Ferentz's Contract: an opposing viewpoint

[Bulldogs1974]

I know I'll get hammered for this but if you read the whole article there is a lot to agree with.

http://www.landgrantholyland.com/20...e-football-iowa-kirk-ferentz-extension-buyout

 

[SDHawkDoc]

Not a surprising argument from an outsider. The points made aren't outrageous interpretations.
The stability argument is probably what resonates most within the athletic department. They have a known quantity that gets them a winning record and to a bowl game more often than not. That's a better option than taking a chance on an unknown who could crash and burn.
The details of the contract might look like poor negotiating, but that there would be an extension was decided with last season's showing. KF will now be at Iowa as long as he wants.

 

[Bulldogs1974]

I'm just not sold on the buyout. that's my only issue.
I think it's easy to forget, after last season, what it looks like around here after a 7-5 or a 6-6 season.
I think kirk is deserving of his salary and bonuses considering what he has done here at iowa. The buyout, however, is a different matter. That buyout says that Kirk is more important than Iowa Football. I'm honestly a little surprised that he is ok with it.

 

[BigDelHawk]

I still say he hands the reigns over to Brian when it is all said and done. We are only one year into a completed practice facility with two back to back good years. Recruiting will follow, a dynasty will be born.

 

[Hwk-I-St8]

There are several issues with the article. First, it completely ignores the fact that, at Iowa, judging whether a FB coach is successful goes beyond the W/L column. It includes, amongh other things, looking at stuff like graduation rates and running the program with integrity. I think our administration views the FB coach as a representative of the school and, as such, should be someone who runs the program will class. Personally, I happy that that's the case. tOSU, on the other hand, does not have those same priorities.

Second, the article, like my friend yesterday, sort of assumes mediocre performance. Short of hiring an absolute top branded coach (who'd likely never come to Iowa) and/or someone who would be willing to massively push or even break the rules, Iowa will always be middle of the pack in recruiting. We'll have up years and down years, and when the stars align, years like 2015. It's been that way since Hayden brought the program to respectability, so I don't understand why people expect anything different.

That being said, our recruiting is looking up, we have some fantastic facilities, and the opportunity is there for KF to go on another run. Whether or not that happens probably depends largely on injuries and attrition. Our first full season with the new facilities yielded a 12-0 regular season. While they help with recruiting, they also help with development. It will be interesting to see if we see an overall bump in year over year performance just due to the improved facilities.

I'll be honest, I don't see the reason for a massive buyout here. I'm guessing that Barta's logic was that he has no intention of firing KF over the next 5 years, so it was somewhat moot. I'm sure he's assuming, and probably rightfully so, that we'll see the usual ~8 win average and he's OK with that. It's not a "shoot for the stars" perspective, but I don't see us being a perennial NC contender on a regular basis. Why plan to fire the coach who got you close 3 times?

 

[hawkssox1]

I still say he hands the reigns over to Brian when it is all said and done. We are only one year into a completed practice facility with two back to back good years. Recruiting will follow, a dynasty will be born.

Dynasty?

 

[latenighter84]

Buyout is not a factor. KF will retire before the contract ends and he will not care about the money or end up Donating it anyway.
IMO BF is by far the odds on pick to take over and he has until around 2022 to prove/disprove his selection.
That keeps the recruits 4yrs out and stability in the program and I think a more aggressive man in the drivers seat.

 

[mvhomerj]

Dynasty?

You me both!

 

[Freyvet]

Dynasty?

Yes, stay with the positive vib my friend!

 

[fifteenandoh]

the Buyout is irrelevant.... you're not getting rid of Kirk Ferentz.

 

[SoDakHawk]

For me it's the Nebraska argument. Most of us said while Nebby has gone through their cycle of coaches that they have unrealistic expectations and that they are not going to attract quality coaches to fill that position because of that, and, voila, they end up with Mike Riley.

If Iowa were to fire KF, who is a legend here, what good coach in their right mind is going to want to come here? They would be following a legend who was fired and have to meet some pretty high expectations. No win situation and would just be keeping the seat warm for their eventual replacement.

It will be much, much easier to transition from KF when he is ready to retire and hand off the reigns of the program. I only hope he keeps his competitive fire and realizes that the day he starts slipping is when he should get out and not hang on too long.

 

[TampaHawkfan]

It seems obvious that KF is/was not going anywhere until he retires (or his fired) so I just don't see the necessity of putting your arse in a sling by extending him out to 2026 with such a massive buyout.

I hope last year was not a total fluke, but if things revert back to 2010-2014 form again, then guess what - we're basically stuck with average, uninspiring football for a LONG time. Remember, after 2009, things were looking pretty rosy but we all know how the next 5 years went. I hope Barta is not making the same mistake all over again, by getting over-excited by a single great season.

As far as "no one will come here if we fire KF" - I'm not saying fire KF, and I'd expect that would only happen if we start having more 2012 type seasons. In that case, I think other coaches would understand making that move. Besides, I'd always want a coach with steel in his balls who EXPECTS to win, not someone who's afraid to go somewhere where winning is expected.

 

[Ronman]

My real problem is establishing the acceptable success rate at seven wins. This means we could lose a bowl game and finish 7-6 and it would meet that standard. Can't believe many Iowa fans would consider that to be a successful season, but evidently Barta does.

 

[hawkfan1963]

I still say he hands the reigns over to Brian when it is all said and done. We are only one year into a completed practice facility with two back to back good years. Recruiting will follow, a dynasty will be born.

I agree Brian is the coach in waiting who is
doing on the job training right now. I think those around Kirk won't let him become apathetic again. I also don't think coaching salaries for ANYBODY should be this high. Given that they are, I guess when you have someone who runs a clean program that doesn't get into trouble and put on probation is worth alot. Stability and loyalty count also. Results are certainly at the top. It's very clear Kirk grew apathetic a few years ago. I believe he did rededicate himself and won't let it happen again.

 

[soybean]

#1 - The "no one would want to come here" argument is a silly one.

#2 - With the staff and facilities we have in place now reverting back to 7-5 or 6-6 seasons is unlikely to occur more than once every 6-7 years and even then just one season at a time.

#3 - Now that Brian Ferentz is standing along side his dad there is little to worry about insofar as the competitive fire going out.

#4 - Take a good hard look at Kirk Ferentz...at 61 I can easily see him coaching in Iowa City for another decade.

#5 - We ain't Nebraska. $4.5M is chump change to our football program and we would never have to settle for a Mike Riley*.






* Never to be confused with Hawkeye great Mike Reilly.

 

[EpenesaEpenesa]

I still say he hands the reigns over to Brian when it is all said and done. We are only one year into a completed practice facility with two back to back good years. Recruiting will follow, a dynasty will be born.

The Iowa program isnt being "handed" to anyone. If BF, is the most qualified person, great, but it wont be handed. Iowa is a good job, there will be interest from other people

 

[24Hawkeye7]

People are always going to talk about Kirk and Iowa unless they get a blockbuster coach, problem is, there aren't blockbuster coaches readily available at any given time w/out major flight risk, I will say one thing, I never thought it as a possibility, but in the back of my mind I was hoping that they might not give him an extension and go after Tom Herman (Who I think -- If the Big12 does not add Houston, Will be leaving that program sooner than everyone thinks) I think Tom Herman will be the next great coach... somewhere

 

[Bulldogs1974]

Football is big business. I just don't understand giving away all of your power. Does anyone in college football have a bigger buyout?

 

[Roy-munson]

Over the next ten years Iowa football will make upwards of 500 million dollars. So only paying your head coach 10% of the earnings is very minimal. And with ferentz yes his average wins will prolly be 7-8 but stability will be there with the massive buyout. It gives Barta another reason not to listen to haywire fans who are wanting ferentz to be gone.

 

[washer]

The

 

[fifteenandoh]

if you remove the first 2 seasons of 1-10 and 3-9...
Kirk Ferentz averages 8.2 wins per season

and 8.25 over the last 8 seasons... and that includes the 4-8 2012 season..

I think some people are under selling coach.
the man is a gawd dam genius... he knows how to run a football program.

 

[soybean]

I know I'll get hammered for this but if you read the whole article there is a lot to agree with.

http://www.landgrantholyland.com/20...e-football-iowa-kirk-ferentz-extension-buyout

That is a very lazy piece that states facts and then promptly ignores them when making its final asessment.

 

[soybean]

The

C'mon, you can do it.

 

[Bulldogs1974]

Over the next ten years Iowa football will make upwards of 500 million dollars. So only paying your head coach 10% of the earnings is very minimal. And with ferentz yes his average wins will prolly be 7-8 but stability will be there with the massive buyout. It gives Barta another reason not to listen to haywire fans who are wanting ferentz to be gone.

Again, not disagreeing with salary. Just the buyout.

 

[Bulldogs1974]

That is a very lazy piece that states facts and then promptly ignores them when making its final asessment.

ignores what. It, albeit begrudgingly, admits is salary could be justified; what it is arguing is giving up power with such a huge buyout.
Where are they wrong?

 

[trippnschmidt]

My real problem is establishing the acceptable success rate at seven wins. This means we could lose a bowl game and finish 7-6 and it would meet that standard. Can't believe many Iowa fans would consider that to be a successful season, but evidently Barta does.

I've heard this said a few places. I did not take it that Barta would consider that a successful season, more that 7 wins is the minimum expectation.

 

[DewHawk]

My real problem is establishing the acceptable success rate at seven wins. This means we could lose a bowl game and finish 7-6 and it would meet that standard. Can't believe many Iowa fans would consider that to be a successful season, but evidently Barta does.

Agreed, very low expectations IMO as well!

 

[EpenesaEpenesa]

My real problem is establishing the acceptable success rate at seven wins. This means we could lose a bowl game and finish 7-6 and it would meet that standard. Can't believe many Iowa fans would consider that to be a successful season, but evidently Barta does.

I dont know, 7-6 last year and I dont think KF is on the Iowa sideline anymore.

 

[ghostOfHomer777]

That being said, our recruiting is looking up, we have some fantastic facilities, and the opportunity is there for KF to go on another run. Whether or not that happens probably depends largely on injuries and attrition. Our first full season with the new facilities yielded a 12-0 regular season. While they help with recruiting, they also help with development. It will be interesting to see if we see an overall bump in year over year performance just due to the improved facilities.

The Hawks had a little bit of a run from '02-'05. Many fans would prefer not to include '05 ... however, Ferentz is always very positive about that group. We were very few bounces of the ball ... and a single Ed Hinkel injury away from a shockingly good season that year.

The biggest "hang-ups" that undermined that past run from running longer were culture issues on the squad (the much reported culture of entitlement that led to the "fat cats" of '06) AND, more importantly, the deteriorating health of Norm Parker.

I think that Ferentz (and others) really do see the possibility for the Hawks to pull off a nice run through the coming years. The recruiting HAS been looking nice. The facilities ARE looking great. And, most importantly, the coaching staff has found a nice equilibrium and the players/coaches have really been fostering and continuing a very positive culture within the program.

Let's say that Iowa can maintain a rate of around 9+ wins through the next 3 years ... potentially another crazy-good season squeezing its way in there. Then, we're looking at the possibility of Kirk actually being on contract at a rate BELOW what would/could be his market value. That could take us near through 2020 ... with only having to worry about the buy-out in his latter years. However, even then, there's no reason to doubt that we couldn't still be decent then.

 

[Bulldogs1974]

The Hawks had a little bit of a run from '02-'05. Many fans would prefer not to include '05 ... however, Ferentz is always very positive about that group. We were very few bounces of the ball ... and a single Ed Hinkel injury away from a shockingly good season that year.

The biggest "hang-ups" that undermined that past run from running longer were culture issues on the squad (the much reported culture of entitlement that led to the "fat cats" of '06) AND, more importantly, the deteriorating health of Norm Parker.

I think that Ferentz (and others) really do see the possibility for the Hawks to pull off a nice run through the coming years. The recruiting HAS been looking nice. The facilities ARE looking great. And, most importantly, the coaching staff has found a nice equilibrium and the players/coaches have really been fostering and continuing a very positive culture within the program.

Let's say that Iowa can maintain a rate of around 9+ wins through the next 3 years ... potentially another crazy-good season squeezing its way in there. Then, we're looking at the possibility of Kirk actually being on contract at a rate BELOW what would/could be his market value. That could take us near through 2020 ... with only having to worry about the buy-out in his latter years. However, even then, there's no reason to doubt that we couldn't still be decent then.

Again I ask, does anyone have a buyout that big? no one is disputing his value/worth when it comes to salary and bonuses. The buyout is another thing.
if KF had gone 6-6 last year and this year people would be going ape sh!t. You can't be that close to that outcome and jump to, potentially, the biggest buyout in college football.

 

[fifteenandoh]

Kirk Ferentz ain't going no where... the Buyout is irrelevant.

 

[ghostOfHomer777]

Again I ask, does anyone have a buyout that big? no one is disputing his value/worth when it comes to salary and bonuses. The buyout is another thing.
if KF had gone 6-6 last year and this year people would be going ape sh!t. You can't be that close to that outcome and jump to, potentially, the biggest buyout in college football.

The buyout is only as big as the salary. If you're "saving" a million a year (or so) for several years ... then that adds up too.

Also, Ferentz doesn't like losing. I'm pretty confident that Iowa is set to look good through 2020. Past then, who knows. However, even should that prognostication prove correct ... Iowa is going to have SEVERAL years of very high level recruiting. That supplies a very nice platform from which to build.

Thus, if Iowa were to somehow drop down to 7-6 for a year or two in the early 2020s ... then Ferentz would invariably make adjustments to change such a trend. If he were to right that ship yet again ... then his contract would be expiring with Iowa back up at a high-point.

The buyout is a worst-case scenario preventative measure. Given the precedent set at Iowa ... Ferentz has managed to remarkably turn things around already on TWO SEPARATE occasions.

When looking at Ferentz, the scenario looks potentially more like a JoPa scenario ... but without the Sandusky baggage. Given how Penn State was able to even reinvent themselves so late in JoPa's career ... there's no reason to suppose that the same couldn't occur at Iowa under Ferentz.

 

[hawk-i bob]

Kirk Ferentz ain't going no where... the Buyout is irrelevant.

and the Buyout is only relevant if Iowa (AD) happens to "fire" him....I don't know...just don't see that happening.

 

[whatsup13579er]

Stop crying about the buyout. The buyout if absolute worst case scenario. If it comes down to the worst case scenario and Barta does have to fire KF, money is not an issue. Barta basically said as much in an interview. Long story short Barta has plenty of money to pay KF's buyout if it comes down to it.

 

[EZ2BJZ]

The Iowa program isnt being "handed" to anyone. If BF, is the most qualified person, great, but it wont be handed. Iowa is a good job, there will be interest from other people

Yes, exactly. I honestly have been scratching my head for a while every time I hear this "Brian Ferentz is the heir apparent to Kirk" talk. No, I'm not saying that Brian would or would not make a good head coach, I'm just trying to understand how people are believing that that's how it actually works. Is there a clause in Ferentz's contract that stipulates when he's ready to retire he gets to choose his successor?

If Brian is the most qualified candidate when that time comes, then great. But until that time comes any conjecture about who will take over for Kirk is just silly.

 

[EZ2BJZ]

The only way there will be a buyout of Kirk's contract is if he gets fired for allowing boys to be molested by one of his staff. Something like that is the only way Kirk ever gets fired.

Because "We are NOT...Penn State."

 

[SDHawkDoc]

The Hawks had a little bit of a run from '02-'05. Many fans would prefer not to include '05 ... however, Ferentz is always very positive about that group. We were very few bounces of the ball ... and a single Ed Hinkel injury away from a shockingly good season that year.

The biggest "hang-ups" that undermined that past run from running longer were culture issues on the squad (the much reported culture of entitlement that led to the "fat cats" of '06) AND, more importantly, the deteriorating health of Norm Parker.

I think that Ferentz (and others) really do see the possibility for the Hawks to pull off a nice run through the coming years. The recruiting HAS been looking nice. The facilities ARE looking great. And, most importantly, the coaching staff has found a nice equilibrium and the players/coaches have really been fostering and continuing a very positive culture within the program.

Let's say that Iowa can maintain a rate of around 9+ wins through the next 3 years ... potentially another crazy-good season squeezing its way in there. Then, we're looking at the possibility of Kirk actually being on contract at a rate BELOW what would/could be his market value. That could take us near through 2020 ... with only having to worry about the buy-out in his latter years. However, even then, there's no reason to doubt that we couldn't still be decent then.

That's a lot of positive spin and exuberant prediction in one post.

I wouldn't devalue what KF accomplished last year because they had many breaks go their way to get there any more than I would give a pass for the lack of results in a season like '05.

Given his relatively long tenure here it's fair to assess the won-loss record as it stands, without caveats.

I agree with the OP's point that the buyout warrants some scrutiny.

 

[hawkfan1963]

Yes, exactly. I honestly have been scratching my head for a while every time I hear this "Brian Ferentz is the heir apparent to Kirk" talk. No, I'm not saying that Brian would or would not make a good head coach, I'm just trying to understand how people are believing that that's how it actually works. Is there a clause in Ferentz's contract that stipulates when he's ready to retire he gets to choose his successor?

If Brian is the most qualified candidate when that time comes, then great. But until that time comes any conjecture about who will take over for Kirk is just silly.

Yes Brian would have to be interviewed and chosen, but here is how I see it. Kirk has run a clean program and he teaches sound fundamental football. Brian has grown up from birth around this type of atmosphere and so I would assume he has the same values as his dad. Now being younger he would see what his dad has done and improve on it. Brian also left pro assistant coaching to return to college coaching. Nick Saban did the same thing. This says something about the difference between the two. Brian has a family now and they are his priority. Brian has lived in larger cities and has lived in Iowa. The world isn't getting safer, its geting more dangerous. While bad things happen anywhere lets face it Iowa City is safer than Boston, Massachusetts. Also a father(Kirk) would certainly get some sort of satisfaction from building a legacy with the Hawkeyes and would certainly get some sort of satisfaction in helping one of his children succeed. So Brian will have to work hard over the next few years, learn, grow, and then I belive he will be given a chance to interview for the job. As far as coaches preparing their replacements and grooming them, go ask Bo Ryan about that.

 

[Hwk-I-St8]

Stop crying about the buyout. The buyout if absolute worst case scenario. If it comes down to the worst case scenario and Barta does have to fire KF, money is not an issue. Barta basically said as much in an interview. Long story short Barta has plenty of money to pay KF's buyout if it comes down to it.

This is a good point. People crying about the buyout are assuming that it prevented us from firing Ferentz recently....probably because they themselves wanted him fired. Barta was very clear that it was not a deterrent then, so it almost certainly wouldn't be one going forward either.

 

[trippnschmidt]

Again I ask, does anyone have a buyout that big? no one is disputing his value/worth when it comes to salary and bonuses. The buyout is another thing.
if KF had gone 6-6 last year and this year people would be going ape sh!t. You can't be that close to that outcome and jump to, potentially, the biggest buyout in college football.

And if he went 0-12 people would be pissed. But they didn't go 0-12. And they didn't go 6-6.