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Gopher fans are turning on Fleck

He will not survive the dissolving of the Big Ten West.

Modern football is about the passing game. The athletes that win want to do it and the rules are set up for it.

The West is flint and rock football with Neanderthal coaching. Once that B.S. schedule goes away packed with similar coaching philosophies many coaches will be done inside three years.

Fleck is scared to pass. That might work in the MAC and the Big Ten West but that’s about it.

Any conversation about winning the West centers on who you don’t play from the East. That statement defines what a joke the west is.
 
Boat Fail GIF by Western Illinois University
 
He will not survive the dissolving of the Big Ten West.

Modern football is about the passing game. The athletes that win want to do it and the rules are set up for it.

The West is flint and rock football with Neanderthal coaching. Once that B.S. schedule goes away packed with similar coaching philosophies many coaches will be done inside three years.

Fleck is scared to pass. That might work in the MAC and the Big Ten West but that’s about it.

Any conversation about winning the West centers on who you don’t play from the East. That statement defines what a joke the west is.
If it was easy everyone would do it right? I actually don't dislike Fleck, he is a little about himself, whatever, but he has always been respectful of his opponents and us and he is a really good coach. Do you really think coaches like him and KF don't want to pass? Like somehow they could just change their philosophies overnight, change the scheme and then start slinging it around with great success? It is not that easy.

Why? There are a lot of great defenses in the B1G. Just think about it like this; how many times have you seen a pass heavy team from the MAC or a non-P5 come play a B1G team with a good defense and they just throw all over them? Look at us, we play a team like Kent St. or Utah St. that throws for a billion yards against everyone else but then against us they get shut down. Because we have better dudes than they have and we are well coached. Why do you think Penn St. with an offense scoring 38 points per game scores only 12 and 15 against OSU and Michigan? Franklin can fire the OC all he wants, he is a really good OC, but those other 2 teams' defenses are elite. The passing game takes so many elements to work, really all of them. When they do it is a beautiful thing, but when they don't it can look really bad. For a great reference of that go back and look at Brady's last two years with the Bucs. One where he has Gronk, one where he doesn't. Any injury at the WR position. Any injury in the oline or two. Brady didn't forget how to play, his play was elite both years. He still had weapons. But the first year they could do no wrong on offense and won the Super Bowl, the second year they looked like they were running in mud and were close to the bottom.

Modern football doesn't mean it is better football, it is an adaptation to talent and rules. Its not like coaches 30, 40, 50 years ago weren't smart. Of course they were. The fundamentals of football are still sound. You have to block. You have to be able to run the football because most defenses can scheme against a one-dimensional offense and great defenses, like a lot of what we see in the B1G, can scheme against balanced attacks too making everything hard.

This is not Tecmo Bowl or Madden. Most of these coaches know what they are doing, they just don't have all the tools to do it. In Fleck's case and in KF's case and any other development program, you are limited by the ebb and flow of the player turnover that you have. If Fleck had a Justin Fields, Joe Burrow or Tua Tagaviola sitting on the bench, sure, he probably would go to a guy like that and see what he can do. But he doesn't and he is stuck playing Kaliakmanus and KF is stuck playing Deacon Hill and having to live through the growing pains.

This is why it makes it so difficult for a development program to be competitive every year. There is a huge difference, huge, between being good once every 4 or 5 years and being good every year. This is what so many people do not appreciate with KF and they won't realize it until after he is gone.
 
If it was easy everyone would do it right? I actually don't dislike Fleck, he is a little about himself, whatever, but he has always been respectful of his opponents and us and he is a really good coach. Do you really think coaches like him and KF don't want to pass? Like somehow they could just change their philosophies overnight, change the scheme and then start slinging it around with great success? It is not that easy.

Why? There are a lot of great defenses in the B1G. Just think about it like this; how many times have you seen a pass heavy team from the MAC or a non-P5 come play a B1G team with a good defense and they just throw all over them? Look at us, we play a team like Kent St. or Utah St. that throws for a billion yards against everyone else but then against us they get shut down. Because we have better dudes than they have and we are well coached. Why do you think Penn St. with an offense scoring 38 points per game scores only 12 and 15 against OSU and Michigan? Franklin can fire the OC all he wants, he is a really good OC, but those other 2 teams' defenses are elite. The passing game takes so many elements to work, really all of them. When they do it is a beautiful thing, but when they don't it can look really bad. For a great reference of that go back and look at Brady's last two years with the Bucs. One where he has Gronk, one where he doesn't. Any injury at the WR position. Any injury in the oline or two. Brady didn't forget how to play, his play was elite both years. He still had weapons. But the first year they could do no wrong on offense and won the Super Bowl, the second year they looked like they were running in mud and were close to the bottom.

Modern football doesn't mean it is better football, it is an adaptation to talent and rules. Its not like coaches 30, 40, 50 years ago weren't smart. Of course they were. The fundamentals of football are still sound. You have to block. You have to be able to run the football because most defenses can scheme against a one-dimensional offense and great defenses, like a lot of what we see in the B1G, can scheme against balanced attacks too making everything hard.

This is not Tecmo Bowl or Madden. Most of these coaches know what they are doing, they just don't have all the tools to do it. In Fleck's case and in KF's case and any other development program, you are limited by the ebb and flow of the player turnover that you have. If Fleck had a Justin Fields, Joe Burrow or Tua Tagaviola sitting on the bench, sure, he probably would go to a guy like that and see what he can do. But he doesn't and he is stuck playing Kaliakmanus and KF is stuck playing Deacon Hill and having to live through the growing pains.

This is why it makes it so difficult for a development program to be competitive every year. There is a huge difference, huge, between being good once every 4 or 5 years and being good every year. This is what so many people do not appreciate with KF and they won't realize it until after he is gone.
There are five great defenses in the Big Ten. Iowa is the only defense in the Big Ten West, the other four are in the East. And Nebraska might be the only other Big Ten west defense even considered “good.”
 
Fleck is scared to pass. That might work in the MAC and the Big Ten West but that’s about it.
iIRC 2019 fleck had several really great college receivers and Tanner Morgan was spot on so they passed a lot that year when they came into Kinnick undefeated. They were a good running team also.

I dont think he has the receivers like he did back then and the qbing
 
iIRC 2019 fleck had several really great college receivers and Tanner Morgan was spot on so they passed a lot that year when they came into Kinnick undefeated. They were a good running team also.

I dont think he has the receivers like he did back then and the qbing
Many of players on this team were not Fleck recruits. Many up here are beginning to question his recruiting which has been rated towards the bottom in the Big 10
 
There are five great defenses in the Big Ten. Iowa is the only defense in the Big Ten West, the other four are in the East. And Nebraska might be the only other Big Ten west defense even considered “good.”
My post was talking in general, that good defense is played in the B1G. I know this year Illinois is not very good there but last year they were one of the top units in football. Wisconsin was elite for a lot of years before this one.

But this year is no slouch either when you look at it:

1 - Michigan
2 - PSU
4 - OSU
8 - Iowa
13 - Rutgers
17 - Nebraska
30 - NW
33 - Wisconsin
38 - Maryland

Then you have for the remaining 5 teams: 52, 58, 77, 80 and 83

That is 9 out of the 14 teams this year in the top 40.

Conversely for other P5 conferences in that range:

Big 12 - 2 (Iowa St. 28, Texas 36)
ACC - 7
Pac 12 - 5
SEC - 3 (surprising)

On a sidenote, the 4 teams coming into the league next year rank"

Oregon - 18 (they are solid but they also have the most money of any team in football, so they can buy anyone they want, as long as they keep doing that they will be competitive in the B1G)
UCLA - 10 (pretty solid, but historically not great here)
USC - 124 (going to need a total unit rebuild on that side of the ball to compete)
Washington - 99 (lose a lot of that offense next year)

I said that because most people get enamored with these high profile offenses, but, data consistently shows that good defense trumps good offense.
 
If it was easy everyone would do it right? I actually don't dislike Fleck, he is a little about himself, whatever, but he has always been respectful of his opponents and us and he is a really good coach. Do you really think coaches like him and KF don't want to pass? Like somehow they could just change their philosophies overnight, change the scheme and then start slinging it around with great success? It is not that easy.

Why? There are a lot of great defenses in the B1G. Just think about it like this; how many times have you seen a pass heavy team from the MAC or a non-P5 come play a B1G team with a good defense and they just throw all over them? Look at us, we play a team like Kent St. or Utah St. that throws for a billion yards against everyone else but then against us they get shut down. Because we have better dudes than they have and we are well coached. Why do you think Penn St. with an offense scoring 38 points per game scores only 12 and 15 against OSU and Michigan? Franklin can fire the OC all he wants, he is a really good OC, but those other 2 teams' defenses are elite. The passing game takes so many elements to work, really all of them. When they do it is a beautiful thing, but when they don't it can look really bad. For a great reference of that go back and look at Brady's last two years with the Bucs. One where he has Gronk, one where he doesn't. Any injury at the WR position. Any injury in the oline or two. Brady didn't forget how to play, his play was elite both years. He still had weapons. But the first year they could do no wrong on offense and won the Super Bowl, the second year they looked like they were running in mud and were close to the bottom.

Modern football doesn't mean it is better football, it is an adaptation to talent and rules. Its not like coaches 30, 40, 50 years ago weren't smart. Of course they were. The fundamentals of football are still sound. You have to block. You have to be able to run the football because most defenses can scheme against a one-dimensional offense and great defenses, like a lot of what we see in the B1G, can scheme against balanced attacks too making everything hard.

This is not Tecmo Bowl or Madden. Most of these coaches know what they are doing, they just don't have all the tools to do it. In Fleck's case and in KF's case and any other development program, you are limited by the ebb and flow of the player turnover that you have. If Fleck had a Justin Fields, Joe Burrow or Tua Tagaviola sitting on the bench, sure, he probably would go to a guy like that and see what he can do. But he doesn't and he is stuck playing Kaliakmanus and KF is stuck playing Deacon Hill and having to live through the growing pains.

This is why it makes it so difficult for a development program to be competitive every year. There is a huge difference, huge, between being good once every 4 or 5 years and being good every year. This is what so many people do not appreciate with KF and they won't realize it until after he is gone.
Agree with most of your points. But offense just seems like something KF treats as way to give his defense a rest. Change is coming,The biggest will be no longer getting to play in the west. I wish the BIG would add 2 more teams. Then create 4 divisions geographically. We keep Nebby,Minnie,Wiscy,NW
 
The reason teams like Iowa are run heavy is to control the clock and limit the number of possessions for teams that have and always will have a recruiting advantage at the skill positions. You know who else is like Ferentz? Saban. He is Kirk Ferentz if all of a sudden we had 5 star players on offense. Make no mistake though Saban is an old school run first guy and it is why he has that many national championships.

Limit the offenses chances to score big puts pressure on every possession. Especially in the College ranks where kids make mistakes regularly no matter how well they are coached.
 
He will not survive the dissolving of the Big Ten West.

Modern football is about the passing game. The athletes that win want to do it and the rules are set up for it.

The West is flint and rock football with Neanderthal coaching. Once that B.S. schedule goes away packed with similar coaching philosophies many coaches will be done inside three years.

Fleck is scared to pass. That might work in the MAC and the Big Ten West but that’s about it.

Any conversation about winning the West centers on who you don’t play from the East. That statement defines what a joke the west is.
The funny thing is: he's had great receivers/athletes that are in the NFL.
 
Agree with most of your points. But offense just seems like something KF treats as way to give his defense a rest. Change is coming,The biggest will be no longer getting to play in the west. I wish the BIG would add 2 more teams. Then create 4 divisions geographically. We keep Nebby,Minnie,Wiscy,NW
I don't disagree with you at all, the west going away is a game changer for philosophy for the west teams. I am not sure if it is still this way, but a couple years ago I saw that stat that basically said the a west team's schedule against the east was a non-issue because even if a team played OSU, PSU and Michigan in their x-overs, as long as they beat the other west teams they go to the B1G. Sure, everyone wants to win a national championship, but, that is not a realistic goal for most teams, so, the goals set forth are to first win the games against your division rivals. Second, if you do that it gets you in the B1G because you can't win the B1G if you are not in it. Then you turn that game into a 1 game playoff.

I think the difference now is that KF and all the coaches have not wavered from their focus and goals, which is to win the west and go the B1G. However for the fans the goals have been escalating on a sliding scale, that some fans want more and do not appreciate that achievement. I promise you that if this team goes to the B1G and wins 10 games KF will deem that a successful season.

Next year though is going to change it for all the west teams as all the games count (not that they don't count now, just from what I said above the east games are not as big of a focus as the west games) and thus they are going to have to score some points. KF knows this, Fleck knows this, all the west teams know this.
 
Maybe he needs some new pants. Or maybe some more cosmetic work on the face.

His act gets old and I can see why Gopher fans may get annoyed with him when they are losing. He has OSU next on the road and then at home against Wisconsin (who is still trying to figure things out). So at best 6-6 and 4-5 in the conference.
 
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I work in the Kalamazoo area with quite a few WMU grads, and was recently told about some of Fleck’s antics from two people close to the athletics department. Fleck’s fling with his second wife began while they were both married; Fleck to the mother of his children and his paramour to the son of a wealthy man who owns multiple car dealerships in the area and also happens to be WMU’s biggest booster for the athletics department. He was understandably pissed off about the whole thing and threatened to cut all funding to the school. WMU considered firing the AD and Fleck before he bolted for Minnesota.
 
If it was easy everyone would do it right? I actually don't dislike Fleck, he is a little about himself, whatever, but he has always been respectful of his opponents and us and he is a really good coach. Do you really think coaches like him and KF don't want to pass? Like somehow they could just change their philosophies overnight, change the scheme and then start slinging it around with great success? It is not that easy.

Why? There are a lot of great defenses in the B1G. Just think about it like this; how many times have you seen a pass heavy team from the MAC or a non-P5 come play a B1G team with a good defense and they just throw all over them? Look at us, we play a team like Kent St. or Utah St. that throws for a billion yards against everyone else but then against us they get shut down. Because we have better dudes than they have and we are well coached. Why do you think Penn St. with an offense scoring 38 points per game scores only 12 and 15 against OSU and Michigan? Franklin can fire the OC all he wants, he is a really good OC, but those other 2 teams' defenses are elite. The passing game takes so many elements to work, really all of them. When they do it is a beautiful thing, but when they don't it can look really bad. For a great reference of that go back and look at Brady's last two years with the Bucs. One where he has Gronk, one where he doesn't. Any injury at the WR position. Any injury in the oline or two. Brady didn't forget how to play, his play was elite both years. He still had weapons. But the first year they could do no wrong on offense and won the Super Bowl, the second year they looked like they were running in mud and were close to the bottom.

Modern football doesn't mean it is better football, it is an adaptation to talent and rules. Its not like coaches 30, 40, 50 years ago weren't smart. Of course they were. The fundamentals of football are still sound. You have to block. You have to be able to run the football because most defenses can scheme against a one-dimensional offense and great defenses, like a lot of what we see in the B1G, can scheme against balanced attacks too making everything hard.

This is not Tecmo Bowl or Madden. Most of these coaches know what they are doing, they just don't have all the tools to do it. In Fleck's case and in KF's case and any other development program, you are limited by the ebb and flow of the player turnover that you have. If Fleck had a Justin Fields, Joe Burrow or Tua Tagaviola sitting on the bench, sure, he probably would go to a guy like that and see what he can do. But he doesn't and he is stuck playing Kaliakmanus and KF is stuck playing Deacon Hill and having to live through the growing pains.

This is why it makes it so difficult for a development program to be competitive every year. There is a huge difference, huge, between being good once every 4 or 5 years and being good every year. This is what so many people do not appreciate with KF and they won't realize it until after he is gone.
I’ve been consistent in saying I appreciate KF and what he’s at Iowa, however hiring Brian , who was obviously unqualified to run a power 5 offense was a major misfire.
Hire a guy who can run an offense , keep Phil firing on all cylinders and there’s no reason Iowa can’t continue to win. The million dollar question is whether or not Kirk will relinquish some control and actually let the OC run the offense… we shall see…
 
He will not survive the dissolving of the Big Ten West.

Modern football is about the passing game. The athletes that win want to do it and the rules are set up for it.

The West is flint and rock football with Neanderthal coaching. Once that B.S. schedule goes away packed with similar coaching philosophies many coaches will be done inside three years.

Fleck is scared to pass. That might work in the MAC and the Big Ten West but that’s about it.

Any conversation about winning the West centers on who you don’t play from the East. That statement defines what a joke the west is.
Passing stats from Michigan at PSU.

17-30 130 yards 1TD...COMBINED
 
Fans keep kvetching about our schedule with new conference members but 2024 additions are UWash in Kinnick and at UCLA in November. Huskieswill be a lot different team without penix and his NFL bound Wrs
UCLA is struggling this year lately.
We go to OSU which replaces our trip to PSU this year.
We play MSU and MD on the road...not scary.
Wis, NW and Neb at home.
Gophers in Minny. ISU at home.

Is this schedule that much scarier than normal. Last year OSU and MICH were 2 certain losses...not seeing that next year.
2025 is much tougher.
Maybe KF has one more big year in him next year and then maybe bail.
 
I’ve been consistent in saying I appreciate KF and what he’s at Iowa, however hiring Brian , who was obviously unqualified to run a power 5 offense was a major misfire.
Hire a guy who can run an offense , keep Phil firing on all cylinders and there’s no reason Iowa can’t continue to win. The million dollar question is whether or not Kirk will relinquish some control and actually let the OC run the offense… we shall see…
What is the common denominator for Iowa's poor offensive production, KF. You could hire Jim Harbaugh to run the offense and it wouldn't change very much because KF keeps his thumb on it. KF will not relinquish control, that would be totally out of character for him
 
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My post was talking in general, that good defense is played in the B1G. I know this year Illinois is not very good there but last year they were one of the top units in football. Wisconsin was elite for a lot of years before this one.

But this year is no slouch either when you look at it:

1 - Michigan
2 - PSU
4 - OSU
8 - Iowa
13 - Rutgers
17 - Nebraska
30 - NW
33 - Wisconsin
38 - Maryland

Then you have for the remaining 5 teams: 52, 58, 77, 80 and 83

That is 9 out of the 14 teams this year in the top 40.

Conversely for other P5 conferences in that range:

Big 12 - 2 (Iowa St. 28, Texas 36)
ACC - 7
Pac 12 - 5
SEC - 3 (surprising)

On a sidenote, the 4 teams coming into the league next year rank"

Oregon - 18 (they are solid but they also have the most money of any team in football, so they can buy anyone they want, as long as they keep doing that they will be competitive in the B1G)
UCLA - 10 (pretty solid, but historically not great here)
USC - 124 (going to need a total unit rebuild on that side of the ball to compete)
Washington - 99 (lose a lot of that offense next year)

I said that because most people get enamored with these high profile offenses, but, data consistently shows that good defense trumps good offense.
Balance of O and D is elite, like OSU/UM/GA. If you are weighted too heavily in one direction you end up in a lot of iffy games.
 
What is the common denominator for Iowa's poor offensive production, KF. You could hire Jim Harbaugh to run the offense and it wouldn't change very much because KF keeps his thumb on it. KF will not relinquish control, that would be totally out of character for him
I’m not convinced either, hopefully he understands it must be done to get this thing where they want it to be. I guess we will know for sure once we know the hire. But literally it can’t get any worse you wouldn’t think. Could it?🫤
 
Here are the B1G Football Head Coach Buyouts. These numbers come from the story linked.

Mel Tucker is fighting to be paid his $79M buyout.

USC’s buyout for Lincoln Riley is not included on this list as it, like Northwestern, is a private institution that has no legal obligation to release coaching contract figures.

  • 1. James Franklin, Penn State (No. 4 overall): $64.67 million
  • 2. Matt Rhule, Nebraska (No. 6 overall): $62.06 million
  • 3. Ryan Day, Ohio State (No. 9 overall): $46.22 million
  • 4. Dan Lanning, Oregon (No. 11 overall): $44.33 million
  • 5. Luke Fickell, Wisconsin (No. 13 overall): $39.68 million
  • 6. Kirk Ferentz, Iowa (No. 14 overall): $37 million
  • 7. Bret Bielema, Illinois (No. 15 overall): $35.75 million
  • 8. Jim Harbaugh, Michigan (No. 21 overall): $27.24 million
  • 9. P.J. Fleck, Minnesota (No. 24 overall): $23.73 million
  • 10. Kalen DeBoer, Washington (No. 25 overall): $23.2 million
  • 11. Tom Allen, Indiana (No. 28 overall): $20.4 million
  • 12. Mike Locksley, Maryland (No. 34 overall): $16.55 million
  • 13. Greg Schiano, Rutgers (No. 40 overall): $13.07 million
  • 14. Ryan Walters, Purdue (No. 44 overall): $12.63 million
  • 15. Chip Kelly, UCLA (No. 48 overall): $8.79 million

 
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