KJ pulls Mantanona's scholarship

[Jay on HR]

The hits keep coming tonight. Sadly we will probably never see Mantanona wrestle for Grandview now.

https://iawrestle.com/2016/10/04/iowa-state-and-anthony-mantanona-parting-ways/

 

[DayHawk18]

I'd go after him if I were Tom and Terry. That kid would be a monster here after a redshirt year

 

[Omahahawk86]

I'd go after him if I were Tom and Terry. That kid would be a monster here after a redshirt year

He's already committed elsewhere.

 

[NYWRESTLER94]

He's already committed elsewhere.

where is that?

 

[TarpHawk]

where is that?

Using my detective skills, one possible clue is Oklahoma.

 

[DayHawk18]

Or he just went on a visit there? It'd be a good get for Roselli but I think he's the kind of kid that would excel with Tom and Terry coaching him. Harness his freak athleticism/power and turn him into the next IMar.

 

[NYWRESTLER94]

Using my detective skills, one possible clue is Oklahoma.

Taking a visit isn't committing though

 

[goiahawkeyes]

I'm torn on this one. Is it "typical" to tell a recruit that if he takes any more visits the offer is being pulled? That seems a little crazy to me. I don't blame Mantanona one bit for taking his visits.

 

[DonHawkeye]

I have heard other coaches use that tactic. Seems like a used car salesmany, but I am sure it works a lot. Also if you are coach wanting to know if the kid is in or out so you can focus on recruiting someone else it make some sense.

 

[goiahawkeyes]

I have heard other coaches use that tactic. Seems like a used car salesmany, but I am sure it works a lot. Also if you are coach wanting to know if the kid is in or out so you can focus on recruiting someone else it make some sense.

I agree, If I'm a coach it'd be a great to be able to say. But if I'm a parent/wrestler...I'd be a little hesitant to commit if I still wanted to take my visits. The more I think this through I switch the "blame" from KJ to Mantanona. Why commit after KJ says that and you know you still want to take a visit?

 

[wasdt21]

its kind of what mark hall was talking about, but not really, more like a free agent trying to play one team off of another best offer wins. I do not blame either side for using their rights. kj kinda screwed him now okie can lower their offer.

 

[Sandor45]

Recruiting has to be the most frustrating part of any college coaching, except for Kale.
You're trying to get impressionable teenagers to commit four or five years of their life to your school with dozens of other coaches competing for the same kid.
It has to be somewhat demeaning for an Olympic Gold medalist like KJ to have to constantly compete for these high school kid's attention. Recruiting isn't even about being a good coach, it's about salesmanship and what accomplishments the coaching staff has had.

 

[HawkTalk3]

I'm torn on this one. Is it "typical" to tell a recruit that if he takes any more visits the offer is being pulled? That seems a little crazy to me. I don't blame Mantanona one bit for taking his visits.

Iowa football uses a similar tactic
http://www.thegazette.com/subject/s...ommitted-to-us-were-committed-to-you-20160808

"In the past, Iowa has pulled a few scholarship offers from players (probably less than a handful) who surprised it with visits to other schools. It’s a sticky situation and everything is on a case-by-case basis, but the Iowa staff seems to have drawn a clear line."

Iowa sends a letter to athletes who commit..

"What’s No. 1 on the list?

“You must not visit another institution.” The next paragraph begins, “At this time, you should contact any other schools recruiting you to notify them of your decision to become a HAWKEYE.”

That begs the question, is that as serious as it sounds? Iowa recruiting coordinator Kelvin Bell says most definitely yes. The question was posed to him, how hard can you stay to that?

“Extremely ... extremely ...,” said Bell, a former Iowa D-lineman who also assists on the defensive line. “Once you’ve committed to us, we’re committed to you. We’re not going to go out looking at other kids at your position, so we don’t expect you to go out and look at other schools.” "

 

[goiahawkeyes]

Iowa football uses a similar tactic
http://www.thegazette.com/subject/s...ommitted-to-us-were-committed-to-you-20160808

"In the past, Iowa has pulled a few scholarship offers from players (probably less than a handful) who surprised it with visits to other schools. It’s a sticky situation and everything is on a case-by-case basis, but the Iowa staff seems to have drawn a clear line."

Iowa sends a letter to athletes who commit..

"What’s No. 1 on the list?

“You must not visit another institution.” The next paragraph begins, “At this time, you should contact any other schools recruiting you to notify them of your decision to become a HAWKEYE.”

That begs the question, is that as serious as it sounds? Iowa recruiting coordinator Kelvin Bell says most definitely yes. The question was posed to him, how hard can you stay to that?

“Extremely ... extremely ...,” said Bell, a former Iowa D-lineman who also assists on the defensive line. “Once you’ve committed to us, we’re committed to you. We’re not going to go out looking at other kids at your position, so we don’t expect you to go out and look at other schools.” "

Good work, Ross. Thank you!

My assumption was that it's a case-by-case basis, like in the article. That's what surprises me about the Mantanona situation. He's a stud that many schools are drooling over and recruiting hard. If there was an exception for the rule, then I'd assume he be the exception. Props to KJ for sticking to his guns on this one.

 

[SPOONER]

I agree, If I'm a coach it'd be a great to be able to say. But if I'm a parent/wrestler...I'd be a little hesitant to commit if I still wanted to take my visits. The more I think this through I switch the "blame" from KJ to Mantanona. Why commit after KJ says that and you know you still want to take a visit?

I don't care for KJ but I have no issue with him here. If it was understood that Mantanona's recruiting was over so the ISU staff could focus their recruiting efforts elsewhere, then he decides to take visits, the kid has to face those consequences.

 

[HawkTalk3]

Good work, Ross. Thank you!

My assumption was that it's a case-by-case basis, like in the article. That's what surprises me about the Mantanona situation. He's a stud that many schools are drooling over and recruiting hard. If there was an exception for the rule, then I'd assume he be the exception. Props to KJ for sticking to his guns on this one.

When they landed Mantanona they probably eased up on going after Wittlake, who is a wrestler ISU really likes. KJ wants his wrestlers to be ALL IN. While you are right Mantanona is someone a lot of college will be recruiting heavily, they don't want to fall out of the Wittlake sweepstakes so an ultimatum makes some sense in this instance.

 

[PapaBearSLIM]

Despite what announcements you make if you still want to visit other schools you are not really "committed"

 

[buf87]

If KJ has other guys interested and Mantanona is not committed, then I don't have a problem. I also think Mantanona & Coleman are both 174 pounders and staff wants one to be a 184 pounder. Lots of good potential 184 pounders in the junior class.

 

[Azchief32]

Maybe Montana was interested in Okie but didn't like the coaches and when Roselli got hired, it changed it for him.

 

[PapaBearSLIM]

In the comments section of the Flo article Mantanona states that he was told he could take his visits. If that's true and ISU reneged on an agreement then the parting of ways with ISU is probably best for the kid. ISU recruiting could suffer in the future if there is a perception of the staff not being trustworthy.

 

[MitchL]

In the comments section of the Flo article Mantanona states that he was told he could take his visits. If that's true and ISU reneged on an agreement then the parting of ways with ISU is probably best for the kid. ISU recruiting could suffer in the future if there is a perception of the staff not being trustworthy.

Doubt that is true and the ISU side will likely disagree with that story even if there is some truth to it.

No one will even remember this kids's recruitment after signing day. From what I've read, this is a very good high school wrestler, but he's not quite considered elite.

Otherwise, I agree with everything you said.

 

[DayHawk18]

In the comments section of the Flo article Mantanona states that he was told he could take his visits. If that's true and ISU reneged on an agreement then the parting of ways with ISU is probably best for the kid. ISU recruiting could suffer in the future if there is a perception of the staff not being trustworthy.

I would tend to agree with the kid here. He's making the biggest decision of his life and a coach is attempting to strong arm him? I would not recommend my kid or any kid go to a school like that.

 

[MSU158]

Pretty straightforward to me. Once you verbal, the commitment is both ways. If you decide to go on visits after the fact, why would the Head Coach be expected to happily say go ahead? In fact, why would you want the guy still? You think Gable would have kept any of his recruits if that happened? He wouldn't recruit guys that said their girlfriends were remotely as important as wrestling. No way he keeps a guy that later decides to go look somewhere else(not that many would want to look somewhere else back then).

In fact, I would think a HC would look desperate if he DIDN'T do what Jackson did!

 

[Omahahawk86]

If KJ has other guys interested and Mantanona is not committed, then I don't have a problem. I also think Mantanona & Coleman are both 174 pounders and staff wants one to be a 184 pounder. Lots of good potential 184 pounders in the junior class.

Coleman is 184.

 

[buf87]

In the comments section of the Flo article Mantanona states that he was told he could take his visits. If that's true and ISU reneged on an agreement then the parting of ways with ISU is probably best for the kid. ISU recruiting could suffer in the future if there is a perception of the staff not being trustworthy.

Then don't verbal until after the visits. There is only so much money to go around and Iowa State used up about all of its recruiting dollars for this year and kids are verballing. KJ can't keep recruiting if he has all the money committed.

 

[Former112]

After perusing his twitter account, this is probably a good decision for KJ.

 

[The Vak]

If KJ told the kid he could go on his visits, and then after he took those visits, he pulled his offer, that's a crappy look no matter how you want to spin that. "Commitment to the program, blah blah blah". These are 17-19 year old kids who are making a decision that will shape the rest of their life, and it's not like they're looking at a shot at a huge pay day like football players, or like they're getting full rides, like football players.

 

[NYWRESTLER94]

I doubt that story is true. Point blank if you're not sure on the school then don't commit I'd think that's pretty simple

 

[MSU158]

Yeah, I have a really hard time seeing a coach say, "Thanks for the verbal and feel free to visit other schools until formal signing day!" That is like saying to your fiance after she just said yes to your proposal, "Feel free to see other guys until we are officially married." Even if you are dumb enough to say it, you sure as hell don't mean it and would be a horse's ass to marry her if she did!

 

[The Vak]

I doubt that story is true. Point blank if you're not sure on the school then don't commit I'd think that's pretty simple

Well, which guy has more of a reason to lie in this situation? Manatona has already lost whatever it is he's losing, whereas KJ has his future recruiting to worry about. I'm more likely to doubt that a kid who has given his verbal would just randomly decided to take his visits without consulting with the coach who made the offer to him.

The more likely scenario, to me, is that KJ told him it was ok, and then after talking to other people decided it looked bad and just pulled the offer, or just decided on his own it looked bad.

 

[The Vak]

I doubt that story is true. Point blank if you're not sure on the school then don't commit I'd think that's pretty simple

Why?

 

[mike tognetti]

I have heard other coaches use that tactic. Seems like a used car salesmany, but I am sure it works a lot. Also if you are coach wanting to know if the kid is in or out so you can focus on recruiting someone else it make some sense.

As you can see, John Smith let Fix visit all those other colleges when he already decided to be a Cowboy. PSU or Sucker U still

(Cael look alike) holding a full ride for him until Nov. (all the good recruits gone by that time). All other schools who get a top recruit (that PSU is looking at) between now and Nov 15 please send thank you card to John Smith in care of OSU Wrestling.

 

[MSU158]

Well, which guy has more of a reason to lie in this situation? Manatona has already lost whatever it is he's losing, whereas KJ has his future recruiting to worry about. I'm more likely to doubt that a kid who has given his verbal would just randomly decided to take his visits without consulting with the coach who made the offer to him.

The more likely scenario, to me, is that KJ told him it was ok, and then after talking to other people decided it looked bad and just pulled the offer, or just decided on his own it looked bad.

The flipside to that is, who are you more likely to believe? A 17 year old who is obviously upset that the team he verballed to pulled his scholly or a Head Coach that has been around the block a few times?

 

[The Vak]

The flipside to that is, who are you more likely to believe? A 17 year old who is obviously upset that the team he verballed to pulled his scholly or a Head Coach that has been around the block a few times?

A logical person doesn't do that unless there is some reason to distrust a source. There is no reason to distrust Manatona other then the fact that, what, he's young?

A logical person who does not know either person involved, which almost none of us do, looks at the factual scenario and determines who has more reason to lie.

 

[MitchL]

Coleman is 184.

Careful, Buf talks to KJ a lot! He's an "insider". And a sunshine pumper among other things. I give him a ton of credit. To stick with a coach that has experienced such a massive wrestler turnover in his time at the helm is admirable.

 

[MSU158]

A logical person doesn't do that unless there is some reason to distrust a source. There is no reason to distrust Manatona other then the fact that, what, he's young?

A logical person who does not know either person involved, which almost none of us do, looks at the factual scenario and determines who has more reason to lie.

Seriously? A logical person wouldn't consider that a 17 year old(especially one that feels scorned) would be more likely to lie than a Head Coach with his entire career on the line? Also, I wasn't saying you should automatically distrust Manatona, but when you have him saying one thing and the Head Coach saying another, I don't see any reason TO trust him MORE than KJ. That was my point.

 

[The Vak]

Seriously? A logical person wouldn't consider that a 17 year old(especially one that feels scorned) would be more likely to lie than a Head Coach with his entire career on the line? Also, I wasn't saying you should automatically distrust Manatona, but when you have him saying one thing and the Head Coach saying another, I don't see any reason TO trust him MORE than KJ. That was my point.

The reason you trust Manatona more than KJ in this scenario is because the factual scenario shows it is much more advantageous and beneficial for KJ to lie then for Manatona.

 

[MitchL]

Geez, guys... we're talking about a kid that is/has been looking at two schools that haven't sniffed the top ten for a while. It's really not a big deal, imo. If you're a sought after recruit, it's nice to have options.

 

[MSU158]

The reason you trust Manatona more than KJ in this scenario is because the factual scenario shows it is much more advantageous and beneficial for KJ to lie then for Manatona.

Sorry, but the way I see the facts, nothing leads me to believe that KJ is more likely to lie than Manatona. But, I have always respected your opinion and actually agree with Mitch that this isn't really a topic that warrants a super heated debate. I wish Manatona the best and also hope it works out for KJ!

 

[buf87]

KJ & staff were done recruiting and were not trying to over recruit Mantanona. I think Mantanona did ask KJ and KJ said go ahead if you want, but your scholarship may be at risk. I see no fault in KJ pulling the scholarship money waiting on a kid that is waivering on his commitment just a few weeks ago.