOT secure and is interceptable by several means along the transmission route.

It would probably be advisable to wait for the FBI and State Dept investigations to conclude before you make the outrageous claims and judgements you've made here (and are being made in the blogosphere), because if those investigations turn up nothing illegal, your head is going to explode.
I am surprised that the Federal Government allows any email system to be used other than the official government servers. I have worked for a finance company, and all external email systems were blocked, and the SEC required that all emails be kept, and that all emails have warning in the footnotes that told all receivers of the email that it was being stored for the SEC. I would figure the federal government should have even tougher standards.
 
It wasn't classified at all when she received it, sent it, or anything else. It didn't become classified until later. How are you not getting this?
In at least one case, Hillary initiated material that was classified. Do you understand that, by definition, that wouldn't be labeled at the time she wrote it?
 
I am surprised that the Federal Government allows any email system to be used other than the official government servers. I have worked for a finance company, and all external email systems were blocked, and the SEC required that all emails be kept, and that all emails have warning in the footnotes that told all receivers of the email that it was being stored for the SEC. I would figure the federal government should have even tougher standards.

...you would think, right?

I am likewise amazed that this practice was not government-wide policy (no personal email used for govt business).
 
In at least one case, Hillary initiated material that was classified. Do you understand that, by definition, that wouldn't be labeled at the time she wrote it?

Again...I'll leave it for the FBI to determine what was or was not 'classified' and where the information originated; not news 'pundits' and blogs.
 
Uh...no.

It's like a candy jar was sitting out with a sign saying 'Free- take one please'. Johnny helped himself to one candy each day he stopped by. A week later, Jimmy saw the same sign and had one free candy, too, each day of the week.

A week later, the same candy jar now has a sign that says 'Candy - 50 cents each'.

Your position is that both Johnny and Jimmy are thieves, because they 'stole candy' that now costs 50 cents. The reality is that the cost of the candy was labeled differently at the time they took it.

And, for another poster - it's not about the 'type of information' on servers being classified - it's either listed as classified and identified as such or it's not. It can be 'sensitive' information, but that's different from formally classified intel.

Just like the 'type' of candy might be free or typically cost 50 cents. It's either labeled/identified as free or costing 50 cents or it's not. I'm reserving judgments on that for formal investigators to make decisions on whether the information was improperly handled, not pundits.


So below Johnny took 4 pieces of candy when the sign said "1".
(So it seems she didn’t break a rule simply by using a personal email to conduct business. Rather, by using personal emails exclusively, she skirted the rules governing federal records management, Cox said.)

So below Jimmy took the whole damn jar instead of "1".
(It would have been a violation of the NARA's rules in the Code of Federal Regulations for Clinton to use personal email exclusively, Metcalfe said. The code requires federal agencies to make and preserve records that duly document agency activity, so that they are readily available when needed -- such as for FOIA requests or congressional inquiries. Using personal email exclusively is contrary to proper record preservation.
"Anyone at NARA would have said you can’t use a personal email account for all of your official business," said Metcalfe, who held his position in part during former President Bill Clinton’s administration.)

Below had Johnny or Jimmy done this (abided by the sign) - no controversy.
(Had Clinton used a @state.gov email address, every email sent and received would have been archived in the State Department system. Clinton, who served from 2009 to 2013, has argued that her emails were archived in the system because she was in the habit of sending them to other government employees with .gov email addresses.)

Add in the fact that Johnny decided to eat all the candy, then throw the jar away and leave only the lid behind... you have wiping of the mail server and the denial of any wrong doing... until caught on the office camera with pieces of candy all around him as he is sleeping at his desk from sugar dose.
 
It wasn't classified at all when she received it, sent it, or anything else. It didn't become classified until later. How are you not getting this?
If it is all done on a government secure server - then no big whoop.
 
It's amazing what lengths people will go to in order to excuse the actions of their preferred criminal cartel. Clinton is a confirmed career criminal, liar and murderess. The US/CIA was selling high powered weapons to Muslim terrorists and the deal went awry. That's why Obumma and Hitlerry let those people die and made all survivors swear to secrecy. Obumma's time is unaccounted for when the attacks happened. That can never happen when you're the POTUS. But we're supposed to believe that he had no idea what was going on when the attacks happened? Someone gave the order for our military to stand down and only a few people had the authority to give the order. That's why its important for Hitlerry to come clean, not that anything would happen to her anyway. Obumma is the worst president in US history (and that's saying something since Bush 1 and jr are former presidents) and he'll be damned if any of his fellow career criminals will ever see justice. So some of those geniuses concocted the "Blame it on a video that no Muslims even saw Defense".

Anyone who believes in the fake game of "Left vs Right" is either brainwashed or gullible and easily manipulated.
 
It's amazing what lengths people will go to in order to excuse the actions of their preferred criminal cartel. Clinton is a confirmed career criminal, liar and murderess. The US/CIA was selling high powered weapons to Muslim terrorists and the deal went awry. That's why Obumma and Hitlerry let those people die and made all survivors swear to secrecy. Obumma's time is unaccounted for when the attacks happened. That can never happen when you're the POTUS. But we're supposed to believe that he had no idea what was going on when the attacks happened? Someone gave the order for our military to stand down and only a few people had the authority to give the order. That's why its important for Hitlerry to come clean, not that anything would happen to her anyway. Obumma is the worst president in US history (and that's saying something since Bush 1 and jr are former presidents) and he'll be damned if any of his fellow career criminals will ever see justice. So some of those geniuses concocted the "Blame it on a video that no Muslims even saw Defense".

Anyone who believes in the fake game of "Left vs Right" is either brainwashed or gullible and easily manipulated.

There is a cure for Clinton Derangement Syndrome you know. A few weeks away from the wingnut echo chamber of hatred and lies would do wonders to bring you back to sanity and reality. A mind is a terrible thing to waste!
 
There is a cure for Clinton Derangement Syndrome you know. A few weeks away from the wingnut echo chamber of hatred and lies would do wonders to bring you back to sanity and reality. A mind is a terrible thing to waste!

Just a little information for you - replace Hillary with any Republican and the Left would be doing much worse then the Right at the moment.
 
There is a cure for Clinton Derangement Syndrome you know. A few weeks away from the wingnut echo chamber of hatred and lies would do wonders to bring you back to sanity and reality. A mind is a terrible thing to waste!

You should follow your own advice since you are precisely the kind of brainwashed Hitlerry bootlicking nut job I was referring to.
 
Just a little information for you - replace Hillary with any Republican and the Left would be doing much worse then the Right at the moment.

Absolutely. That's why big-time politics is a blood-sport.

The GOP needs to keep this issue in the headlines for the next calendar year to either prevent HC from getting the Dem nomination, or discrediting her vs their own candidate. That's the main reason all the pundit blurbs coming out are 'news' right now.

Her best hope is for the FBI investigation to be tied up soon, and minimize the fallout from whatever that outcome is (if that is possible - a criminal indictment may not end up with her in jail, but it'd sure end her political aspirations).
 
Again...I'll leave it for the FBI to determine what was or was not 'classified' and where the information originated; not news 'pundits' and blogs.
It's not up to the FBI to determine what material is classified and what isn't. And I don't think there's any question about the origin of the e-mail I was referring to.
 
Again...I'll leave it for the FBI to determine what was or was not 'classified' and where the information originated; not news 'pundits' and blogs.
I realize it is hopeless to present you with facts. Nonetheless, I am linking an article you should read. The fact that it is from an anti-Hillary source should be kept in mind, but is not justification for discounting everything in it. The factual assertions can be checked -- and have been.

The one aspect that you should note is that (1) Hillary originated the e-mails in question on her private server; (2) the content of the e-mails was redacted when they were released because they were classified. Ergo, in the real world, there is no doubt that Hillary originated classified e-mails.

http://thefederalist.com/2015/09/01...nd-distributed-highly-classified-information/
 
Ergo, in the real world, there is no doubt that Hillary originated classified e-mails.

http://thefederalist.com/2015/09/01...nd-distributed-highly-classified-information/

You seem to not understand how email works. Email servers both SEND and RECEIVE emails. Thus, although HC could have 'sent' information that was classified, she also could have responded to emails which already had classified information in them.

Not sure how many times I have to re-state it, but the FBI is looking into this exact issue, to identify the SOURCE of the classified information. Just because it was on her server is not a sufficient logical condition for her to have initiated it....
 
You seem to not understand how email works. Email servers both SEND and RECEIVE emails. Thus, although HC could have 'sent' information that was classified, she also could have responded to emails which already had classified information in them.

Not sure how many times I have to re-state it, but the FBI is looking into this exact issue, to identify the SOURCE of the classified information. Just because it was on her server is not a sufficient logical condition for her to have initiated it....

If she did, what makes it any less of a crime if she responded to emails with classified info in them? And if she responded, she must have read them. How did she not know the information in those emails, labelled classified or not, weren't filled with sensitive information. She was the SOS after all. And if she realized sensitive info was being sent to her, why would she continue to use a private email server/account?

Incompetent
at best.
 
If she did, what makes it any less of a crime if she responded to emails with classified info in them? And if she responded, she must have read them. How did she not know the information in those emails, labelled classified or not, weren't filled with sensitive information. She was the SOS after all. And if she realized sensitive info was being sent to her, why would she continue to use a private email server/account?

Incompetent
at best.

'Classified' information is also not intended to be sent via regular '.gov' emails; thus, the case that info was sent via a personal email vs. a non-secure system .gov email is really irrelevant.

Any information being released by the State Dept and ending up in Op Eds probably indicates there is no criminal or indictable case element to the information - if FBI were needing that information for a potential criminal case, they would have prevented any release of it, as potentially harming or compromising their case....

Or, is it now the policy of federal attorneys/entities to publicly release their case in advance of potential criminal charges?
 
You seem to not understand how email works. Email servers both SEND and RECEIVE emails. Thus, although HC could have 'sent' information that was classified, she also could have responded to emails which already had classified information in them.

Not sure how many times I have to re-state it, but the FBI is looking into this exact issue, to identify the SOURCE of the classified information. Just because it was on her server is not a sufficient logical condition for her to have initiated it....

I'd be interested in seeing your source regarding the FBI investigation.
 
'Classified' information is also not intended to be sent via regular '.gov' emails; thus, the case that info was sent via a personal email vs. a non-secure system .gov email is really irrelevant.

Any information being released by the State Dept and ending up in Op Eds probably indicates there is no criminal or indictable case element to the information - if FBI were needing that information for a potential criminal case, they would have prevented any release of it, as potentially harming or compromising their case....

Or, is it now the policy of federal attorneys/entities to publicly release their case in advance of potential criminal charges?

You realize several (don't know the number) of the emails released were redacted, right? The sensitive or classified info that was censored could still be part of an FBI investigation.
 
You realize several (don't know the number) of the emails released were redacted, right? The sensitive or classified info that was censored could still be part of an FBI investigation.

Could be....but by identifying the specific email, date, time, recipients, you're throwing information out there that no prosecutor would want disclosed if he's trying to build a case.
 
You seem to not understand how email works. Email servers both SEND and RECEIVE emails. Thus, although HC could have 'sent' information that was classified, she also could have responded to emails which already had classified information in them.

Not sure how many times I have to re-state it, but the FBI is looking into this exact issue, to identify the SOURCE of the classified information. Just because it was on her server is not a sufficient logical condition for her to have initiated it....
Not sure you read the linked piece.
 
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How about a link, for those of us who are not inclined to take your word for it?

The FBI’s interest in Clinton’s e-mail system comes after the intelligence community’s inspector general referred the issue to the Justice Department in July. Intelligence officials expressed concern that some sensitive information was not in the government’s possession and could be “compromised.” The referral did not accuse Clinton of any wrongdoing, and the two officials said Tuesday that the FBI is not targeting her.

Kendall confirmed the contact, saying: “The government is seeking assurance about the storage of those materials. We are actively cooperating.”

A lawyer for the Denver company, Platte River Networks, declined to comment, as did multiple Justice Department officials.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...dd85ec-3aae-11e5-8e98-115a3cf7d7ae_story.html
 
How about a link, for those of us who are not inclined to take your word for it?

F.B.I. agents investigating Hillary Rodham Clinton’s private email server are seeking to determine who at the State Department passed highly classified information from secure networks to Mrs. Clinton’s personal account, according to law enforcement and diplomatic officials and others briefed on the investigation.
To track how the information flowed, agents will try to gain access to the email accounts of many State Department officials who worked there while Mrs. Clinton was secretary of state, the officials said. State Department employees apparently circulated the emails on unclassified systems in 2009 and 2011, and some were ultimately forwarded to Mrs. Clinton.
They were not marked as classified, the State Department has said, and it is unclear whether its employees knew the origin of the information.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/15/u...hillary-clinton-at-state-department.html?_r=0
 


Using your generous effort here, the first item that comes up says this:

An FBI probe into whether Hillary Clinton mishandled classified information on her private server has been described as "extremely serious" and has required the help of the agency's best investigators.

The investigation, which Clinton has dismissed as a routine "security inquiry," is examining a possible violation of the Espionage Act, according to a report by Fox News.

This link is from the Washington Examiner, and is a bit different than your interpretation of the FBI's investigation.
 
F.B.I. agents investigating Hillary Rodham Clinton’s private email server are seeking to determine who at the State Department passed highly classified information from secure networks to Mrs. Clinton’s personal account, according to law enforcement and diplomatic officials and others briefed on the investigation.
To track how the information flowed, agents will try to gain access to the email accounts of many State Department officials who worked there while Mrs. Clinton was secretary of state, the officials said. State Department employees apparently circulated the emails on unclassified systems in 2009 and 2011, and some were ultimately forwarded to Mrs. Clinton.
They were not marked as classified, the State Department has said, and it is unclear whether its employees knew the origin of the information.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/15/u...hillary-clinton-at-state-department.html?_r=0


Here's the next paragraph from that NYT's article:

The F.B.I. is also trying to determine whether foreign powers, especially China or Russia, gained access to Mrs. Clinton’s private server, although at this point, any security breaches are speculation.

That sounds like a potential violation of the espionage act.
 
Here's the next paragraph from that NYT's article:

The F.B.I. is also trying to determine whether foreign powers, especially China or Russia, gained access to Mrs. Clinton’s private server, although at this point, any security breaches are speculation.

That sounds like a potential violation of the espionage act.

You DO understand the meaning of the word 'speculation', don't you?

How about the comments made in the other article where they state that HC is not specifically under investigation?

I have no dog in this hunt; HC is not on my list of electable candidates. But the political rancor on this topic is amusing to watch as the pundits and OpEds whip up a fervor on the issue. Watching you and others in this thread is like tossing hotdog pieces around in a room full of dachshunds....
 
You DO understand the meaning of the word 'speculation', don't you?

How about the comments made in the other article where they state that HC is not specifically under investigation?

I have no dog in this hunt; HC is not on my list of electable candidates. But the political rancor on this topic is amusing to watch as the pundits and OpEds whip up a fervor on the issue. Watching you and others in this thread is like tossing hotdog pieces around in a room full of dachshunds....
Question about two Inspector Generals and the FBI, Joe: Are they oped, or are they pundits?
 
Question about two Inspector Generals and the FBI, Joe: Are they oped, or are they pundits?

I forget....have they levied any charges yet?

The links I've posted have implied (certainly, not a guarantee) that she is not the one under investigation.
Have you heard that repeated by any of the 'pundits'?
 
You DO understand the meaning of the word 'speculation', don't you?

How about the comments made in the other article where they state that HC is not specifically under investigation?

I have no dog in this hunt; HC is not on my list of electable candidates. But the political rancor on this topic is amusing to watch as the pundits and OpEds whip up a fervor on the issue. Watching you and others in this thread is like tossing hotdog pieces around in a room full of dachshunds....

For someone who is a self-proclaimed 'smart' person, you are certainly quick to resort to ridiculing posters who you don't agree with. Maybe it's just me, but I'm more convinced to agree with an argument when confronted with facts, logic and reasoning, as opposed to petty name-calling.
 
For someone who is a self-proclaimed 'smart' person, you are certainly quick to resort to ridiculing posters who you don't agree with. Maybe it's just me, but I'm more convinced to agree with an argument when confronted with facts, logic and reasoning, as opposed to petty name-calling.

I'm not "ridiculing posters I don't agree with". I'm pointing out that most of the posts here are referring to speculation, blogs, pundits and OpEds, as opposed to the actual facts. And the frenzy that occurs whenever one of them posts another story that the 'Espionage Act' may be involved, etc. etc. It is like tiny dogs chasing hotdog treats, where the treats are not real facts (just like hotdogs aren't real food).

You should really take a step back and look at what has been posted vs. what has been actually reported as facts vs. mere speculation. HC may be in deep over this issue; I have yet to see a credible news source reporting that FBI or any other government organization is planning to press charges, or is likely heading an investigation in that direction.
 
You DO understand the meaning of the word 'speculation', don't you?

How about the comments made in the other article where they state that HC is not specifically under investigation?

I have no dog in this hunt; HC is not on my list of electable candidates. But the political rancor on this topic is amusing to watch as the pundits and OpEds whip up a fervor on the issue. Watching you and others in this thread is like tossing hotdog pieces around in a room full of dachshunds....

That seems to refer to David Kendall, Hillary's attorney who was in possession of the thumb drive containing some of the emails in question. The paragraph after the one you quoted states:

Kendall confirmed the contact, saying: “The government is seeking assurance about the storage of those materials. We are actively cooperating.”

There are questions regarding whether Kendall, Cheryl Mills, and Huma Abedin had security clearances. Also, that article is 6 weeks old.
 
I'm not "ridiculing posters I don't agree with". I'm pointing out that most of the posts here are referring to speculation, blogs, pundits and OpEds, as opposed to the actual facts. And the frenzy that occurs whenever one of them posts another story that the 'Espionage Act' may be involved, etc. etc. It is like tiny dogs chasing hotdog treats, where the treats are not real facts (just like hotdogs aren't real food).

You should really take a step back and look at what has been posted vs. what has been actually reported as facts vs. mere speculation. HC may be in deep over this issue; I have yet to see a credible news source reporting that FBI or any other government organization is planning to press charges, or is likely heading an investigation in that direction.

You're right about taking a step back and looking at what has been posted. The OP of this thread pointed out that there are gaps of several months in the emails HC has submitted. She also signed under threat of perjury that she had turned over all applicable emails. So either she had periods of several months where she sent no email, or she is a perjurer.
 
I'm not "ridiculing posters I don't agree with". I'm pointing out that most of the posts here are referring to speculation, blogs, pundits and OpEds, as opposed to the actual facts. And the frenzy that occurs whenever one of them posts another story that the 'Espionage Act' may be involved, etc. etc. It is like tiny dogs chasing hotdog treats, where the treats are not real facts (just like hotdogs aren't real food).

You should really take a step back and look at what has been posted vs. what has been actually reported as facts vs. mere speculation. HC may be in deep over this issue; I have yet to see a credible news source reporting that FBI or any other government organization is planning to press charges, or is likely heading an investigation in that direction.
What you do not understand -- or, to give you the benefit of the doubt, what you understand but have decided to ignore -- is that what is being discussed are not the opinions of the people writing the opeds and columns, but the facts they present in the course of expressing those opinions. If Ann Coulter writes a column in which she says the sun rises in the East, the fact Ann Coulter wrote it does not mean it shouldn't be considered.
 
That doesn't make it right and Colin Powell isn't running for president. Far as I am concerned Powell should probably be brought up on charges as well.
I love how you righties are all ready to throw Powell to the dogs. Of course, he never was really a Republican, was he?
 
What you do not understand -- or, to give you the benefit of the doubt, what you understand but have decided to ignore -- is that what is being discussed are not the opinions of the people writing the opeds and columns, but the facts they present in the course of expressing those opinions. If Ann Coulter writes a column in which she says the sun rises in the East, the fact Ann Coulter wrote it does not mean it shouldn't be considered.

No, they are random facts surrounded by rampant speculation. Many of the 'facts' are also irrelevant to the issue, and there is no indication that FBI gives a rip about those 'facts'.

As I've stated here many times - I'll await formal information releases from the government entities and FBI and how they relate to either formal charges or informal reprimands before I get all bent out of shape listening to pundits.

I've also stated that HC setting up her own private email, irrespective of the server, was not a great idea; I'm rather curious who provided her the legal advice that it WAS a good idea, because it has exposed her to possibly having to turn over many personal emails/communications which will ultimately leak out into the media. No one would have had access to those, otherwise. Reminds me of Nixon and his tapes; if he'd have never made the tapes, there would have been no 'smoking gun' to implicate him on Watergate....

My guess is that HC won't get into trouble regarding emails send to/from government officials, but may have something in personal emails sent to non-government officials (which would otherwise not be accessible to the government investigators) which could cause her some problems.

But that is not an issue the pundits are discussion - they are belaboring points that are mostly not important or not relevant.
 
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