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Could Pemsl be a Nigel(so?) Hayes level player

perryhawk

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Apr 3, 2008
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I think their size and skill set are somewhat similar. Cordell would have a ways to go in developing his game......but they are both crafty and smart players.

I will be very interested to see what Cordell's conditioning and physical maturity look like after a healthy off season. Then the development and improvement of his outside and free throw shot will hopefully take his production to another level.
 
He could be every bit as good or better if he can knock down a jumper. As you said Pemsl is very crafty and he was only a freshman.
 
Maybe. Certainly needs to add to his game a lot to get there. I'm more curious over how much PT he'll get with the incoming players and lack of outgoing players coming up.

No shortage of big guys on the roster next year for certain.
 
Good analogy. Cordell's athleticism improved over the course of the season-he seemed to get stronger and quicker. Not a great jumper but good first step. Particularly good because his first step has a hellishly effective shot fake with it. Great OP.
 
Perhaps a better comparison to Pemsl's potential would be Reggie Evans. I don't think Pemsl will ever develop the outside shooting of Hayes but could add a nice mid-range game and can be an effective rebounder and a force around the rim.
 
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I see more Glen Davis (Big Baby) than Nigel Hayes. Nigel brings the ball up the court and was quite a 3 point threat his sophomore year. Don't see that with Pemsl.
 
Pemsl reminds me of Brunner with his skillset around the basket. Not as good hops as Brunner, maybe a little quicker 1st step. Hopefully Pemsl develops some face up game to make his inside game more effective.

Pemsl is very heady player. Impressive.
 
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Good analogy. Cordell's athleticism improved over the course of the season-he seemed to get stronger and quicker. Not a great jumper but good first step. Particularly good because his first step has a hellishly effective shot fake with it. Great OP.
Cordell is more mobile and athletic than Hayes. He has shown a lot of improvement and confidence in the post. With more PT and development he will only get better. And, if he can master Hayes' moves under the basket where you hook the other guy and when you go up for a shot then you stick the elbow in the guy's throat, then he will be very good.
 
Cordell is more mobile and athletic than Hayes. He has shown a lot of improvement and confidence in the post. With more PT and development he will only get better. And, if he can master Hayes' moves under the basket where you hook the other guy and when you go up for a shot then you stick the elbow in the guy's throat, then he will be very good.


More athletic than Hayes? I think that's pushing it. Foot speed advantage Hayes, Vertical leap advantage Hayes, Strength, advantage Hayes (Pemsl may surpass Hayes here) . Look I'm a big Pemsl fan but "athletetism" is not his strength. Cook is MUCH better "athlete"
 
More athletic than Hayes? I think that's pushing it. Foot speed advantage Hayes, Vertical leap advantage Hayes, Strength, advantage Hayes (Pemsl may surpass Hayes here) . Look I'm a big Pemsl fan but "athletetism" is not his strength. Cook is MUCH better "athlete"
Keep watching Cordell, it gets better.
 
More athletic than Hayes? I think that's pushing it. Foot speed advantage Hayes, Vertical leap advantage Hayes, Strength, advantage Hayes (Pemsl may surpass Hayes here) . Look I'm a big Pemsl fan but "athletetism" is not his strength. Cook is MUCH better "athlete"

hinmo I'm with you on most of that.....but I think the key is that we really don't know how athletic Cordell is yet. I think that is because he is coming off of surgeries that inhibited his conditioning and strength training (not to mention normal growth and development) for at least the last couple of years. Consequently, I think he is more athletic than he has shown so far, but how much more is yet to be determined......Hayes is athletic in his mobility for a big guy, but his jumping ability is average for a 6'8" D1 bball player (in my estimation only). Cordell could get there. If Cordell increases his lateral quickness and body control he will be exceptional.
 
I hope he gets to rest his leg awhile before he starts in again. I mean- two knee surgeries and a long metal rod in his femur. He had to be in some pain this year. I just don't know how much faster he can get. Some, I hope. He's quick, not fast. I don't think anybody on this board has seen him play more than I have and he made a huge jump this year from high school, thanks to the Iowa staff's coaching. I do believe, with the talent level coming in next year, he will have to expand his game in order to expand or keep his minutes. He said in an interview last week with a local newspaper that he never expected to play as much this year as he did. I think he will work very hard on his game off-season.
 
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More athletic than Hayes? I think that's pushing it. Foot speed advantage Hayes, Vertical leap advantage Hayes, Strength, advantage Hayes (Pemsl may surpass Hayes here) . Look I'm a big Pemsl fan but "athletetism" is not his strength. Cook is MUCH better "athlete"

Definitely not more athletic than Hayes, it's not even close. The strength maybe surpassed as Pemsl progresses in year 2,3 4, but unless I see NBA scouting/combine measurable, I wouldn't believe it until proven.
 
hinmo I'm with you on most of that.....but I think the key is that we really don't know how athletic Cordell is yet. I think that is because he is coming off of surgeries that inhibited his conditioning and strength training (not to mention normal growth and development) for at least the last couple of years. Consequently, I think he is more athletic than he has shown so far, but how much more is yet to be determined......Hayes is athletic in his mobility for a big guy, but his jumping ability is average for a 6'8" D1 bball player (in my estimation only). Cordell could get there. If Cordell increases his lateral quickness and body control he will be exceptional.

I feel like pemsl already has exceptional body control considering all the post moves and crazy layups he seems to make
 
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Keep watching Cordell, it gets better.


I think he has potential to REALLY blossom and grow into a great player as his leg gets better and better. Amazing how far he has ALREADY came! That said his game now is pretty much below the rim where Hayes (while not exactly a high flyer) I've seen throw down some powerful dunks. We are comparing a freshman to senior but it was said he's more athletic and mobile than Hayes now. I just don't think so but I also don't think their good comparisons. I think Cook's game may start to resemble Hayes more tha Pemsl's will but don't see either one of these guys ever be used to bring the ball up court like Hayes had at times.
 
I think he has potential to REALLY blossom and grow into a great player as his leg gets better and better. Amazing how far he has ALREADY came! That said his game now is pretty much below the rim where Hayes (while not exactly a high flyer) I've seen throw down some powerful dunks. We are comparing a freshman to senior but it was said he's more athletic and mobile than Hayes now. I just don't think so but I also don't think their good comparisons. I think Cook's game may start to resemble Hayes more tha Pemsl's will but don't see either one of these guys ever be used to bring the ball up court like Hayes had at times.
Those are fair statements. I'm not saying Hayes is not a great player. He is, and Cordell will continue to develop in the post. As far as handling the ball and bringing it up the court, he is probably not the best option for that. Let's see how his development comes along. I do agree that Tyler is the better athlete though.
 
No! Pemsl makes more freethrows

Actually So far he hasn't shot them as well as Hayes. Hayes shot over 70% his soph and Jr years (be happy if Pemsl improves to this). But yes Hayes did seem to forget how to shoot FTs this year only shooting 58-59% ( about the same as Pemsl). I'm confident Cordell WILL improve here, he and Cook both shot better as the season progressed.
 
Good lord! Fans that have no clue come out of the woodwork & unite. You are comparing a dump truck to a Ferrari. As pointed out Cook is the better comparison right now.


Nigel Hayes is no Ferrari. He's gotten where he's gotten on the back of Wisconsin's rep. He's not nearly as athletic as people think he is and he will be a huge bust in the NBA assuming he even makes it to the league. I'm not saying Pemsl is an all-star or anything but Hayes is so overrated it's not even funny.
 
Hayes handles are much much better. He also is a better rebounder and much quicker off the floor. Pemsl may get to be as smooth around the hoop as Hayes, but his game has a long ways to go to get to the same skill level offensively. He could become a bruiser like Hayes, but has to have better hops to be as effective.

There's the defensive side of the game and Cordell has a long ways to go there as well.
 
Nigel Hayes is no Ferrari. He's gotten where he's gotten on the back of Wisconsin's rep. He's not nearly as athletic as people think he is and he will be a huge bust in the NBA assuming he even makes it to the league. I'm not saying Pemsl is an all-star or anything but Hayes is so overrated it's not even funny.


Hayes won't play in the NBA. I really haven't heard any "experts" predict he will. Watching him his sophomore year I thought he just might turn into an NBA player. He did not continue to develop and did not have a very good senior season. Statistically he and Pemsl had similar seasons as freshmen but I think that's about where the similarities end.
 
Pemsl is probably a better golfer than Hayes.

I don't know about this "athletic" stuff. I struggle to define what people mean when they say it. Leaps out of the gym? Can dribble all day? Lateral Quickness? Quick first step?

Do what is skilled? Shooting? Passing? Moves around the basket?

What is Basketball IQ? Good communicator? Keeps the offense moving? Cuts off passing lanes without letting his guy get free?

It's like shot blockers. If they can play defense and it includes blocking shots they are special. But there are guys that hunt for blocks and will leave their guy free to take a step and help. And I've said before, space eaters who can deny entry passes and alter shots don't get a single mark on the Box Score, but are often better defenders.

This all confuses me and probably because Hayes and Pemsl aren't a good comparison in my opinion. Hayes is more of an inside/outside power forward type that runs hot and cold with his shots. He's very physical under the basket, or moving towards it. He is, to me, the modern Big Ten power forward. A shooter and a Hockey player.

I see Pemsl's game as going back to old school guys something like Horton, Special K, further back Dan Frost. Guys that can bang, got a big rear to back people down with, and can pump fake, take a step and mess up a defender. They would be awesome Centers if they were 7', but still very serviceable at 6'8"-6"10".

Furthermore, I don't know if Pemsl will ever get the minutes to have stats to compare to Hayes. But I could see him battling for the sixth man title with Baer. And that's where I think the value is going to be. Quality offense and skill (better passer than Hayes) coming off the bench.
 
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...day-measurements-highlights-and-top-prospects

Looks like Hayes his 6'725", 7'3" wingpsan, 34.5" vertical at 245 LBS as tested last year. I'm sure he improved on his numbers. I'm not sure how Pemsl compares, but the only thing that seems similar is the weight? Hayes was listed as 11% body fat, but is not listed as 240 LBS. Will be interesting to see what his combine numbers are this year.

Pemsl was listed at 249lbs. But I've heard he played at 265lbs. this season.
 
Dan, sounds like you DO understand the "athlete" stuff. As a strength coach there where a number of different measurables I could use to give me on measurables. You can be a great athlete but not a great basketball player and vice versa. Some times these "measurables" don't translate to the court/field. I don't think there is any doubt that Pemsl has many attributes that are not "measurable" that are going to be key to him turning into a great Hawkeye. Athletecism right now is NOT his strength.
 
Speaking of badger athleticism, what was with Iverson, their most athlete is player's weak layup attempt in OT? Nerves? If he flushes that instead of getting it blocked they win. Did he play much in our win In Madison? I don't remember him playing much. I do remember him against us in IC last year.
 
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If he can get an outside shot, Niang may eventually be a better comparison for Pemsl. Craft post moves without elevating a lot. Not sure he'll ever have the dribble handle and shot of Georges though
 
Good lord! Fans that have no clue come out of the woodwork & unite. You are comparing a dump truck to a Ferrari. As pointed out Cook is the better comparison right now.

As mentioned, Hays is not even remotely close to a ferrari, maybe a camero.

Hes not that much better than Pemsl, considering one is a freshman and one a senior.
 
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If he can get an outside shot, Niang may eventually be a better comparison for Pemsl. Craft post moves without elevating a lot. Not sure he'll ever have the dribble handle and shot of Georges though
So my understanding was that Pemsl had a decent mid range game in high school. I thought on some of the high lights he shot some mid jumpers. No doubt he needs to work on this, but did he just not include this part of his game this year, and stayed within his role? I know he clanked the last shot in the NIT, but I think he was shocked to get the ball. His stroke looks good.
 
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I want to make one thing clear. I love Cordell Pemsl and his potential. Just don't agree that RIGHT NOW he is more "mobile and athletic" than Hayes. I have member Gilligan blowing me up with messages how wrong I am about Cordell.........I do like the Niang comparison better.
 
I think Cordell will trim down a little bit and that will really benefit him. That doesn't even necessarily mean losing 10+ pounds. I think he's carrying a little bit of bad weight right now, probably as a result of his injuries and sitting out for so long. I think he makes a similar body transformation that Georges Niang made in college.
 
I want to make one thing clear. I love Cordell Pemsl and his potential. Just don't agree that RIGHT NOW he is more "mobile and athletic" than Hayes. I have member Gilligan blowing me up with messages how wrong I am about Cordell.........I do like the Niang comparison better.
I'd agree, and would be thrilled if he had Georges career!
 
I want to make one thing clear. I love Cordell Pemsl and his potential. Just don't agree that RIGHT NOW he is more "mobile and athletic" than Hayes. I have member Gilligan blowing me up with messages how wrong I am about Cordell.........I do like the Niang comparison better.

What is the deal with him sending messages?

Im pretty sure its Herby.

Is he baned from regular posting?
 
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