Professor Plum, Billiard Room, Candlestick? Nope, Title IX. Again.

[GracefromAbove]

Can we please stop pretending, via sustained standing ovations in Carver, Kinnick, or otherwise, that the reason the new women's wrestling team and its highly compensated coach are on campus is anything other than Title IX and court settlement? The same Title IX that every knowledgeable wrestling fan has despised and decried in relation to college wrestling program cuts for the past decade plus.

"A Title IX lawsuit settlement in October forced the school to create the program along with a $400,000 payment. Iowa will have the only women’s wrestling team in a Power 5 conference." https://www.kcrg.com/2021/11/20/iow...-wrestling-coach-least-115000-five-year-deal/

Nothing against Coach Chun, but the women's program and her salary is not quite the "You get what you earn" scenario that Hawkeye wrestling fans tell themselves that they consistently support and honor. Welcoming Coach Chun was the right thing to do, but how did the first returning national championship men's wrestling team in 10 years (earned on the mat) get less than a standing ovation, when the same fans gave an earned-in-the-lawyers'-office program head at least 30 seconds of standing ovation?

 

[HawkFan1986]

Who pissed in your corn flakes?

 

[GracefromAbove]

Title IX. As a fan of college wrestling, you're a big fan of Title IX? Or are you more a fan of lawsuit-initiated programs derived from Title IX?

 

[Gusaford]

I'm just a caveman, but wouldn't the widespread adoption of women's wrestling teams remove the pressure on ADs to cut men's teams to meet Title IX requirements? Seems to be something that should be applauded, not decried. Whether the result of Title IX or not, the Iowa women's wrestling team is a great thing in and of itself. Time for other schools to step up.

 

[HawkFan1986]

Title IX. As a fan of college wrestling, you're a big fan of Title IX? Or are you more a fan of lawsuit-initiated programs derived from Title IX?

I’m wasn’t a big fan and I’m still not, but it’s not going away and there’s nothing we can do about it now. I for one am happy that the good ole U of I is leading the charge with women’s wrestling, and I’m not gonna fuss about why.

 

[texas twister]

It is a MAJOR historic event of long, long lasting effects. OP has no idea of the significance of this addition. Secondly, everyone decides for himself what constitutes an event that thrills the soul and her being named as head coach did just that. Go play with dolls if you don't like it.

 

[GracefromAbove]

I’m wasn’t a big fan and I’m still not, but it’s not going away and there’s nothing we can do about it now. I for one am happy that the good ole U of I is leading the charge with women’s wrestling, and I’m not gonna fuss about why.

"Leading the charge" by getting sued first isn't exactly an admirable form of leadership.

To each their own in terms of excitement, or lack thereof, related to the women's team, Coach Chun, and her $115k annual salary before escalations, but for the thousands in Carver's standing ovation Friday, make sure to ask yourselves why Iowa's Athletic Department wasn't forthcoming with the Title IX lawsuit during press conferences announcing the program, timing of creation, and new hire. Probably because the Athletic Department knows that being forced to create and hire under Title IX legal settlement, even though true, does not generate the excitement and belief among college wrestling fans that the rest of their public relations messaging spin garnered.

 

[dtripp26]

OP should change his screen name to sh!tfromabove

 

[wasdt21]

trolls gonna troll

 

[texas twister]

"Leading the charge" by getting sued first isn't exactly an admirable form of leadership.

To each their own in terms of excitement, or lack thereof, related to the women's team, Coach Chun, and her $115k annual salary before escalations, but for the thousands in Carver's standing ovation Friday, make sure to ask yourselves why Iowa's Athletic Department wasn't forthcoming with the Title IX lawsuit during press conferences announcing the program, timing of creation, and new hire. Probably because the Athletic Department knows that being forced to create and hire under Title IX legal settlement, even though true, does not generate the excitement and belief among college wrestling fans that the rest of their public relations messaging spin garnered.

Rather than being an over analyst or a Debbie Downer, I'll just take great joy in seeing Iowa lead the way for woman's wrestling and be elated for all the young ladies out there that have an opportunity to compete in collegiate wrestling.

 

[BBptg5]

I'm just a caveman, but wouldn't the widespread adoption of women's wrestling teams remove the pressure on ADs to cut men's teams to meet Title IX requirements? Seems to be something that should be applauded, not decried. Whether the result of Title IX or not, the Iowa women's wrestling team is a great thing in and of itself. Time for other schools to step up.

yeah, you would think. however, the mens sports have already been cut…swimming, diving, tennis and gymnastics. Barta is who should have been cut.

 

[BBptg5]

OP should change his screen name to sh!tfromabove

ok, you didn’t like what he said, however, everything he said was a fact like it or not,

 

[texas twister]

"Leading the charge" by getting sued first isn't exactly an admirable form of leadership.

To each their own in terms of excitement, or lack thereof, related to the women's team, Coach Chun, and her $115k annual salary before escalations, but for the thousands in Carver's standing ovation Friday, make sure to ask yourselves why Iowa's Athletic Department wasn't forthcoming with the Title IX lawsuit during press conferences announcing the program, timing of creation, and new hire. Probably because the Athletic Department knows that being forced to create and hire under Title IX legal settlement, even though true, does not generate the excitement and belief among college wrestling fans that the rest of their public relations messaging spin garnered.

ok, you didn’t like what he said, however, everything he said was a fact like it or not,

This is only speculation. It is not "fact". "Fact" doesn't use words like "probably". That is a fact.

 

[LIV4GOD]

I'm just a caveman, but wouldn't the widespread adoption of women's wrestling teams remove the pressure on ADs to cut men's teams to meet Title IX requirements?

It didn't stop the men's teams being cut, and the exact women's sport being reinstated after being cut at Iowa.

 

[sstark46]

make sure to ask yourselves why Iowa's Athletic Department wasn't forthcoming with the Title IX lawsuit during press conferences announcing the program, timing of creation, and new hire. Probably because the Athletic Department knows that being forced to create and hire under Title IX legal settlement, even though true, does not generate the excitement and belief among college wrestling fans that the rest of their public relations messaging spin garnered.

Uhhhhhhh it was literally explained and discussed by Barta in the opening press conference announcing the team that this stemmed from the Title IX lawsuit. They were not in any way trying to hide that or not be forthcoming about it.

See post 37 in this topic, which is a transcript of that press conference
Post in thread 'Iowa to Become First Power Five Institution to Add Women’s Wrestling' https://iowa.forums.rivals.com/thre...-to-add-women’s-wrestling.368692/post-9302488

 

[BBptg5]

This is only speculation. It is not "fact". "Fact" doesn't use words like "probably". That is a fact.

ok..we did get fined, we did cut 4 min’s sports, we were obligated under the law suite to add another woman’s sport. I did not use probably..

 

[GracefromAbove]

Uhhhhhhh it was literally explained and discussed by Barta in the opening press conference announcing the team that this stemmed from the Title IX lawsuit. They were not in any way trying to hide that or not be forthcoming about it.

See post 37 in this topic, which is a transcript of that press conference
Post in thread 'Iowa to Become First Power Five Institution to Add Women’s Wrestling' https://iowa.forums.rivals.com/threads/iowa-to-become-first-power-five-institution-to-add-women’s-wrestling.368692/post-9302488

Thanks for providing the transcript. I see that you are unequivocally correct regarding Barta acknowledging the Title IX lawsuit. Certainly meets the definition of being forthcoming in that portion of the press conference.

However, my fundamental question remains: were 8,000 or 10,000 wrestling fans at Carver really standing-ovation excited about the results of a Title IX lawsuit? Given the well-deserved years of Title IX hate among college wrestling fans due to dozens of terminated wrestling programs, why was such a strong proportion of the crowd supporting a position that exists only because the university got sued under the same law that the fans hate?

 

[MVPFAN]

Can we please stop pretending, via sustained standing ovations in Carver, Kinnick, or otherwise, that the reason the new women's wrestling team and its highly compensated coach are on campus is anything other than Title IX and court settlement? The same Title IX that every knowledgeable wrestling fan has despised and decried in relation to college wrestling program cuts for the past decade plus.

"A Title IX lawsuit settlement in October forced the school to create the program along with a $400,000 payment. Iowa will have the only women’s wrestling team in a Power 5 conference." https://www.kcrg.com/2021/11/20/iow...-wrestling-coach-least-115000-five-year-deal/

Nothing against Coach Chun, but the women's program and her salary is not quite the "You get what you earn" scenario that Hawkeye wrestling fans tell themselves that they consistently support and honor. Welcoming Coach Chun was the right thing to do, but how did the first returning national championship men's wrestling team in 10 years (earned on the mat) get less than a standing ovation, when the same fans gave an earned-in-the-lawyers'-office program head at least 30 seconds of standing ovation?

Go back to your hole. I don't care if they decided to add it after being held at gun point.

 

[SittingSwitch]

Can we please stop pretending, via sustained standing ovations in Carver, Kinnick, or otherwise, that the reason the new women's wrestling team and its highly compensated coach are on campus is anything other than Title IX and court settlement? The same Title IX that every knowledgeable wrestling fan has despised and decried in relation to college wrestling program cuts for the past decade plus.

"A Title IX lawsuit settlement in October forced the school to create the program along with a $400,000 payment. Iowa will have the only women’s wrestling team in a Power 5 conference." https://www.kcrg.com/2021/11/20/iow...-wrestling-coach-least-115000-five-year-deal/

Nothing against Coach Chun, but the women's program and her salary is not quite the "You get what you earn" scenario that Hawkeye wrestling fans tell themselves that they consistently support and honor. Welcoming Coach Chun was the right thing to do, but how did the first returning national championship men's wrestling team in 10 years (earned on the mat) get less than a standing ovation, when the same fans gave an earned-in-the-lawyers'-office program head at least 30 seconds of standing ovation?

You cite the law responsible for gender equity and then say, let's stop pretending a huge advancement in womens sports is because of the very law designed to do this very thing. You're brilliant. Her salary comes from starting a program from scratch and being a leader and billboard for Iowa in this space. How much would you take that job for, with all that responsibility? Again, not sure why anyone would "pretend" here. That's like saying, let's stop pretending that you exist to post stupid comments isn't because your dad poked your mom - or some small deviation from that. Rookie post, rookie!

 

[SittingSwitch]

You cite the law responsible for gender equity and then say, let's stop pretending a huge advancement in womens sports is because of the very law designed to do this very thing. You're brilliant. Her salary comes from starting a program from scratch and being a leader and billboard for Iowa in this space. How much would you take that job for, with all that responsibility? Again, not sure why anyone would "pretend" here. That's like saying, let's stop pretending that you exist to post stupid comments isn't because your dad poked your mom - or some small deviation from that. Rookie post, rookie!

And, even more, what wrestling fan wouldn't give a standing ovation for the new Head Coach of one of their programs? You're weird, and uneducated. Back to de-tasslin'

 

[sunwarrior]

Thanks for providing the transcript. I see that you are unequivocally correct regarding Barta acknowledging the Title IX lawsuit. Certainly meets the definition of being forthcoming in that portion of the press conference.

However, my fundamental question remains: were 8,000 or 10,000 wrestling fans at Carver really standing-ovation excited about the results of a Title IX lawsuit? Given the well-deserved years of Title IX hate among college wrestling fans due to dozens of terminated wrestling programs, why was such a strong proportion of the crowd supporting a position that exists only because the university got sued under the same law that the fans hate?

Gee, I don’t know… maybe because if this had been the solution the whole time those programs wouldn’t have been cut in the first place.

Maybe because we are fans of WRESTLING and the idea of more Hawkeyes wrestling gets us excited.

Lots of civil rights advancements have happened as a result of court rulings. Should we be pissed that schools are integrated too?

Who cares how it happened, it’s a good thing. And if more schools add women’s programs as a result, no reason for Title IX to be the cause of dropped programs anymore. Great thing all around for fans of WRESTLING.

Do you feel threatened by powerful women?

 

[texas twister]

ok..we did get fined, we did cut 4 min’s sports, we were obligated under the law suite to add another woman’s sport. I did not use probably..

You said that gracefromabove was using facts. gracefromabove was using speculation and not facts and did use the word "probably".

 

[Gusaford]

Thanks for providing the transcript. I see that you are unequivocally correct regarding Barta acknowledging the Title IX lawsuit. Certainly meets the definition of being forthcoming in that portion of the press conference.

However, my fundamental question remains: were 8,000 or 10,000 wrestling fans at Carver really standing-ovation excited about the results of a Title IX lawsuit? Given the well-deserved years of Title IX hate among college wrestling fans due to dozens of terminated wrestling programs, why was such a strong proportion of the crowd supporting a position that exists only because the university got sued under the same law that the fans hate?

Some day you may have a daughter who likes sports and wants to participate in sports in college -- I do -- and you may feel differently about Title IX. You can cut men's programs or add women's programs. Which do you prefer?

 

[natchrlman]

I was on my feet clapping.... I raised 5 daughters and I’ll applaud any new opportunities for women...... Where else in the world would be a better fit for this??
Chun was of Team USA women’s rise and she’s a perfect choice to lead women’s collegiate wrestling at the power 5 level
if that bothers you you’re barking up the wrong tree here..... why don’t you run along and go **** yourself dipshit?

 

[Neo_Hawk]

Can we please stop pretending, via sustained standing ovations in Carver, Kinnick, or otherwise, that the reason the new women's wrestling team and its highly compensated coach are on campus is anything other than Title IX and court settlement? The same Title IX that every knowledgeable wrestling fan has despised and decried in relation to college wrestling program cuts for the past decade plus.

"A Title IX lawsuit settlement in October forced the school to create the program along with a $400,000 payment. Iowa will have the only women’s wrestling team in a Power 5 conference." https://www.kcrg.com/2021/11/20/iow...-wrestling-coach-least-115000-five-year-deal/

Nothing against Coach Chun, but the women's program and her salary is not quite the "You get what you earn" scenario that Hawkeye wrestling fans tell themselves that they consistently support and honor. Welcoming Coach Chun was the right thing to do, but how did the first returning national championship men's wrestling team in 10 years (earned on the mat) get less than a standing ovation, when the same fans gave an earned-in-the-lawyers'-office program head at least 30 seconds of standing ovation?

I take it you have caught on to the lie that size doesn't matter, are embarrassed and upset and are lashing out.

Are you angry that a women is making more money than you or pissed that girls are achieving something you could never accomplish?

I'm a life long wrestling fan and long time supporter of Title IV. Your argument is ridiculous, women's/girls wrestling happens to be a huge growth sport in this country at the high school and senior level. The missing piece has been P5. Iowa making this addition reinforces our standing as the leader in college wrestling.

Heaven forbid we add more sports and more opportunities for those entering college. Especially something so pathetic as a sport that teaches hard work, discipline and personal accountability.

 

[rcamp67]

I take it you have caught on to the lie that size doesn't matter, are embarrassed and upset and are lashing out.

Are you angry that a women is making more money than you or pissed that girls are achieving something you could never accomplish?

I'm a life long wrestling fan and long time supporter of Title IV. Your argument is ridiculous, women's/girls wrestling happens to be a huge growth sport in this country at the high school and senior level. The missing piece has been P5. Iowa making this addition reinforces our standing as the leader in college wrestling.

Heaven forbid we add more sports and more opportunities for those entering college. Especially something so pathetic as a sport that teaches hard work, discipline and personal accountability.

It’s title 9 not title 4 and I don’t think I’ve ever meet anyone involved in wrestling that was a supporter of such ridiculous laws. It has killed wrestling and it makes no sense. Programs were forced to make decisions they never should have had to make. Add a women’s program that will lose money or cut a men’s program that wasn’t making any money. Fiscally it was an easy decision in many cases. Title IX was “woke” before woke was a thing and it’s destructive to men’s sports while doing little for women’s sports.

That being said I don’t care that title IX led to us having women’s wrestling at Iowa. I’m just happy to have it. I’m glad the university made the decision to add women’s wrestling instead of further cuts to men’s programs. I’m also very excited to see our women’s program grow!

 

[GunFingers]

Yeah, Title IX has been used+abused. Doesn't mean you can't celebrate good things that come from it, directly/indirectly.

I - like most I suspect - had no idea there was any Title IX relationship here. I see a good thing and cheer it on. I even have hopes they'll alternate men/women matches during duals so the meet can last longer. Give me two hours of wrestling instead of one. Title IX, lawsuit, whatever influenced the creation of the Women's Wrestling program ... the outcome is fantastic.

 

[Jcchawk]

Thanks for providing the transcript. I see that you are unequivocally correct regarding Barta acknowledging the Title IX lawsuit. Certainly meets the definition of being forthcoming in that portion of the press conference.

However, my fundamental question remains: were 8,000 or 10,000 wrestling fans at Carver really standing-ovation excited about the results of a Title IX lawsuit? Given the well-deserved years of Title IX hate among college wrestling fans due to dozens of terminated wrestling programs, why was such a strong proportion of the crowd supporting a position that exists only because the university got sued under the same law that the fans hate?

What should they have done? Boo'd? Does it make a difference why the program was started as to whether fans should support it?

 

[Neo_Hawk]

It’s title 9 not title 4 and I don’t think I’ve ever meet anyone involved in wrestling that was a supporter of such ridiculous laws. It has killed wrestling and it makes no sense. Programs were forced to make decisions they never should have had to make. Add a women’s program that will lose money or cut a men’s program that wasn’t making any money. Fiscally it was an easy decision in many cases. Title IX was “woke” before woke was a thing and it’s destructive to men’s sports while doing little for women’s sports.

That being said I don’t care that title IX led to us having women’s wrestling at Iowa. I’m just happy to have it. I’m glad the university made the decision to add women’s wrestling instead of further cuts to men’s programs. I’m also very excited to see our women’s program grow!

Why should a tax payer with, let's say 4 girls, see a portion of his money go toward growing school sports, but those sports are only for boys, so he is helping fund other kids while his girls have no opportunity to play?

Title IX didn't cut wrestling opportunities, admins and athletic directors did. Just because the system was started to only support boys sports, doesn't make it right. When it comes to youth sports, I don't understand anyone against giving both boy and girls the same opportunities, and since other than Football and sometimes BBall, most every single college sport loses money, what is the justification for only wasting money on boys sports?

I do appreciate you spell checking me, you are soooo cool. And if you haven't met anyone in wrestling that didn't support Title IX, you may want to expand your circle. You also say that Title IX has done little for women's sports? Do some research, because that is the most ridiculous thing said on HR since the OP. It pretty much invalidates anything you have to say.

 

[Menace Sockeyes]

Can we please stop pretending, via sustained standing ovations in Carver, Kinnick, or otherwise, that the reason the new women's wrestling team and its highly compensated coach are on campus is anything other than Title IX and court settlement? The same Title IX that every knowledgeable wrestling fan has despised and decried in relation to college wrestling program cuts for the past decade plus.

"A Title IX lawsuit settlement in October forced the school to create the program along with a $400,000 payment. Iowa will have the only women’s wrestling team in a Power 5 conference." https://www.kcrg.com/2021/11/20/iow...-wrestling-coach-least-115000-five-year-deal/

Nothing against Coach Chun, but the women's program and her salary is not quite the "You get what you earn" scenario that Hawkeye wrestling fans tell themselves that they consistently support and honor. Welcoming Coach Chun was the right thing to do, but how did the first returning national championship men's wrestling team in 10 years (earned on the mat) get less than a standing ovation, when the same fans gave an earned-in-the-lawyers'-office program head at least 30 seconds of standing ovation?

Yeah, a couple things...

A) They were clearly forced to create a woman's TEAM. They didn't HAVE to go the wrestling route, but they did because...

B) The plans were already in the works via Brands and Barta. They just accelerated the formation of the program to settle the suit.

C) No matter how much we hate it (and I used to REALLY be against it) Title IX is a good law. Not perfect, but good. The only thing that makes it not perfect, is the behemoth that is college football.

My youngest daughter heard about this at halftime of the BTN wrestling meet, and turned to me and said, "Dad! We're going to that!". I don't think she's ever been more up for a sporting event in her life. We'll be there at the very first meet, and I'm going to love it, thank you very much.

 

[Ruinous]

I feel dumber having read this thread.

 

[Grip220]

I feel dumber having read this thread.

This

 

[bluroptimo]

Long post here....

In the late 90's I was friends with someone doing gender based research in education (Ph.D work, how boys learn, how girls learn, etc) and I was told that if not for Title IX estimates were by the year 2070 MOST college admissions spots would go to women. This person wasn't a Title IX apologist, more of what you'd call a pure educator aware of trends dating back decades. The explanation was that girls mature earlier into HS academic settings (boys catch up but not til we are older) and that a lot of societal push in education had been focused on improving school based outcomes for girls. It was a potent 1-2 combination already playing out in the late 90's.

Fast forward to 2021. Wall Street Journal reports:

• Women make up 60% of college students compared to 1970 when they made up 43%
• Last year 1.5 million fewer students enrolled in college, 70% of the decline was male

In real world outcomes that means if you're a male getting good grades in HS you have a college admissions advantage. And a pretty nice dating pool.

It also means that at some point there will be a push towards improving educational outcomes for men (stuff my friend was researching in the late 90's). In other words, how to structure HS for the boys adolescent brain...the research is out there, I know bc my friend in the late 90's showed me, this is how you structure a boys classroom and it was different than a girls classroom. Still those tactics and applications aren't widespread, yet.

Anyway, just trying to add to the conversation here. I always thought it was an interesting wrinkle to Title IX which I have hated more than once mostly for cutting men's sports as a shortcut solution to gender equity in sports.

 

[SPOONER]

This has to be one of the most thoughtful trolls of all time. Why did fans cheer for a Hawkeye? Amazing stuff. I'm actually sort of impressed.

 

[ping72]

What a weird thread with a bunch of accounts that have hardly ever posted before.

I feel like an internal discussion has just anonymously gone public.

 

[el dub]

Thanks for providing the transcript. I see that you are unequivocally correct regarding Barta acknowledging the Title IX lawsuit. Certainly meets the definition of being forthcoming in that portion of the press conference.

However, my fundamental question remains: were 8,000 or 10,000 wrestling fans at Carver really standing-ovation excited about the results of a Title IX lawsuit? Given the well-deserved years of Title IX hate among college wrestling fans due to dozens of terminated wrestling programs, why was such a strong proportion of the crowd supporting a position that exists only because the university got sued under the same law that the fans hate?

Some have to be drug, kicking and screaming into the present.

Iowa now supports women’s wrestling. A new coach was introduced during the Princeton dual. The fans gave her a gracious welcome.

Welcome to the brave, new world. I have faith in your ability to grow and adapt.

Go Hawks?

 

[js8793]

This has to be one of the most thoughtful trolls of all time. Why did fans cheer for a Hawkeye? Amazing stuff. I'm actually sort of impressed.

really quality work. look no further than the two likes the post has. like moths to the flame lol

 

[so cal hawkfan]

I’ve got no data to back this up, but I would wager that Iowa leading the charge with women’s wrestling can only help the men’s team. More funding, recruiting (young people are into this kinda stuff) etc. If it helps the men’s team in anyway, I’m all in. Now as a wrestling fan, I find women’s wrestling pretty unwatchable. When freestyle is on and they switch between showing men and then women’s competition, that’s my potty break time. Title IX isn’t going away no matter how little money womens sports earn vs mens sports. It is what it is.

 

[el dub]

Serious question…. How many weights will there be? (I’m guessing 10?)

 

[jrod65]

Serious question…. How many weights will there be? (I’m guessing 10?)

Was literally just looking at rankings.

10 weights:

101, 109, 116, 123, 130, 136, 143, 155, 170, 191