Exactly. A swing of the camera caught THE swing of emotion of two athletes that want the same thing. And there is only one of those things. Incredible moment.
OTT Session 3
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anon_0pi0cv8t1ggvb
Guest
That's your opinion. You think it's absurd that I keep commenting on it, and I think it's absurd that the PSU/NLWC wrestlers keep proselytizing every interview.
Again, you're best off blocking me, because I'll continue to comment on it.
From my perspective, your constant preaching against this is "cultlike."
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anon_0pi0cv8t1ggvb
Guest
People who are in the cult don't realize how weird it is to hear in every interview.
Holy irony. You seem oblivious to your weirdness in your constant jihad against it.
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anon_0pi0cv8t1ggvb
Guest
I think the same about people like you.
I have nothing against the concept of religion. I just find the prevalence of discussing religion after an athletic competition very weird and inappropriate. Wouldn't you find it weird if an athlete won a match and then spent time preaching atheism or agnosticism? That's how some non-religious people view it when an athlete fixates on religion in their post match interview.
Someone who is an atheist or agnostic have no personal "entity" to thank their success for. The equivalent would be like me thinking it weird for some agnostic champion to preach how great it is to be an American, to have opportunities in such a great county with a system like ours. Then I get on a message board and constantly rail about it. I would be the weirdo.
Yeah, you're definitely the weird one on this.
How can you think poorly of someone who uses both "holy" and "jihad" in a post about religion?
Thomas Gilman had this to say about sharing a room with Spencer Lee in 2018. Will we get to see these Iowa legends collide at the Olympic Trials? | FloWrestling | flowrestling · Original audio
Thomas Gilman had this to say about sharing a room with Spencer Lee in 2018. Will we get to see these Iowa legends collide at the Olympic Trials?. flowrestling · Original audio
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Forrest is the least likely, he may take an official visit like Lockett did, to squeeze more cash out of OSU. Blaze has taken an official last fall, along with tOSU, Cornell, Purdue, and last one was Michigan.
Yea...it's not an accident. Coaches have slowed Lee down a lot. Stop dealing in what it could be (dominating, 2 min TFS) and deal in what is (picking and choosing spots, scoring in transition). If he hits a wall in a match, it's real tough to ride out an empty tank against Nico or Gilman. I thought his tank was just fine all tourney.
This is my impression too, Chief. You're certainly more "connected" than I am, but from an observation standpoint, and having coached some kids that are built more like Spencer (albeit, much less awesome), and some that are built like my brother-in-law, the differences are quite stark.
Some guys have an incredible ability to sprint, and empty a tank in a very quick, herculean display of power. Think powerlifter, sprinter, offensive lineman, etc.
Other guys, (like my brother-in-law) are pure endurance, with very little sprinting ability for high specific output. Ben (my bil) was a solid wrestler, but almost always had to come from behind after surviving the early onslaught. In college he took up ultra-marathons, where he one time ran a 66 mile race in the mountains that lasted 16 hours.
I think there are many guys that fall into the incredibly-long endurance type, but they are usually the plodders that have to be crafty and careful to stay in position and maintain a high-ish pace the whole match. These are the guys that don't seem tired late in matches, because they physically can't sprint hard enough to spend their "tank."
On the other hand we have pure sprinters, that have an extraordinary ability to make bursts of power in a hurry, (Usain Bolt) like Spencer, maybe Burroughs, (but he's good at picking his spots and making a short bursts) and others. Spencer just happens to make a sprint that lasts for 30-40 seconds with a shot, short scramble, and then a gut/lace situation that absolutely drains his tank for a while. If he's forced to stay in a match with a modest pace is where he's ended up looking like he's in trouble.
I don't think this is a problem, as much as it's a management thing. In matches where he goes in knowing he's got a tough one he doesn't get tired. He manages his pace and picks his spots. (Nato x3?, Suriano, Gilman x2, etc.)
Where he's been in trouble is where he's tried to end it early and hit a wall.
Sorry for the book. It's been rattling in my head for about 6 years.
Some guys have an incredible ability to sprint, and empty a tank in a very quick, herculean display of power. Think powerlifter, sprinter, offensive lineman, etc.
Other guys, (like my brother-in-law) are pure endurance, with very little sprinting ability for high specific output. Ben (my bil) was a solid wrestler, but almost always had to come from behind after surviving the early onslaught. In college he took up ultra-marathons, where he one time ran a 66 mile race in the mountains that lasted 16 hours.
I think there are many guys that fall into the incredibly-long endurance type, but they are usually the plodders that have to be crafty and careful to stay in position and maintain a high-ish pace the whole match. These are the guys that don't seem tired late in matches, because they physically can't sprint hard enough to spend their "tank."
On the other hand we have pure sprinters, that have an extraordinary ability to make bursts of power in a hurry, (Usain Bolt) like Spencer, maybe Burroughs, (but he's good at picking his spots and making a short bursts) and others. Spencer just happens to make a sprint that lasts for 30-40 seconds with a shot, short scramble, and then a gut/lace situation that absolutely drains his tank for a while. If he's forced to stay in a match with a modest pace is where he's ended up looking like he's in trouble.
I don't think this is a problem, as much as it's a management thing. In matches where he goes in knowing he's got a tough one he doesn't get tired. He manages his pace and picks his spots. (Nato x3?, Suriano, Gilman x2, etc.)
Where he's been in trouble is where he's tried to end it early and hit a wall.
Sorry for the book. It's been rattling in my head for about 6 years.
Great post. I had some 'gas tank' concerns with Spencer in his earlier matches but thought he managed his matches with Gilman perfectly. Besides training methods, some people's physiology is just different and you have to build it in the plan. I swim alot - I feel like a heart attack is imminent during laps 1-3 or so, but once my system is going, it is mostly boredom that slows me down. Only certain changes to my pre-swim warmup seem to alter that pattern. Totally different if I'm just lifting or something. Know your system, know your opponent, strategize.
Haha, I've noticed the 1 minute heart-attack in myself, both when I run and in wrestling matches. Rarely did I have a match where I was exhausted at the end, except when I tried to wrestle college kids as a 31-year old office-dweller. That was a bad day, and cured me of my itch to compete.
Another anecdote about Spencer. Back in 2019 I was coaching at our HS conference tournament, and in our conference used to be Devin Schroder, (Purdue). His dad was still the coach at the time, and I talked to him about Devin's recent match with Spencer, where Spencer did what Spencer did with a 15-point tech (or something). What was amazing to me is that Schroder used to do the same things to the HS kids in Michigan. He'd take them down, chop, tilt, tilt, tilt, pin, etc. It was amazing seeing Spencer to that to him.
Anyway, Schroder's dad talked about how incredibly strong he is. How Devin never felt that kind of strength and power in his arms, shoulders, and chest. As a comparison, I'm pretty sure at the time one of the Purdue coaches was AJ Schopp, who was also quite good on top.
All that to say, Spencer, while maybe measurably, is pretty-strong in a weight room sense, when he's in competition is able to elevate his output unlike most others. I don't care how "full" your tank is, and how fast you can normally recover, when you can pour out all of your energy into one burst, ain't nobody stopping you except your own ability to recover after getting emptied.
Think of a cheetah. Fastest thing on land, however, I just read that after a sprint like that they are close to brain damage as their lungs can't add enough oxygen to their blood to recover.
Some good thoughts here. When healthy, we've seen SL be able to do 7 mins just fine in folk...especially when they peak him for nationals. I think, in his case, conditioning issues comes down to not being able to wrestle live as much as the next guy because of his knees over the years. As we know, there is really no substitute for gas tank building than wrestling.
That ultra marathon stuff is just nuts. Ever read David Goggins book Can't Hurt Me? If not, worth the read. He talks about how he heard about an ultra marathon qualifier in the local area and decides on a whim to go run it. Pain and hilarity ensue.
Agreed. Real Woods spoke about wrestling him in the room and even two weights lighter, never felt that strength. I think Gilman was the more physical guy in the first period in the first match but after that, was never really able to push Spencer around and he seemed to know it. Normally, Gilman bullies guys for push outs and I think he got one or two total in two matches? Lee him up on one foot once in each match and immediately took him out which goes to my work smarter, not harder theory.
I was most impressed with Spencer’s scrambling. Both matches the deciding points were scored of scrambles.
He's always been very good but I almost puked when his knee was in that position. After 3 years in Happy Valley, you'd think they would have taught TG how to scramble
(not a shot at PSU/NLWC btw)Adding to this thread, maybe could be another topic, but anyway . . . I became an Iowa fan in the late 1990s while sitting in the arena watching Midlands. I remember the seemingly relentless pace that Schwab and Mike Zadick were able to maintain. I also remember the impenetrable wall that was Joe Williams. He'd seemingly stand there for 6 straight minutes with 2 or 3 (maybe 1) honest attempts that sometimes came from 12-15 feet away.
We used to stand there wondering why Joe wouldn't simply do that blast double 6 more times and end the match. Well, I'm thinking that Joe understood his ability to sprint and the time it took to recover. He was so quick and powerful, yet he was able to maintain a solid match pace without depleting his tank, only picking his attacks when we felt he was able to finish cleanly, thereby protecting his "tank" for later scrambles and bursts of energy, only if necessary.
Spencer on the other hand, indulged us with his sprinting ability and would end most matches in a hurry. Had the guy been able to pace himself a little better, and avoid doing some of the high-power things he did, I'd venture a guess that he wouldn't have been injured as much, and likely would have had fewer losses, however, he wouldn't have been as endearing to the fans. (think, Kyle Dake, Joe Williams, etc.)
Either way, I'm grateful that all these guys have different flavors. I wasn't quick, so I tried to wrestle like Schwab and Mike Zadick, but I also wasn't very skilled. lol. Other kids can mimic the high-power guys.
Maybe that's part of why I like wrestling so much, there is not a singular body type or formula to success. You work with what you've got.
We used to stand there wondering why Joe wouldn't simply do that blast double 6 more times and end the match. Well, I'm thinking that Joe understood his ability to sprint and the time it took to recover. He was so quick and powerful, yet he was able to maintain a solid match pace without depleting his tank, only picking his attacks when we felt he was able to finish cleanly, thereby protecting his "tank" for later scrambles and bursts of energy, only if necessary.
Spencer on the other hand, indulged us with his sprinting ability and would end most matches in a hurry. Had the guy been able to pace himself a little better, and avoid doing some of the high-power things he did, I'd venture a guess that he wouldn't have been injured as much, and likely would have had fewer losses, however, he wouldn't have been as endearing to the fans. (think, Kyle Dake, Joe Williams, etc.)
Either way, I'm grateful that all these guys have different flavors. I wasn't quick, so I tried to wrestle like Schwab and Mike Zadick, but I also wasn't very skilled. lol. Other kids can mimic the high-power guys.
Maybe that's part of why I like wrestling so much, there is not a singular body type or formula to success. You work with what you've got.
Nah, I'll just keep pointing out what a hypersensitive judgemental prick you are since you can't seem to let athletes thank their God of choice.
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anon_0pi0cv8t1ggvb
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Ok Mr. Hypersensitive.
Guys like Brooks have gone beyond "thanking their God of choice".
Penn State wrestling champ under fire for comments disparaging Islamic prophet Muhammad
Aaron Brooks won his third national title over the weekend, but some folks aren't happy with what he had to say after.
Willie posted on a different forum Blaze is down to tOSU and PSU.
This. My biggest observation, outside of Spencer Lee is back to being Spencer Lee, was his shot selection especially in the Gilman match. He slowed it down, picked his spots, and outside of maybe one shot attempt finished every time he shot. He also got to his single with Gilman having that left leg lead, so SL had to shift away from his go to high-c/dump on right leg. He’s back and as good as can be right now. I’ve been watching him since about 6th grade on Young Guns teams and I couldn’t be happier
Awesome. 3 of arguably the top lightweight prospects since Lee and we're gonna go 0'fer.
I don't give a crap what they say about religion, atheism, agnosticism or devil worship. Why does it bother you so much?
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anon_0pi0cv8t1ggvb
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Why does me criticizing and mocking proselytizing bother you so much?
I'm not the biggest Flo fan, but they had an excellent broadcast this morning. It's worth a listen in it's entirety, but if you want just the 57kg stuff it's around the 1:12:00 mark.
They talk about his tank and even do a deep dive into his competition in Turkey.
And the posts today have been incredible. Love it.
But after reading some of this Lee reminds me of the great tour cycling sprinters like: Mark Cavendish, Peter Sagan, Eddy Merckx, Marcel Kittel, etc.
These are guys that get burned during a high pace race and need to ride smart simply to make it to those sprint points. They're in conservative mode until they flip that switch then it's all or nothing.
But when they finally decide to hit the afterburner there's no one on the planet that can generate that type of power over 30 sec, then they're are depleted and need recovery time before going again.
I'm now in full agreement that's just who Lee is and he's learning how to control and master it.
They talk about his tank and even do a deep dive into his competition in Turkey.
And the posts today have been incredible. Love it.
But after reading some of this Lee reminds me of the great tour cycling sprinters like: Mark Cavendish, Peter Sagan, Eddy Merckx, Marcel Kittel, etc.
These are guys that get burned during a high pace race and need to ride smart simply to make it to those sprint points. They're in conservative mode until they flip that switch then it's all or nothing.
But when they finally decide to hit the afterburner there's no one on the planet that can generate that type of power over 30 sec, then they're are depleted and need recovery time before going again.
I'm now in full agreement that's just who Lee is and he's learning how to control and master it.
because when the athletes do it, we listen to it for 10 seconds and its over
when do it, its the initial comments and then you inevitably arguing with a bunch of people for the next few days
i don't even really disagree with you...but you're such an insufferable pr*ck about it that i'd rather just listen to brooks tell me to come to christ at this point
If you're a fast twitch kind of guy a maximal strength effort drains you rather quickly. I'd watch lifters sometimes blow up a weight and them and their friends think they'll just add a few more pounds the next lift. And they'll often fail. Your nervous system recovers slower than your cardio and muscle physiology. You might feel fine but the tank is empty for another very hard effort.
It's a few seconds for these guys and you don't have to let it affect your day. But yeah, the constant whining about it is screwed up.
Seems to bother you more than me, evidence is your post count on the subject.
Take this advice from an older man you need to mellow out. Life is too short to get spun up over nothing.
Because it's a wrestling forum? Maybe? How's your compliance gig going? Turn over any violations lately? You must have a lot of free time.
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anon_0pi0cv8t1ggvb
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I get it. But to your point, I made two comments about the religious preaching in interviews at the trials. Then for each comment about 5 people respond telling me I'm either wrong or that "the athletes have the right to say that" which I've never argued otherwise. Those people fail to recognize that people being preached to have the right to say "preaching is cringy".
Everyone who replies and argues that it's wrong to criticize preaching are contributing to the back and forth and are hypocritically committing the same act that they're criticizing me for. We mocked "fun" in PSU interviews for years and no one had an issue when someone pointed out that it sounds cult like, cliche, cringy, etc. Religion is no different and imo less appropriate for interviews when discussed in a way that is preaching to an audience.
Just as you and others have said to me, "if it bothers you just ignore it and move on" feel free to take your own advice rather than replying to my comments and asking me to stop. Or you're hypocritically just contributing to the very thing you're criticizing.
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anon_0pi0cv8t1ggvb
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Gee I wonder how the topic of religious preaching came up on a wrestling forum. 🤡
Talking about free time as you spend yours posting on a rival fanbases message board. 🤡
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anon_0pi0cv8t1ggvb
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I enjoy back and forths. If it bothered me I wouldn't post here or engage. Conversations like these are sociologically interesting imo. It's eye opening witnessing people so ingrained in a culture that they can't fathom the weirdness of saying a man who died thousands of years ago is going to return to earth soon, as an interview response to how they got better at wrestling after qualifying for the Olympics.
