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MSU still a bad matchup without Valentine

Agree that Sparty gets away with aggressive play/fouls but at the same time they play great team defense, rebound on both ends of the court, and are extremely efficient towards the end of the game when the pressure is on.
Just wish the Hawks would be as aggressive for a full 40 minutes on defense and at the same time not choke during the last 5-10 minutes of the game against MSU. Recently it seems as if Sparty simply executes better down the stretch then what the Hawks do.
 
If MSU had a starting lineup of Groucho, Harpo, Chico, Zeppo, and Gummo, with Larry, Curly, and Moe the first off the bench, they'd still be a bad match-up for the Hawks. Throw Shemp into the mix and we've got no chance. They've got our number, big time.
Problem is that the three stooges always seem to be in striped shirts for the MSU games.
 
The B12 does not have small venues but keep trying to crawfish. Do you want to use Jud Heathcote or Bobby Knight to support your marquee coach comment as well? It is comical to watch your squirming because you used very little thought to try and belittle the B12 and ISU...... LOL!

Keep telling yourself that. You have come with nothing to disprove and the little data to support your position that has been accurate. That's typical so I get it.

I am happy to list out all of the B1G & Big 12 arena capacities and attendance. Here's a highlight of your small venues; ISU's capacity is # 4 in the Big 12 but would rank # 11 in the B1G. Ok State who is next at # 5 would be 12th only ahead of Rutgers and NW. So that goes on top of the B1G having to top 4 largest and 7 of the top 10 venues in terms of capacity. In terms of attendance, the B1G has 8 of the top 25, the Big 12 2 of the top 25 with KSU almost in, if you want to take 3 of 25 go ahead it's the season of giving. After that you have to go into the mid 30's to find another Big 12 team.

Hey if you want to bring in old national title winning B1G coaches go right ahead. It just goes to show more B1G final fours, championship game apearences and NCAA titles. All of which disprove your credibility to give sound advice on how to beat these league opponents historically.

We got here based on your sound advice on beating Izzo. The same Izzo that has already beat Kansas this year, who I respect and has a marquee coach in Self and beat your nomination as a marquee coach in Krueger who is a very good coach just not marquee in last year's tourney on his way to a final four. I also recall Izzo beating a great ISU team in the final 8 a few years back - do you? I think your coach got up into the officials that day so how did that work out?

You can take the last word but that really highlights the insignificance of your advice on beating Izzo.
 
Quit making excuses before the game is played. The guards will dictate who wins this game. Iowa has the advantage with DV out, and if MG can push and kick effectively. Uthoff will be a focus of every opposing defence the rest of the year so the other players have to step up. Hawks win by 3 over Sparty in Carver.

This post is obviously based on ignorance of the history of these games. .....if past games were called even remotely close to legit we wouldn't be having this discussion. ......
 
This post is obviously based on ignorance of the history of these games. .....if past games were called even remotely close to legit we wouldn't be having this discussion. ......
I have watched many of the Sparty/Hawk match-up and agree that Sparty will try and play ugly. This is the reason FM has to be all over the zebras from tip-off so they know he won't stand for it. If he can also get the crowd involved in not allowing a mugging, the hawks have an opportunity. Believe it or not, the crowd can have an impact on how a game is called....... Hence Hilton magic.
 
Krueger over Ryan? LoL. That is a joke.

Ryan is a lock hall of fame and has done more than Bill Snyder at KSU has in comparison. He goes down as one of the best coaches in college basketball history. (And I hate Wisc)

Krueger? LOL. Make me laugh
 
I have watched many of the Sparty/Hawk match-up and agree that Sparty will try and play ugly. This is the reason FM has to be all over the zebras from tip-off so they know he won't stand for it. If he can also get the crowd involved in not allowing a mugging, the hawks have an opportunity. Believe it or not, the crowd can have an impact on how a game is called....... Hence Hilton magic.
You would be the first clown over here criticizing Frans behavior
 
Keep telling yourself that. You have come with nothing to disprove and the little data to support your position that has been accurate. That's typical so I get it.

I am happy to list out all of the B1G & Big 12 arena capacities and attendance. Here's a highlight of your small venues; ISU's capacity is # 4 in the Big 12 but would rank # 11 in the B1G. Ok State who is next at # 5 would be 12th only ahead of Rutgers and NW. So that goes on top of the B1G having to top 4 largest and 7 of the top 10 venues in terms of capacity. In terms of attendance, the B1G has 8 of the top 25, the Big 12 2 of the top 25 with KSU almost in, if you want to take 3 of 25 go ahead it's the season of giving. After that you have to go into the mid 30's to find another Big 12 team.

Hey if you want to bring in old national title winning B1G coaches go right ahead. It just goes to show more B1G final fours, championship game apearences and NCAA titles. All of which disprove your credibility to give sound advice on how to beat these league opponents historically.

We got here based on your sound advice on beating Izzo. The same Izzo that has already beat Kansas this year, who I respect and has a marquee coach in Self and beat your nomination as a marquee coach in Krueger who is a very good coach just not marquee in last year's tourney on his way to a final four. I also recall Izzo beating a great ISU team in the final 8 a few years back - do you? I think your coach got up into the officials that day so how did that work out?

You can take the last word but that really highlights the insignificance of your advice on beating Izzo.
You are arguing with a guy whose conference champion has been the same team for what, 12 years?

The Jayhawk conference is a one team league and has been for over a decade. It's laughable to watch ISU fans try to piggyback on KUs success.
 
I have watched many of the Sparty/Hawk match-up and agree that Sparty will try and play ugly. This is the reason FM has to be all over the zebras from tip-off so they know he won't stand for it. If he can also get the crowd involved in not allowing a mugging, the hawks have an opportunity. Believe it or not, the crowd can have an impact on how a game is called....... Hence Hilton magic.
Ehhh that backfired on them a couple times in the recent past....against Kansas in particular.

Just depends on if you get refs who are scared by the home crowd into making calls or refs who get tired of the constant bitching by the home crowds (ISU) and call stuff against them.

True story. And also true is that it doesn't matter what Iowa fans do (jeer the refs or sit on their hands), they'll still have more bad calls go against them than their opponent, especially if that opponent is Michigan State.
 
Just a stat for you Hawk fans the fouls called was 31 each on MSU and Oakland. Also, the last 5 games between Oakland and MSU the point difference total was been 13 pts. Oakland gets up for MSU. They have talent. They have 3 transfers from power 5 conferences and Felder was terrific in High School. He just lacked height for power 5 teams. Also, Jalen Hayes a Forward on their team played great. He played on the same High School team of Valentine ,Forbes and your own Anthony Clemens(sp).

The difference is that, if it's your normal big ten officiated game, MSU probably fouled another 50 times that were not called.

MSUs "defense" is essentially non stop fouling and daring the officials to call it.
The refs always end up backing down and just letting it go by the middle of the second half.
 
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You are arguing with a guy whose conference champion has been the same team for what, 12 years?

The Jayhawk conference is a one team league and has been for over a decade. It's laughable to watch ISU fans try to piggyback on KUs success.
It is a shame that you try and change the subject from MSU/Hawk match-up. Feeling bad about who you are can manifest itself in many ways. Good luck against Sparty to all "Hawkeyes".
 
Just a stat for you Hawk fans the fouls called was 31 each on MSU and Oakland. Also, the last 5 games between Oakland and MSU the point difference total was been 13 pts. Oakland gets up for MSU. They have talent. They have 3 transfers from power 5 conferences and Felder was terrific in High School. He just lacked height for power 5 teams. Also, Jalen Hayes a Forward on their team played great. He played on the same High School team of Valentine ,Forbes and your own Anthony Clemens(sp).
I would like you to find the foul difference between MSU and Iowa historically, or MSU vs any big ten team historically for that.....do not get me wrong I love Izzo and MSU is top 5/10 program in the country....but if you can honestly tell me that MSU does not get "the benefit of the doubt" more often than not, well I would call you a liar
 
What are you talking about? You obviously know very little about the B12 as evidenced by your small venue comment. I am sure Izzo is more "marquee" than Self, or Ryan is more "marquee" than Krueger.....LOL! But getting back on topic, Fran will have to establish his presence early, unless the zebras Just don't like him at all.
I think the point was that the Big12 pales in comparison to the Big Ten.....also the fact that every big ten team knows when they play MSU it is going to be the most physical team of the year, which would be fine if some fouls were ever called.....especially with the new rule emphasis....no excuses needed to be made if any team loses to MSU, they are a damn good team
 
I think the point was that the Big12 pales in comparison to the Big Ten.....also the fact that every big ten team knows when they play MSU it is going to be the most physical team of the year, which would be fine if some fouls were ever called.....especially with the new rule emphasis....no excuses needed to be made if any team loses to MSU, they are a damn good team
Pales in comparison how? Are you comparing number of titles? That would be one each since the formation of the B12. Took a quick look at this season and the B12 is 5-2 against the B10. So frankly it is not fact..... But you know that.... At least one would think so...
 
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I would like you to find the foul difference between MSU and Iowa historically, or MSU vs any big ten team historically for that.....do not get me wrong I love Izzo and MSU is top 5/10 program in the country....but if you can honestly tell me that MSU does not get "the benefit of the doubt" more often than not, well I would call you a liar

The foul calls are often even, which if you watch the games , illustrates the problem.

If all fouls were called by the books MSU should have 4-5 times more fouls.
 
I think too much has been made of the officiating. Iowa has lost due to 6+ minute scoring droughts, inability to identify shooters and better talent. The seniors have talked about their confidence and lessons learned from close games, so let's see these 4 guys step and play a complete game. I think we are likely going to be a bubble team and this was a game I had in the L category with Valentine, so stealing a W here against # 1 would be huge.
 
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Great opportunity, not every team gets an opportunity like this. Just come ready to play and leave it all on the court. It's a home game so should be ours for the taking. I believe we can and big part of me says we will if Jarrod plays his game and the rest of the Hawks follow suit.
 
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I think too much has been made of the officiating. Iowa has lost due to 6+ minute scoring droughts, inability to identify shooters and better talent. The seniors have talked about their confidence and lessons learned from close games, so let's see these 4 guys step and play a complete game. I think we are likely going to be a bubble team and this was a game I had in the L category with Valentine, so stealing a W here against # 1 would be huge.

All good and valid points. I would argue a little bit that some of those scoring droughts sometimes were a direct result of mugging/hacking D and no whistles. I can also recall at least twice that we cleanly blocked an MSU shot on a final possession and/or under a minute to play with the game being decided and we got whistled for a foul. One was a block of Gary Harris on a 3 by White that was all ball. These are the types of calls that MSU gets and has earned because they have proved it nationally.

We have to be able to flat out beat them despite the respect calls they will get. Home court means nothing in terms of influencing refs in the B1G against teams like MSU.
 
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All good and valid points. I would argue a little bit that some of those scoring droughts sometimes were a direct result of mugging/hacking D and no whistles. I can also recall at least twice that we cleanly blocked an MSU shot on a final possession and/or under a minute to play with the game being decided and we got whistled for a foul. One was a block of Gary Harris on a 3 by White that was all ball. These are the types of calls that MSU gets and has earned because they have proved it nationally.

We have to be able to flat out beat them despite the respect calls they will get. Home court means nothing in terms of influencing refs in the B1G against teams like MSU.

I think there were two game that White cleanly blocked Harris on 3 pt shots and Harris got bail out calls both times. Huge calls where Whitey was stepping up and making a play and Ref took it away. Then there have been the super obvious flops from that annoying PG. There have been at least three games we have had MSU on the ropes in last few years and combination of Iowa not executing /MSU athletes stepping up /and at times rip jobs from refs at times have done us in.

I can recall Gessel getting stripped as Freshman in closing minutes as example of Iowa not making play. Last year Gessel trying to go one on one to tie or take lead and getting his shot swatted. Those were cases of MSU guys making plays and our guys not.
 
The big difference is Izzo can cry for an hour never get T'd up but if Fran complains he'd be thrown out.

The big difference is Izzo approaches the refs with a "smile" and begs them. Fran bangs chairs around and has an awesome "mad face". You catch more bees with honey, right?

Also, as for the fouls committed that don't get called, I'm sick of whining about it. Why don't the Hawks just start doing it too if teams get away with it?
 
The big difference is Izzo approaches the refs with a "smile" and begs them. Fran bangs chairs around and has an awesome "mad face". You catch more bees with honey, right?

Also, as for the fouls committed that don't get called, I'm sick of whining about it. Why don't the Hawks just start doing it too if teams get away with it?

Yeah, Fran and those chairs. Happens every darn game!
 
Yeah, Fran and those chairs. Happens every darn game!

Obviously not, but you're helping to make my point. Fran gets pissed off and uses that ANGER to go after refs. Izzo is also pissed off, but he knows how to grin and bear it, do his little smirk thing and "hug" the officials while telling them it has to turn his way.

Guess who gets the calls? Some of it has to do with pedigree, but a lot has to do with approach.
 
Obviously not, but you're helping to make my point. Fran gets pissed off and uses that ANGER to go after refs. Izzo is also pissed off, but he knows how to grin and bear it, do his little smirk thing and "hug" the officials while telling them it has to turn his way.

Guess who gets the calls? Some of it has to do with pedigree, but a lot has to do with approach.

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