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Difference between 15-16 hawks and 20-21 hawks

Fran-Con-2

HR All-State
Nov 17, 2019
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I think alot of this season can be measured by Fran's 15-16 season. 15-16 was his sixth year as coach, and the culmination of his first good recruiting class after he got established (4 senior starters, 3 of them were four star recruits). This year is Frans 11th year as coach, and kind of the culmination of Fran's second half of his tenure ( four starters are upperclassmen, J-Bo and Garza seniors have been the bedrock of Iowa basketball rebuild after 17-18). We obviously have high expectations now, but let's not forget that 15-16 we were ranked as high as #3, and Uthoff was a poy candidate until the last stretch of the season. In many ways, 15-16 and 20-21 are the two "stars are aligning" type seasons Fran has had.

Obviously we all know how 15-16 turned out. And the jury is out whether that will happen this season. Although there are many reasons to differentiate this year from 15-16 (Garza, moxy of our 3 point shooters, etc.) I think the biggest difference is our bench.

In 15-16, we had basically nobody on the bench. We had Baer, uhl, wagner, ellingson, and christian williams. Baer was a great hawkeye, but only a sophomore at the time. I almost don't even need to say anything about uhl, wagner, ellingson, and williams. They seemed to be good teammates, but none of them ever became starters and only one of them finished his career at iowa. To put it bluntly, they weren't B10 players. And to make matters worse, they were all underclassmen at the time.

Similarly, our bench was a monumental question mark this year. Only Joe T logged real (productive) minutes before this season. However, some of our backups are making serious arguments for getting starters minutes. I don't think anyone on this board would be overly worried if our starting lineup included Joe T and Keegan Murray. Nunge shouldn't be a starter right now, but he does LOTS for the team (7 boards and 3 blocks today; averaging as many points and more boards than kriener last year). Pat Mccaffery does some stuff, hustle plays, but he looks like he'll be a B10 player someday. Pat, our 4th worst backup, might've been our best backup were he on the 15-16 team.

The point is, it's understandable that a team will fade late in a season when you have virtually no competent backups. Today we would not have won without the play of our bench. I don't expect smooth sailing all season, but I am awfully encouraged by what I've seen so far and the bench is the primary reason for that. I am confident this team is built different.
 
I think alot of this season can be measured by Fran's 15-16 season. 15-16 was his sixth year as coach, and the culmination of his first good recruiting class after he got established (4 senior starters, 3 of them were four star recruits). This year is Frans 11th year as coach, and kind of the culmination of Fran's second half of his tenure ( four starters are upperclassmen, J-Bo and Garza seniors have been the bedrock of Iowa basketball rebuild after 17-18). We obviously have high expectations now, but let's not forget that 15-16 we were ranked as high as #3, and Uthoff was a poy candidate until the last stretch of the season. In many ways, 15-16 and 20-21 are the two "stars are aligning" type seasons Fran has had.

Obviously we all know how 15-16 turned out. And the jury is out whether that will happen this season. Although there are many reasons to differentiate this year from 15-16 (Garza, moxy of our 3 point shooters, etc.) I think the biggest difference is our bench.

In 15-16, we had basically nobody on the bench. We had Baer, uhl, wagner, ellingson, and christian williams. Baer was a great hawkeye, but only a sophomore at the time. I almost don't even need to say anything about uhl, wagner, ellingson, and williams. They seemed to be good teammates, but none of them ever became starters and only one of them finished his career at iowa. To put it bluntly, they weren't B10 players. And to make matters worse, they were all underclassmen at the time.

Similarly, our bench was a monumental question mark this year. Only Joe T logged real (productive) minutes before this season. However, some of our backups are making serious arguments for getting starters minutes. I don't think anyone on this board would be overly worried if our starting lineup included Joe T and Keegan Murray. Nunge shouldn't be a starter right now, but he does LOTS for the team (7 boards and 3 blocks today; averaging as many points and more boards than kriener last year). Pat Mccaffery does some stuff, hustle plays, but he looks like he'll be a B10 player someday. Pat, our 4th worst backup, might've been our best backup were he on the 15-16 team.

The point is, it's understandable that a team will fade late in a season when you have virtually no competent backups. Today we would not have won without the play of our bench. I don't expect smooth sailing all season, but I am awfully encouraged by what I've seen so far and the bench is the primary reason for that. I am confident this team is built different.

Great post. I posted in another thread but we did not play our best today. Great teams find a way to win. Are we a great team? Time will tell, but we didn't play our best vs Minnesota and fell apart to lose that one and probably should have won. Rutgers reminds physically of Michigan State teams of the past. We have always struggled against those teams. We won. Enjoy this team. These type of Iowa teams don't come around very often.
 
Excellent post OP. The main differences between Woody & Gesell's team and this years team are 3 fold.
1) The 2015-2016 team was the opposite of this team. They were great defensively but they were challenged offensively. This years team is great offensively and challenged defensively.
2) The bench. Compare Baer, Wagner, Uhl, Williams & Ellingson to Joe T., Nunge, Keegan, PMac & Ulis.
3) The 2015-2016 team would go ice cold and have 5-6 minute scoreless streaks frequently. All teams have scoring droughts but this years team can score 15 points in a hurry and make up for the occasional drought.
 
Graet stuff here, we also have a once in a lifetime program changer guy in the name of Luka Garza who can score at will from anywhere who has balls of steel and won't ever fade away like Uthoff seemed to do unfortunately.

Sometimes don't agree with some of your covid/political leanings. But you are spot on and a nice refresher to realize all of us here are Hawks first and foremost and we will never see a player like Garza again in our lifetimes. I was at Megan Gustafsons number retirement ceremony postgame last year and can't wait to be there for Garza's. Well deserved it will be!
 
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Sometimes don't agree with some of your covid/political leanings. But you are spot on and a nice refresher to realize all of us here are Hawks first and foremost and we will never see a player like Garza again in our lifetimes. I was at Megan Gustafsons number retirement ceremony postgame last year and can't wait to be there for Garza's. Well deserved it will be!
I'm a Science and Republic kinda guy is all and yes we are.
 
Sometimes don't agree with some of your covid/political leanings. But you are spot on and a nice refresher to realize all of us here are Hawks first and foremost and we will never see a player like Garza again in our lifetimes. I was at Megan Gustafsons number retirement ceremony postgame last year and can't wait to be there for Garza's. Well deserved it will be!
Wish Women's games were on more 90% of fanbase missing out on Garza of the women's game Clark!
 
I'm a Science and Republic kinda guy is all and yes we are.
I'm a Science and Republic kinda guy is all and yes we are.

I'm a guy that agrees with the science but also was worried about shutdowns, etc. Sure hope they get their vaccination rollout figured out! I try to typically stay out of the political threads but I think for the most part all of us in off topic would get along great at a tailgate!

Go hawks!
 
Sometimes don't agree with some of your covid/political leanings. But you are spot on and a nice refresher to realize all of us here are Hawks first and foremost and we will never see a player like Garza again in our lifetimes. I was at Megan Gustafsons number retirement ceremony postgame last year and can't wait to be there for Garza's. Well deserved it will be!

This is me totally. Chrishawks political stuff drives me freaking crazy but more times than not I read something on the other boards and say this guy knows what he is talking about and agree with it. Then I see its him and lol how we both see everything but politics similar. He seems like a cool dude
 
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This is me totally. Chrishawks political stuff drives me freaking crazy but more times than not I read something on the other boards and say this guy knows what he is talking about and agree with it. Then I see its him and lol how we both see everything but politics similar. He seems like a cool dude

Even with the politics I love the OT board. For the most part I watch the news every morning, night and get notifications on my phone. But when news happens its always on HROT. My wife(no pic) jokes about hot or trending topics and will ask what does HROT have to say?
 
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This is me totally. Chrishawks political stuff drives me freaking crazy but more times than not I read something on the other boards and say this guy knows what he is talking about and agree with it. Then I see its him and lol how we both see everything but politics similar. He seems like a cool dude
I am. I served the country and swore an oath to uphold the constitution and IMO that is under threat openly now. GW was my Commander and Chief most of time couldn't disagree with him more but respected him as he loved and respected his country and the foundations of our Republic.
 
Even with the politics I love the OT board. For the most part I watch the news every morning, night and get notifications on my phone. But when news happens its always on HROT. My wife(no pic) jokes about hot or trending topics and will ask what does HROT have to say?

Lol. Mine always complains but in a nice away about me spending time on HROT. But the moment she is trying to decide where to go on vacation she asks me to ask the people of HROT. Or she is deciding between two vehicle and wants their opinion. I was going to tell her to just open an account and ask herself but she would be in amazement of some of the topics in here and some of the colorful characters
 
Lol. Mine always complains but in a nice away about me spending time on HROT. But the moment she is trying to decide where to go on vacation she asks me to ask the people of HROT. Or she is deciding between two vehicle and wants their opinion. I was going to tell her to just open an account and ask herself but she would be in amazement of some of the topics in here and some of the colorful characters

I bought a vehicle from Hertz this summer due to a HROT recommendation. Best deal but one of the worst experiences of my life!
 
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Go ****ing Hawks!!!!!!!!!!!


I am. I served the country and swore an oath to uphold the constitution and IMO that is under threat openly now. GW was my Commander and Chief most of time couldn't disagree with him more but respected him as he loved and respected his country and the foundations of our Republic.

Trump is an idiot and as a republican I truly despise that man.


.....But after saying that I'm sure there are some comments I can find that I disagree with you on HROT the last few days. ha
 
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Excellent post OP. The main differences between Woody & Gesell's team and this years team are 3 fold.
1) The 2015-2016 team was the opposite of this team. They were great defensively but they were challenged offensively. This years team is great offensively and challenged defensively.
2) The bench. Compare Baer, Wagner, Uhl, Williams & Ellingson to Joe T., Nunge, Keegan, PMac & Ulis.
3) The 2015-2016 team would go ice cold and have 5-6 minute scoreless streaks frequently. All teams have scoring droughts but this years team can score 15 points in a hurry and make up for the occasional drought.
We had some scoring threats in 15-16, Uthoff averaged 19 ppg and Jok 16. The difference was they fed off the perimeter. We had virtually no inside game. Woodbury was good for putbacks and the occasional layup, but nobody saw him as a scoring threat. Teams could just clog up the perimeter and we were toast.

Obviously, this years team has the perfect mix of inside outside scoring. It is the perfectly balanced offense.

Luckily, I think the defensive efforts this week have been an improvement from the beginning of the season. Still lots of work to go, but I think theres hope. Defense is largely a team thing and can be built on over the course of a season. Even unathletic guys can make up through hustle and hidden to an extent through scheme. It's not perfect, but it will be enough to win games. Offense, on the other hand, not so much. Woodbury at the age of 22 wasn't going to learn any post moves over the course of his senior season. Gesell wasn't going to learn how to shoot the rock consistently. The offensive ingredients were already baked in and the team was fundamentally flawed. If this team can continue to improve on D, they will be a threat.
 
In 15-16 our POY type candidate was mentally soft as baby sh$& a lot of the time. Teams could easily take him out of the game and we weren’t great offensively after him, collectively.

This 20-21 has a POY candidate that doesn’t go down quite so easily. And when he’s quiet in spurts, we have more capable scorers around him.
 
In 15-16 our POY type candidate was mentally soft as baby sh$& a lot of the time. Teams could easily take him out of the game and we weren’t great offensively after him, collectively.

This 20-21 has a POY candidate that doesn’t go down quite so easily. And when he’s quiet in spurts, we have more capable scorers around him.

Uthoff and Jok didn't have any scoring help and the opposing teams put all their focus on those two guys. Teams learned they didn't have to guard Clemmons or Gesell at 3pt line and Gesell always was good to get a couple of his dribble drives swatted at critical times. Woody was a 50% shooter on layups and zero post moves. Teams just mugged Jok and Uthoff and didn't bother worrying about the other guys. The team had a nice stretch when Clemmons and Gesell were on fire from 3, but that faded 2nd half of B1G season. Even Dom Uhl has a couple good games and then returned to career 20% 3pt shooting level. The team was very experienced, but fundamentally flawed as mentioned earlier.
 
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