I Think its officially over for the Hawks
- Thread starter Mike_a_TetonValley
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86_90....we agree more than you think. We are pretty far apart when we don't but over all, we do well.
for the record....I am not an insider. I know the guys on the staff for a while. (and other programs) Know most of the families on the team. I don't abuse the relationships I have because I know people hit them up all the time and I don't want to be that guy. I have been a coach for a while in a few places and found it is easy to get to know wrestlers, coaches an families. I do a lot of listening and love how approachable the wrestling community really is.
for the record....I am not an insider. I know the guys on the staff for a while. (and other programs) Know most of the families on the team. I don't abuse the relationships I have because I know people hit them up all the time and I don't want to be that guy. I have been a coach for a while in a few places and found it is easy to get to know wrestlers, coaches an families. I do a lot of listening and love how approachable the wrestling community really is.
Great post. Criticizing why we aren't scoring more or taking more shots is one thing but the personal attacks these scum bag cowards make is embarrassing to Hawkeye nation.
Penn State fans were merciless on the Altons. Every fan base has the idiots that attack their athletes, we just have more since 1000 fans are on here while other boards hope to get 100. Any recruit with an ounce of common sense can see that the Iowa fan base as a whole is the best in the country. St. Louis is filled with Hawkeye fans right now. Ignore the mouth breathing morons on here.
Nevermind anything I've ever said if you haven't already.
I truly apologize to anyone that I've offended and don't want to have or make enemies. It just literally sickens me that people are so hard on these 18-22 year olds that give every ounce of their blood, sweat, and tears to the program we all love.
I really hope Cory Clark gives even the most fickle fans something to be happy about tonight.
Go Hawks!
Posted from Rivals Mobile
I truly apologize to anyone that I've offended and don't want to have or make enemies. It just literally sickens me that people are so hard on these 18-22 year olds that give every ounce of their blood, sweat, and tears to the program we all love.
I really hope Cory Clark gives even the most fickle fans something to be happy about tonight.
Go Hawks!
Posted from Rivals Mobile
Would you care to share your evidence for this or is it just one of those things you'll keep to yourself?
I have a hard time believing any top notch wrestler (or any scholarship athlete for that matter) would use message board activity as a significant criteria for choosing which school to attend.
I would have to be really concerned if a top wrestler had a message board influence their choice. However, I could see where some people wouldn't want their kids to wrestle under the microscope that Iowa can be. We may have unrealistic, moronic fans but that is because they also come with a well educated, passionate fanbase. You either want to wrestle on the big stage or don't. Wrestling is largely still an individual sport. You can certainly be highly successful at at a school like Kent St, Old Dominion, Northwester, ASU, etc.
It had nothing to do with the message board and everything to do with our unrealistic fans... Many who post here.
It sickens me to say it, but many people use this board as the pulse of our fanbase. It's a fact.
And yes, I'll keep to myself out of respect for those that enlighten me. Not sure why that's so hard for some of you comprehend. Just click the ignore button if you hate me so much.
Posted from Rivals Mobile
Meltdowns like the one that has occurred on this board affect the overall perception of our program and fans. It may not directly influence recruits, but I would be willing to bet that it indirectly does. If the wrestling community as a whole thinks we're a bunch of dbags it is definitely going to prevent some kids from even giving us a serious look.
Better that there are no fans at all, thus no negative posts. Likewise, there should be no fans in stands putting pressure on the team or coaches. Best to have no message boards either, which allegedly break the spirits of parents, wrestlers (and apparently some posters on here).
This entire web site needs to shut down, too many fans posting here--and some posts are critical of the team. This is, of course, unacceptable.
I for one don't believe I want a kid on this team who would let themselves be infected by things like this. I feel like a Hawkeye wrestler is a guy who WANTS that challenge, who WANTS that high level of scrutiny, who WANTS sky high expectations. I want the guy with a singular focus, the guy who wont let anything get in his way. Besides, thinking you'll be safe from scrutiny by going to NW or MINN is really ridiculous. Those places have high expectations too.
I live in Vegas, follow UNLV B-ball and what not. A couple of years ago in recruiting Anthony Bennett (future #1 overall pick) his final two choices came down to UNLV and Kentucky. Needless to say he was highly sought after by both sides AND their groups of fans. Of course he sided with the Rebels and I only bring it up here because of the reaction from Kentucky fans. It was really really bad. The vitrial thrown Bennett's direction was borderline criminal. Saying the worst possible things you could expect southerners to say to the kid on twitter and whatnot. And this is Kentucky, this is a school that gets every kid they want, stockpiling their roster with McDonalds AA's every single year. And here they didn't get one great player and their fans are being beyond inappropriate. Then fast forward 9 months later when Bennett wasn't doing as well as UNLV fans thought he should have (routinely gassing in games) then THEY started talking bad about the guy. Apparently, everybody forgot how happy they were when he chose UNLV in the first place.
My point is, fans everywhere are ridiculous. IF Bennett thought he could escape this level of scrutinty by choosing UNLV he was sorely mistaken. That's part of the DNA of fandom. Fanaticism. If you don't want to accept the spotlight and the scrutiny that comes with it then I would say you have little business being a big time DI college athlete, and certainly have no business being a Hawkeye wrestler. You can't accept the adoration without also accepting everything that comes with it. And its much harder on the parents than the kid themselves, anyway.
I live in Vegas, follow UNLV B-ball and what not. A couple of years ago in recruiting Anthony Bennett (future #1 overall pick) his final two choices came down to UNLV and Kentucky. Needless to say he was highly sought after by both sides AND their groups of fans. Of course he sided with the Rebels and I only bring it up here because of the reaction from Kentucky fans. It was really really bad. The vitrial thrown Bennett's direction was borderline criminal. Saying the worst possible things you could expect southerners to say to the kid on twitter and whatnot. And this is Kentucky, this is a school that gets every kid they want, stockpiling their roster with McDonalds AA's every single year. And here they didn't get one great player and their fans are being beyond inappropriate. Then fast forward 9 months later when Bennett wasn't doing as well as UNLV fans thought he should have (routinely gassing in games) then THEY started talking bad about the guy. Apparently, everybody forgot how happy they were when he chose UNLV in the first place.
My point is, fans everywhere are ridiculous. IF Bennett thought he could escape this level of scrutinty by choosing UNLV he was sorely mistaken. That's part of the DNA of fandom. Fanaticism. If you don't want to accept the spotlight and the scrutiny that comes with it then I would say you have little business being a big time DI college athlete, and certainly have no business being a Hawkeye wrestler. You can't accept the adoration without also accepting everything that comes with it. And its much harder on the parents than the kid themselves, anyway.
Let them hate us out of jealousy (the basis for a lot of it), not because we give them real reasons to
It has been interesting to see people criticizing people for criticizing people by doing the same thing... And yes I get the difference between doing it to wrestlers and message board people.
OK, Mr. Wonderful. I won't name drop for the sake of appeasing you, that much I know for certain. And when you say "guys" as in plural, and there are two posts above yours, I made the assumption you're talking about me. I stick up for myself. If you or anyone else doesn't like it, too bad. You're entitled to your opinion, same as I am.
lets say a recruit comes for a visit from out of state and hangs out with dziewa for a while. that recruit asks josh if he is happy with his decision to move across the country to come to iowa. if josh has been getting slammed everyday by his "fans" it might have an effect on his answer to that recruit. now you guys can justify what you post however you want but everything we say and do has some effect.iowa has the best fan base we should be aware everyone else is watching and waiting for something to use against us.
I can somewhat confirm what Gobblin is saying. While waiting to get into Nationals this morning we got to talking with a dad and a couple of kids wearing young guns gear. Not sure who the kids were, possible recruits, possibly not, but the dad was talking about how everyone in the arena is against Iowa, and then mentioned the message boards and how crazy it was. Recruits and parents do read the boards.
I get overly emotional about Iowa wrestling as well, but when I see.the wrestlers parents, family, girlfriends crying after a loss or career ends, remember that they have so much more invested than us as fans.
I get overly emotional about Iowa wrestling as well, but when I see.the wrestlers parents, family, girlfriends crying after a loss or career ends, remember that they have so much more invested than us as fans.
Sorry but this is the natural of all sports and individual sports in general. The biggest spotlights also require the thickest skins. Working hard and not achieving a goal is sometimes what happens. I'm sure most would still say it's the process/journey that matters more. Of course this is assuming the athlete did everything he/she could. Results are for fans.
Good insight 86_90 about it being the process/journey.
I think another thought I would add would be to say it is about teaching Good Sportsmanship.
And as fans I think sportsmanship should be important to us too.
It's all part of the process of growing up and becoming well balanced mature adults.
I really have enjoyed watching the competitors at NCAA this year. Lots of great kids all over this country on many different teams.
I just want to add to this thread. All of us are has beens, or more than likely, a never was. If anybody gets flustered by what WE say, then they have bigger problems in life. We all come here to talk anything Iowa wrestling and share our opinions.
As for doing anything in life, It takes a lot to be great and famous. Your loved or hated no matter what. You'll be judged in a positive or negative light, justly or wrongly, by the common people. Its been that way for millenniums. Opinions didn't just miraculously show up with this board. To say this board has any influence on recruits or players is hogwash. The poster who says that is full of it . The recruit who believes it and gets influenced by this place is weak minded. REMEBER THIS IS ALL OPINION! ALL OF IT!
Statistically Iowa Wrestling is the BEST PROGRAM IN THE BIG 10, BAR NONE...Embrace it or shy away.
Parity is just an excuse....and IN MY OPiNION there's less and less parity in every college sport "except wrestling"....BS
Posted from Rivals Mobile
As for doing anything in life, It takes a lot to be great and famous. Your loved or hated no matter what. You'll be judged in a positive or negative light, justly or wrongly, by the common people. Its been that way for millenniums. Opinions didn't just miraculously show up with this board. To say this board has any influence on recruits or players is hogwash. The poster who says that is full of it . The recruit who believes it and gets influenced by this place is weak minded. REMEBER THIS IS ALL OPINION! ALL OF IT!
Statistically Iowa Wrestling is the BEST PROGRAM IN THE BIG 10, BAR NONE...Embrace it or shy away.
Parity is just an excuse....and IN MY OPiNION there's less and less parity in every college sport "except wrestling"....BS
Posted from Rivals Mobile
While I agree to a point about not being affected by a message board or poster think of it in a bigger concept. If u were around a negative situation all the time, would it not affect you? It's almost like being around negative family members. It just weighs on you after a while. Some can handle it and block it out and others can't.
Go check out the Minnesota Board right now, just for one. IF Missouri has one, check that out too. Then go ahead and branch out and check out a couple others. Then get back to me.
In the order of reasons why Little Johnny or Little Jane would or would not attend University XYZ, I PRAY the parents are smart enough to put message board banter near the bottom of the list right next to spot-a-pot cleanliness or available dog-walkers.
Sounds to me like the best thing we could do for recruits is just shut this site down, then watch them flock in.................
I made a post earlier but it didn't go thru. Yes I'm on vacation but I've visted this place constantly
Posted from Rivals Mobile
Posted from Rivals Mobile
Stupid phone....
Gobblin, I love everything you add to this board but your wrong on this issue. If wrestlers or parents or whoever can't take the pressure of us has beens or nobody's giving OPINIONS then gtfo.
We all love Iowa wrestling and want to see them dominate. Parity's just an excuse and honestly it's becoming rare in every sport...."except for wrestling"
Posted from Rivals Mobile
Gobblin, I love everything you add to this board but your wrong on this issue. If wrestlers or parents or whoever can't take the pressure of us has beens or nobody's giving OPINIONS then gtfo.
We all love Iowa wrestling and want to see them dominate. Parity's just an excuse and honestly it's becoming rare in every sport...."except for wrestling"
Posted from Rivals Mobile
Seriously?
The landscape of college wrestling has completely changed over the last 20 years or so, thanks in large part to all of the fantastic coaches Gable has spread around the country. Call it whatever you want, but "parity" is a pretty good descriptor, as wrestlers nationwide are now getting a quality of preparation and training that used to be pretty unique to Iowa. The skill and conditioning levels are higher nationwide than ever before. More programs are entering the national title conversation than ever before. This stuff is obvious reality -- not an excuse.
I doubt many recruits use message boards as a primary factor in their decision, but if I were a parent of a highly coveted recruit, I'd sure as heck be checking out what the fans are saying online about their program to get a better understanding of the program, itself, if nothing else. If I saw a bunch of hypercritical knuckleheads dominating the conversation on a given board, it would reflect negatively on that program, whether those fans were representative of the fan base at large or not.
I think fans are too quick to dismiss concerns about talk on message boards by responding with stuff like, "If they can't take the heat, they have no business wrestling at Iowa." Frankly, I think this is a cop-out by the fans. There may be some truth in that sentiment, but you're kidding yourself if you think recruits and parents ignore message boards. It's an Internet age we live in, folks -- people look online for just about EVERYTHING. Why would we expect wrestling talk to be any different? And you're kidding yourself if you don't believe a negative tone on a message board could negatively affect a kid's recruitment. I'm not saying it always does or that it should, but it's foolish to just dismiss the possibility. I think some fans just use that argument to give themselves license to say whatever stupid and over-the-top criticisms about wrestlers and coaches they choose to put out there. If all of us imagined ourselves speaking directly to whoever is the subject of our post, we'd all be better off, and recruits and their families would have a more favorable impression of Iowa fans. I don't see any possible downside to that solution. Shoot -- that's what we should all be doing whether recruits and their families paid attention to this board or not.
This post was edited on 3/22 9:30 AM by WWDMHawkeye
The landscape of college wrestling has completely changed over the last 20 years or so, thanks in large part to all of the fantastic coaches Gable has spread around the country. Call it whatever you want, but "parity" is a pretty good descriptor, as wrestlers nationwide are now getting a quality of preparation and training that used to be pretty unique to Iowa. The skill and conditioning levels are higher nationwide than ever before. More programs are entering the national title conversation than ever before. This stuff is obvious reality -- not an excuse.
I doubt many recruits use message boards as a primary factor in their decision, but if I were a parent of a highly coveted recruit, I'd sure as heck be checking out what the fans are saying online about their program to get a better understanding of the program, itself, if nothing else. If I saw a bunch of hypercritical knuckleheads dominating the conversation on a given board, it would reflect negatively on that program, whether those fans were representative of the fan base at large or not.
I think fans are too quick to dismiss concerns about talk on message boards by responding with stuff like, "If they can't take the heat, they have no business wrestling at Iowa." Frankly, I think this is a cop-out by the fans. There may be some truth in that sentiment, but you're kidding yourself if you think recruits and parents ignore message boards. It's an Internet age we live in, folks -- people look online for just about EVERYTHING. Why would we expect wrestling talk to be any different? And you're kidding yourself if you don't believe a negative tone on a message board could negatively affect a kid's recruitment. I'm not saying it always does or that it should, but it's foolish to just dismiss the possibility. I think some fans just use that argument to give themselves license to say whatever stupid and over-the-top criticisms about wrestlers and coaches they choose to put out there. If all of us imagined ourselves speaking directly to whoever is the subject of our post, we'd all be better off, and recruits and their families would have a more favorable impression of Iowa fans. I don't see any possible downside to that solution. Shoot -- that's what we should all be doing whether recruits and their families paid attention to this board or not.
This post was edited on 3/22 9:30 AM by WWDMHawkeye
(WDM, sorry for long post, and I agree with you for the most part FWIW, but you can't control what millions of people from all walks of like and intelligence levels say or do, you just can't, it's not realistic in the least. There is no eligibility form. You just deal with it, like everything else - of course you can "filter" what you say, and make it less "hurtful" to people, while still getting the point across, which I agree is good, but realistic? Not a chance.)
WDM, you know that I love your stuff here, you're as level headed as they come and have a long history as a Hawk Wrestling Fan (and I typically like what Gobblin brings as well, but he raised my ire thinking he was attacking me and stupid threads like this one are extended because of it - so I apologize to everyone for my part in having to sort thru that crap, including Gobblin). But, I think we are giving people far too little credit for having some common sense. For me it's that simple.
Of course anyone on the planet can visit this site, or any other. And unless they have some interest in wrestling, they'd have little reason to be here. So it stands to reason recruits, parents and current wrestlers or Coaches COULD drop by here at any time. I would hope they are not naive enough to think that every little thing is going to be puppies and rainbows. Real Life doesn't work that way, it never has and never will. I think we are doing a disservice to many of these fine folks by insinuating they aren't smart enough to sort thru the crap that inevitably will happen when groups of strangers from all walks of life exchange in banter relative to sports. Death, taxes, and petty arguments and stupid people on internet message boards are 100% guaranteed when you wake up in the morning (and yes I include myself in that group, from my "high horse" and all).
The only difference between this place and your local watering hole is it's in writing. This stuff has been going on since sports were invented.
And contrary to what Gobblin may believe, I have indeed been around many of the "greats" of this sport, many, many times over the years in all kinds of settings. It is what it is, doesn't make me "special" in the least, just happened because of peope I've known all my life. I am here to tell you with 100% certainty, they discuss this stuff just like us "mere mortals" do. They are after all just people, there is no God status, they just happened to be better at wrestling than most. They have earned my respect in that regard, but they are far less important than your Doctor is in the real world. And they know good or bad wrestling when they see it, and will comment on it just like every Tom, Dick and Harry. It absolutely works that way, and if you need more evidence of that, Jim Gibbons would tell you "No Shit".............
I would add that "those people" (Coaches, parents and/or recruits), are no different than you and I or anyone else on the planet. They're just people. And if they and their offspring are involved in wrestling, there's a good chance they are good, hard working people, with working brains that realize you separate and process the good from the bad, just like you would in every situation you encounter in real life.
This place has plenty of good information, from all kinds of people, and that's why it's frequented like no other. Inevitably people will disagree, and have differing opinion's on all things wrestling. There is nothing you or I or anyone can do to change that, IMO. And last but not least, it's the exact same thing everywhere you go, but more people come to this site than any other, I assume it's not always for the "train wrecks". There is frequently "good stuff" that happens here as well. I think people know that. Common sense isn't all that common, but it does exist.
I agree with just about everything you say there, sloe. My only disagreement is that there is something we can do -- all of us can think a little longer before we post and ask ourselves whether we'd feel comfortable stating our post verbally to the face of its subject. As I mentioned, I think this is something we should all be doing, whether this board has any effect on recruits, their parents, current Hawkeyes, etc.
No doubt that recruits and their families deserve the assumption that they're smart enough to sort the quality information from the nonsense. However, assuming that they're perfectly capable of mentally "separating the wheat from the chaff", that fact shouldn't keep each of us from doing our part to make this board the most hospitable place it can be.
Not for a second do I believe that we could or should be able to control what everyone says on this board -- I'm just suggesting that it would be a better place if each of us assumed some responsibility for keeping it that way.
No doubt that recruits and their families deserve the assumption that they're smart enough to sort the quality information from the nonsense. However, assuming that they're perfectly capable of mentally "separating the wheat from the chaff", that fact shouldn't keep each of us from doing our part to make this board the most hospitable place it can be.
Not for a second do I believe that we could or should be able to control what everyone says on this board -- I'm just suggesting that it would be a better place if each of us assumed some responsibility for keeping it that way.
