More on Recruiting

[Eternal Return]

2 star players from last year who made significant contributions to Iowa's success:

P. Hesse
J. Jackson
B. Niemann
D. Kidd
J. Jewell
A. Wadley
J. Canzeri
M. VandeBerg
N. Meier

Just saying' ...

 

[millhawk]

2 star players from last year who made significant contributions to Iowa's success:

P. Hesse
J. Jackson
B. Niemann
D. Kidd
J. Jewell
A. Wadley
J. Canzeri
M. VandeBerg
N. Meier

Just saying' ...[/QU

Evaluation is kind of important along with a good work ethic, ya think? Honestly, I thought Hesse, Jackson, Canzeri were underrated. I'm sure Wadley was a 2 because of his size but his vids were really, really good. I'd hate to think about our wr corp without MVB. All are great success stories.

 

[millhawk]

Evaluation along with a good work ethic is important, ya think? Hesse, Jackson, Canzeri were underrated by rivals in my book. Wadley had great vids but was so small. I'd hate to think of our wr corp without MVB. All great success stories and tough hard nosed football players. Offering Jewell was a stroke of genius by the coaches, especially Reese.

 

[pocha444444]

Start recruiting only two stars?

 

[Hawks_Rock_12]

2 star players from last year who made significant contributions to Iowa's success:

P. Hesse
J. Jackson
B. Niemann
D. Kidd
J. Jewell
A. Wadley
J. Canzeri
M. VandeBerg
N. Meier

Just saying' ...

When the majority of the roster is made up of 2/3 star players it stands to reason that 2 star players will be playing.

 

[cmhawks99]

When the majority of the roster is made up of 2/3 star players it stands to reason that 2 star players will be playing.

That is true but doesn't really get to the heart of the matter either. An Iowa 2-star isn't a "typical" 2-star. Nor is a Wisconsin 2-star for that matter. The Truth as I see it is in the "evaluation" not in the development. That's not to say there isn't some developing, but more often than not these kids are hitting the field by at latest year 3 often times sooner. If they were hitting it at year 4 or 5 you'd say yeah Iowa "developed" that kid, but the more Truthful answer is the kid was under-rated and over looked. Our TRUE talent is seeing the "talent" as redundant as that sounds.

IMO a great Iowa class would have mostly three star athletes with 2-5 2-star and 2-5 4s...I think that is realistic and repeatable.

10, 2s are to many, of that i wager we agree...but if you think we will consistently sign 4 or 5 or 8, 4s you are tricking yourselves.

As for the twos we have years were most of them turn into great players and we have years were very few of them do...

I still contend if it weren't for that 2008 and 2009 class that performed so badly we wouldn't have had the angst that we've had the last couple years.

I'm just hoping for great leadership that's my concern.

 

[birdman1973]

When the majority of the roster is made up of 2/3 star players it stands to reason that 2 star players will be playing.

What counts is the coaching staff identifies good players who fit Iowa's football needs and they agree to come to Iowa to play ball, not how many stars Rivals assigns to them. A 4 star player might become a great player on one team and not match up at all with another teams style or needs at all or get stuck behind a 3 year starter and not get to play much.

 

[iowalaw]

This is a very silly thread. You do realize that something like 79 of our 85 scholarship players are 2** and 3***, and all 20+ of our walkons are 2** or not rated?

Thus, 100 of the 106 guys on the team are 3*** or lower rated guys. I would hope that many of them would be solid contributors. If they weren't, we would only have 6 guys playing on the entire team.

Let me reverse it for you. 100% of the 4**** on the Iowa roster are major contributors. They include:

Jaleel Johnson (multi year starter)
Faith Ekakitie (starter/2nd team)
Jay Scheel (co starter as a soph)
James Daniels (starter as a soph; will be a 4 yr starter)
Tyler Wiegers (2nd team QB as a soph)
Ryan Ward (2nd team)

So unwittingly, the OP is arguing that stars do matter, and we need to get more 4 stars on the roster. I tend to agree with him.

 

[IowaNiceHawk]

2 star players from last year who made significant contributions to Iowa's success:

P. Hesse
J. Jackson
B. Niemann
D. Kidd
J. Jewell
A. Wadley
J. Canzeri
M. VandeBerg
N. Meier

Just saying' ...

I think your list is missing George Kittle, who is now ranked as the # 1 Tight End in that country, thanks to the HAWKEYE Coaches !!

 

[TKingpin]

Not to mention the "walk-ons" who probably aren't even 2 stars: Boone Myers, Cole Croston and Snyder.

 

[Freyvet]

This is a very silly thread. You do realize that something like 79 of our 85 scholarship players are 2** and 3***, and all 20+ of our walkons are 2** or not rated?

Thus, 100 of the 106 guys on the team are 3*** or lower rated guys. I would hope that many of them would be solid contributors. If they weren't, we would only have 6 guys playing on the entire team.

Let me reverse it for you. 100% of the 4**** on the Iowa roster are major contributors. They include:

Jaleel Johnson (multi year starter)
Faith Ekakitie (starter/2nd team)
Jay Scheel (co starter as a soph)
James Daniels (starter as a soph; will be a 4 yr starter)
Tyler Wiegers (2nd team QB as a soph)
Ryan Ward (2nd team)

So unwittingly, the OP is arguing that stars do matter, and we need to get more 4 stars on the roster. I tend to agree with him.

You are an idiot! And I didn't even read you post but have seen enough of you in the past to surmise I need never read a post of yours!

 

[NevadaHawk]

Start recruiting only two stars?

If they can be coached up to play like 4*s, yes.

 

[ghostOfHomer777]

Let's be REALLY, REALLY honest here. How many stars does Oliver Martin get if he didn't attend all those camps?

Now ask yourself, how many guys are there out there who have a very high level of (raw) talent but, for whatever reason, do not have the time or money to go to all those camps and/or get all the extra specialty training that refines their technique?

 

[EZ2BJZ]

I think in general recruiting rankings are a pretty fair indicator of overall talent, which is why teams like Ohio State and Alabama tend to be on top. Granted, they are not the end all be all of who's going to be good and who's not, but they are usually pretty accurate.

As someone pointed out, there are a myriad of reasons why some kids fly under the radar recruiting-wise. One of the reasons why I believe Ferentz has been so successful at Iowa is his ability to identify those kids who are not heavily recruited but have the raw talent and work ethic to turn into stars or significant contributors.

Four and five star players are great, and Iowa should definitely throw their hat in the ring for them--they've had a few of them commit over the years after all--but just because a kid has four/five star status in high school doesn't mean they are going to be stars in college. As I pointed out in another thread, the three 5-star players Iowa did land never even saw the field. And a large number of 4-star players Iowa has gotten have either been busts, flunked out, or got booted for legal issues.

I will take Bob Sanders, Robert Gallery, Dallas Clark, Ricky Stanzi, Desmond King, CJ Beathard, and so many more every day of the week.

 

[iahawkeyes17]

This is a very silly thread. You do realize that something like 79 of our 85 scholarship players are 2** and 3***, and all 20+ of our walkons are 2** or not rated?

Thus, 100 of the 106 guys on the team are 3*** or lower rated guys. I would hope that many of them would be solid contributors. If they weren't, we would only have 6 guys playing on the entire team.

Let me reverse it for you. 100% of the 4**** on the Iowa roster are major contributors. They include:

Jaleel Johnson (multi year starter)
Faith Ekakitie (starter/2nd team)
Jay Scheel (co starter as a soph)
James Daniels (starter as a soph; will be a 4 yr starter)
Tyler Wiegers (2nd team QB as a soph)
Ryan Ward (2nd team)

So unwittingly, the OP is arguing that stars do matter, and we need to get more 4 stars on the roster. I tend to agree with him.

Ryan ward is not as you call it "a major contributor". He has barely played since he's gotten here. Same with wiegers as the back up though next year be a different story for him.

 

[HoustonHawkeye]

And James Daniels stepped in to a starting position, especially on the OL which is against the norm, as a 4 star recruit. How many 2 star OL can do that?

 

[MepoDawg#]

Ryan ward is not as you call it "a major contributor". He has barely played since he's gotten here. Same with wiegers as the back up though next year be a different story for him.

And Scheel wasn't a major contributor last year either.

 

[SDHawkDoc]

Iowa does more than many teams with lesser rated talent.
I'm not understanding what the OP is trying to get at, though.
If the bulk of your players are 2 and 3 star guys then it stands to reason that 2 and 3 star guys are who will be seeing the field.

 

[scotthawk1964]

Scheel's only real contribution has come with the rehab team.

 

[SWIowahawks]

I took the Op meaning they contributed to Iowa's first 12-0 team ever. It is pretty astounding that all these guys that no one wanted, helped form an undefeated regular season team.

I think you guys pointing out how few 4star guys Iowa has, are helping make the OPs point. Or I could be off and that's not what the OP meant.

 

[RogerKint]

This is a very silly thread. You do realize that something like 79 of our 85 scholarship players are 2** and 3***, and all 20+ of our walkons are 2** or not rated?

Thus, 100 of the 106 guys on the team are 3*** or lower rated guys. I would hope that many of them would be solid contributors. If they weren't, we would only have 6 guys playing on the entire team.

Let me reverse it for you. 100% of the 4**** on the Iowa roster are major contributors. They include:

Jaleel Johnson (multi year starter)
Faith Ekakitie (starter/2nd team)
Jay Scheel (co starter as a soph)
James Daniels (starter as a soph; will be a 4 yr starter)
Tyler Wiegers (2nd team QB as a soph)
Ryan Ward (2nd team)

So unwittingly, the OP is arguing that stars do matter, and we need to get more 4 stars on the roster. I tend to agree with him.

Dear Moron,
Johnson.....Major Contributor
Daniels......Major Contributor
Ekakitie.....Good player, but plays behind 3* Bazata, or gives Johnson a rest
Scheel.......Has not even seen the field yet!!!
Wiegers....Plays only if 3* ahead of him gets hurt, or in mop up
Ward.........Good player, but cannot find him on any depth chart.
iowalaw.....A jizz rag waiting to be used.

 

[cmhawks99]

This is a very silly thread. You do realize that something like 79 of our 85 scholarship players are 2** and 3***, and all 20+ of our walkons are 2** or not rated?

Thus, 100 of the 106 guys on the team are 3*** or lower rated guys. I would hope that many of them would be solid contributors. If they weren't, we would only have 6 guys playing on the entire team.

Let me reverse it for you. 100% of the 4**** on the Iowa roster are major contributors. They include:

Jaleel Johnson (multi year starter)
Faith Ekakitie (starter/2nd team)
Jay Scheel (co starter as a soph)
James Daniels (starter as a soph; will be a 4 yr starter)
Tyler Wiegers (2nd team QB as a soph)
Ryan Ward (2nd team)

So unwittingly, the OP is arguing that stars do matter, and we need to get more 4 stars on the roster. I tend to agree with him.

Even for an instigator like you this is a big swing and miss...

1st the same thing was said above...

2nd Iowa 2-stars go on to the NFL at an alarming rate and their was an article on it a few years ago.

3rd, all of those 4 stars have had an opurtunity to beat out the 2 & 3 stars ahead of them and could not, I'd head back to the drawing board if I were you...

Anything else...

 

[Freyvet]

Dear Moron,
Johnson.....Major Contributor
Daniels......Major Contributor
Ekakitie.....Good player, but plays behind 3* Bazata, or gives Johnson a rest
Scheel.......Has not even seen the field yet!!!
Wiegers....Plays only if 3* ahead of him gets hurt, or in mop up
Ward.........Good player, but cannot find him on any depth chart.
iowalaw.....A jizz rag waiting to be used.

I like this one!

 

[SLarew]

This is a very silly thread. You do realize that something like 79 of our 85 scholarship players are 2** and 3***, and all 20+ of our walkons are 2** or not rated?

Thus, 100 of the 106 guys on the team are 3*** or lower rated guys. I would hope that many of them would be solid contributors. If they weren't, we would only have 6 guys playing on the entire team.

Let me reverse it for you. 100% of the 4**** on the Iowa roster are major contributors. They include:

Jaleel Johnson (multi year starter)
Faith Ekakitie (starter/2nd team)
Jay Scheel (co starter as a soph)
James Daniels (starter as a soph; will be a 4 yr starter)
Tyler Wiegers (2nd team QB as a soph)
Ryan Ward (2nd team)

So unwittingly, the OP is arguing that stars do matter, and we need to get more 4 stars on the roster. I tend to agree with him.

If you thin Ryan Ward has made major contributions then you either need to pay attention during games, if you actually watch, or start watching them sober

 

[InsaneHawkJJP]

Stars mean nothing to these coaches... I think it's pretty obvious...hard work beats talent when talent doesn't work! When the higher rated kids come in assuming the starting job is a given, they more often than not lose it. I'm not saying don't recruit the higher rated guys, it's all about the work ethic.

 

[ZaHawks]

2 star players from last year who made significant contributions to Iowa's success:

P. Hesse
J. Jackson
B. Niemann
D. Kidd
J. Jewell
A. Wadley
J. Canzeri
M. VandeBerg
N. Meier

Just saying' ...

This is the dumbest thread ever! If you only recruited 1 star players, all of your solid contributors would be 1 star players. Just saying' ... lol

 

[unoHawkeye]

Don't care how Ferentz recruits as long as we've consistently got a shot at winning the west/conference.

That said, the same people saying that stars don't matter are the same ones who drool over the likes of Calloway, Benjamin, and Epenesa and predict greatness for our '17 class. Everybody here believes that stars matter whether they want to admit it or not. If they didn't, they would hold every class to the exact same expectation and would not get more excited for some recruits than others. If you got more excited when Calloway committed than when Harrell committed, you believe that the star system holds weight. If you got more excited when Eno committed than when Kelly-Martin committed, you believe that the star system holds weight. Hell, if you got more excited when A.J. Epenesa committed than when Coy Kirkpatrick committed, you believe that the star system holds weight.

I'm sure there will be a couple "holier than thou" posters who try to argue that they are equally excited for every recruit Iowa gets and that they hold the same expectations for the 2017 class as they did when the 2014 class signed. I'm not buying it. Are stars everything? Of course not. People can fly under the radar, some can be overrated, and some maybe just don't have the attitude to compete at the next level, which wouldn't be reflected in stars. However, those who attempt to discredit stars altogether are silly.

 

[Suterman]

With a great coaching staff with an eye for the right kind of player (Iowa), better talent will equal better results. Talent matters all day.

 

[terrehawk]

Iowa law used the word "unwittingly " heh heh heh heh. In my best bevis and butt head voice

 

[sijoint]

If they can be coached up to play like 4*s, yes.

And don't forget...Doylization can add at least one star to each athlete.

 

[cmhawks99]

Don't care how Ferentz recruits as long as we've consistently got a shot at winning the west/conference.

That said, the same people saying that stars don't matter are the same ones who drool over the likes of Calloway, Benjamin, and Epenesa and predict greatness for our '17 class. Everybody here believes that stars matter whether they want to admit it or not. If they didn't, they would hold every class to the exact same expectation and would not get more excited for some recruits than others. If you got more excited when Calloway committed than when Harrell committed, you believe that the star system holds weight. If you got more excited when Eno committed than when Kelly-Martin committed, you believe that the star system holds weight. Hell, if you got more excited when A.J. Epenesa committed than when Coy Kirkpatrick committed, you believe that the star system holds weight.

Well I have to tell you I love Kelly-Martin....and I'm not overly concerned he will decommit so ...yeah I guess I am just as happy with him...

I honestly don't "get" the rankings so its hard for me to take them too seriously. Yes I get the best of the best teams have good rankings on a regular basis. But I also get that routinely EVERY year there are still Texas, USC, Miami, FSU in past years, Michigan, ND, Tenn, etc, etc, etc....that always, Let that sink in..."ALWAYS" sign top 20 classes and yet they have horrendous stretches of futility, so its a lot more than recruiting rankings. And its not just coaching. Its fit, chemistry, effort and some good fortune as well.

Of the top 300 recruits every year only about half of them go on to star, that alone tells you they aren't terribly accurate. The key is stacking 5 on top of each other and that is NEVER going to be Iowa if you are expecting top "rated" classes. But if you open your eyes you might actually be aware they HAVE signed 5 straight really good classes. ....

QB play and chemistry and peer leadership, that will always be our key.

 

[Eternal Return]

Iowa does more than many teams with lesser rated talent.
I'm not understanding what the OP is trying to get at, though.
If the bulk of your players are 2 and 3 star guys then it stands to reason that 2 and 3 star guys are who will be seeing the field.

I wasn't trying to make any "political" point. I was mostly just curious about how many 2-star guys on Iowa's team were major contributors last year, looked it up, and decided to post the results of my search. As far as the notion about 2-star versus 3-star guys, Iowa recruits a heck of a lot more 3-star players than 2-star players year-in and year-out, but some years when they have five 2-stars they wind up with three of them contributing in significant ways (60 percent return on investment--pretty damn good for guys considered to be mostly MAC-level players coming out of HS). If I have any point at all it's that it's surprising that there's such a high percentage of the two-star players that signed with Iowa that actually turn out to be good players. It's a compliment to the players and the coaches, in other words.

Anyway, I think this is a great thread. I didn't foresee this type of discussion developing when I posted. Kudos to the great insights provided.

 

[Eternal Return]

2 star players from last year who made significant contributions to Iowa's success:

P. Hesse
J. Jackson
B. Niemann
D. Kidd
J. Jewell
A. Wadley
J. Canzeri
M. VandeBerg
N. Meier

Just saying' ...

This is the dumbest thread ever! If you only recruited 1 star players, all of your solid contributors would be 1 star players. Just saying' ... lol

Maybe for you -- apparently you haven't read many threads on this site. But what fascinated me when I looked up the recruiting rankings of the players from last year's team was that these guys were two-star players coming out of high school. I had no idea what they were ranked before looking. For example, I thought Jewell, Niemann, and VandeBerg were probably 4-star recruits. So, after discovering this (I realize you may have followed all of this each and every day for 1000s of days now, but I haven't), I thought it was worthwhile to share the information. I thought it was pretty cool that these guys exceeded expectations and that the coaches have gotten so much out of them.

But it's clear you're a weak hermeneutical thinker in the sense that you launch interpretations of others' intentions based on the projections of your prejudices. As soon as a mention of rankings comes up you assume it must mean x, y, or z, without ever considering that perhaps it's q, r, or t. If you consider yourself a learner rather than someone who remains stuck in a way of thinking, you can use this information in a manner that expands possibilities when making future analyses. If you're a flat-earther then reading what I've written has changed nothing about the way that you perceive textual information.