Luka elbows

[youflog1hawk]

What is the man supposed to do? A guy has his knee up his @$$ and gets called for a foul. Will this be a pattern we will see from referees the rest of the way? If so is it a result of opposing coaches complaints.
He is the one that gets cut or nose bleed!

 

[UncannyNanny]

It happens every time Luka gets a mismatch with a smaller guard. Luka holds the ball in the high post and they put their head directly under the ball so he can’t come down with it without elbowing them.

 

[jonesy5960]

They need to start enforcing the cylinder rule. You're handicapping Garza by not allowing any movement whatsoever.

 

[silasstarr]

The first one was BS. The second one was really close and I can see why it was called. Luka extended his elbow a bit after the defender had taken a step back. It's a tough rule to enforce like the announcers mentioned.

 

[HeRKeYHoPeFuL]

What I don't understand is how they overturned a cylinder violation. If the guy was in Luka's cylinder... the foul occurred before Luka turned and caught him with the elbow.

I don't disagree with the end result, but the process to get to an offensive foul is a little confusing.

 

[LarryMullenJr.]

The first one was BS. The second one was really close and I can see why it was called. Luka extended his elbow a bit after the defender had taken a step back. It's a tough rule to enforce like the announcers mentioned.

yeah, the first one had a tiny amount of contact, and the Maryland guy realizes a second later that he got hit in the head and can benefit from it if he acts it up. Kudos to him, and that's honestly what he probably should do, but upon review it should be nothing and a flop warning.

Side note, but I like Robbie Hummel doing games....until he gets on a 5-minute tangent about his Russian facemask. But it was a 20+ point game at that point.

 

[HeRKeYHoPeFuL]

yeah, the first one had a tiny amount of contact, and the Maryland guy realizes a second later that he got hit in the head and can benefit from it if he acts it up. Kudos to him, and that's honestly what he probably should do, but upon review it should be nothing and a flop warning.

Side note, but I like Robbie Hummel doing games....until he gets on a 5-minute tangent about his Russian facemask. But it was a 20+ point game at that point.

To be fair, having played a decent number of pickup games and catching elbows myself... there is a delayed reaction to when the contact occurs and when the pain sensation causes you to flail/grab/fall.

Fran definitely needs to start chirping for the refs to be watching for cylinder violations though... it's crazy how much is let go prior to Luka turning, which is when it's a possibility to get offensive fouls.

 

[herkhatescy]

It happens every time Luka gets a mismatch with a smaller guard. Luka holds the ball in the high post and they put their head directly under the ball so he can’t come down with it without elbowing them.

Isn't that considered in cylinder?

 

[24 so far]

To be fair, having played a decent number of pickup games and catching elbows myself... there is a delayed reaction to when the contact occurs and when the pain sensation causes you to flail/grab/fall.

Fran definitely needs to start chirping for the refs to be watching for cylinder violations though... it's crazy how much is let go prior to Luka turning, which is when it's a possibility to get offensive fouls.

Your experience reminds me of a time "back in the day" when a guy in our pickup games who had a penchant for trying to cut underneath people to "steal a rebound", didn't time this particular attempt very well and I came straight down like a "normal" rebound and caught him in the eye with my elbow as he was cutting under me. He bled like a stuck hog, and was wearing white shorts and a mostly white shirt, both getting bloodier by the second! Played a few more possessions and eventually we had to tell him to get it taken care of because you're bleeding all over the court! (super nice guy, a local Doctor, could have stitched himself up courtside! Ha!).

 

[UncannyNanny]

Isn't that considered in cylinder?

Yes it is, one of those rules that exist but never get called.

 

[CAhawki]

i can live with the first call... as pathetic as it was. the second was a total joke. the call the cylinder rule, then go to the monitor. crap process all the way around.

 

[HawkRugged17]

Elbows ... down!

 

[SoonerBeAHawk]

Seems to me when an opposing player hits Luka's elbow with his face the foul should be on that player.

But seriously, I share the OP's concern of a few slimy coaches causing a stink and pretty soon Luka gets a bad rep that way. Otoh, Luka's got that national POY candidate thingy going (again) so that can cover a multitude of alleged sins in the eyes of the refs. Which is good.

 

[Bee93]

Seems to me when an opposing player hits Luka's elbow with his face the foul should be on that player.

But seriously, I share the OP's concern of a few slimy coaches causing a stink and pretty soon Luka gets a bad rep that way. Otoh, Luka's got that national POY candidate thingy going (again) so that can cover a multitude of alleged sins in the eyes of the refs. Which is good.

Agree with this. As Herkey pointed out above, it’s now on Fran to counter with informing refs of the cylinder rule prior to tipoff

 

[2432Hawk]

What is the man supposed to do? A guy has his knee up his @$$ and gets called for a foul. Will this be a pattern we will see from referees the rest of the way? If so is it a result of opposing coaches complaints.
He is the one that gets cut or nose bleed!

That's what they started doing toward the end of last year too.

Heck, I wouldn't be shocked to see a team put a guy out there with a face mask on and just get into his space like that. Luka keeps the ball high so his elbows are naturally right there.... but he's also very good at using them to create space.

Luka is gonna get the Rodney Dangerfield treatment from the Refs than we can kiss the BigTen title goodbye... pretty much seems they're already priming Michigan to be the Champion and conference darling.

 

[Ronman]

As I mentioned in another post, it seems as though Luka is the only big that isn't protected by the "cylinder violation" rule. They explained the second on Luka by saying there can't be a cylinder violation by a player behind you. Wha?!?

I think it's obvious that some B1G coaches are trying to somewhat negate Luka's effectiveness around the hoop by complaining to the refs before the games even start. McCaffery needs to counter this by complaining how Luka is being assaulted by double and triple teams that are initiating contact with him instead of allowing him to maneuver around the hoop.

 

[HerkyFan4Life]

At least he isn't poking people in the eyes when on defense!

 

[mooresville hawk]

Hopefully, the calls last night do not become a trend with the officials. I understand that the players cannot swing their elbows to clear out space. That being said, I have heard for years that a big guy needs to keep the ball up high and not bring it down so smaller players can steal it. How do you keep the ball high and your elbows in?

 

[Herky T Hawk]

How do you keep the ball high and your elbows in?

It is kind of like the Time Warp dance, but instead of your knees you bring in your elbows.

 

[ChuckBarkley]

The call on Luka was complete BS. Hopefully Fran sends video to league office. And the B10 discusses w/ officials. Those are two big IFs but it would be good to see happen.

 

[HoustonREDHawk]

Agree with the OP. Not much Luka can do, when he often has multiple guys violating his cylinder and one of them gets his face in front of his elbows. I am glad I don't have to officiate guys guarding Luka. His ability to keep moving without losing his pivot foot and maintaining control of the ball with multiple defenders around him is pretty incredible to watch.

 

[goodbyebobby]

yeah, the first one had a tiny amount of contact, and the Maryland guy realizes a second later that he got hit in the head and can benefit from it if he acts it up. Kudos to him, and that's honestly what he probably should do, but upon review it should be nothing and a flop warning.

Side note, but I like Robbie Hummel doing games....until he gets on a 5-minute tangent about his Russian facemask. But it was a 20+ point game at that point.

Hummel is fantastic. Knows his stuff, personable, and funny.

 

[iahawks10]

What I don't understand is how they overturned a cylinder violation. If the guy was in Luka's cylinder... the foul occurred before Luka turned and caught him with the elbow.

I don't disagree with the end result, but the process to get to an offensive foul is a little confusing.

I have no idea how they can officiate the game using the monitor. I don’t believe I’ve ever seen that before (the call reversal). Complete BS, but there were multiple calls last night that left you scratching your head. The three fouls on Luka were all terrible calls. Two travels on Toussaint were garbage calls as well.

How does a crew overturn the second review on Garza? The ref signals cylinder as he makes the original call live. There were two players clearly in Garza’s cylinder. The primary defender clearly fouls Garza before Garza received the ball and while he had possession, with a knee between Garza’s legs. How was that not called on review? None of this makes sense on how the conclusion was made after the review. Thankfully this wasn’t a close game, because the officials had a terrible night, even for them.

The first one was a flop with terrible acting, even for an athlete. I believe he may have connected with the elbow to the Maryland players face, but nowhere near to the extent of the delayed players reaction. So bad.

 

[OutbackBowl2017]

Total bs on the call with Luka turning and not even touching the Maryland player in the face. Add in the official calling it from behind without a clear view of the non contact to the face. Clear flop and that has to be called as such. This isn’t soccer. No blood, no foul.

The other one where the guys were in his space/cylinder, needs to be called as such. You can’t body up or underneath a guy and expect no contact or a guy not to go down or fall on someone in his space. It has to be a foul on the encroacher of said space to prevent them from continually doing it.

 

[RomanHawk]

yeah, the first one had a tiny amount of contact, and the Maryland guy realizes a second later that he got hit in the head and can benefit from it if he acts it up. Kudos to him, and that's honestly what he probably should do, but upon review it should be nothing and a flop warning.

Side note, but I like Robbie Hummel doing games....until he gets on a 5-minute tangent about his Russian facemask. But it was a 20+ point game at that point.

I said at the time that it should have been called a flop. Does a flop foul have to be preceded by a warning or can it be called outright?

 

[amahawk]

I was wondering about the "cylinder Rule"? Isn't Luka entitled to his own space?

 

[HawkRugged17]

 

[Hawksfor3]

Will this be a pattern we will see from referees the rest of the way?

No, but only from a "select" few.

 

[Hawksfor3]

At least he isn't poking people in the eyes when on defense!

I wonder if any G-Leaguers have been blessed by Woody.