Blown Leads Under McCaffery

[IowaHawkeyeFBnBB4Life]

We'll examine them starting from 2012/2013 I say....

12/13
-vs Michigan State
-@ Wisconsin (back and fourth, but Iowa led by 3 with under a minute)
-@ Nebraska
-vs Michigan State (B1G Tournament)

13/14
-vs Villanova
-vs Iowa State
-@ Wisconsin
-vs Wisconsin (close, but Iowa had a late lead)
-vs Tennessee (OT, where Iowa scored 1 in OT)

14/15
-vs Michigan State
-vs Penn State (B1G Trny)

These are some ones that stand out and I am doing a favor by not putting a lot of the "close" ones here where it was a 1-2 point game either way down the stretch.

 

[PhantomFlyer]

I know this is off your point, but I'm curious when Iowa last won a game on a last second/possession shot. I can think of ones where Iowa has lost but not where they've run. Do we have to go back to the Alford years when this has happened?

 

[hawk-i bob]

I know this is off your point, but I'm curious when Iowa last won a game on a last second/possession shot. I can think of ones where Iowa has lost but not where they've run. Do we have to go back to the Alford years when this has happened?

at Minnesota last year off the top of my head or maybe that doesn't count since there was less than 2 secs to go

 

[nhrahawk1973]

I know this is off your point, but I'm curious when Iowa last won a game on a last second/possession shot. I can think of ones where Iowa has lost but not where they've run. Do we have to go back to the Alford years when this has happened?

Florida State. Jok was pretty clutch to win that one. I agree with what you are saying though. They are on the short end a lot more often than not.

 

[Kurt Warner]

I know this is off your point, but I'm curious when Iowa last won a game on a last second/possession shot. I can think of ones where Iowa has lost but not where they've run. Do we have to go back to the Alford years when this has happened?

You're right that it has been ages, and I think maybe you do have to go back that far. Recker did it a time or two in the big ten tournament I remember. That surely can't be the last time can it??

 

[IowaHawkeyeFBnBB4Life]

Uthoff hit a 3 last year at the end to send the game @ NW into OT, but Iowa lost when Alex Olah was allowed to play football.

 

[hawk-i bob]

Uthoff hit a 3 last year at the end to send the game @ NW into OT, but Iowa lost when Alex Olah was allowed to play football.

I remember that...wholly crap he just chucked it.

 

[srams21]

I would say the Minnesota game from last year when Uthoff hit that shot counts. If not, then you really gotta go back far. It always seems like some rare bench player hits a game winning shot against us. Who was that guy from MSU who barely ever played but came off the bench to hit the game winner against us last year (or maybe it was two years ago)?

 

[hawk-i bob]

I would say the Minnesota game from last year when Uthoff hit that shot counts. If not, then you really gotta go back far. It always seems like some rare bench player hits a game winning shot against us. Who was that guy from MSU who barely ever played but came off the bench to hit the game winner against us last year (or maybe it was two years ago)?

Russell Byrd ... it wasn't the game winner hit it with 34 secs left -- but it certainly helped seal the deal.

Man after all these threads - I think I'm going to therapy tomorrow. Like my grandsons say .... grandpa there is just too much drama going on.

I've been under the weather...wife is really sick...these threads sure make me feel better.

 

[hawk-i bob]

Florida State. Jok was pretty clutch to win that one. I agree with what you are saying though. They are on the short end a lot more often than not.

wasn't hit with no time left (which I guess is the criteria) ... but still good to see. Florida State is really talented.

 

[DanL53]

Russell Byrd ... it wasn't the game winner hit it with 34 secs left -- but it certainly helped seal the deal.

Man after all these threads - I think I'm going to therapy tomorrow. Like my grandsons say .... grandpa there is just too much drama going on.

I've been under the weather...wife is really sick...these threads sure make me feel better.

4-14, 8-10, 9-9, 9-9, 12-6. People just need to quit digging into the dirt. For every stat that says stuff like we lose more close games than our share...it simply means than we must not get beaten by more very often.

 

[SWIowahawks]

Devyn Marble hit a jumper right at the end of regulation against Tennessee to force OT. At least I think it was at the end of regulation.

Didn't Cyrus Tate have a last second layup or put back during the Lick era?

 

[kellerm]

4-14, 8-10, 9-9, 9-9, 12-6. People just need to quit digging into the dirt. For every stat that says stuff like we lose more close games than our share...it simply means than we must not get beaten by more very often.

Great point. Let's ask the question. Under Fran how times recently has iowa just gotten trounced. All I can think of from last year was Gonzaga. We were never in that one. ISU at Iowa although I think it was close at half. Not to many though.

 

[sloehawk]

Russell Byrd ... it wasn't the game winner hit it with 34 secs left -- but it certainly helped seal the deal.

Man after all these threads - I think I'm going to therapy tomorrow. Like my grandsons say .... grandpa there is just too much drama going on.

I've been under the weather...wife is really sick...these threads sure make me feel better.

Didn't some kid from Illinois that hardly ever played hit a game winner against us in the last couple of years too?

 

[DanL53]

Great point. Let's ask the question. Under Fran how times recently has iowa just gotten trounced. All I can think of from last year was Gonzaga. We were never in that one. ISU at Iowa although I think it was close at half. Not to many though.

Well, just last year we only lost six Big Ten games in the regular season. Won twelve of them. And the five points or less or OT thing? Lost three of them. So that leaves our three worst losses as:

@ #6 Wisconsin 82-50. (I don't know about anybody else, but that one still hurts me right in the dangling participles.)
Mich State 75-61.
#5 Wisconsin 74-63. At least we made a game of it.

Weird huh? Our three worst losses in the regular season came to teams that made the Final Four. Ah, but I shouldn't say that, somebody is going to say I pulled it out of my rear...doesn't mean anything...I only point out the good stuff.

Now if you want info outside the Big Ten games...Iowa State kicked our rear bad and like you said Gonzaga. We lost six games total outside the 12-6 mark including some heartbreakers.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

We'll examine them starting from 2012/2013 I say....

12/13
-vs Michigan State
-@ Wisconsin (back and fourth, but Iowa led by 3 with under a minute)
-@ Nebraska
-vs Michigan State (B1G Tournament)

13/14
-vs Villanova
-vs Iowa State
-@ Wisconsin
-vs Wisconsin (close, but Iowa had a late lead)
-vs Tennessee (OT, where Iowa scored 1 in OT)

14/15
-vs Michigan State
-vs Penn State (B1G Trny)

These are some ones that stand out and I am doing a favor by not putting a lot of the "close" ones here where it was a 1-2 point game either way down the stretch.

And how many of those teams had a good week of practice before those games?......

 

[Lone Clone]

We'll examine them starting from 2012/2013 I say....

12/13
-vs Michigan State
-@ Wisconsin (back and fourth, but Iowa led by 3 with under a minute)
-@ Nebraska
-vs Michigan State (B1G Tournament)

13/14
-vs Villanova
-vs Iowa State
-@ Wisconsin
-vs Wisconsin (close, but Iowa had a late lead)
-vs Tennessee (OT, where Iowa scored 1 in OT)

14/15
-vs Michigan State
-vs Penn State (B1G Trny)

These are some ones that stand out and I am doing a favor by not putting a lot of the "close" ones here where it was a 1-2 point game either way down the stretch.

The thing that stands out to me in that list is that with a couple of exceptions, those were outstanding opponents that Iowa really shouldn't have been in a position to beat late in the game. So there's that. Maybe the Hawks over-achieved just to get into a place where they could lose a close game.

 

[hawk-i bob]

The thing that stands out to me in that list is that with a couple of exceptions, those were outstanding opponents that Iowa really shouldn't have been in a position to beat late in the game. So there's that. Maybe the Hawks over-achieved just to get into a place where they could lose a close game.

Yep we get what you are saying. Anytime we are in a tight one with a really good team...we over-achieved even to be in a close game in the first place.. No one would be bitching if we just went ahead lost sooner like we are suppose to.

Enjoy it while it last.

 

[cg8284]

4-14, 8-10, 9-9, 9-9, 12-6. People just need to quit digging into the dirt. For every stat that says stuff like we lose more close games than our share...it simply means than we must not get beaten by more very often.

You started an entire thread posting basically the same thing then tell people to quit digging?

 

[DanL53]

You started an entire thread posting basically the same thing then tell people to quit digging?

Oh dear. An entire thread? I'll try to start just a regular thread next time. Posting basically the same thing? So is that the same thing, or something different?

 

[HoustonREDHawk]

Not sure what those Hawkeye fans bitching about Fran and Iowa players want done. We went through a decade of lousy Iowa BB, and now we are able to compete with anyone. We can still dream big, but why do we need the non-stop threads criticizing the coach and individual players after losses?

 

[BeepBeepInMyJeep]

Mike does a decent job at a lot of things. But when we get to a point at the end of games where he has to take the air out of the ball and create a shot with under 5 on the shot clock, we are not giving the team the best chance to win. We should run the offense that got us the lead to begin with.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

The thing that stands out to me in that list is that with a couple of exceptions, those were outstanding opponents that Iowa really shouldn't have been in a position to beat late in the game. So there's that. Maybe the Hawks over-achieved just to get into a place where they could lose a close game.

Maybe....maybe not....

 

[DanL53]

Mike does a decent job at a lot of things. But when we get to a point at the end of games where he has to take the air out of the ball and create a shot with under 5 on the shot clock, we are not giving the team the best chance to win. We should run the offense that got us the lead to begin with.

You know, I agree with that. Just like it used to annoy the heck out of me when Dr. Tom would run that double screen up top for the point guard to pick which direction to take to penetrate. That is, when Troy Skinner was our point guard. When it was Andre Woolridge I loved that play.

 

[Ronman]

and I am doing a favor by not putting a lot of the "close" ones here [/B]where it was a 1-2 point game either way down the stretch.

I'm sure Coach McCaffery truly appreciates the favor.

 

[Ronman]

Great point. Let's ask the question. Under Fran how times recently has iowa just gotten trounced. All I can think of from last year was Gonzaga. We were never in that one. ISU at Iowa although I think it was close at half. Not to many though.

I'd bet this years game against the Clones will eventually morph into a trouncing in their eyes.

 

[buttermypancakes]

Didn't some kid from Illinois that hardly ever played hit a game winner against us in the last couple of years too?

Tyler Griffey

 

[SDHawkDoc]

Dan, I appreciate that you posted the stats demonstrating Iowa's performance at the end of close games. I see it more as a flaw than the positive spin it seems you're trying to put on it.

I do think Fran has been a good hire. He brought Iowa basketball back from the deep, deep hole it was in. But, it hasn't been without bumps. And there are things that can be criticized. This is one of them.

 

[DanL53]

Dan, I appreciate that you posted the stats demonstrating Iowa's performance at the end of close games. I see it more as a flaw than the positive spin it seems you're trying to put on it.

I do think Fran has been a good hire. He brought Iowa basketball back from the deep, deep hole it was in. But, it hasn't been without bumps. And there are things that can be criticized. This is one of them.

Thanks. I too see a 9-20 record in games decided by five points or less, or overtime, to be a flaw. I think where I lost some folks is when I tried to point out that the worst years were when Gesell was a freshmen and sophomore. Seems like we went 0-4 and 2-6? I might have lost some folks also when I pointed out that many of the losses were to highly ranked Big Ten teams. And then there is the comment that looking at the overall records, which do indicate improvement each year, than if the close losses are out of whack it can only mean we haven't lost by large margins that often.

And yeah, those look like spins, but they are also true. In the end I suspect that 9-20 is confirmation we have a problem, but in the scheme of things the fan base took the Iowa loss to Iowa State and just like last year ran silly amuck with torches and pitchforks looking for the culprits who done it!!!

Sometime I'll have to tell the story of Bill Berry, a fellow who was lynched in Pekin, Illinois. Really, drug out of jail and lynched without a trial. Thing was he was a total #$#$% and deserved it, on the whole. But he was already in the jail when his brother killed a deputy sheriff and it was that crime, and the convenience of knowing where Bill was, that led to his lynching.

Good folks of that town got drunk and did something that one of them even felt so remorseful after as to kill himself. We lost to Iowa State and a problem, a real problem, gets blown up...just human nature.

 

[Lone Clone]

Yep we get what you are saying. Anytime we are in a tight one with a really good team...we over-achieved even to be in a close game in the first place.. No one would be bitching if we just went ahead lost sooner like we are suppose to.

Enjoy it while it last.

No, that is NOT what I'm saying. But never mind.

 

[hawk-i bob]

overachieve to perform better than would be expected on the basis of one's talent.

 

[cg8284]

Oh dear. An entire thread? I'll try to start just a regular thread next time. Posting basically the same thing? So is that the same thing, or something different?

Your schtick is getting old. Keep talking out both sides of your mouth. I'll wait in anticipation of the next thread that you start then totally contradict yourself in the 10th post.

 

[PhantomFlyer]

Your schtick is getting old. Keep talking out both sides of your mouth. I'll wait in anticipation of the next thread that you start then totally contradict yourself in the 10th post.

Exactly. He spends countless posts spinning and then misrepresenting the points being made by critics. Contrary to what Dan thinks nobody is calling for Fran to be fired, nobody thinks he's on a hotseat, and nobody doesn't think the program is in much better shape than when Lick left. If he would stop spinning, and stop erecting strawmen arguments he might actually make some reasonable points.

It's a message board. People aren't just going to talk about the good things going on with the program, they'll talk about where things can be improved. EVERY fan site message board does this but somehow Dan is bewildered it goes on here.

 

[clickhere 01]

Exactly. He spends countless posts spinning and then misrepresenting the points being made by critics. Contrary to what Dan thinks nobody is calling for Fran to be fired, nobody thinks he's on a hotseat, and nobody doesn't think the program is in much better shape than when Lick left. If he would stop spinning, and stop erecting strawmen arguments he might actually make some reasonable points.

It's a message board. People aren't just going to talk about the good things going on with the program, they'll talk about where things can be improved. EVERY fan site message board does this but somehow Dan is bewildered it goes on here.

Go easy on Dan, he's had a rough couple of days. His whole little world is falling apart.

 

[DanL53]

Your schtick is getting old. Keep talking out both sides of your mouth. I'll wait in anticipation of the next thread that you start then totally contradict yourself in the 10th post.

Show me the contradictions. Introduce more than just complaints. Goes for you too, clickhere01.

 

[Lone Clone]

overachieve to perform better than would be expected on the basis of one's talent.

I think the "any time" qualifier is what struck me as inaccurate. But most of the examples you cited are games with teams that were better than Iowa. If you lose by a point to Michigan State, how are you supposed to view that, if not that you almost pulled an upset?

 

[hawk-i bob]

I think the "any time" qualifier is what struck me as inaccurate. But most of the examples you cited are games with teams that were better than Iowa. If you lose by a point to Michigan State, how are you supposed to view that, if not that you almost pulled an upset?

what strikes me is a ISU fan using the terminology over achieving when describing Iowa's close losses.

 

[Kurt Warner]

You started an entire thread posting basically the same thing then tell people to quit digging?

I almost posted this exact post cg8284, it was like, ooook, that's like the pot calling the kettle black.

 

[Lone Clone]

what strikes me is a ISU fan using the terminology over achieving when describing Iowa's close losses.

OK, you've confused me. I think sometimes Iowa plays teams that are better than Iowa. When those games go down to the wire, I think obviously Iowa has over-achieved.....or the opponent has under-achieved, or a combination of both. You apparently think that the normal, expectable result is for Iowa to win every game it plays. I disagree.

This isn't just an Iowa thing. In football this year, for example, I thought ISU over-achieved to play Okie State down to the wire. ISU lost a close game. The fact that it could/should have won, except for a mistake or two at the end, doesn't mean the team didn't over-achieve in order to put itself in that position.

 

[DanL53]

I almost posted this exact post cg8284, it was like, ooook, that's like the pot calling the kettle black.

You mean because I presented facts for discussion, but didn't agree with some of the conclusions others had regarding those facts? Hilarious. I also believe children shouldn't be driving cars or getting jobs as Doctors, but I do believe in a free country. Are those contrary statements?

Yesterday I had a guy who didn't have the capacity to understand the difference between an ESPN evaluation score and an ESPN ranking arguing with me over who Iowa's best recruits have been, or are going to be.

What do you want Kurt? I have only so much patience with idiots.